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In the Name of God بسم الله
Significance of 12

Why Most Iranians Hate Khomeini?

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You are attempting to show your 'expertise' by lobbing in a few anecdotal stories, which lack background and explanation and from these anecdotes you are attempting to draw some conclusions.

Do i really need to remind you of Sakineh Mohammadi, just one example for now: http://freesakineh.org/

Please tell me that was Islamic.

Edited by Significance of 12

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If you wanna be hard headed about it as i said before, by all means, but please do it at an appropriate thread. this is just taking us away from the topic of this thread.

Well it's you who is bringing up all these varied points, I was just rebutting them. The starting point for using a discussion board is to have a clear idea as to what you want to talk about.

You started with expat Iranians hating the IRI and as people pointed out to you, this is not entirely unexpected. I have come across a number of these people in the UK and what remains unexplained is how a country that is so poor and which treats everyone so badly nevertheless managed to provide these people with enough financial capital to start businesses, buy property and join expensive health clubs.

You've then moved onto the idea that the IRI is not Islamic and you've given some poor examples to support your assertion and you're none too pleased when they're rebutted.

I suggest you go back to the drawing board and draw up a list of "Reasons why I hate the IRI'. Then decide which of these reasons have something in common that they can be put into a specific thread. For each new group of ideas start a new thread.

If you are not sure about the coherence of a group of ideas, make a list on this thread and we'll tell you.

For example when you are arguing that the IRI is not Islamic it does not make a lot of sense to put in references to the Green movement, upholding Islam does not appear to be one of their priorities.

So before you go any further make sure you decide which point of view you want to attack the IRI from. Is it that it is not Islamic enough or not liberal enough. Bear in mind that posters who try to make both points (as you seem to have done) look somewhat bizarre.

Do i really need to remind you of Sakineh Mohammadi, just one example for now: http://freesakineh.org/

Please tell me that was Islamic.

Sorry but this is another example of your confusion.

Elsewhere you question the Islamic credentials of the IRI. Yet here you link to a freedom campaign whose supporters (see your link), include such well known Muslim scholars as Salman Rushdie, Irshad Manji and Ian McEwan. Actually they are well known Islamophobes.

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Well it's you who is bringing up all these varied points, I was just rebutting them. The starting point for using a discussion board is to have a clear idea as to what you want to talk about.

You started with expat Iranians hating the IRI and as people pointed out to you, this is not entirely unexpected. I have come across a number of these people in the UK and what remains unexplained is how a country that is so poor and which treats everyone so badly nevertheless managed to provide these people with enough financial capital to start businesses, buy property and join expensive health clubs.

You've then moved onto the idea that the IRI is not Islamic and you've given some poor examples to support your assertion and you're none too pleased when they're rebutted.

I suggest you go back to the drawing board and draw up a list of "Reasons why I hate the IRI'. Then decide which of these reasons have something in common that they can be put into a specific thread. For each new group of ideas start a new thread.

If you are not sure about the coherence of a group of ideas, make a list on this thread and we'll tell you.

For example when you are arguing that the IRI is not Islamic it does not make a lot of sense to put in references to the Green movement, upholding Islam does not appear to be one of their priorities.

So before you go any further make sure you decide which point of view you want to attack the IRI from. Is it that it is not Islamic enough or not liberal enough. Bear in mind that posters who try to make both points (as you seem to have done) look somewhat bizarre.

What I wanted to talk about got discussed and explained till post #21, and to be honest it did clear up my mind about the confusions i had. But this barbie-drama started when IRI was decorated with Islamic Law and thats where it all started going off-road. For a mod, you really didn't go through the thread at all, did you? Me hating IRI or loving them, makes no difference, not to me, not to you, not to anyone, so thats irrelevant. And every example i give you, you will throw it away calling it poor examples, kind of like what Americans do to new evidence calling it "conspiracy theory".

I must admit i'm new to this site and have just started looking into world issues, and im not familiar with the term "green movement".

Elsewhere you question the Islamic credentials of the IRI. Yet here you link to a freedom campaign whose supporters (see your link), include such well known Muslim scholars as Salman Rushdie, Irshad Manji and Ian McEwan. Actually they are well known Islamophobes.

So we abondon the truth cuz its backed up by "Islamophobes"?

