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In the Name of God بسم الله

Validity Of Shea Sect

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Be Good

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Quran is nothing but sectarian, the Ansar and Muhajirun is nothing but sectarian!

Dear Brother

You are using two names "Sh'iah & Muslim". OK "Muslim" is as per last verse of Sura Al-hajj that commands us to be Muslims, And which verse commands us to be a Sh'iah?

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Dear Brother

You are using two names "Sh'iah & Muslim". OK "Muslim" is as per last verse of Sura Al-hajj that commands us to be Muslims, And which verse commands us to be a Sh'iah?

You are the one discussing sectarian. I am not.

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LOL. i do follow Prophet Muhammed pbuh bcoz Quran commands me to follow Prophet pbuh. There are more than 30 verses in the Quran that commands to Follow Prophet Muhammed and also 7:158 commands to follow Prophet Ummi. BUT i am not a shea, i do not wear a label that equates to dividing ummah. Shea now a days is a proper sect, dont you call yourself moumins? lol

Dear Brother discard your sect & label for the sake of Allah please. :)

Lol, OK brother. Let's do this one step at a time, do you agree that Allah labeled Prophet Ibrahim as a muslim and a shi'ah?

By the way, by following the Holy Prophet you are, by definition a shi'ah, a follower even though you don't use the title. Lol.

Edited by MFAHH
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Lol, OK brother. Let's do this one step at a time, do you agree that Allah labeled Prophet Ibrahim as a muslim and a shi'ah?

By the way, by following the Holy Prophet you are, by definition a shi'ah, a follower even though you don't use the title. Lol.

LOL.

Dear Brother

Who is The Most Wise

You Or Allah

I leave it up to you.

I you love Allah then you will call yourself a Muslims, disassociate yourself from sect and stop wearing a label of Shea. What would you answer to Allah on the day of judgment once there is NO direct verse that commands to be a Shea. Please do not look for the answer outside The Glorious Quran.

Please do read Quran with understanding in the language you understand the best and please stop blind following.

I just can pray for you. May Allah guide you to the straight path. The path of those who were blessed. :)

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LOL.

Dear Brother

Who is The Most Wise

You Or Allah

I leave it up to you.

I you love Allah then you will call yourself a Muslims, disassociate yourself from sect and stop wearing a label of Shea. What would you answer to Allah on the day of judgment once there is NO direct verse that commands to be a Shea. Please do not look for the answer outside The Glorious Quran.

Please do read Quran with understanding in the language you understand the best and please stop blind following.

I just can pray for you.

Allah is the Most Wise so why did He say what He said?

Let's try again, do you agree that Allah labeled Prophet Ibrahim as a muslim and a shi'ah? Brother, answer my question, I am using nothing but 2 verses from the Quran.

May Allah guide you to the straight path. The path of those who were blessed. :)

May Allah guide us all.

Edited by MFAHH
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Allah is the Most Wise so why did He say what He said?

Let's try again, do you agree that Allah labeled Prophet Ibrahim as a muslim and a shi'ah? Brother, answer my question, I am using nothing but 2 verses from the Quran.

May Allah guide us all.

37:83 Among his followers was Abraham.

Right?.

Now dear if you translate it suiting your ends then that's a different thing. In this verse God never said that his sect was Shea, nor he wore a label Shea. Right? Abraham followed NOAH and was a MUslim. Right?

I had many discussions with almost every sect, none recoginzez the Quranic truth. Everyone starts justifying his sect from Quran. BUT beauty of Quran is "It named us MUslims as per last verse of Sura Al-Hajj".

Now please try to understand my point that where in Quran it COMMANDS us to be a Shea. Please gimme a verse, i shall convert myself a Shea right here in front of you and if you cant present a verse that directly commands then dear brother you are blindly following your scholars NOT the Quran. Quran is a "لَا رَيْبَ ۛ فِيهِ ".

Have you ever read the Quran in the language you understand?

Edited by Be Good
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LOL.

Dear Brother

Who is The Most Wise

You Or Allah

I leave it up to you.

I you love Allah then you will call yourself a Muslims, disassociate yourself from sect and stop wearing a label of Shea. What would you answer to Allah on the day of judgment once there is NO direct verse that commands to be a Shea. Please do not look for the answer outside The Glorious Quran.

Please do read Quran with understanding in the language you understand the best and please stop blind following.

I just can pray for you. May Allah guide you to the straight path. The path of those who were blessed.   :)

if those who became the Sunni Muslims hadn't gone astray the Shia wouldn't have to distinguish which version of Islam we follow.  it would be great if there was only one version of Islam, but we have to deal with reality as reality came to us.  you believe your version is correct, we believe our version is correct.  

Brother "Be Good," if you were around at the time of Ashura in Muharram of 61 AH, would you have given your allegiance to Yazid (la) or to Imam Hussein (as)?  One group of Muslims attacking another group of Muslims, which side are you on?

