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In the Name of God بسم الله

Hadith E Thaqalayan

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Please i want the shia/sunni sahih version about Hadith e Thaqalayan.

Sunni sahih version (because as per sunni it is one of the book of sahih hadiths, after sahih bukhari):

Zuhayr ibn Harb and Shuja` ibn Makhlad narrated to me from `Ulayyah that he said: Zuhayr said: narrated to us Isma`il ibn Ibrahim, from Abu Hayyan, from Yazid ibn Hayyan, who said: "I, Husayn ibn Sabrah and `Umar ibn Muslim went to see Zayd ibn Arqam. When we sat down with him, Husayn said to him, 'O Zayd, you have been greatly fortunate. You have seen the Messenger of Allah, upon whom be Allah's peace and benedictions, heard his speech, fought with him in battles and have prayed behind him. Indeed, O Zayd, you have been enormously fortunate. Narrate to us what you have heard from the Messenger of Allah , may Allah's peace and benedictions be upon him.'

"Zayd said: 'O brother, by God, I have become aged and old and I have forgotten some of what I used to remember from the Messenger of Allah , upon whom be Allah's peace and benedictions. So accept what I narrate to you and as to what I don't, trouble me not regarding it.' Then he said: 'One day the Messenger of Allah , upon whom be Allah's peace and benedictions, addressed us near a pond called Khumm between Makkah and Madinah. He praised God and extolled Him and preached and reminded (us). Then he said, "Lo, O people, I am only a human being and I am about to respond to the messenger of my Lord [i.e. the call of death]. I am leaving behind two precious things (thaqalayn) among you. The first of the two is the Book of Allah. In it is guidance and light. So get hold of the Book of Allah and adhere to it." Then he urged and motivated (us) regarding the Book of Allah . Then he said, "And my Ahl al Bayt (family). I urge you to remember God regarding my Ahl al Bayt. I urge you to remember God regarding my Ahl al Bayt. I urge you to remember God regarding my Ahl al Bayt".

(Sahih Muslim, part 7, Kitab fada'il al Sahabah [Maktabat wa Matba`at Muhammad `Ali Subayh wa Awladuhu: Cairo] pp. 122-123.)

http://www.al-islam.org/thaqalayn/nontl/Versions.htm

Shia vesion: I want to know what is the shia sahih version? i.e. itrah or ahle-bayt!

Edited by serious-sam
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Salams

The shia versions also mention Quran and Ahl-ul-bayt (i-e Itrat). However, there are apparantly other narrations in sunni school which refer to Quran and Sunnah. This is where we (shias and sunni) disagree ...........There is also disagreement in the definition of Ahl-ul-bayt for the purpose of guidance in Islam.

Fi-Amanillah

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Salams

The shia versions also mention Quran and Ahl-ul-bayt (i-e Itrat). However, there are apparantly other narrations in sunni school which refer to Quran and Sunnah. This is where we (shias and sunni) disagree ...........There is also disagreement in the definition of Ahl-ul-bayt for the purpose of guidance in Islam.

Fi-Amanillah

As i think sunni's ahle-bayti version is more sahih than sunnati version! (lord botta please help on this issue)

Please tell me the sahih shia version & how definition of ahl-ul-bayt varies? Is there any narration regarding two personalities of ahl-ul-bayt?

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As i think sunni's ahle-bayti version is more sahih than sunnati version!

That wouldn't make any sense though. The sunni's ahle-bayt version includes Bibi Ayesha and Imam Ali in the same list. Both fought an Islamic war resulting in loss of many Muslim lives. Question is, who was responsible ? And how can one of the two members of Ahl-ul-bayt be responsible when both of them are supposed to be a source of guidance ?

Please tell me the sahih shia version & how definition of ahl-ul-bayt varies? Is there any narration regarding two personalities of ahl-ul-bayt?

Generally and literally speaking, ahl-ul-bayt refers to people of the house (Your close family). But shias consider the Prophet's Immaculate Progency as the source of guidance after the demise of the Prophet. As for Sunni Muslims, since they (most of them) do not believe in Masoom progeny of the Prophet and it's divine leadership in Islam, their belief and understanding of Ahl-ul-bayt revolves around general/literal meaning.

Salams

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That wouldn't make any sense though. The sunni's ahle-bayt version includes Bibi Ayesha and Imam Ali in the same list. Both fought an Islamic war resulting in loss of many Muslim lives. Question is, who was responsible ? And how can one of the two members of Ahl-ul-bayt be responsible when both of them are supposed to be a source of guidance ?

But according to sunni's: Both didnot fought intentionally & they din't hate each other but they respect each other.

Generally and literally speaking, ahl-ul-bayt refers to people of the house (Your close family). But shias consider the Prophet's Immaculate Progency as the source of guidance after the demise of the Prophet. As for Sunni Muslims, since they do not believe in Masoom progeny of the Prophet, their belief and understanding of Ahl-ul-bayt revolves around general/literal meaning.

Salams

I want to know: rasool-Allah said "Quran & my ahle-bayt", does ahle-bayt means for respect also or only for guidence?

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As i think sunni's ahle-bayti version is more sahih than sunnati version! (lord botta please help on this issue)

I agree. I have doubts about the sunnati version being authentic.

There are a few things about Ahlul Bayt that one needs to keep in mind though. The Sunni understanding of Ahlul Bayt doesn't limit it to Ali, Fatima, Al-Hasan and Al-Hussain. There are a few possible interpretations. It could include the wives as well. It could include other members like Al-Abbas, Ja'afar bin Abi Talib, Abdullah bin Al-Abbas. It could include other descendants of Ali like Mohammed bin Al-Hanafiya. Basically, there is no real evidence that would cause Sunnis to believe that Ahlul Bayt is specifically limited to Fatima and the twelve Imams.

...and Ahlul Sunnah do hold to the teachings of Ahlul Bayt. I recall Al-Hakim, in Ma'rifat Uloom Al-Hadith, stating that there are two hundred narrators from Ahlul Bayt that we take our hadiths from.

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But according to sunni's: Both didnot fought intentionally & they din't hate each other but they respect each other.

So as long as two members of Ahl-ul-bayt respect and do not hate each other, the loss of muslim lives is okay and part of collateral damage ? Bro, the Prophet is saying that the Ahlulbayt are a source of guidance after him and here we have two confused members of Ahl-ul-bayt (Nauzbillah) who fought even though they respected each other and it was all part of the big scheme called fate ?

I want to know: rasool-Allah said "Quran & my ahle-bayt", does ahle-bayt means for respect also or only for guidence?

According to shias, Immaculate progeny of the Prophet needs to be respected and followed. As for fallible progeny, it only needs to be respected (but not necessarily followed).

Salams

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I agree. I have doubts about the sunnati version being authentic.

There are a few things about Ahlul Bayt that one needs to keep in mind though. The Sunni understanding of Ahlul Bayt doesn't limit it to Ali, Fatima, Al-Hasan and Al-Hussain. There are a few possible interpretations. It could include the wives as well. It could include other members like Al-Abbas, Ja'afar bin Abi Talib, Abdullah bin Al-Abbas. It could include other descendants of Ali like Mohammed bin Al-Hanafiya. Basically, there is no real evidence that would cause Sunnis to believe that Ahlul Bayt is specifically limited to Fatima and the twelve Imams.

...and Ahlul Sunnah do hold to the teachings of Ahlul Bayt. I recall Al-Hakim, in Ma'rifat Uloom Al-Hadith, stating that there are two hundred narrators from Ahlul Bayt that we take our hadiths from.

Can you please quote that hadith of Ma'rifat Uloom Al-Hadith with page no.

So as long as two members of Ahl-ul-bayt respect and do not hate each other, the loss of muslim lives is okay and part of collateral damage ? Bro, the Prophet is saying that the Ahlulbayt are a source of guidance after him and here we have two confused members of Ahl-ul-bayt (Nauzbillah) who fought even though they respected each other and it was all part of the big scheme called fate ?

Bro i said: According to sunni's: They didnot fought intentionally but there was conspiracy of non-believers.

According to shias, Immaculate progeny of the Prophet needs to be respected and followed. As for fallible progeny, it only needs to be respected (but not necessarily followed).

Salams

Your wordings should be like this:

According to shias, Immaculate ahle-bayt of the Prophet needs to be respected and followed. As for fallible ahle-bayt, it only needs to be respected (but not necessarily followed).

Because hadith-e-thaqlayan didnot said progeny! It says about ahle-bayt.

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Bro i said: According to sunni's: They didnot fought intentionally but there was conspiracy of non-believers.

Firstly, there was no conspiracy of non-believers. Muslims i-e companions of the Prophet were involved. I havn't read any sunni text claiming that non-believers were involved. It was mostly zubair and talha.

Secondly, I am just making a point that the content of Hadith e thaqlain contradicts this belief that two members of Ahl-ul-bayt fought an unintentional battle.

Your wordings should be like this:

According to shias, Immaculate ahle-bayt of the Prophet needs to be respected and followed. As for fallible ahle-bayt, it only needs to be respected (but not necessarily followed).

Because hadith-e-thaqlayan didnot said progeny! It says about ahle-bayt.

Hadith e Thaqlayn refers to Itrat which is also translated as progeny. But I get your point... and I have no disagreement with the 'correction'.

Salams

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From al-Khisal of Shaykh Saduq (ar). . .

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w/s

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From al-Khisal of Shaykh Saduq (ar). . .