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(salam)

Ever since I came to Canada, every single Iranian I've met has this unimaginable hate for ayatollah khomeini and curse him in the most pathetic and disgusting ways. Not one Iranian i've met has said anything good about him (at least here).

Seems like you might been hanging around too between Younge & Steeles and Yonge & Finch. Canada has a very large Iranian population and majority of them are all Shah-lovers. So in other words, you might be meeting up with the wrong Iranians.

Why don't you go to the Iranian mosque in Canada and see if you still see the same reaction?

Wassalam

Edited by Aal-e-Imran

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(salam)

Seems like you might been hanging around too between Younge & Steeles and Yonge & Finch. Canada has a very large Iranian population and majority of them are all Shah-lovers. So in other words, you might be meeting up with the wrong Iranians.

Why don't you go to the Iranian mosque in Canada and see if you still see the same reaction?

Wassalam

talking about the one near Victoria pk and O'Connor? you're right I should've. Never been there. And I'm talking about the main concentration of Iranians, Richmond hill, but rest of Toronto too.

See its not like I'm going around interviewing people about it, but it just happens that out of nowhere they start cussing Khomeini out, out of their frustrations for leaving their happy life in Iran and coming to Canada. I thought maybe there was more to it, that's why I made this post in the first place.

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I don't like Khomeini and I am a Muslim Shia. Yes he was a great man in the sense that he brought about the revolution that not many people could do so and he has influenced many people, i'm not going to deny that. However, he has the blood of innocent people on his hands. He didn't put a stop to khalkhali executing innocent people and then declaring them as shaheeds... yes i'm aware some of them were part of the MKO whom betrayed their own country. In fact, if we look at this Islamically capital punishment can't take place so easily as you need a lot of evidence and during the time of ghayba not all parts of the sharia can be implemented.

The people who hate khomeini with a passion is due to the fact that he imposed all these rules on them without them being prepared so obviously they would rebel against this. Furthermore, a lot of people were put in prison and people were condemned for wearing jeans etc and i even heard that acid used to be thrown on them. At the end of the day, all these killings were done under the name of Islam. This is what happens when people gain power and during the course of history we can see how these so called khalifahs used Islam as a means to control people.

Also, those who did vote for Ahmadenejad wouldn't have done so if they knew what was to come. I neither support Ahmadenejad nor Musavi.They're both as bad as each other.

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However, he has the blood of innocent people on his hands.

You assume that they are innocent. Why?

The people who hate khomeini with a passion is due to the fact that he imposed all these rules on them without them being prepared so obviously they would rebel against this.

This is true...

Furthermore, a lot of people were put in prison and people were condemned for wearing jeans etc and i even heard that acid used to be thrown on them.

... but this is just rumor-mongering. Don't believe everything you hear.

At the end of the day, all these killings were done under the name of Islam.

The only "killings" that happened were for traitors who collaborated with Saddam and the imperialists.

Therefore, one should not be ashamed if such executions are carried out in the name of Islam.

Islam prescribes for capital punishment in such cases.

This is what happens when people gain power and during the course of history we can see how these so called khalifahs used Islam as a means to control people.

Typical "power corrupts" mentality.

Well I got news for you: power and administration are a necessary part of any society. And we would rather have righteous leaders and let Islam's name become tarnished in the eyes of certain naive people than have corrupt leaders and an Islam that is not "tarnished" by the "evils" of politics.

Also, those who did vote for Ahmadenejad wouldn't have done so if they knew what was to come.

This is unsubstantiated...

Moreover, "what was to come" was a product of the naivete and treachery of the greens. So why would that make people who voted for Ahmadinejad regretful?

I neither support Ahmadenejad nor Musavi.They're both as bad as each other.

You Shirazi followers are always trying to stay on the fence by saying things like this.

This is not about Mousavi vs. Ahmadinejad. Those are just names. This is bigger than me, this is bigger than you, and this is bigger than even Mousavi or Ahmadinejad. This is about our obligation to prevent the revolution from becoming deviated. This is about truth against falsehood, just like in all those stories you read about in that book we have.

Anyway, Iranians should be proud to have a president like Ahmadinejad. A man who works hard, gives up sleep, doesn't steal from the people, lives a simple life; someone who says what he means and means what he says. Me and my friend were talking about this today and we came to the conclusion that with all the moft khors in our country, we probably deserve an imperialist stooge like Mammad Reza Shah rather than a lion like Ahmadi.

