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In the Name of God بسم الله

How Do You Explain That Imam Did Not Commit Suicid

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I think you can start by defining the word suicide. Choosing to kill yourself. If you knew an army of 30,000 people were coming to get you. and You decided that well I cant run away from my responsibilities as an ambassador for islam. Hussein chose to fight the army. You can define it as suicide, but it was inevitable situation. Stand up for your beliefs and be a martyr or be an american defined "suicide bomber" You get what im saying?

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(bismillah)

(salam)

Tell to your brother that the in the Quran Allah say that "كُلُّ مَنْ عَلَيْهَا فَانٍ ﴿26﴾ وَيَبْقَىٰ وَجْهُ رَبِّكَ ذُو ٱلْجَلَـٰلِ وَٱلْإِكْرَامِ ﴿27﴾" - Everyone on earth is destined to die. (26) Only the Supreme Essence of your Glorious and Gracious Lord will remain forever. (27)

If your friend say to Imam Aba Abdillah( (as) that he will be die in Karbala, then akid, Allah say to all of us in Quran that we are to be dying, and only Allah is to be for the ever.

So if you say like this, then we all make the suicide? But then Allah not good, because Allah say suicide sharan haraam.

So you see your friend his logic is far from Quran and his logic is bad, he must read more Quran and think about Quran and it is good for all

You see when Allah speak of thing in tomorrow and in past, this because Allah make the time - read al-Asar in Quran - al-Asar - the Time it is like human being, it is from creation of the Allah.

So for Allah time is not like the tomorrow and the past, it is all together, ya'ni Allah he see tomorrow, today, yestday, next month, yester month and like this in same time. So when Allah see the tomorrow it is not because he make the tomorrow happen like that - it is because he put us in the dimension of the time so for humans it is tomorrow and past, not for the Allah.

When Allah make this idea of the Time, he make the idea for us to have the chance to make good actions or the bad actions, and then the Allah he can the examination us.

I am hoping you understand because I am sorry for my english it is not so great.

(salam)

Mokhtar

Edited by mokhtar.thaqafi
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Ya Ali

How do you explain that Imam Hussain did not commit suicide? Someone is debating me and they are saying that the Prophet (pbuh) told him he will die in Kerbala, so he walked to his death!

Im confused, please help

wasallam

(salam)

æóãóÇ ÊóÏúÑöí äóÝúÓñ ÈöÃóíöø ÃóÑúÖò ÊóãõæÊõ - "and no soul knoweth in what land it will die.." (31:34)

The prophet (pbuh) merely informed the location and circumstances of his death - that doesn't justify the people calling for the Imam's blood (ie. forcing his allegiance or else taking his head - why did he leave madinah to begin with?).

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When ibrahim a.s dreamt of sacrificing his son he voluntarily presented his son for sacrifice, there was no force(jabr) nor fear(khauf). The same way Imam Hussain a.s moved forward for a great sacrifice for Allah azwj. Had he a.s backed out after the failed attack in Mecca it would be called timidity and those who are hujjat of Allah are free of timidity and fear of the oppostion army. To them Allah azwj is sufficient.

Imam Hussain a.s marched to kufa for the kufans wanted an imam for themselves. Had he backed out after receiving the news of their treacher, it would be called timidity Had he accepted the offer of bayth to tyrant yazeed l.a; it would have been submission of Islam to batil and this submission would indeed be submission of Allah azwj to shaytan l.a because Allah azwj rules through His hujjat a.s.

So imamHussain a.s presented his life for the protection of Islam and protection of the wilayat of Allah azwj. I hope u understand.

Ya Ali Madad

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I've also heard that Allah (swt) erased their memory of their time of death before they were killed. E.g. before Imam Hasan (as) took the poison, he knew he would die by that poison but Allah (swt) erased his memory moments before about that aspect.

Don't know how credible that is though.