ÍÏËäÇ ãÍãÏ Èä ÇáÍÓä Èä ÃÍãÏ Èä ÇáæáíÏ ÑÖí Çááå Úäå ÞÇá: ÍÏËäÇ ãÍãÏ Èä - ÇáÍÓä ÇáÕÝÇÑ¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ÇáÍÓíä Èä ÃÈí ÇáÎØÇÈ¡ æíÚÞæÈ Èä íÒíÏ ÌãíÚÇ¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ÃÈí ÚãíÑ¡ Úä ÚÈÏ Çááå Èä ÓäÇä¡ Úä ãÚÑæÝ Èä ÎÑÈæС Úä ÃÈí ÇáØÝíá ÚÇãÑ Èä æÇËáÉ¡ Úä ÍÐíÝÉ Èä ÃÓíÏ ÇáÛÝÇÑí ÞÇá: áãÇ ÑÌÚ ÑÓæá Çááå Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå ãä ÍÌÉ ÇáæÏÇÚ æäÍä ãÚå ÃÞÈá ÍÊì ÇäÊåì Åáì ÇáÌÍÝÉ ÝÃãÑ ÃÕÍÇÈå ÈÇáäÒæá ÝäÒá ÇáÞæã ãäÇÒáåã¡ Ëã äæÏí ÈÇáÕáÇÉ ÝÕáì ÈÃÕÍÇÈå ÑßÚÊíä¡ Ëã ÃÞÈá ÈæÌåå Åáíåã ÝÞÇá áåã: Åäå ÞÏ äÈÃäí ÇááØíÝ ÇáÎÈíÑ Ãäí ãíÊ æÃäßã ãíÊæä¡ æßÃäí ÞÏ ÏÚíÊ ÝÇÌÈÊ æÃäí ãÓÄæá ÚãÇ ÇÑÓáÊ Èå Åáíßã¡ æÚãÇ ÎáÝÊ Ýíßã ãä ßÊÇÈ Çááå æÍÌÊå æÃäßã ãÓÄæáæä¡ ÝãÇ ÃäÊã ÞÇÆáæä áÑÈßã¿ ÞÇáæÇ: äÞæá: ÞÏ ÈáÛÊ æäÕÍÊ æÌÇåÏÊ - ÝÌÒÇß Çááå ÚäÇ ÃÝÖá ÇáÌÒÇÁ - Ëã ÞÇá áåã: ÃáÓÊã ÊÔåÏæä Ãä áÇ Åáå ÅáÇ Çááå æÃäí ÑÓæá Çááå Åáíßã æÃä ÇáÌäÉ ÍÞ¿ æÃä ÇáäÇÑ ÍÞ¿ æÃä ÇáÈÚË ÈÚÏ ÇáãæÊ ÍÞ¿ ÝÞÇáæÇ: äÔåÏ ÈÐáß¡ ÞÇá: Çááåã ÇÔåÏ Úáì ãÇ íÞæáæä¡ ÃáÇ æÅäí ÇÔåÏßã Ãäí ÃÔåÏ Ãä Çááå ãæáÇí¡ æÃäÇ ãæáì ßá ãÓáã¡ æÃäÇ Ãæáì ÈÇáãÄãäíä ãä ÃäÝÓåã¡ Ýåá ÊÞÑæä áí ÈÐáß¡ æÊÔåÏæä áí Èå¿ ÝÞÇáæÇ: äÚã äÔåÏ áß ÈÐáß¡ ÝÞÇá: ÃáÇ ãä ßäÊ ãæáÇå ÝÅä ÚáíÇ ãæáÇå (1) æåæ åÐÇ¡ Ëã ÃÎÐ ÈíÏ Úáí Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã ÝÑÝÚåÇ ãÚ íÏå ÍÊì ÈÏÊ ÂÈÇØåãÇ: Ëã: ÞÇá: Çááåã æÇá ãä æÇáÇå¡ æÚÇÏ ãä ÚÇÏÇå¡ æÇäÕÑ ãä äÕÑå æÇÎÐá ãä ÎÐáå¡ ÃáÇ æÅäí ÝÑØßã (2) æÃäÊã æÇÑÏæä Úáí ÇáÍæÖ¡ ÍæÖí ÛÏÇ æåæ ÍæÖ ÚÑÖå ãÇ Èíä ÈÕÑì æÕäÚÇÁ (3) Ýíå ÃÞÏÇÍ ãä ÝÖÉ ÚÏÏ äÌæã ÇáÓãÇÁ¡ ÃáÇ æÅäí ÓÇÆáßã ÛÏÇ ãÇÐÇ ÕäÚÊã ÝíãÇ ÃÔåÏÊ Çááå Èå Úáíßã Ýí íæãßã åÐÇ ÅÐÇ æÑÏÊã Úáí ÍæÖí¡ æãÇÐÇ ÕäÚÊã ÈÇáËÞáíä (4) ãä ÈÚÏí ÝÇäÙÑæÇ ßíÝ Êßæäæä ÎáÝÊãæäí ÝíåãÇ Ííä ÊáÞæäí¿ ÞÇáæÇ: æãÇ åÐÇä ÇáËÞáÇä íÇ ÑÓæá Çááå¿ ÞÇá: ÃãÇ ÇáËÞá ÇáÇßÈÑ ÝßÊÇÈ Çááå ÚÒæÌá¡ ÓÈÈ ããÏæÏ ãä Çááå æãäí Ýí ÃíÏíßã¡ ØÑÝå ÈíÏ Çááå æÇáØÑÝ ÇáÂÎÑ ÈÃíÏíßã¡ Ýíå Úáã ãÇ ãÖì æãÇ ÈÞí Åáì Ãä ÊÞæã ÇáÓÇÚÉ¡ æÃãÇ ÇáËÞá ÇáÇÕÛÑ Ýå ÍáíÝ ÇáÞÑÂä (5) æåæ Úáí Èä ÃÈí ØÇáÈ æ ÚÊÑÊå Úáíåã ÇáÓáÇã¡ æÅäåãÇ áä íÝÊÑÞÇ ÍÊì íÑÏÇ Úáí ÇáÍæÖ. ÞÇá ãÚÑæÝ Èä ÎÑÈæÐ: ÝÚÑÖÊ åÐÇ ÇáßáÇã Úáì ÃÈí ÌÚÝÑ Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã ÝÞÇá: ÕÏÞ ÃÈæ ÇáØÝíá - ÑÍãå Çááå - åÐÇ ÇáßáÇã æÌÏäÇå Ýí ßÊÇÈ Úáí Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã æÚÑÝäÇå.

æÍÏËäÇ ÃÈí ÑÖí Çááå Úäå ÞÇá: ÍÏËäÇ Úáí Èä ÅÈÑÇåíã¡ Úä ÃÈíå¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä - ÃÈí ÚãíÑ æÍÏËäÇ ÌÚÝÑ Èä ãÍãÏ Èä ãÓÑæÑ ÑÖí Çááå Úäå ÞÇá: ÍÏËäÇ ÇáÍÓíä Èä ãÍãÏ ÇÈä ÚÇãÑ¡ Úä Úãå ÚÈÏ Çááå Èä ÚÇãÑ¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ÃÈí ÚãíÑ. æÍÏËäÇ ãÍãÏ Èä ãæÓì Èä ÇáãÊæßá ÑÖí Çááå Úäå ÞÇá: ÍÏËäÇ Úáí Èä ÇáÍÓíä ÇáÓÚÏ ÂÈÇÏí¡ Úä ÃÍãÏ Èä ÃÈí ÚÈÏ Çááå ÇáÈÑÞí¡ Úä ÃÈíå¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ÃÈí ÚãíÑ¡ Úä ÚÈÏ Çááå Èä ÓäÇä Úä ãÚÑæÝ Èä ÎÑÈæС Úä ÃÈí ÇáØÝíá ÚÇãÑ Èä æÇËáÉ¡ Úä ÍÐíÝÉ Èä - ÃÓíÏ ÇáÛÝÇÑí ÈãËá åÐÇ ÇáÍÏíË ÓæÇÁ

w/s

(salam)

brother, is this hadith sahih?

also, is this the only version of hadith thaqalayn in Shi`a sources?

thanks

Wassalam

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I agree. I have doubts about the sunnati version being authentic.

There are a few things about Ahlul Bayt that one needs to keep in mind though. The Sunni understanding of Ahlul Bayt doesn't limit it to Ali, Fatima, Al-Hasan and Al-Hussain. There are a few possible interpretations. It could include the wives as well. It could include other members like Al-Abbas, Ja'afar bin Abi Talib, Abdullah bin Al-Abbas. It could include other descendants of Ali like Mohammed bin Al-Hanafiya. Basically, there is no real evidence that would cause Sunnis to believe that Ahlul Bayt is specifically limited to Fatima and the twelve Imams.

...and Ahlul Sunnah do hold to the teachings of Ahlul Bayt. I recall Al-Hakim, in Ma'rifat Uloom Al-Hadith, stating that there are two hundred narrators from Ahlul Bayt that we take our hadiths from.

Bro my understanding is the whole Banu abdul Muttalib is Ahlulbayt historically

e.g Obaidah b Harith martyr at Badr , Tufail b Harith a Badri , Zubair b Abdullah ( an uncle of Ali not the famous sahabi ) martyr at Adnajan are all included in Ahlulbayt

what is your view cuz it seems you include only abbas and his progeny along with ali and his family, what about uncles and nephews of Ali from abu talib's other brothers ( not just abbas)

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(salam)

brother, is this hadith sahih?

also, is this the only version of hadith thaqalayn in Shi`a sources?

thanks

Wassalam

No, not sahih but hasan I think.