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if those who became the Sunni Muslims hadn't gone astray the Shia wouldn't have to distinguish which version of Islam we follow.  it would be great if there was only one version of Islam, but we have to deal with reality as reality came to us.  you believe your version is correct, we believe our version is correct.  

Brother "Be Good," if you were around at the time of Ashura in Muharram of 61 AH, would you have given your allegiance to Yazid (la) or to Imam Hussein (as)?  One group of Muslims attacking another group of Muslims, which side are you on?

Dear Brother

I am just a Muslim as per last verse of Sura Al-Hajj. But being a Muslim i love Ahle Bayt too, rather every Muslim MUST love Ahle Bayt. And on the other hand we are NOT allowed to distinguish ourselves by label a name bcoz Quran does NOT commands so, not even to distinguish. :)

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i do follow Prophet Muhammed pbuh

So you are a follower of the Holy Prophet?

Dear Brother

I am just a Muslim as per last verse of Sura Al-Hajj. But being a Muslim i love Ahle Bayt too, rather every Muslim MUST love Ahle Bayt. And on the other hand we are NOT allowed to distinguish ourselves by label a name bcoz Quran does NOT commands so, not even to distinguish. :)

So you are a lover of Ahlulbayt?

37:83 Among his followers was Abraham.

Right?.

Now dear if you translate it suiting your ends then that's a different thing. In this verse God never said that his sect was Shea, nor he wore a label Shea. Right? Abraham followed NOAH and was a MUslim. Right?

I had many discussions with almost every sect, none recoginzez the Quranic truth. Everyone starts justifying his sect from Quran. BUT beauty of Quran is "It named us MUslims as per last verse of Sura Al-Hajj".

Now please try to understand my point that where in Quran it COMMANDS us to be a Shea. Please gimme a verse, i shall convert myself a Shea right here in front of you and if you cant present a verse that directly commands then dear brother you are blindly following your scholars NOT the Quran. Quran is a "لَا رَيْبَ ۛ فِيهِ ".

Have you ever read the Quran in the language you understand?

I don't think you realise that the word Shi'ah can have meanings other than sect.

And on the other hand we are NOT allowed to distinguish ourselves by label a name bcoz Quran does NOT commands so, not even to distinguish.

Am I right or are you?

Edited by MFAHH
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So you are a follower of the Holy Prophet?

So you are a lover of Ahlulbayt?

I don't think you realise that the word Shi'ah can have meanings other than sect.

Alhamdolillah, I being a Muslim love Prophet Muhammed pbuh and Ahle Bayt too. Sectarianism is against Quranic teaching. Dear Brother WHY shud i risk my salvation, WHY shud i take risk for that which is clearly NOT sanctioned and commanded by Quran & Allah.

Please Think over it & Ponder. Allah wont listen that i was folowing so and so, i was following my forefathers, i was following scholars.

Lets be a Muslim as per last verse of Sura Al-Hajj & disassociate from sects and groups . :)

Edited by Be Good
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Alhamdolillah, I being a Muslim love Prophet Muhammed pbuh and Ahle Bayt too. Sectarianism is against Quranic teaching. Dear Brother WHY shud i risk my salvation, WHY shud i take risk for that which is clearly NOT sanctioned and commanded by Quran & Allah.

Please Think over it & Ponder. Allah wont listen that i was folowing so and so, i was following my forefathers, i was following scholars.

Lets be a Muslim as per last verse of Sura Al-Hajj & disassociate from sects and groups . :)

Brother, from your posts all that I can make sense of is that you are playing with semantics. Do you not realise that by following the Holy Prophet, you are his follower (Shi'ah)? That by loving the Ahlubayt, you are their lover? As you said, to love and follow then is a must as ordained by the Quran, yet you say that being their follower (Shi'ah) and lover isn't commanded in the Quran and that it alludes to sectarianism, do you not see that you are just toying with words and producing no logical evidence that should be based entirely on the Holy Quran?

How is it that if something is not explicitly ordained in the Quran then it becomes blind following of scholars on our part? The argument is completely non-sequitor.

Edited by MFAHH
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Brother, from your posts all that I can make sense of is that you are playing with semantics. Do you not realise that by following the Holy Prophet, you are his follower (Shi'ah)? That by loving the Ahlubayt, you are their lover? As you said, to love and follow then is a must as ordained by the Quran, yet you say that being their follower (Shi'ah) and lover isn't commanded in the Quran and that it alludes to sectarianism, do you not see that you are just toying with words and producing no logical evidence that should be based entirely on the Holy Quran?

How is it that if something is not explicitly ordained in the Quran then it becomes blind following of scholars on our part? The argument is completely non-sequitor.

That is why i asked as to if you have read the Quran with understanding then you must have read this verse too and a brother loves his brother. Right?