Edited by Replicant
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Suicide means to give your life away intentionally. A martyr of Allah (swt) means to give your life away intentionally for the cause of Allah (swt). A person who commits suicide goes to hell and resides therein forever. A martyr of Allah (swt) goes straight to Heaven without penalty.

See the difference?

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Do you seriously think that if imam hussain didnt go to Karbala and martyr there, than he would have been safe and alive?

He only had 2 choices as he said, either fight or pledge allegience...

Imam hussain wasn't planning on going to karbala in the first place, he went to Mecca and remained there, but after he heard that Yazeed was ready to kill him even if he was in the kabaa he had to leave and go somewhere else (he didn't even finish his piligrimage as you may know).

And when imam hussain reached karbala his horse stopped and didn't want to move, this was another sign that this was his destined place.

let's than imagine that imam hussain pledged allegience to yazeed, than what would we have... what infallable imam would agree to pledge to a drunk yard who commits all sorts of sins in this world and disregarded the teachings of our holy Prophet (SAW), just imagine what would be our state now if this had happened (no majalis, no knowledge, and a weak shia sect because people will follow the wrong and say if imam Hussain did so (Astagfarullah) why cant we...).

So my brother there was no possible way to escape the tragedy of karbala and imam hussain tried to stop the battle as much as he could, he even called out "if you have no religion than atleast be free in this word".

But unfortunatly he couldn't , I don't know about you but this does not look like suicide to me, he tried to save as much blood as he could, a person that commits suicide isn't forced to do so and is just depressed and has no aim in life...

This was definatly not the character of our Holy imam .

Hope this was helpful

Edited by shia pride
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We've answered a similar question regarding the decision of Imam Hussain (A): http://www.shiaanswers.net/?p=565

I'd like to add to that Allah (SWT) chooses who to give hidden knowledge to (Ilm Alghaib). The ones he choose are on such high status that they do not use this knowledge for their personal advantage but only when it is needed to complete their missions and play their roles from Allah (SWT). That being said they have to deal with people based on what the people show. If someone appears to be credible to everyone and says something, even if the Imam using his special knowledge can tell that he is lying, the Imam will proceed with that information. The Prophet (S) is narrated to have said: "I only judge between you with the sworn statements and the evidence. Some of you may be more convincing than others; however, whoever I take something from his brother and give him [unjustly], he should know I gave him a piece of Hell" (Alkafi 7:414, Wasa'il Alshia 27:232. Sahih Muslim 3:1337).

So for each Imam when they made the decisions that they made (eating poisonous food, Imam Ali praying at the masjid and Imam Hussain going to Karbala) they were doing the normal action which a normal person in their situation would do given the appearances of things. The fact that that leads to their death doesn't mean they committed suicide since they did not cause the action to occur and Allah ordered them to use the regular facts rather than what lies beneath.

Edited by ShiaAnswers
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Salam,

If a person, in the course of his actions, knows that he will die for (100% sure) the sake of Allah swt, then it is not a suicide. How did Imam Hussain (as) was so sure? He was informed by the Prophet (pbuh). And the Prophet (pbuh) was informed by Allah swt.

We should die for a cause...it would be better be for the sake of Allah swt and approved by Him swt. If it is not for the sake of Allah swt then avoid that kind of death.

Layman

Edited by layman
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Ya Ali

How do you explain that Imam Hussain did not commit suicide? Someone is debating me and they are saying that the Prophet (pbuh) told him he will die in Kerbala, so he walked to his death!

Im confused, please help

wasallam

(salam)

I would also like to add that in the quran in verse 72:26-27, Allah (swt) sais:

"He (alone) knows the Unseen (al-ghayb), nor does He make any one acquainted with His Mysteries,- Except to him whom He chooses as a messenger....

also, "Nor shall they compass aught of His knowledge except as He willeth"..(2:255)

from these verses Allah (swt) does not give his knowledge to anyone accept whom he is pleased with, when people say that imam hussein (a.s) knew he was going

to die and commited suicide, they don't know that whoever is given ilm al-ghayb must have patience to take it on, if he (a.s) did not have patience then he would

not have been told where he was going to die, and this is a lesson taken from the story of khoder (a.s) and prophet musa (a.s) in surah 18: al-kahf, which is a vital

story where we can learn from.