This is a better sanad. . .

From Uyun and Kamal ad-Deen of Shaykh Saduq (ar). . .

æÍÏøËäÇ ÃÍãÏ Èä ÒíÇÏ Èä ÌÚÝÑ ÇáåãÏÇäíø ÞÇá : ÍÏøËäÇ Úáí Èä ÅÈÑÇåíã Èä åÇÔã ¡ Úä ÃÈíå ¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ÃÈí ÚãíÑ ¡ Úä ÛíÇË Èä ÅÈÑÇåíã ¡ Úä ÇáÕÇÏÞ Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã ¡ Úä ÃÈíå ãÍãÏ Èä Úáíø ¡ Úä ÃÈíå Úáíø ¡ Úä ÃÈíå ÇáÍÓíä Úáíåã ÇáÓáÇã ÞÇá : « ÓÆá ÃãíÑ ÇáãÄãäíä Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã Úä ãÚäì Þæá ÑÓæá Çááå Õáøì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå æÓáøã : Åäøí ãÎáøÝ Ýíßã ÇáËÞáíä ßÊÇÈ Çááå æÚÊÑÊí ¡ ãóä ÇáÚÊÑÉ¿ ÝÞÇá : ÃäÇ æÇáÍÓä æÇáÍÓíä æÇáÇóÆãøÉ ÇáÊÓÚÉ ãä æáÏ ÇáÍÓíä ¡ ÊÇÓÚåã ãåÏíøåã æÞÇÆãåã ¡ áÇ íÝÇÑÞæä ßÊÇÈ Çááå æáÇ íÝÇÑÞåã ÍÊøì íÑÏæÇ Úáì ÑÓæá Çááå Õáøì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå æÓáøã ÍæÖå

w/s

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And sahih from al-Kafi. . .

محمد بن يحيى، عن أحمد بن محمد، عن الحسين بن سعيد، عن النضر بن سويد، عن يحيى الحلبي، عن بريد بن معاوية، عن محمد بن مسلم، عن أبي جعفر (عليه السلام) في خطبة يوم الجمعة الخطبة الاولى:

الحمد لله نحمده ونستعينه ونستغفره ونستهديه ونعوذ بالله من شرور أنفسنا ومن سيئات أعمالنا، من يهدي الله فلا مضل له ومن يضلل فلا هادي له.

وأشهد أن لا إله إلا الله وحده لا شريك له وأشهد أن محمدا عبده ورسوله انتجبه لولايته واختصه برسالته وأكرمه بالنبوة، أمينا على غيبه ورحمة للعالمين وصلى الله على محمد وآله و(عليهم السلام).

اوصيكم عباد الله بتقوى الله واخوفكم من عقابه فإن الله ينجي من اتقاه بمفازتهم لايمسهم السوء ولا هم يحزنون ويكرم من خافه يقيهم شر ما خافوا ويلقيهم نضرة وسرورا وارغبكم في كرامة الله الدائمة واخوفكم عقابه الذي لا انقطاع له ولا نجاة لمن استوجبه فلا تعزنكم الدنيا ولا تركنوا إليها فإنها دار غرور، كتب الله عليها وعلى أهلها الفناء فتزودوا منها الذي أكرمكم الله به من التقوى والعمل الصالح فإنه لا يصل إلى الله من إعمال العباد إلا ما خلص منها ولا يتقبل الله إلا من المتقين وقد أخبركم الله عن منازل من آمن وعمل صالحا وعن منازل من كفر وعمل في غير سبيله وقال: " ذلك يوم مجموع له الناس وذلك يوم مشهود * وما نؤخره إلا لاجل معدود * يوم يأتي لا تكلم نفس إلا بإذنه فمنهم شقي وسعيد * فأما الذين شقوا ففي النار لهم فيها زفير وشهيق خالدين فيها ما دامت السموات والارض إلا ما شاء ربك إن ربك فعال لما يريد وأما الذين سعدوا ففي الجنة خالدين فيها مادامت السموات والارض إلا ما شاء ربك عطاء غير مجذوذ (1) " نسأل الله الذي جمعنا لهذا الجمع أن يبارك لنا في يومنا هذا وأن يرحمنا جميعا إنه على كل شئ قدير

إن كتاب الله أصدق الحديث وأحسن القصص وقال الله عزوجل: " وإذا قرئ القرآن فاستمعوا له وأنصتوا لعلكم ترحمون " (1) فاسمعوا طاعة [ا] لله وأنصتوا ابتغاء رحمته.

ثم اقرأ سورة من القرآن وادع ربك وصل على النبي (ص) وادع للمؤمنين والمؤمنات. ثم تجلس قدر ما تمكن هنيهة ثم تقوم فتقول:

الحمد لله نحمده ونستعينه ونستغفره ونستهديه ونؤمن به ونتوكل عليه ونعوذ بالله من شرور أنفسنا ومن سيئات أعمالنا، من يهدي الله فلا مضل له ومن يضلل فلا هادي له.

وأشهد أن لا إله إلا الله وحده لا شريك له وأشهد أن محمدا عبده ورسوله أرسله بالهدى ودين الحق ليظهره على الدين كله ولو كره المشركون وجعله رحمة للعالمين بشيرا ونذيرا وداعيا إلى الله بإذنه وسراجا منيرا من يطع الله ورسوله فقد رشد ومن يعصهما فقد غوى.

اوصيكم عباد الله بتقوى الله الذي ينفع بطاعته من أطاعه والذي يضر بمعصيته من عصاه، الذي إليه معادكم وعليه حسابكم فإن التقوى وصية الله فيكم وفي الذين من قبلكم قال الله عزوجل: " ولقد وصينا الذين اوتوا الكتاب من قبلكم وإياكم أن اتقوا الله وأن تكفروا فإن لله ما في السموات وما في الارض وكان الله غنيا حميدا (2) " انتفعوا بموعظة الله وألزموا كتابه فإنه أبلغ الموعظة وخير الامور في المعاد عاقبة ولقد اتخذ الله الحجة فلا يهلك من هلك إلا عن بينة ولا يحيى من حي إلا عن بينة وقد بلغ رسول الله (صلى الله عليه وآله) الذي ارسل به فألزموا وصيته وما ترك فيكم من بعده من الثقلين كتاب الله وأهل بيته اللذين لا يضل من تمسك بهما ولا يهتدي من تركهما، اللهم صل على محمد عبدك ورسولك سيد المرسلين وإمام المتقين ورسول رب العالمين - ثم تقول -: اللهم صل على أمير المؤمنين ووصي رسول رب العالمين

. . .

http://al-shia.org/html/ara/books/lib-hadis/al-kafi-3/20.htm

w/s

Edited by Jondab_Azdi
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Bro my understanding is the whole Banu abdul Muttalib is Ahlulbayt historically

e.g Obaidah b Harith martyr at Badr , Tufail b Harith a Badri , Zubair b Abdullah ( an uncle of Ali not the famous sahabi ) martyr at Adnajan are all included in Ahlulbayt

what is your view cuz it seems you include only abbas and his progeny along with ali and his family, what about uncles and nephews of Ali from abu talib's other brothers ( not just abbas)

It doesn't have to be limited to Al-Abbas and his children. I just thought of him off the top of my head. I don't have any objections of those you've mentioned above being included in Ahlul Bayt.

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Salam,

Allow me to add a new dimension to this discussion:

Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "There will be twelve Muslim rulers." He then said a sentence which I did not hear. My father said, "All of them (those rulers) will be from Quraish."

In bukhari, muslim, Abu dawood and many others

As you all might know the only 12 known amirs were Imam Ali and his sons [as] . Now thats agreed what was there position regarding who the ahulubayt were?

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Salam,

Allow me to add a new dimension to this discussion:

Narrated Jabir bin Samura: I heard Muhammad saying, "There will be twelve Muslim rulers." He then said a sentence which I did not hear. My father said, "All of them (those rulers) will be from Quraish."

In bukhari, muslim, Abu dawood and many others

As you all might know the only 12 known amirs were Imam Ali and his sons [as] . Now thats agreed what was there position regarding who the ahulubayt were?

Pfffft... How many of those were actual Amirs?

The hadith says nothing about who the Ahlul Bayt are. Plus, we don't believe in the existence of Mohammed bin Hasan Al-Askari. Just because Shias associate these hadiths with their chosen Ahlul Bayt doesn't mean that Sunnis have to do the same with the exact same individuals. Bottom line is that there is no connection between the two hadiths. Just because Shias connect the two, doesn't mean that Sunnis should.

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Please i want the shia/sunni sahih version about Hadith e Thaqalayan.

Sunni sahih version (because as per sunni it is one of the book of sahih hadiths, after sahih bukhari):

Zuhayr ibn Harb and Shuja` ibn Makhlad narrated to me from `Ulayyah that he said: Zuhayr said: narrated to us Isma`il ibn Ibrahim, from Abu Hayyan, from Yazid ibn Hayyan, who said: "I, Husayn ibn Sabrah and `Umar ibn Muslim went to see Zayd ibn Arqam. When we sat down with him, Husayn said to him, 'O Zayd, you have been greatly fortunate. You have seen the Messenger of Allah, upon whom be Allah's peace and benedictions, heard his speech, fought with him in battles and have prayed behind him. Indeed, O Zayd, you have been enormously fortunate. Narrate to us what you have heard from the Messenger of Allah , may Allah's peace and benedictions be upon him.'

