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In the Name of God بسم الله
Guest Muhamad

Martial Arts Anyone ?

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1 hour ago, 313 Seeker said:

Can you tell us more about it? What is your experience and wisdom from this? How would you train people in this for self defense purpose?

It was quite a long time ago, and I only studied for less than three years. Hsing-I is in the same family as Tai Chi and Bagua, internal style arts. Internal arts rely on body mechanics and "chi", along with grounding to generate incredible power in expert practicioners. All internal arts take a lot longer to learn than "external" styles, but even a little knowledge can go a long way. 

Any martial art is better than no martial art for self defense purposes. The key is for an individual to not show off or become arrogant about their skills, and make unwise choices as a result. 

I loved the study of Hsing-I, and looked for a new teacher for years after moving away from my first school. I had started out in karate, but didn't enjoy it. At the school where I studied, both arts were offered. The office manager, who was a Hsing-I student, observed my frustration and suggested I switch. I am very glad I took her advice.

There are many styles of fighting/defense. There isn't one which is best for everyone. The best strength I observed in Hsing-I, which it shares with tai-chi, is that it's unexpected. A person does not have to be large or powerful to start. The art builds the student. 

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@notme

Yes I agree about internal styles being more important than external. My wife and I are doing Bagua and Jiu Jitsu in parallel together at home. She complained the other day that she wants to do kickboxing because it was more "fun". I agreed with her and told her that I'd show her Muay Thai soon, but that Bagua Quan was much more important, as it is internal and more difficult. Once she mastered the internal, the external is much easier. And she would be much better at it once taking care of internal. 

It's like the concept of working on muscles in external styles, while the more internal we go, the more we go towards the light in terms of Qi (energy) and the resulting Li (Force). In between we condition bones and tendons, which is almost never addressed in modern martial arts styles. 

I don't know if you mind doing that, but would you be so kind to explain to us the two occasions of how exactly you warded off the two attackers, and how your training helped you with that?

I likewise went through Karate experience when I was about 9 years old, and after failing the orange belt (didn't do my homework of learning the Kata properly I guess .. ), i left martial arts and went into running, then swimming and mountain biking. Only when at uni i had 2 trainings in boxing at the local gym, and the guy was so impressed with me that he refused to train me at uni, and said I had to go to this really rundown area where the main boxing scene of the city was. I didn't do that of course, just by imagining the smelly changing rooms and the kind of people that go there. 
So when I graduated from uni i started getting knee problems, and a doctor told me that the only solution to this was training the leg muscles. I figured out that I needed to start a martial art which uses legs. A friend of mine who was training with Fady Merza had taught me some Muay Thai which was loads of fun, but I felt that the best is Shaolin Kung Fu, as it encompasses more spirituality and flexibility. So i joined the local Shaolin school and got hooked ever since. This was about 15 years of total obsession with every fighting art i can put my hands on to.

Thanks to God

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For each one are successive before and behind him who protect him by the decree of Allah . Indeed, Allah will not change the condition of a people until they change what is in themselves. And when Allah intends for a people ill, there is no repelling it. And there is not for them besides Him any patron. 13:11

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And He is the subjugator over His servants, and He sends over you guardian-angels until, when death comes to one of you, Our messengers take him, and they do not fail. 6:61

__________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

 

This is perhaps the most important post from me on this thread since I started it 6 years ago! Why?

 

1 - First of all it keeps us humble and makes us realize that our protection as well as fighting abilities depend on others who are commissioned by God to protect us and prevent our imminent death.

2 - Secondly, we must remember to thank God for our protection, and ask for more. Personally, I like to be in touch with my angels and thank them, and love them ( especially pray for them ), and direct them. Even if I can not see them!

3 - It removes fear and anxiety, because one does not feel responsible for ones safety. One basically gives the responsibility to God and trusts in Him as our Waly. ( give him the Wakeel - like delegate ones' self to Him )

4 - It will encourage us to be clean and good, because those protective creatures get attracted to goodness. 

5 - Takes away loneliness, because one knows that there are always others around you, comforting you, praying for you, and taking care of you ( via the order of the God of Muhamad ).

6 - I believe that the more one thanks God for this, the more of these protective creatures God will send you. 

7 - It puts everything into perspective. If those angels go away for one second we would immediately die, according to hadiths I read. Disaster is always about to happen and God saves us from it at every moment through these helpers and watchers.

Some info on wikipedia

 

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Salam Alaikum,

Martial arts should be for real life situations. Many times those situations mean that one is close to death, or even brings death to someone when done in self-defense. This brings me to another point that I personally like to practice:

I like to keep good relations with the angel(s) of death around us. They are the ones who will make our death easy or hard when the time comes. And they also can help us perhaps take the lives of those who try to kill us. Of course, everything happens with the permission of Allah, but so does everything that happens no matter where, when or to whom, and by whom. 