Thus the reason why imam hussein (a.s) was given the knowledge where he was going to die because he (a.s) would not run away from the battle because he finds freedom

when he dies (he had the patience), and so a person in suicide is in despair in his life it means nothing to him, but he (a.s) was looking forward to going back to his Lord .

wa salam

Edited by Son Of Adam
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Dear Brother,

"Amar Bil Maroof Nahi Anil Munkar" is the Answer, He was asked for Guidance but when he reached there he was betrayed by None other than So called Muslims.

That is the responsibilty of Imam...

There are three grades of Imaan referred in Hadiths:

1. Doing Amar Bil Maroof Nahi Anil Munkar by Tounge & Hands.

2. Doing it by Only tounge.

3. Cannot do but you curse evil in heart: this is the most low category of Iman.

Surely Imam(as) Did the Best he could had Done....

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I'm appalled to see Abu Abdillah (as) being accused of committing suicide. There is a difference between suicide and martyrdom. In the first case, a person takes their own life because he or she has lost faith in this world or has deemed life not worth living, both of which amount to a crime against Allah, particularly His Wisdom and Justice. However, in the second case, a person submits their own life to the cause of Allah or to destiny, particularly because the inevitability of an outcome has become apparent, knowing that something far better awaits him or her in the afterlife. The difference between suicide and martyrdom is the actor's relationship to faith in Allah.

Edited by al-Irshad
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I am assuming that you want to reply to a non-muslim/non-shia. So giving replies quoting our books would not be of much help.

Example1:

Take examples of political elections. with so much money needed to be spent on it (lets take US elections example). Then logically, one should ideally run for president only if he is sure to win otherwise its a total intentional waste of money (financial suicide). But we do not look at it so because we believe every one has a chance to win, however slight.

In the same way, Imam did have a chance to win. So we can not call it suicide.

Example2:

You go sit for an exam and even before you have exited the exam centre you know you have failed. Even though you tried all your best, but if you fail, would you say that the failure is a result of you knowing that you will fail? No.

Same way, even if Imam knew he and his family would be killed, it does not imply that he willingly went there to get them all killed

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Meaning of the Term "Suicide" according to the Medical Dictionary My link

The meaning derived from herein (source provided) is that WILLFULLY TAKING one's life. In some Societies like the Japanese Tradition, it is considered an Honour to commit suicide in particular circumstances.

FYI - Islam FORBIDS this act (the act of willfully taking one's life).

Imam Hussain laid down his life for dignity. The prophet (pbuh), Imam Ali (as) also knew that he will be martyred and has cursed the "oppressors" of the Imam.

To stand up for opression and to fulfil his grandfather's promise to Almighty Allah, Imam Hussain (A.S) laid down his life in Karbala.

There's a humongous difference between WILLFULLY TAKING & WILLFULLY GIVING UP your life.

Edited by xstatik2
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In secular term, say for example you are a Palestinian and you do not want to submit to the whim and fancy of the Zionist state, then wherever you may be, the Israeli will find ways to harm you. Remember the days of the KGB in Russia?

Imam Husain (as) is of the stance that he does want to submit to Yazid (la). His choice.

Wherever he went to, Yazid's army will spy and pursue. Karbala is just a place. The closing finale could have been anywhere actually.

I do not know if you want to go far to argue that one has already "blatantly committed suicide" when one does not want to submit to something (create whatever scenarios in your head) when the result of doing so could be detrimental to one's life ....

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AA

To understand the cause of imaam hussain you may find the following thread of some help.

Imaad hussian was defending the foundational principle of islam ie freedom of thought and expression against the tyrant who wanted to gag him. So imaam was killed by deception. Most people who claim to be muslims have little or no knowldge of islam.

If people are wrong about principles of islam they cannot be right in their detail.

Edited by Mughal1
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