"Zayd said: 'O brother, by God, I have become aged and old and I have forgotten some of what I used to remember from the Messenger of Allah , upon whom be Allah's peace and benedictions. So accept what I narrate to you and as to what I don't, trouble me not regarding it.' Then he said: 'One day the Messenger of Allah , upon whom be Allah's peace and benedictions, addressed us near a pond called Khumm between Makkah and Madinah. He praised God and extolled Him and preached and reminded (us). Then he said, "Lo, O people, I am only a human being and I am about to respond to the messenger of my Lord [i.e. the call of death]. I am leaving behind two precious things (thaqalayn) among you. The first of the two is the Book of Allah. In it is guidance and light. So get hold of the Book of Allah and adhere to it." Then he urged and motivated (us) regarding the Book of Allah . Then he said, "And my Ahl al Bayt (family). I urge you to remember God regarding my Ahl al Bayt. I urge you to remember God regarding my Ahl al Bayt. I urge you to remember God regarding my Ahl al Bayt".

(Sahih Muslim, part 7, Kitab fada'il al Sahabah [Maktabat wa Matba`at Muhammad `Ali Subayh wa Awladuhu: Cairo] pp. 122-123.)

http://www.al-islam.org/thaqalayn/nontl/Versions.htm

Shia vesion: I want to know what is the shia sahih version? i.e. itrah or ahle-bayt!

(bismillah)

(salam)

first i highlight khumm because there is some revisionist literature with regards to denying that the holy prophet (pbuh) ever addressed the people at khumm

and all sorts of maps are pulled up and then shown as to it was impossible for people to gather there for the split to their destinations etc

for as they say prove no place and the hadith will fade away, for their mawla argument has been beaten to the ground

infact anyone who follows conjecture with regards to mawla is beaten to the ground

the second part makes mention of two precious things and that is why it is so dangerous to take things without their full context and understanding

when one is so high how can the second be so ordinary(they are both a source of guidance)

poor bro layman kept harping about this but alas fell on deaf ears

remember ibrahim(as) and imams in his dhuriat(progeny)

and no unjust from them

and sis zainabia's article on aal e nabuwa or aal e aathar (tatheer)

and many prophets were not amirs of their times

so amiriat(kingship) is not synonomous with guidance

that is why sufis have a chain of guidance of wilaya

and maulana maudoodi wrote a famous book called khilafat and kingship

and that is why the sunnis have the four rightly guided caliphs and stop there

more thought needs to go in the posts

(wasalam)

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And sahih from al-Kafi. . .

محمد بن يحيى، عن أحمد بن محمد، عن الحسين بن سعيد، عن النضر بن سويد، عن يحيى الحلبي، عن بريد بن معاوية، عن محمد بن مسلم، عن أبي جعفر (عليه السلام) في خطبة يوم الجمعة الخطبة الاولى:

الحمد لله نحمده ونستعينه ونستغفره ونستهديه ونعوذ بالله من شرور أنفسنا ومن سيئات أعمالنا، من يهدي الله فلا مضل له ومن يضلل فلا هادي له.

وأشهد أن لا إله إلا الله وحده لا شريك له وأشهد أن محمدا عبده ورسوله انتجبه لولايته واختصه برسالته وأكرمه بالنبوة، أمينا على غيبه ورحمة للعالمين وصلى الله على محمد وآله و(عليهم السلام).

اوصيكم عباد الله بتقوى الله واخوفكم من عقابه فإن الله ينجي من اتقاه بمفازتهم لايمسهم السوء ولا هم يحزنون ويكرم من خافه يقيهم شر ما خافوا ويلقيهم نضرة وسرورا وارغبكم في كرامة الله الدائمة واخوفكم عقابه الذي لا انقطاع له ولا نجاة لمن استوجبه فلا تعزنكم الدنيا ولا تركنوا إليها فإنها دار غرور، كتب الله عليها وعلى أهلها الفناء فتزودوا منها الذي أكرمكم الله به من التقوى والعمل الصالح فإنه لا يصل إلى الله من إعمال العباد إلا ما خلص منها ولا يتقبل الله إلا من المتقين وقد أخبركم الله عن منازل من آمن وعمل صالحا وعن منازل من كفر وعمل في غير سبيله وقال: " ذلك يوم مجموع له الناس وذلك يوم مشهود * وما نؤخره إلا لاجل معدود * يوم يأتي لا تكلم نفس إلا بإذنه فمنهم شقي وسعيد * فأما الذين شقوا ففي النار لهم فيها زفير وشهيق خالدين فيها ما دامت السموات والارض إلا ما شاء ربك إن ربك فعال لما يريد وأما الذين سعدوا ففي الجنة خالدين فيها مادامت السموات والارض إلا ما شاء ربك عطاء غير مجذوذ (1) " نسأل الله الذي جمعنا لهذا الجمع أن يبارك لنا في يومنا هذا وأن يرحمنا جميعا إنه على كل شئ قدير

إن كتاب الله أصدق الحديث وأحسن القصص وقال الله عزوجل: " وإذا قرئ القرآن فاستمعوا له وأنصتوا لعلكم ترحمون " (1) فاسمعوا طاعة [ا] لله وأنصتوا ابتغاء رحمته.

ثم اقرأ سورة من القرآن وادع ربك وصل على النبي (ص) وادع للمؤمنين والمؤمنات. ثم تجلس قدر ما تمكن هنيهة ثم تقوم فتقول:

الحمد لله نحمده ونستعينه ونستغفره ونستهديه ونؤمن به ونتوكل عليه ونعوذ بالله من شرور أنفسنا ومن سيئات أعمالنا، من يهدي الله فلا مضل له ومن يضلل فلا هادي له.

وأشهد أن لا إله إلا الله وحده لا شريك له وأشهد أن محمدا عبده ورسوله أرسله بالهدى ودين الحق ليظهره على الدين كله ولو كره المشركون وجعله رحمة للعالمين بشيرا ونذيرا وداعيا إلى الله بإذنه وسراجا منيرا من يطع الله ورسوله فقد رشد ومن يعصهما فقد غوى.

اوصيكم عباد الله بتقوى الله الذي ينفع بطاعته من أطاعه والذي يضر بمعصيته من عصاه، الذي إليه معادكم وعليه حسابكم فإن التقوى وصية الله فيكم وفي الذين من قبلكم قال الله عزوجل: " ولقد وصينا الذين اوتوا الكتاب من قبلكم وإياكم أن اتقوا الله وأن تكفروا فإن لله ما في السموات وما في الارض وكان الله غنيا حميدا (2) " انتفعوا بموعظة الله وألزموا كتابه فإنه أبلغ الموعظة وخير الامور في المعاد عاقبة ولقد اتخذ الله الحجة فلا يهلك من هلك إلا عن بينة ولا يحيى من حي إلا عن بينة وقد بلغ رسول الله (صلى الله عليه وآله) الذي ارسل به فألزموا وصيته وما ترك فيكم من بعده من الثقلين كتاب الله وأهل بيته اللذين لا يضل من تمسك بهما ولا يهتدي من تركهما، اللهم صل على محمد عبدك ورسولك سيد المرسلين وإمام المتقين ورسول رب العالمين - ثم تقول -: اللهم صل على أمير المؤمنين ووصي رسول رب العالمين

. . .

http://al-shia.org/html/ara/books/lib-hadis/al-kafi-3/20.htm

w/s

thanks. Is this most authentic?

Can you please quote here the opinion of allamah majlisi (& others) regarding this hadith i.e. where (book & page no.) he considered this hadith as sahih!

As i can see this hadith signifies: "ahle-bayt" not "itrah".

Jondab Azdi: Request for one more help: Is there any hadith which signifies that rasool-Allah differentiated b/w the two ahle-bayt personalities?

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thanks. Is this most authentic?

The one I quoted in post 14 is also authentic.

Can you please quote here the opinion of allamah majlisi (& others) regarding this hadith i.e. where (book & page no.) he considered this hadith as sahih!

As i can see this hadith signifies: "ahle-bayt" not "itrah".

Jondab Azdi: Request for one more help: Is there any hadith which signifies that rasool-Allah differentiated b/w the two ahle-bayt personalities?

Sahih a/c to Majlisi in Mirat al-Uqul Vol. 15, Pg. 356

الحديث السادس)

(1): صحيح

http://gadir.free.fr/Ar/Ehlibeyt/kutub2/Mirat_ul_Ukul/015.htm

w/s

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From al-Khisal of Shaykh Saduq (ar). . .