Ya Ali

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The experience of the Egyptian "Revolution" vindicates everything that Ayatollah Khomeini did. Any reasonable person is totally aghast at the way in which the U.S. is manipulating the wishes of the Egyptian people.

The following article in the UKs centre-left Guardian newspaper has a large number of comments and many of the highly recommended ones are along the lines of:

American and Israeli interests will do all in their power to maintain their proxy strangle hold on the country but the natives are restless and eventually they will gain their freedom.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/feb/06/andrew-rawnsley-egypt-mubarak-democracy?intcmp=239

And

Already the US is manouevering behind Sulieman. I fear a return to the old order with the usual reprisals against any who champion free speech.

It's easy and naive to think that the IRI was a natural conclusion to the 1979 Revolution. In reality there were many forces inside/outside Iran more than happy to derail it. If they ended up dead, too bad.

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(salam)

talking about the one near Victoria pk and O'Connor? you're right I should've.

Yes.

And I'm talking about the main concentration of Iranians, Richmond hill, but rest of Toronto too.

It's the same old Shah loving Iranis bro; most of the new generation doesn't care or know jack all about religion.

Wassalam

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The reality is that every group of religion will be given the chance to rule but none can impplement justice.

Shias too in ghayba will make their own imams as Sunnis previously did and still do.

All u people wait for imam ajf and he will decide what Khomeini and khamenei or his likes are.

Just wait

ya Ali Madad

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The reality is that every group of religion will be given the chance to rule but none can impplement justice.

Shias too in ghayba will make their own imams as Sunnis previously did and still do.

All u people wait for imam ajf and he will decide what Khomeini and khamenei or his likes are.

Just wait

ya Ali Madad

What is the point of gheibat if we are to sit on our hands and do nothing?

What is the point of revelation if much of its content is to be ignored in this period (of gheibat)?

Nobody can be a leader in gheibat? The affairs of the world are to be ignored during gheibat?

If the revolution didn't happen, it would have been preferable? God is more pleased that people live under Taghut than under a just leader like Emam Khomeini or Seyyed Ali Khamenei?

It's funny that you make such implicit accusations against Emam and against the leader (telling us that we should "just wait" for Imam Mahdi to come and punish them), because it shows that you see yourself to be the one who knows what Imam Mahdi wants or will want. And your kind calls us arrogant for thinking that the leader is a representative of Imam Mahdi in gheibat? lol

Ya Ali

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What is the point of gheibat if we are to sit on our hands and do nothing?

What is the point of revelation if much of its content is to be ignored in this period (of gheibat)?

Nobody can be a leader in gheibat? The affairs of the world are to be ignored during gheibat?

If the revolution didn't happen, it would have been preferable? God is more pleased that people live under Taghut than under a just leader like Emam Khomeini or Seyyed Ali Khamenei?

It's funny that you make such implicit accusations against Emam and against the leader (telling us that we should "just wait" for Imam Mahdi to come and punish them), because it shows that you see yourself to be the one who knows what Imam Mahdi wants or will want. And your kind calls us arrogant for thinking that the leader is a representative of Imam Mahdi in gheibat? lol

Ya Ali

Ironically, when Islam was brought to the people of Yemen, There had a group who said....yeah, we are Muslim,. but let us Wait for Allah to implement Islamic Law rather then who the Prophet (pbuh) appointed to carry out the Criminal Justice in Yemen.

They are there every generation with the same Idea but using a different yet similar excuse.

I guess the saying holds true...."The More things change, the More things stay the Same"

And the fact is, people like this don't just want us to wait for capital punishment to be implemented by the Mahdi, they want to wait for EVERYTHING to be implemented by the Mahdi.

AKA: We should just promote an Ultra-Secular no holds bar society until his arrival.

An Example of there General Attitude-

You say: Look at all the Pornography on TV. How am I supposed to raise my daughter with this! This should be Banned!!!

They say: Oh, Just lower you gaze and shut of your TV.

You Say: This man has been caught producing Alcohol in an Islamic state when he knows it is against the law and it's punishment. He deserves the appropriate amount of Lashes!

They Say: You Cant Implement such thing! Wait till the Arrival of the Imam!

Ohhhhh The Hypocrisy!

:rolleyes:

Edited by Glow

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