Arabic And Farsi

[Livindesert]

How close is Arabic to Farsi? From an outsiders perspective they seem very similar. (I speak neither Arabic or Farsi)

Edited March 12, 2011 by Livindesert

[DoubleAgent4]

The Farsi language is made up of 60% Arabic...

[Simorgh]

The Farsi language is made up of 60% Arabic...

Proof?

[Livindesert]

The Farsi language is made up of 60% Arabic...

Is that true?

[DayStrike312]

I wish I knew Farsi!!!! :cry:

[Abu Tufayl]

(bismillah)

Only thing Farsi has similar with arabic are use of borrowed words and writing system. That's about it. Different (infinitely easier) grammer. Farsi has no gender rules, everything is gender neutral (it, he, and she are the same word "oo")

[Livindesert]

(bismillah)

Only thing Farsi has similar with arabic are use of borrowed words and writing system. That's about it. Different (infinitely easier) grammer. Farsi has no gender rules, everything is gender neutral (it, he, and she are the same word "oo")

O.k. thanks : ) I just started learning Farsi the other day through Rosetta Stone and was wondering since the writing system looked so similar.

[Simorgh]

Is that true?

No, it is not. You will not be able to follow a single sentence in either language if all you purely know is one or the other language. While it is written in the same manner, due to a similar written alphabet (with the exception that farsi has 4 more letters in its alphabet), everything is pronounced in a very different way. The words that are used in both languages, are usually religious words. So assuming we do not use religious words in our conversation, not a single word will be understood by an arabic speaker. Even for these religious words there are pure farsi equivalents that can, and often do get used. However, I have to add that whether an arabic speaker will understand something from farsi, depends on its vicinity to Iran (e.g. someone from let's say Bahrain in comparison to someone from Morocco), but that is due to the influence farsi has had on the Persian Gulf states.

[DoubleAgent4]

The words that are used in both languages, are usually religious words

Arabic is mixed with the Farsi language so it doesn't necessarily mean that it has to be religious arabic words used. For e.g glasses in Farsi glasses is عينک whereas in arabic it's something else but as we can see the word

'عين' means eye in arabic...lets not forget that Iran used to be an arab speaking country for centuries so if all the arabic were taken out of the modern Farsi language I for one wouldn't understand it...maybe a couple of words here and there.

Edited March 12, 2011 by Hawraa29

[Nokare-Zahra]

(salam)

^ If we are going at that rate, then I can say French is 50% Iranian, because of words like merci,assansor[elevator] ..

Farsi and Arabic are not even similar in anyway. You can say Farsi is similar in Urdu, in terms of grammar and alphabets, and the letters/handwritings used.

Eltemase Doa.

[DoubleAgent4]

(salam)

^ If we are going at that rate, then I can say French is 50% Iranian, because of words like merci,assansor[elevator] ..

Farsi and Arabic are not even similar in anyway. You can say Farsi is similar in Urdu, in terms of grammar and alphabets, and the letters/handwritings used.

Eltemase Doa.

I'm just going by what my Iranian teacher told me...ever since I can remember I've always been told that the Farsi language contains a large percentage of Arabic however that doesn't necessarily mean that Arab speakers will understand it as Farsi is a mixture of other languages.

[Simorgh]

Arabic is mixed with the Farsi language so it doesn't necessarily mean that it has to be religious arabic words used. For e.g glasses in Farsi glasses is Úíä˜ whereas in arabic it's something else but as we can see the word

'Úíä' means eye in arabic...lets not forget that Iran used to be an arab speaking country for centuries so if all the arabic were taken out of the modern Farsi language I for one wouldn't understand it...maybe a couple of words here and there.

The Arabic language contains about 13.000 words, according to scholarly research more than 5.000 of these words are originally Persian words. The reason many of these words are thought to be Arabic, even by many Iranians, is because Arabic speakers have always had the tendency to Arabize words.

[The Canuck]

^ If we are going at that rate, then I can say French is 50% Iranian, because of words like merci,assansor[elevator] ..

Farsi and Arabic are not even similar in anyway. You can say Farsi is similar in Urdu, in terms of grammar and alphabets, and the letters/handwritings used.

Eltemase Doa.

lol those are the only french words. If you go by this, then every language is 50% of each other (which is horrible math by the way). It's like the word "computer" being used in many languages, it doesn't mean that all those languages have a large amount of English in them.