ÍÏËäÇ ãÍãÏ Èä ÇáÍÓä Èä ÃÍãÏ Èä ÇáæáíÏ ÑÖí Çááå Úäå ÞÇá: ÍÏËäÇ ãÍãÏ Èä - ÇáÍÓä ÇáÕÝÇÑ¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ÇáÍÓíä Èä ÃÈí ÇáÎØÇÈ¡ æíÚÞæÈ Èä íÒíÏ ÌãíÚÇ¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ÃÈí ÚãíÑ¡ Úä ÚÈÏ Çááå Èä ÓäÇä¡ Úä ãÚÑæÝ Èä ÎÑÈæС Úä ÃÈí ÇáØÝíá ÚÇãÑ Èä æÇËáÉ¡ Úä ÍÐíÝÉ Èä ÃÓíÏ ÇáÛÝÇÑí ÞÇá: áãÇ ÑÌÚ ÑÓæá Çááå Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå ãä ÍÌÉ ÇáæÏÇÚ æäÍä ãÚå ÃÞÈá ÍÊì ÇäÊåì Åáì ÇáÌÍÝÉ ÝÃãÑ ÃÕÍÇÈå ÈÇáäÒæá ÝäÒá ÇáÞæã ãäÇÒáåã¡ Ëã äæÏí ÈÇáÕáÇÉ ÝÕáì ÈÃÕÍÇÈå ÑßÚÊíä¡ Ëã ÃÞÈá ÈæÌåå Åáíåã ÝÞÇá áåã: Åäå ÞÏ äÈÃäí ÇááØíÝ ÇáÎÈíÑ Ãäí ãíÊ æÃäßã ãíÊæä¡ æßÃäí ÞÏ ÏÚíÊ ÝÇÌÈÊ æÃäí ãÓÄæá ÚãÇ ÇÑÓáÊ Èå Åáíßã¡ æÚãÇ ÎáÝÊ Ýíßã ãä ßÊÇÈ Çááå æÍÌÊå æÃäßã ãÓÄæáæä¡ ÝãÇ ÃäÊã ÞÇÆáæä áÑÈßã¿ ÞÇáæÇ: äÞæá: ÞÏ ÈáÛÊ æäÕÍÊ æÌÇåÏÊ - ÝÌÒÇß Çááå ÚäÇ ÃÝÖá ÇáÌÒÇÁ - Ëã ÞÇá áåã: ÃáÓÊã ÊÔåÏæä Ãä áÇ Åáå ÅáÇ Çááå æÃäí ÑÓæá Çááå Åáíßã æÃä ÇáÌäÉ ÍÞ¿ æÃä ÇáäÇÑ ÍÞ¿ æÃä ÇáÈÚË ÈÚÏ ÇáãæÊ ÍÞ¿ ÝÞÇáæÇ: äÔåÏ ÈÐáß¡ ÞÇá: Çááåã ÇÔåÏ Úáì ãÇ íÞæáæä¡ ÃáÇ æÅäí ÇÔåÏßã Ãäí ÃÔåÏ Ãä Çááå ãæáÇí¡ æÃäÇ ãæáì ßá ãÓáã¡ æÃäÇ Ãæáì ÈÇáãÄãäíä ãä ÃäÝÓåã¡ Ýåá ÊÞÑæä áí ÈÐáß¡ æÊÔåÏæä áí Èå¿ ÝÞÇáæÇ: äÚã äÔåÏ áß ÈÐáß¡ ÝÞÇá: ÃáÇ ãä ßäÊ ãæáÇå ÝÅä ÚáíÇ ãæáÇå (1) æåæ åÐÇ¡ Ëã ÃÎÐ ÈíÏ Úáí Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã ÝÑÝÚåÇ ãÚ íÏå ÍÊì ÈÏÊ ÂÈÇØåãÇ: Ëã: ÞÇá: Çááåã æÇá ãä æÇáÇå¡ æÚÇÏ ãä ÚÇÏÇå¡ æÇäÕÑ ãä äÕÑå æÇÎÐá ãä ÎÐáå¡ ÃáÇ æÅäí ÝÑØßã (2) æÃäÊã æÇÑÏæä Úáí ÇáÍæÖ¡ ÍæÖí ÛÏÇ æåæ ÍæÖ ÚÑÖå ãÇ Èíä ÈÕÑì æÕäÚÇÁ (3) Ýíå ÃÞÏÇÍ ãä ÝÖÉ ÚÏÏ äÌæã ÇáÓãÇÁ¡ ÃáÇ æÅäí ÓÇÆáßã ÛÏÇ ãÇÐÇ ÕäÚÊã ÝíãÇ ÃÔåÏÊ Çááå Èå Úáíßã Ýí íæãßã åÐÇ ÅÐÇ æÑÏÊã Úáí ÍæÖí¡ æãÇÐÇ ÕäÚÊã ÈÇáËÞáíä (4) ãä ÈÚÏí ÝÇäÙÑæÇ ßíÝ Êßæäæä ÎáÝÊãæäí ÝíåãÇ Ííä ÊáÞæäí¿ ÞÇáæÇ: æãÇ åÐÇä ÇáËÞáÇä íÇ ÑÓæá Çááå¿ ÞÇá: ÃãÇ ÇáËÞá ÇáÇßÈÑ ÝßÊÇÈ Çááå ÚÒæÌá¡ ÓÈÈ ããÏæÏ ãä Çááå æãäí Ýí ÃíÏíßã¡ ØÑÝå ÈíÏ Çááå æÇáØÑÝ ÇáÂÎÑ ÈÃíÏíßã¡ Ýíå Úáã ãÇ ãÖì æãÇ ÈÞí Åáì Ãä ÊÞæã ÇáÓÇÚÉ¡ æÃãÇ ÇáËÞá ÇáÇÕÛÑ Ýå ÍáíÝ ÇáÞÑÂä (5) æåæ Úáí Èä ÃÈí ØÇáÈ æ ÚÊÑÊå Úáíåã ÇáÓáÇã¡ æÅäåãÇ áä íÝÊÑÞÇ ÍÊì íÑÏÇ Úáí ÇáÍæÖ.

Muhammad ibn al-Hassan ibn Ahmad ibn al-Walid - may God be pleased with him - narrated that Muhammad ibn al-Hassan al-Saffar quoted Muhammad ibn al-Hussein ibn Abil-Khat’tab and Yaqoob ibn Yazid, on the authority of Muhammad ibn Abi Umayr, on the authority of Abdullah ibn Sin’an, on the authority of Ma’ruf ibn Kharboz, on the authority of Abil Tufayl Amer ibn Vasele’, on the authority of Haziqat ibn Asid al-Qaffari, “When God’s Prophet (MGB) returned from the Farewell Pilgrimage we were with him (MGB). When we reached Al-Juhfa, the Prophet (MGB) ordered his companions to relax. Then the people all settled down. Then they said the call to prayer and the Prophet (MGB) said two units of prayers with his companions. Then the Prophet (MGB) turned towards them and told them, ‘The Graceful, the All-Aware has informed me that I will die and so shall you. Assume that I have answered God’s call. I am held responsible to God regarding what I have delivered to you. Verily, I am leaving behind God’s Book and His Proof. You are held responsible for them. What would you tell your Lord?’ They said, ‘We will say that you fulfilled your mission, gave us advice, and strived. May God grant you the best reward on our behalf.’”

Then the Prophet (MGB) asked them, “Don’t you bear witness that there is no god but One; that I am God’s Prophet sent to you; that Paradise does exist; that Hell does exist; and that there is resurrection after death?” They replied, “We bear witness to this.”

The Prophet (MGB) said, “May God bear witness to what you say. I take you as witnesses and bear witness that God is my Master. I am the Master of all Muslims. Is it not true that my Mastery over the believers is more than that of their own mastery over themselves? Do you believe in this? Will you bear witness to this?” They replied, “We bear witness to this.”

Then the Prophet (MGB) said, “Whoever I am the Master of, Ali is the Master of.” Then he grabbed Ali’s hand and raised it up along with his own hand in such a way that both their underarms could be seen. Then the Prophet (MGB) said, “O my God! Please be the friend of his friends and be the enemy of his enemies. Assist whoever assists him, and abandon whoever abandons him. I shall leave and you will meet me again at the Heavenly Pool[144] later. That is a Pool whose width expands from Bosri to San’a. There are as many silver goblets in it as there are stars in the sky. Then I shall question you about what you bear witness to today when I meet you at my Pool. I will ask you what you did with the Two Heavy Things and how you dealt with what I left behind when you meet me. “

They said, “O Messenger of God! What are the Two Heavy Things?”

The Prophet (MGB) said, “The greater of the Two Heavy Things is the Book of the Honorable the Exalted God. It is a means that is extended from God and I towards you. One side of it is in the Hand of God and the other side is in your hands. The knowledge of the past and what is yet to come up until the arrival of the Hour is in it. And the smaller of the Two Heavy Things is equal to the Quran: It is Ali ibn Abi Talib (MGB) and his Household (MGB). These Two will be inseparable until they come to me at the Heavenly Pool.”

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Muhammad ibn al-Hassan ibn Ahmad ibn al-Walid - may God be pleased with him - narrated that Muhammad ibn al-Hassan al-Saffar quoted Muhammad ibn al-Hussein ibn Abil-Khat’tab and Yaqoob ibn Yazid, on the authority of Muhammad ibn Abi Umayr, on the authority of Abdullah ibn Sin’an, on the authority of Ma’ruf ibn Kharboz, on the authority of Abil Tufayl Amer ibn Vasele’, on the authority of Haziqat ibn Asid al-Qaffari, “When God’s Prophet (MGB) returned from the Farewell Pilgrimage we were with him (MGB). When we reached Al-Juhfa, the Prophet (MGB) ordered his companions to relax. Then the people all settled down. Then they said the call to prayer and the Prophet (MGB) said two units of prayers with his companions. Then the Prophet (MGB) turned towards them and told them, ‘The Graceful, the All-Aware has informed me that I will die and so shall you. Assume that I have answered God’s call. I am held responsible to God regarding what I have delivered to you. Verily, I am leaving behind God’s Book and His Proof. You are held responsible for them. What would you tell your Lord?’ They said, ‘We will say that you fulfilled your mission, gave us advice, and strived. May God grant you the best reward on our behalf.’”