 

Edited by 313 Seeker

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Everybody knows how to fight:

Allah swt made it that each animal and us humans by nature know how to fight. Just like babies are capable of floating and keeping their breath, and all animals can swim, God has taught us in out nature to be able to defend ourselves very effectively. Because of our insecurities and mental pollution, we have forgotten it and need to train again to simply let go of our insecurities. The biggest goal of training and preparing for a fight is not the actual skill or increased capability, but rather the lack of insecurity and inhibitions. When walking on the street we find more people attacking us, when walking without self confidence. When having an air of confidence, that in itself will protect us. Just like dogs will run after and possibly bite anybody who runs away from them or is scared, the same dog will shy away and run away if you charge towards it or show no fear and attack it. Even if you know that these two German Shepherds can rip you apart in no-time, your confidence will make them scared of you.

There is a hadith that says something along the lines of:

- He who does not fear Allah, fears everything. And he who fears Allah, is feared by everything.

When getting rid of inhibitions, mental blocks, complexes and the likes, we simply return to our basic fitra (in Arabic), or basic instinct given by God that does not need invention. 

Somebody who seems weak and untrained can be a formidable fighter in real life - like a mother defending her baby for instance. At the same time a trained martial artist buff guy could be totally useless in real fights. It is due to the spiritual heart condition, and the blessing by God.

This instinct within us is the reason why advanced martial artists emulate animals in their training and styles. Even, they can use them in their minds during real fights. I had an incidence once where I pretended to be a praying mantis in a real confrontation. The guy got so out of breath, that he just walked away alhamdulilah. 

This basic instinct is strongest in mother-child protection. (It seems) Here is an example

 

Quote

Colorado Mother Fights Off Mountain Lion To Save Her Son

 
June 19, 20162:40 PM ET
ap_603532118896_custom-f158601fa1365f74e
 

The Colorado boy was attacked by a mountain lion (though not this particular animal, photographed by the National Park Service in California's Santa Monica Mountains National Recreation Area).

HOPD/AP

A Colorado woman managed to fight off a mountain lion that was attacking her 5-year-old son.

During the harrowing rescue Friday evening, she "reached into the animal's mouth and wrested her son's head from its jaws," The Aspen Times reported.

The child was playing outside with his brother when his mother heard the sound of screaming, Pitkin County police said in a statement. She rushed outside to find a mountain lion on top of her son.

"The woman charged the animal, yanked away one of its paws and discovered her son's whole head was in its mouth," The Associated Press reported. She was then "able to physically remove her son from the mountain lion," the police said.

"She was able to pry the cat's jaws open," Deputy Michael Buglione told The Aspen Times. "She's a hero."

The child sustained injuries to his face, head and neck and is now in "fair condition," according to the police. He was transferred from Aspen to a hospital in Denver. His mother sustained minor injuries to her legs and hand.

source

 

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Fight against Multiple opponents:

 

The good news is that people who are true to the One God can beat several opponents each. Allah tells us this in the Quran, and even weaker momins can beat at least 2 people each. The normal is 10 each. Of course numbers in the Quran can be more than we actually think. Anyway:

 

O Prophet, urge the believers to battle. If there are among you twenty [who are] steadfast, they will overcome two hundred. And if there are among you one hundred [who are] steadfast, they will overcome a thousand of those who have disbelieved because they are a people who do not understand. 8:65

Now, Allah has lightened [the hardship] for you, and He knows that among you is weakness. So if there are from you one hundred [who are] steadfast, they will overcome two hundred. And if there are among you a thousand, they will overcome two thousand by permission of Allah . And Allah is with the steadfast. 8:66

 

Of course the above counts only for real fights where one is right. It probably wont work if one fights for money or fame in a 'ring'.

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I am sure that many have wondered if it's good to do modern-day body building, and if that is the way of the Prophets and Imams. My theory is that it isn't.

Why?

Because to start with this kind of training and muscle building requires a diet that was very different from the ahlul bayt from what we know. the high-protein diets that require huge amounts of meat or protein shakes were probably not on the menu back then. We know that the ahlulbayt ate very sparsely.

There are other reason too, such as modern-day body building being very external, while not focusing on tendons or bones. Personally I do lift a bit of weights, but focus much more on reps than maxing out. 

here is a hadith in circulation. I don't know its source though, if somebody can share it (i think this thread is really quite dead other than me .. maybe i should stop posting here as there seems to be no other people willing to contribute, ask, or share on this topic ..)

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14 hours ago, 313 Seeker said:

I am sure that many have wondered if it's good to do modern-day body building, and if that is the way of the Prophets and Imams. My theory is that it isn't.

weight training is mostly for cosmetic reasons - it has very little practical benefits. for example:

 

I dont think the Imams (as) would have done weight lifting because it severely restricts your range of movement. on a battlefield you need to be flexible and have excellent cardio. I think you are 100% correct that ligament/ tendon strength is way more important

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On 11/04/2017 at 11:23 PM, 313 Seeker said:

I am sure that many have wondered if it's good to do modern-day body building, and if that is the way of the Prophets and Imams. My theory is that it isn't.

Why?

Because to start with this kind of training and muscle building requires a diet that was very different from the ahlul bayt from what we know. the high-protein diets that require huge amounts of meat or protein shakes were probably not on the menu back then. We know that the ahlulbayt ate very sparsely.
 