Farsi does have a very large Arabic vocabulary, with many words Farsi-Arabic mixed, and at the same time possibly some being originally Farsi words that are used in Arabic as well. There may also be equivalent Farsi words for Arabic origin words, but the reality is Arabic words and influence is probably very high, and if you pick up a Farsi dictionary you can see 60%-70% Arabic in it ( either by way of Arabic origin words, Farsi/Arabic mix words, or even old Farsi origin words adopted by Arabic).

However they are completely different languages still, Farsi is Indo-Iranian, Arabic is Semetic. Structurally and grammatically they are different.

[Nokare-Zahra]

(salam)

lol those are the only french words. If you go by this, then every language is 50% of each other (which is horrible math by the way). It's like the word "computer" being used in many languages, it doesn't mean that all those languages have a large amount of English in them.

Farsi does have a very large Arabic vocabulary, with many words Farsi-Arabic mixed, and at the same time possibly some being originally Farsi words that are used in Arabic as well. There may also be equivalent Farsi words for Arabic origin words, but the reality is Arabic words and influence is probably very high, and if you pick up a Farsi dictionary you can see 60%-70% Arabic in it ( either by way of Arabic origin words, Farsi/Arabic mix words, or even old Farsi origin words adopted by Arabic).

However they are completely different languages still, Farsi is Indo-Iranian, Arabic is Semetic. Structurally and grammatically they are different.

It's not the only French words..

douce,karavate,manteaux ,chaffauge, autobus,jambon, sac.. there's probably more words I have missed anyway.

I agree with the rest of your post.

Eltemase Doa.

[Gypsy]

(salam)

Farsi sounds so different from Arabic. Even the way it is spoken is very different.

Most of the language in the world has some form of influence from Indo-Iranian.

[IraqiAmerican777]

I'm studying it now (farsi) and although I already spoke Arabic going in, it was hard because farsi has several "z" letters and 2 "t's" and they have "che" and "peh" while Arabic doesnt have a che (unless your speaking Iraqi) and we use "be" when writing p so it can all get confusing lol...iraqi arabic is close to it. Sometimes I only understand the teacher because Iraqis use persian words like "khosh" and "cha" and others..lol

[Ibn Abdullah]

"A dictionary based sample yields an inventory of approximately 8000 Arabic loanwords in current standard Persian or about forty percent of an everyday literary vocabulary of 20,000 words, not counting compounds and deravitives."

John R. Perry, "Lexical Areas and Semantic Fields of Arabic" in Éva Ágnes Csató, Eva Agnes Csato, Bo Isaksson, Carina Jahani, Linguistic convergence and areal diffusion: case studies from Iranian, Semitic and Turkic,Routledge, 2005.

A lot of words in Farsi are derived from Arabic even if they have come to take on an independent form. Of course the language structure is quite different but in terms of pure vocabulary it has been very much affected. Plus a lot of our terms and expressions are injected straight from Arabic which more so has to do with the religion (alhamdulilah, Mashallah, etc; which are used very commonly). I think as the quote above said, basic convo between two iranians (particularly in slang) has a lot more Arabic loan words than more formal speak. And a lot of Arabic words are creeping more into Farsi and are used interchangeably with the original farsi words. For example Rooz/Yawm is one I can think of.

As the brother above said Farsi is more closely related to Iraqi Arabic than any other dialects. I guess the closest form of Arabic to Farsi would be Ahwazi Arabic due to the great amount of contact between the two languages.

[ImamAliLover]

(bismillah)

(salam)

i am by no means fluent in Arabic, but even with my little amount of Arabic, i can understand 25%-50% of what Persian people are saying when they're speaking Persian simply because they use many Arabic loan-words.

For example, this is a random speech by Khatami:

Here are some Arabic words i've noticed here:

(in the order that i heard the word)

1) Ghayr Deeni=non-religious

2) Akthar (he said it as aksar)=Most (can mean 'more' in certain contexts)

3) Ya'ni=this means (also often used to stall in a sentence, similar to "ya know" or "like..." in English)

4) Nidhaam (he said it as nizaam)=Regime

5) Qabool=Something that one accepts/agrees with

6) Ma'loom=Something that is known

7) 'Itiqaad=Belief

8) Hadharaat (he said it as hazaraat)=The plural of "hadhrat", which is a respectful way to address someone or refer to someone