Then the Prophet (MGB) asked them, “Don’t you bear witness that there is no god but One; that I am God’s Prophet sent to you; that Paradise does exist; that Hell does exist; and that there is resurrection after death?” They replied, “We bear witness to this.”

The Prophet (MGB) said, “May God bear witness to what you say. I take you as witnesses and bear witness that God is my Master. I am the Master of all Muslims. Is it not true that my Mastery over the believers is more than that of their own mastery over themselves? Do you believe in this? Will you bear witness to this?” They replied, “We bear witness to this.”

Then the Prophet (MGB) said, “Whoever I am the Master of, Ali is the Master of.” Then he grabbed Ali’s hand and raised it up along with his own hand in such a way that both their underarms could be seen. Then the Prophet (MGB) said, “O my God! Please be the friend of his friends and be the enemy of his enemies. Assist whoever assists him, and abandon whoever abandons him. I shall leave and you will meet me again at the Heavenly Pool[144] later. That is a Pool whose width expands from Bosri to San’a. There are as many silver goblets in it as there are stars in the sky. Then I shall question you about what you bear witness to today when I meet you at my Pool. I will ask you what you did with the Two Heavy Things and how you dealt with what I left behind when you meet me. “

They said, “O Messenger of God! What are the Two Heavy Things?”

The Prophet (MGB) said, “The greater of the Two Heavy Things is the Book of the Honorable the Exalted God. It is a means that is extended from God and I towards you. One side of it is in the Hand of God and the other side is in your hands. The knowledge of the past and what is yet to come up until the arrival of the Hour is in it. And the smaller of the Two Heavy Things is equal to the Quran: It is Ali ibn Abi Talib (MGB) and his Household (MGB). These Two will be inseparable until they come to me at the Heavenly Pool.”

Thanks for providing us the translation. But this hadith is not sahih you can see the narrators do not reach to imam (as) .

Please provide the translation of the most authentic hadith i.e. this one:

ãÍãÏ Èä íÍíì¡ Úä ÃÍãÏ Èä ãÍãÏ¡ Úä ÇáÍÓíä Èä ÓÚíÏ¡ Úä ÇáäÖÑ Èä ÓæíÏ¡ Úä íÍíì ÇáÍáÈí¡ Úä ÈÑíÏ Èä ãÚÇæíÉ¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ãÓáã¡ Úä ÃÈí ÌÚÝÑ (Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã) Ýí ÎØÈÉ íæã ÇáÌãÚÉ ÇáÎØÈÉ ÇáÇæáì:

ÇáÍãÏ ááå äÍãÏå æäÓÊÚíäå æäÓÊÛÝÑå æäÓÊåÏíå æäÚæÐ ÈÇááå ãä ÔÑæÑ ÃäÝÓäÇ æãä ÓíÆÇÊ ÃÚãÇáäÇ¡ ãä íåÏí Çááå ÝáÇ ãÖá áå æãä íÖáá ÝáÇ åÇÏí áå.

æÃÔåÏ Ãä áÇ Åáå ÅáÇ Çááå æÍÏå áÇ ÔÑíß áå æÃÔåÏ Ãä ãÍãÏÇ ÚÈÏå æÑÓæáå ÇäÊÌÈå áæáÇíÊå æÇÎÊÕå ÈÑÓÇáÊå æÃßÑãå ÈÇáäÈæÉ¡ ÃãíäÇ Úáì ÛíÈå æÑÍãÉ ááÚÇáãíä æÕáì Çááå Úáì ãÍãÏ æÂáå æ(Úáíåã ÇáÓáÇã).

ÇæÕíßã ÚÈÇÏ Çááå ÈÊÞæì Çááå æÇÎæÝßã ãä ÚÞÇÈå ÝÅä Çááå íäÌí ãä ÇÊÞÇå ÈãÝÇÒÊåã áÇíãÓåã ÇáÓæÁ æáÇ åã íÍÒäæä æíßÑã ãä ÎÇÝå íÞíåã ÔÑ ãÇ ÎÇÝæÇ æíáÞíåã äÖÑÉ æÓÑæÑÇ æÇÑÛÈßã Ýí ßÑÇãÉ Çááå ÇáÏÇÆãÉ æÇÎæÝßã ÚÞÇÈå ÇáÐí áÇ ÇäÞØÇÚ áå æáÇ äÌÇÉ áãä ÇÓÊæÌÈå ÝáÇ ÊÚÒäßã ÇáÏäíÇ æáÇ ÊÑßäæÇ ÅáíåÇ ÝÅäåÇ ÏÇÑ ÛÑæÑ¡ ßÊÈ Çááå ÚáíåÇ æÚáì ÃåáåÇ ÇáÝäÇÁ ÝÊÒæÏæÇ ãäåÇ ÇáÐí ÃßÑãßã Çááå Èå ãä ÇáÊÞæì æÇáÚãá ÇáÕÇáÍ ÝÅäå áÇ íÕá Åáì Çááå ãä ÅÚãÇá ÇáÚÈÇÏ ÅáÇ ãÇ ÎáÕ ãäåÇ æáÇ íÊÞÈá Çááå ÅáÇ ãä ÇáãÊÞíä æÞÏ ÃÎÈÑßã Çááå Úä ãäÇÒá ãä Âãä æÚãá ÕÇáÍÇ æÚä ãäÇÒá ãä ßÝÑ æÚãá Ýí ÛíÑ ÓÈíáå æÞÇá: " Ðáß íæã ãÌãæÚ áå ÇáäÇÓ æÐáß íæã ãÔåæÏ * æãÇ äÄÎÑå ÅáÇ áÇÌá ãÚÏæÏ * íæã íÃÊí áÇ Êßáã äÝÓ ÅáÇ ÈÅÐäå Ýãäåã ÔÞí æÓÚíÏ * ÝÃãÇ ÇáÐíä ÔÞæÇ ÝÝí ÇáäÇÑ áåã ÝíåÇ ÒÝíÑ æÔåíÞ ÎÇáÏíä ÝíåÇ ãÇ ÏÇãÊ ÇáÓãæÇÊ æÇáÇÑÖ ÅáÇ ãÇ ÔÇÁ ÑÈß Åä ÑÈß ÝÚÇá áãÇ íÑíÏ æÃãÇ ÇáÐíä ÓÚÏæÇ ÝÝí ÇáÌäÉ ÎÇáÏíä ÝíåÇ ãÇÏÇãÊ ÇáÓãæÇÊ æÇáÇÑÖ ÅáÇ ãÇ ÔÇÁ ÑÈß ÚØÇÁ ÛíÑ ãÌÐæÐ (1) " äÓÃá Çááå ÇáÐí ÌãÚäÇ áåÐÇ ÇáÌãÚ Ãä íÈÇÑß áäÇ Ýí íæãäÇ åÐÇ æÃä íÑÍãäÇ ÌãíÚÇ Åäå Úáì ßá ÔÆ ÞÏíÑ

Åä ßÊÇÈ Çááå ÃÕÏÞ ÇáÍÏíË æÃÍÓä ÇáÞÕÕ æÞÇá Çááå ÚÒæÌá: " æÅÐÇ ÞÑÆ ÇáÞÑÂä ÝÇÓÊãÚæÇ áå æÃäÕÊæÇ áÚáßã ÊÑÍãæä " (1) ÝÇÓãÚæÇ ØÇÚÉ [Ç] ááå æÃäÕÊæÇ ÇÈÊÛÇÁ ÑÍãÊå.

Ëã ÇÞÑà ÓæÑÉ ãä ÇáÞÑÂä æÇÏÚ ÑÈß æÕá Úáì ÇáäÈí (Õ) æÇÏÚ ááãÄãäíä æÇáãÄãäÇÊ. Ëã ÊÌáÓ ÞÏÑ ãÇ Êãßä åäíåÉ Ëã ÊÞæã ÝÊÞæá:

ÇáÍãÏ ááå äÍãÏå æäÓÊÚíäå æäÓÊÛÝÑå æäÓÊåÏíå æäÄãä Èå æäÊæßá Úáíå æäÚæÐ ÈÇááå ãä ÔÑæÑ ÃäÝÓäÇ æãä ÓíÆÇÊ ÃÚãÇáäÇ¡ ãä íåÏí Çááå ÝáÇ ãÖá áå æãä íÖáá ÝáÇ åÇÏí áå.

æÃÔåÏ Ãä áÇ Åáå ÅáÇ Çááå æÍÏå áÇ ÔÑíß áå æÃÔåÏ Ãä ãÍãÏÇ ÚÈÏå æÑÓæáå ÃÑÓáå ÈÇáåÏì æÏíä ÇáÍÞ áíÙåÑå Úáì ÇáÏíä ßáå æáæ ßÑå ÇáãÔÑßæä æÌÚáå ÑÍãÉ ááÚÇáãíä ÈÔíÑÇ æäÐíÑÇ æÏÇÚíÇ Åáì Çááå ÈÅÐäå æÓÑÇÌÇ ãäíÑÇ ãä íØÚ Çááå æÑÓæáå ÝÞÏ ÑÔÏ æãä íÚÕåãÇ ÝÞÏ Ûæì.