5

Modern-day bodybuilding is great as a hobby, it can be halal provided you lower your gaze at the gym and is good at character building if your training naturally especially you learn patience and hard work and dedication and so on. So I'd recommend it.

Within combat I guess it's kinda useless, you get gassed out quicker when your shredded and have a low percentage of body fat, having fat is useful. Not to mention most of them just train muscles for show, it is important to train the back muscles and abdomen and leg's especially for real power and explosiveness.

I've heard some probably mythical statements at the madrassah when I was a kid by a really excited teacher about how Imam Ali a.s would walk and his muscles would ripple apparently and so on, and I understand that Hazrat Hamza used to hunt lions and had big biceps or something or at least was a really strong and champion like personality but he had seen better times.

However, as you have mentioned the diet the imams had wasn't that great and they went through a lot of hardships, I don't think you can make major gains whilst living off dates and water and some tough bread.

Unless faith alone gets you ripped.

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i think that people back then lived such an active lifestyle that they didn't need to train very much to be super fit. And as long as one is thin, while being fit, one will definitely look very ripped. But of course one may not be big or buff from a distance, but I am sure that their posture was very good. 

Milking cows, working the lands as Imam Ali used to do, and riding, carrying water, building things with their own hands, grinding, not sitting on chairs, etc made them probably super strong (a bit like peasants of today). I am sure that they trained martial arts with sticks, bow and arrow, swords, spears, and many more. But when it comes to real fighting with weapons, being buff is of little advantage. It's only in this age where weapons are not allowed that people put a lot of importance in being big and bulky. But those who train to fight don't usually look that big. Special forces soldiers are usually not very buff looking either.

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On 7/7/2015 at 1:04 PM, peace seeker II said:

^^^ a woman training under my combat instructor fended off a knife attacker the other day by disarming him and scaring him enough that he ran away .. it's mostly in techniques that don't require much strength, and a little bit of practice for nervous system memory .. rather than muscle memory ..

 

 .. when the guy saw that she knew what she was doing he gave up .. 

 

i trained with the woman not long after making this post, and realized that she was far from mastering the anti-knife defense drills. she didn't even remember the very basics, and when she tried to do them, she couldn't.

Turns out that my ex-combat instructor was a liar. oh well!! lesson learned .. i hope . don't trust whatever stories instructors say :rolleyes:

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:grin: quite hilarious, but i like it. usually martial artists will tell you that anger is the enemy of a fighter, but in this case i think it would be an exception. maybe anger in a controlled setting like that can be empowering to start anew on a fresh note. ever tried to stand in the middle of nowhere and scream your heart out? 

 

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This guy packed such a strong punch, that for his size was supernatural and miraculous masha Allah. He would make earthquakes when hitting the heavy bag .. and of course he would use his whole body as a whip, and not just shoulder and upper body, as most people do .. miss this dude ..

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Jet Li at 14 will make you understand why he is such a great Kung Fu artist. Some may say that this is like a dance etc. but the point is that this is more about the spirit of fighting, and if you can do what is done here, then any technique of move will be a piece of cake, plus you will have superior balance, flow, body control, speed, flexibility and base. masha Allah. 

 

The following video below contains a Kung Fu anthem that could be seen as a nasheed. It has a lot in common with Islam and 313 mentality. It is used for this brilliant movie intro of the anti-imperialist movie called "Once upon a time in China", featuring Jet Li when older. 

The lyrics translated are below:

 

The English Translation is as follows

Title: A Man Should Strengthen Himself

(Stanza 1)
Vigorous when facing the beatings of ten thousands heavy waves
Ardent just like the rays of the red sun
Having courage like forge iron and bones as hard as refined steel
Having lofty aspirations and excellent foresight
I worked extremely hard, aspiring to be a strong and courageous man
In order to become a hero, One should strive to become stronger everyday
An ardent man shines brighter than the sun

(Stanza 2)
Allowing the sky and sea to amass energy for me
To split heaven and part the earth, to fight for my aspirations
Watching the stature and grandure of jade coloured waves
at the same time watching the vastness  jade coloured sky,  let our noble spirit soar

I am a man and I must strive to strengthen myself.
Walking in firm steps and standing upright let us all aspire to be a pillar of the society, and to be a hero
Using our hundredfold warmth, to bring forth a thousandfold of brilliance
Be a hero
Being ardent and with strong courage
Shine brighter than the sun

subhan Allah

Edited by 313 Seeker

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People not willing to learn from east and west will lag behind. Mixed Martial Arts that started off from exactly a marriage of both worlds will always be stronger as it is tested. But the key in my opinion is to be master of both. And only in this way can one use real Tai Chi or any other form of Kung Fu. The internal Kung Fu styles are probably the hardest to apply in real life.

M.M.A. Fighter’s Pummeling of Tai Chi Master Rattles China

 

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classic worth watching. Shaolin Buddhism and Kung Fu is corrupt and far away from true martial arts like most Muslims are as well today (far away from true Islam, as was predicted for the end times), but the light of the truth and wisdom of this art and philosophy still shines through i believe. Jet Li here did a great job and it's very motivational and has some wisdoms that resonate with Islam for sure!

 

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