9) Taghyeer=Change

10) Asaasee=Basis

11) Gahrbi=Western

12) 'itiqadat=Plural of 'itiqad

13) Dunya=World

14) Huqooq (he said it as hughooq)=Rights

15) Hatta=Even (can also mean 'until' in other contexts)

16) i'm not sure if he used the word "millah" because the video got a little choppy, but if he did, that's another Arabic word

17) Hujoom=Attack

18) Jaanib=Side (ie this regime is being attacked from all angles/sides/fronts by America)

19) Afkaar=ideas

20) Jumhuriyy(ah)=Republic

So in less than 3 minutes, i counted about 20 Arabic words. Now, i don't know Farsi so i don't know which of these Arabic words were origionally Farsi loan-words to Arabic (or form other languages), but it's still rather telling imo

As for the pure "Fusha" Farsi, then yea, that's a completely different language and i probably wouldn't be able to understand a single word from that except words that English or Arabic took from it.

Edited July 16, 2011 by ImamAliLover

[baradar_jackson]

And a lot of Arabic words are creeping more into Farsi and are used interchangeably with the original farsi words. For example Rooz/Yawm is one I can think of.

???

I've never heard an Iranian use yawm.

And the words that have crept into Farsi recently (past 70-80 years) have not been Arabic but mostly French and English.

Arabic influence on Farsi is mostly from the days when Iran first became Islamic.

[IraqiAmerican777]

I also noticed that Iraqis and Persians eat alot of the same exact dishes...fesenjoon, sebzi, dill rice, sahoon, loobia, kookoo....and we look alike..lol

[Abu'l Khattab]

I also noticed that Iraqis and Persians eat alot of the same exact dishes...fesenjoon, sebzi, dill rice, sahoon, loobia, kookoo....and we look alike..lol

Lol, those are obvious Iranian dishes brought to Iraq by people who call themselves "karbalaiyah". The only foods iraqis can claim is theirs is stuff like qeema, fasooliya, bamya etc.

Iranians look better than iraqs, proven fact.

[guest 34193]

The Arabic language contains about 13.000 words, according to scholarly research more than 5.000 of these words are originally Persian words. The reason many of these words are thought to be Arabic, even by many Iranians, is because Arabic speakers have always had the tendency to Arabize words.

That's insane and I'm guessing the product of some Persian pride nationalism (which often means, anti-Arab). Farsi or New Persian is really a mixed language combining the actual Persian language with Arabic loan words plus a modified Arabic alphabet (and eventually some French, etc). Even in the title you have under your username, you're using an Arabic word in there ("akhir"). In Arabic the words are formed on patterns using triliteral (usually) root letters, unlike Farsi which is more like English (as an example) of randomly importing and using words without much pattern. So for instance, from that same akhir, you would derive (apart from all the many verb conjugations), aakhira, ta'kheer, akheer, mi'khaar, ta'akhkhur, mu'akhkhar, muta'akhkhir, etc. all from the root letter alif - kha - ra. Majority of Arabic is like this. Imported words (such as those that did come from Persian) tend to really stick out since they don't follow the same type of patterns (unless forced to). So to say that 5000 words of Arabic are originally Persian is just ludicrous, especially to someone who knows both languages.

[IraqiAmerican777]

Lol, those are obvious Iranian dishes brought to Iraq by people who call themselves "karbalaiyah". The only foods iraqis can claim is theirs is stuff like qeema, fasooliya, bamya etc.

Iranians look better than iraqs, proven fact.

Umm..your reply is stupid.

I never said those dishes were Iraqi, I said they're eaten in both countries.

Iraq happens to be the melting pot of Turkish, Aramaic, Arab, and Persian food.

As for the looks department, there are attractive and ugly people everywhere; I was commenting on the obvious fact that intermarriages between Persians and Iraqis are common, hence the similar features.

[Abu'l Khattab]

Umm..your reply is stupid.

An Iraqi calling something stupid? How ironic.

I never said those dishes were Iraqi, I said they're eaten in both countries.

I didn't claim that you said that, I just said that they're obviously iranian dishes, no one can dispute that.

Iraq happens to be the melting pot of Turkish, Aramaic, Arab, and Persian food.

Yay for them, the only authentic Iraqi foods have rice and a side dish.

As for the looks department, there are attractive and ugly people everywhere; I was commenting on the obvious fact that intermarriages between Persians and Iraqis are common, hence the similar features.

Um, no they don't marry each other as much as you think. The contrast of their cultures, languages etc. is enough to distinguish them.