ÇæÕíßã ÚÈÇÏ Çááå ÈÊÞæì Çááå ÇáÐí íäÝÚ ÈØÇÚÊå ãä ÃØÇÚå æÇáÐí íÖÑ ÈãÚÕíÊå ãä ÚÕÇå¡ ÇáÐí Åáíå ãÚÇÏßã æÚáíå ÍÓÇÈßã ÝÅä ÇáÊÞæì æÕíÉ Çááå Ýíßã æÝí ÇáÐíä ãä ÞÈáßã ÞÇá Çááå ÚÒæÌá: " æáÞÏ æÕíäÇ ÇáÐíä ÇæÊæÇ ÇáßÊÇÈ ãä ÞÈáßã æÅíÇßã Ãä ÇÊÞæÇ Çááå æÃä ÊßÝÑæÇ ÝÅä ááå ãÇ Ýí ÇáÓãæÇÊ æãÇ Ýí ÇáÇÑÖ æßÇä Çááå ÛäíÇ ÍãíÏÇ (2) " ÇäÊÝÚæÇ ÈãæÚÙÉ Çááå æÃáÒãæÇ ßÊÇÈå ÝÅäå ÃÈáÛ ÇáãæÚÙÉ æÎíÑ ÇáÇãæÑ Ýí ÇáãÚÇÏ ÚÇÞÈÉ æáÞÏ ÇÊÎÐ Çááå ÇáÍÌÉ ÝáÇ íåáß ãä åáß ÅáÇ Úä ÈíäÉ æáÇ íÍíì ãä Íí ÅáÇ Úä ÈíäÉ æÞÏ ÈáÛ ÑÓæá Çááå (Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå) ÇáÐí ÇÑÓá Èå ÝÃáÒãæÇ æÕíÊå æãÇ ÊÑß Ýíßã ãä ÈÚÏå ãä ÇáËÞáíä ßÊÇÈ Çááå æÃåá ÈíÊå ÇááÐíä áÇ íÖá ãä ÊãÓß ÈåãÇ æáÇ íåÊÏí ãä ÊÑßåãÇ¡ Çááåã Õá Úáì ãÍãÏ ÚÈÏß æÑÓæáß ÓíÏ ÇáãÑÓáíä æÅãÇã ÇáãÊÞíä æÑÓæá ÑÈ ÇáÚÇáãíä - Ëã ÊÞæá -: Çááåã Õá Úáì ÃãíÑ ÇáãÄãäíä ææÕí ÑÓæá ÑÈ ÇáÚÇáãíä

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حدثنا محمد بن محمد ، قال : حدثنا أبو القاسم جعفر بن محمد بن قولويه ( رحمه الله ) ، قال : حدثني أبي ، قال : حدثني سعد بن عبد الله ، عن أحمد بن محمد ابن عيسى ، عن الحسن بن محبوب الزراد ، عن أبي محمد الأنصاري ، عن معاوية بن وهب ، قال : كنت جالسا عند جعفر بن محمد ( عليهما السلام ) إذ جاء شيخ قد انحنى من الكبر ، فقال : السلام عليك ورحمة الله وبركاته . فقال له أبو عبد الله : وعليك السلام ورحمة الله وبركاته ، يا شيخ ادن مني ، فدنا منه فقبل يده فبكى ، فقال له أبو عبد الله ( عليه السلام ) : وما يبكيك يا شيخ ؟ قال له : يا بن رسول الله ، أنا مقيم على رجاء منكم منذ نحو من مائة سنة ، أقول هذه السنة وهذا الشهر وهذا اليوم ، ولا أراه فيكم ، فتلومني أن أبكي ! قال : فبكى أبو عبد الله ( عليه السلام ) ثم قال : يا شيخ ، إن أخرت منيتك كنت معنا ، وإن عجلت كنت يوم القيامة مع ثقل رسول الله ( صلى الله عليه وآله ) . فقال الشيخ : ما أبالي ما فاتني بعد هذا يا بن رسول الله . فقال له أبو عبد الله ( عليه السلام ) : يا شيخ ، إن رسول الله ( صلى الله عليه وآله ) قال : إني تارك فيكم الثقلين ما إن تمسكتم بهما لن تضلوا : كتاب الله المنزل ، وعترتي أهل بيتي ، تجئ وأنت معنا يوم القيامة . قال : يا شيخ ، ما أحسبك من أهل الكوفة . قال : لا . قال : فمن أين أنت ؟ قال : من سوادها جعلت فداك . قال : أين أنت من قبر جدي المظلوم الحسين ( عليه السلام ) ؟ قال : إني لقريب منه . قال : كيف إتيانك له ؟ قال : إني لآتيه وأكثر . قال : يا شيخ ، ذاك دم يطلب الله ( تعالى ) به ، ما أصيب ولد فاطمة ولا يصابون بمثل الحسين ( عليه السلام ) ، ولقد قتل ( عليه السلام ) في سبعة عشر من أهل بيته ، نصحوا لله وصبروا في جنب الله ، فجزاهم أحسن جزاء الصابرين ، إنه إذا كان يوم القيامة أقبل رسول الله ( صلى الله عليه وآله ) ومعه الحسين ( عليه السلام ) ويده على رأسه بقطر دما فيقول : يا رب ، سل أمتي فيم قتلوا ولدي . وقال ( عليه السلام ) . كل الجزع والبكاء مكروه سوى الجزع والبكاء على الحسين ( عليه السلام ) .

أمالي شيخ الطائفة ص 161 .

The sanad is Hasan for Abi Muhammad al Ansari has no direct Tawthiq but is close to sahih.

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ÍÏËäÇ ÃÍãÏ Èä ÒíÇÏ Èä ÌÚÝÑ ÇáåãÏÇäí ÞÇá ÍÏËäÇ Úáí Èä ÅÈÑÇåíã ¡ Úä ÃÈíå ¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ÃÈí ÚãíÑ Úä ÛíÇË Èä ÅÈÑÇåíã ¡ Úä ÇáÕÇÏÞ ÌÚÝÑ Èä ãÍãÏ Úä ÃÈíå ãÍãÏ Èä Úáí Úä ÇÈíå Úáí Èä ÇáÍÓíä ¡ Úä ÃÈíå ÇáÍÓíä Èä Úáí Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã ÞÇá

ÓÆá ÃãíÑ ÇáãÄãäíä Úä ãÚäì Þæá ÇáÑÓæá Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå æÓáã : Åäí ãÎáÝ Ýíßã ÇáËÞáíä ßÊÇÈ Çááå æÚÊÑÊí . ãä ÇáÚÊÑÉ ¿ ÝÞÇá :" ÃäÇ æ ÇáÍÓä æÇáÍÓíä æÇáÃÆãÉ ãä æáÏ ÇáÍÓíä ÊÇÓÚåã ãåÏíåã æÞÇÆãåã ¡ áÇ íÝÇÑÞæä ßÊÇÈ Çááå æáÇ íÝÇÑÞåã ¡ ÍÊì íÑÏæÇ Úáí ÑÓæá Çááå Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå ÍæÖå

Ahmad bin Ziyad bin Jafar al Hamdani from Ali bin Ibrahim from his father from Muhammad bin Abi Umayr from Ghiyath bin Ibrahim from al-Sadiq Jafar bin Muhammad from his father Muhammad bin Ali from his father Ali bin Husain from his father Husain bin Ali (peace be on all of them) who said : Ameer -ul-Mumineen was asked on the meaning of the words of the messenger of Allah 'I am authorizing among you two weighty things the book of Allah and my itrah' who are the itrah?

so he said I and Hasan and Husain and the imams from Husain the ninth of whom is the Mahdi and Qaim, they never leave the book of Allah and the book of Allah never leaves them until they meet the messenger of Allah at the pond

Hasan ka Sahih Hadith as all Rijal are Thiqah

Ýí ßãÇá ÇáÏíä Õ240 ÑÞã64

æÚíæä ÃÎÈÇÑ ÇáÑÖÇ Ì2 Õ60 ÑÞã25

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حدثنا محمد ين الحسين ، عن جعفر بن بشير ، عن ذريح بن يزيد ، عن أبي عبد الله عليه السلام قال : قال رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم

إني تركت فيكم الثقلين كتاب الله و أهل بيتي ، فنحن أهل بيته

Muhammad bin al Husayn (bin Abi Khattab) from Jafar bin Bashir from Dhurayh bin Yazid from Abi Abdillah (a.s) who said : The messenger of Allah said 'surely I leave behind me two weighty things the book of Allah and my Ahlulbayt' and we are the ahlulbayt.

The sanad is Sahih

Basair Darajat ص 334

Chapter on the Saying of the messenger of Allah 'I am leaving behind....'

Edited by Islamic Salvation
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Úáí Èä ÅÈÑÇåíã¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ÚíÓì¡ Úä íæäÓ æÚáí Èä ãÍãÏ¡ Úä Óåá ÇÈä ÒíÇÏ ÃÈí ÓÚíÏ¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ÚíÓì¡ Úä íæäÓ¡ Úä ÇÈä ãÓßÇä¡ Úä ÃÈí ÈÕíÑ ÞÇá ÓÃáÊ ÃÈÇ ÚÈÏÇááå (Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã) Úä Þæá Çááå ÚÒæÌá: " ÃØíÚæÇ Çááå æÃØíÚæÇ ÇáÑÓæá æÃæáí ÇáÇãÑ ãäßã " ÝÞÇá: äÒáÊ Ýí Úáí Èä ÃÈí ØÇáÈ æÇáÍÓä æÇáÍÓíä Úáíåã ÇáÓáÇã

……………………….