[IraqiAmerican777]

An Iraqi calling something stupid? How ironic.

I didn't claim that you said that, I just said that they're obviously iranian dishes, no one can dispute that.

Yay for them, the only authentic Iraqi foods have rice and a side dish.

Um, no they don't marry each other as much as you think. The contrast of their cultures, languages etc. is enough to distinguish them.

I didn't think it was possible for you to come up with an even stupider response than your previous post, but you've outdone yourself. Clearly, you have some pent up animosity towards Iraqis, probably Arabs at large. So I'll just ignore your nonsense from here on.

[Abu'l Khattab]

I didn't think it was possible for you to come up with an even stupider response than your previous post, but you've outdone yourself. Clearly, you have some pent up animosity towards Iraqis, probably Arabs at large. So I'll just ignore your nonsense from here on.

It's because you don't have a reply, you know I'm right. What some isolated people do doesn't reflect on the Iraqis as an entirety.

[baradar_jackson]

I didn't think it was possible for you to come up with an even stupider response than your previous post, but you've outdone yourself. Clearly, you have some pent up animosity towards Iraqis, probably Arabs at large. So I'll just ignore your nonsense from here on.

Don't mind Haidar. He's a hybrid Iranian-Iraqi going through an identity crisis.

[Abu'l Khattab]

Don't mind Haidar. He's a hybrid Iranian-Iraqi going through an identity crisis.

Says the one who's apparently anti-American but lives in America himself? Yeah, a real identity crisis there.

Edit: Funny how you say that to me and not Mufeed ;)

Edited July 17, 2011 by haidar al karrar

[baradar_jackson]

Says the one who's apparently anti-American but lives in America himself? Yeah, a real identity crisis there.

Edit: Funny how you say that to me and not Mufeed ;)

I never claimed to be anti-American, and I do not make any criticism of the US unless it involves their interference in the affairs of other countries (which Americans themselves also complain of).

Don't do qiyas between you and Mufeed. Since when did Mufeed ever say anti-Iraqi stuff like you do?

[Abu'l Khattab]

I never claimed to be anti-American, and I do not make any criticism of the US unless it involves their interference in the affairs of other countries (which Americans themselves also complain of).

Don't do qiyas between you and Mufeed. Since when did Mufeed ever say anti-Iraqi stuff like you do?

Oh wow, must be a change of stance then.

Qiyas? More like Mufeed's doing taqiyyah...

[Islamic Salvation]

An interesting Hadith in Sahih al-Bukhari in which the prophet speaks Arabic and a bit of Farsi (the title of the thread)

ÍÏËäÇ ãÍãÏ Èä ÈÔÇÑ: ÍÏËäÇ ÛäÏÑ: ÍÏËäÇ ÔÚÈÉ¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ÒíÇÏ¡ Úä ÃÈí åÑíÑÉ Ãä ÇáÍÓä Èä Úáí ÃÎÐ ÊãÑÉ ãä ÊãÑ ÇáÕÏÞÉ¡ ÝÌÚáåÇ Ýí Ýíå¡ ÝÞÇá ÇáäÈí Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÓáã ÈÇáÝÇÑÓíÉ: (ßÎ ßΡ ÃãÇ ÊÚÑÝ ÃäÇ áÇ äÃßá ÇáÕÏÞÉ

Hasan bin Ali took a date from the dates of Sadaqah (Zakat) and put it into his mouth, so the prophet Õá Çááå Úáíå æÂáå æÓáã said in persian : Kakh! Kakh!, do you not know that we do not eat from the Sadaqah

Of course its Abu Hurayra narrating the incident, but it affirms the belief that the Ahlulbayt did not take from the Zakat and the Sadaqah, and that the prophet spoke persian language from their authentic collection.

Note also that Imam Hasan would have been definitely less then nine years old here.

Edited July 18, 2011 by Islamic Salvation

[baradar_jackson]

Persian pride nationalism

For someone who is so against the concept of taqleed, you sure have no problem doing taqleed of my terminology.

[Marbles]

Don't mind Haidar. He's a hybrid Iranian-Iraqi going through an identity crisis.

Look who is saying :rolleyes:

[baradar_jackson]

Look who is saying :rolleyes:

So I'm a hybrid and I have an identity crisis?

[Marbles]

So I'm a hybrid

Culturally hybrid. Torn.

I have an identity crisis?

Obviously.