ÝÞÇá ÑÓæá Çááå (Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå): Ýí Úáí: ãä ßäÊ ãæáÇå¡ ÝÚáí ãæáÇå¡ æÞÇá (Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå) ÇæÕíßã ÈßÊÇÈ Çááå æÃåá ÈíÊí¡ ÝÅäí ÓÃáÊ Çááå ÚÒæÌá Ãä áÇ íÝÑÞ ÈíäåãÇ ÍÊì íæÑÏåãÇ Úáí

ÇáÍæÖ¡ ÝÃÚØÇäí Ðáß æÞÇá

áÇ ÊÚáãæåã Ýåã ÃÚáã ãäßã¡ æÞÇá: Åäåã áä íÎÑÌæßã ãä ÈÇÈ åÏì¡ æáä íÏÎáæßã Ýí ÈÇÈ ÖáÇáÉ

.....................................

Çáßáíäí Ýí ÇáßÇÝí Ì1 Õ286 Ü 288 ¡ ßÊÇÈ ÇáÍÌÉ ¡ ÈÇÈ ãÇ äÕ Çááå ÚÒæÌá æÑÓæáå Úáì ÇáÃÆãÉ æÇÍÏÇð ÝæÇÍÏÇ

The first sanad is sahih according to Majlisi

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حدثنا أحمد بن زياد بن جعفر الهمداني قال حدثنا علي بن إبراهيم ، عن أبيه ، عن محمد بن أبي عمير عن غياث بن إبراهيم ، عن الصادق جعفر بن محمد عن أبيه محمد بن علي عن ابيه علي بن الحسين ، عن أبيه الحسين بن علي عليه السلام قال

سئل أمير المؤمنين عن معنى قول الرسول صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم : إني مخلف فيكم الثقلين كتاب الله وعترتي . من العترة ؟ فقال :" أنا و الحسن والحسين والأئمة من ولد الحسين تاسعهم مهديهم وقائمهم ، لا يفارقون كتاب الله ولا يفارقهم ، حتى يردوا علي رسول الله صلى الله عليه وآله حوضه

Ahmad bin Ziyad bin Jafar al Hamdani from Ali bin Ibrahim from his father from Muhammad bin Abi Umayr from Ghiyath bin Ibrahim from al-Sadiq Jafar bin Muhammad from his father Muhammad bin Ali from his father Ali bin Husain from his father Husain bin Ali (peace be on all of them) who said : Ameer -ul-Mumineen was asked on the meaning of the words of the messenger of Allah 'I am authorizing among you two weighty things the book of Allah and my itrah' who are the itrah?

so he said I and Hasan and Husain and the imams from Husain the ninth of whom is the Mahdi and Qaim, they never leave the book of Allah and the book of Allah never leaves them until they meet the messenger of Allah at the pond

Hasan ka Sahih Hadith as all Rijal are Thiqah

في كمال الدين ص240 رقم64

وعيون أخبار الرضا ج2 ص60 رقم25

looks hazrat fatima (ra) is excluded from this sahih hadith. :squeez:

Now i am curious to see the sahih hadith which includes fatima (ra) as among ahle-bayt of thaqlayan.

Edited by serious-sam
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This is starting to paralell Bani Israel's questions to Musa (a.s) on the cow they were supposed to sacrifice.

You have got a Hadith which specifies the 12 imams as the Itrah now you want one which includes Bibi Fatima (a.s) then what? or is it just questions for questioning sake.

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This is starting to paralell Bani Israel's questions to Musa (a.s) on the cow they were supposed to sacrifice.

You have got a Hadith which specifies the 12 imams as the Itrah now you want one which includes Bibi Fatima (a.s) then what? or is it just questions for questioning sake.

You didnot realized that other members already showed the hadith of itrah.

Re-refer:

But it seems really strange to me, your sahih hadith excludes fatima (ra) from ahlebayt of thaqalayan! How?

One of the ahul-kisa is missing!

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You didnot realized that other members already showed the hadith of itrah.

Re-refer:

But it seems really strange to me, your sahih hadith excludes fatima (ra) from ahlebayt of thaqalayan! How?

One of the ahul-kisa is missing!

Bibi Fatima (as) and imam Ali (as) are the roots of the tree of the progeny of the Prophet. She is not a Prophet nor a Imam. Only Jews and Wahhabis have women as Prophet and Imams.

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junk posts.

Anyway my point is:

Once try to look at hadith:

ÍÏËäÇ ãÍãÏ íä ÇáÍÓíä ¡ Úä ÌÚÝÑ Èä ÈÔíÑ ¡ Úä ÐÑíÍ Èä íÒíÏ ¡ Úä ÃÈí ÚÈÏ Çááå Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã ÞÇá : ÞÇá ÑÓæá Çááå Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå æÓáã

Åäí ÊÑßÊ Ýíßã ÇáËÞáíä ßÊÇÈ Çááå æ Ãåá ÈíÊí ¡ ÝäÍä Ãåá ÈíÊå

Muhammad bin al Husayn (bin Abi Khattab) from Jafar bin Bashir from Dhurayh bin Yazid from Abi Abdillah (a.s) who said : The messenger of Allah said 'surely I leave behind me two weighty things the book of Allah and my Ahlulbayt' and we are the ahlulbayt.

The sanad is Sahih

Basair Darajat Õ 334

Chapter on the Saying of the messenger of Allah 'I am leaving behind....'

prophet (pbuh) didot said 'i am leaving imams or 12 imams" he said "i am leaving ahulbayt (itrah)" .

& other hadith says itrah excludes fatima (ra) !

ÍÏËäÇ ÃÍãÏ Èä ÒíÇÏ Èä ÌÚÝÑ ÇáåãÏÇäí ÞÇá ÍÏËäÇ Úáí Èä ÅÈÑÇåíã ¡ Úä ÃÈíå ¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ÃÈí ÚãíÑ Úä ÛíÇË Èä ÅÈÑÇåíã ¡ Úä ÇáÕÇÏÞ ÌÚÝÑ Èä ãÍãÏ Úä ÃÈíå ãÍãÏ Èä Úáí Úä ÇÈíå Úáí Èä ÇáÍÓíä ¡ Úä ÃÈíå ÇáÍÓíä Èä Úáí Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã ÞÇá

ÓÆá ÃãíÑ ÇáãÄãäíä Úä ãÚäì Þæá ÇáÑÓæá Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå æÓáã : Åäí ãÎáÝ Ýíßã ÇáËÞáíä ßÊÇÈ Çááå æÚÊÑÊí . ãä ÇáÚÊÑÉ ¿ ÝÞÇá :" ÃäÇ æ ÇáÍÓä æÇáÍÓíä æÇáÃÆãÉ ãä æáÏ ÇáÍÓíä ÊÇÓÚåã ãåÏíåã æÞÇÆãåã ¡ áÇ íÝÇÑÞæä ßÊÇÈ Çááå æáÇ íÝÇÑÞåã ¡ ÍÊì íÑÏæÇ Úáí ÑÓæá Çááå Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå ÍæÖå

Ahmad bin Ziyad bin Jafar al Hamdani from Ali bin Ibrahim from his father from Muhammad bin Abi Umayr from Ghiyath bin Ibrahim from al-Sadiq Jafar bin Muhammad from his father Muhammad bin Ali from his father Ali bin Husain from his father Husain bin Ali (peace be on all of them) who said : Ameer -ul-Mumineen was asked on the meaning of the words of the messenger of Allah 'I am authorizing among you two weighty things the book of Allah and my itrah' who are the itrah?

so he said I and Hasan and Husain and the imams from Husain the ninth of whom is the Mahdi and Qaim, they never leave the book of Allah and the book of Allah never leaves them until they meet the messenger of Allah at the pond

Hasan ka Sahih Hadith as all Rijal are Thiqah

Ýí ßãÇá ÇáÏíä Õ240 ÑÞã64

æÚíæä ÃÎÈÇÑ ÇáÑÖÇ Ì2 Õ60 ÑÞã25

So it is really strange: shia sahih hadith excludes one of the member of ahul-kisa from itrah of thaqalayan!

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junk posts.

Anyway my point is:

Once try to look at hadith:

prophet (pbuh) didot said 'i am leaving imams or 12 imams" he said "i am leaving ahulbayt (itrah)" .

& other hadith says itrah excludes fatima (ra) !

So it is really strange: shia sahih hadith excludes one of the member of ahul-kisa from itrah of thaqalayan!

(bismillah)

(salam)

you will never understand this for you are not a muhhib

you have fard namaz which you have to follow

to reject is kufr as bro akamp explained

then you have recomended to raise your station

together they all make ibadah

(wasalam)

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^_^

Anyways can any shia explain this!

(bismillah)

(salam)

ss told you you would never understand the above

anyways you too reading my posts

both you salafis say one thing and do another

when zia ul haq was the president of pakistan and was sitting in the garden one evening eating sandwiches for tea with his wife

a crow keeps on swooping and picking up pieces of the sandwich and taking off into the tree to finish before making another plunge

zia gets tired and tells his wife to go in and get the gun so he can shoot the crow down

as his wife leaves to go in and get the gun, the crow says this is going to be the final plunge

so let me take a nice piece and be gone

so the crow makes a final swoop

as he gets to the sandwich zia pulls his gun out and shoots the crow

the crow while breathing his last says,

' the b*****d always says one thing and does another

(wasalam)

Edited by haideriam
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