إِنَّمَا الْمُؤْمِنُونَ إِخْوَةٌ فَأَصْلِحُوا بَيْنَ أَخَوَيْكُمْ وَاتَّقُوا اللَّهَ لَعَلَّكُمْ تُرْحَمُونَ

"The believers are nothing else than brothers. So make reconciliation between your brothers, and fear Allah, that you may receive mercy." [Al-Hujjurat, 49:10]

I love everyone, i simply do not let the seeds of hatred to grow. :)

Edited by Be Good
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well. i am just a muslim too.  

how's that, does that satisfy your simplicity?  

your idea of "muslim" is informed by Sunni scholars, mine is informed by the Shia scholars, and so that makes the statement "I am Muslim" mean different things for different people.  How do you suggest we communicate "I am Muslim" in a way to avoid any confusion on exactly what is meant?

for every argument you bring against us that has something to do with "sect" we can change around the variables and present you with the same argument.  however, most shias are intelligent enough to realize the divisions in Islam are already accomplished facts and so the "sect" argument as you and your ilk present is not a very useful or compelling argument.  so instead of that, you will find the Shias bringing forth much more compelling arguments, like say the speech given by the Holy Prophet (as) at Ghadir Khum.  Or verse 33:33.  Or the superior leadership qualities of Imam Ali (as).  

It is you, my dear brother, who needs to wake up.  

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That is why i asked as to if you have read the Quran with understanding then you must have read this verse too and a brother loves his brother. Right?

ÅöäóøãóÇ ÇáúãõÄúãöäõæäó ÅöÎúæóÉñ ÝóÃóÕúáöÍõæÇ Èóíúäó ÃóÎóæóíúßõãú æóÇÊóøÞõæÇ Çááóøåó áóÚóáóøßõãú ÊõÑúÍóãõæäó

"The believers are nothing else than brothers. So make reconciliation between your brothers, and fear Allah, that you may receive mercy." [Al-Hujjurat, 49:10]

I love everyone, i simply do not let the seeds of hatred to grow. :)

Masha'Allah brother, it's good that you treat everyone as your brother. :)

But I don't see what that has to do with my previous post, if it's possible, could you answer my last points.

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(salam)

Be (deceptively) good... The games you're trying to play here have been initiated by many of your likes who came here before you only to get owned by my wise Shia brothers.

In my honest opinion, you are actually seeking division rather than unification of Muslims by playing this elaborate never-ending cat'n'mouse game. All I've seen you do is rant rant rant...

Come out of those wahabbi curtains you have hidden behind. A true Muslim as per your definition shouldn't be afraid to expose himself in his true colours, unless they are ugly.

(wasalam)

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Brother's just leave him alone. One of the brother clearly said that Imam Ali (r.a) said don't argue with the fools so leave it. He doesn't even know what he is asking and he is just repeating himself like a parrot saying "show me a proof in the Quran" etc... The Quran talks about Shia as a follower like the brother has said about Ibrahim (A.S). There for the Quran does not tell us to create a sect or group don't your brain take this, or are you just trying to take us as a fool. If you wana follow sunni group then go follow. But just leave us alone. We don't need stupid question's which don't have any sense of humor in it. Look at your question and look at your answer. Ive scrolled up and down about 10 times and all i see is "SHOW ME A PROOF IN THE QURAN " but nothing else from you. Go see a doctor please because you either aint making any sense or your having understanding difficulties. Wa salam. (and sorry about my temper)

And finally i just want to say do you actually know the meaning of Shi'ah, Because from your words i have come to a conclusion that you seem to not know what a shia means. Either way i hope this helps..

Shia mean's a FOLLOWER. There for if they say "Shia'tul Allah" means = The Follower of Allah. There for aren't you the follower of Allah ?

If they say "Shia'tul Mohammad (pbuh)" means= The Follower of Prophet Mohammad (pbuh). There for aren't you the follower of our beloved prophet ?

And there for because we have followed the true Sunnah of our prophet (pbuh) his true Sunnah was thought to us by his Ahlulbayt (a.s).. So i don't know if others agree with me but I am so so proud to be the Shia'tul Allah, Shia'tul Mohammad (pbuh), Shia'tul Ali.(a.s) Wa salam

Edited by Huseyin_Cetin_Turkish_Shia
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well. i am just a muslim too.  

how's that, does that satisfy your simplicity?  

your idea of "muslim" is informed by Sunni scholars, mine is informed by the Shia scholars, and so that makes the statement "I am Muslim" mean different things for different people.  How do you suggest we communicate "I am Muslim" in a way to avoid any confusion on exactly what is meant?

for every argument you bring against us that has something to do with "sect" we can change around the variables and present you with the same argument.  however, most shias are intelligent enough to realize the divisions in Islam are already accomplished facts and so the "sect" argument as you and your ilk present is not a very useful or compelling argument.  so instead of that, you will find the Shias bringing forth much more compelling arguments, like say the speech given by the Holy Prophet (as) at Ghadir Khum.  Or verse 33:33.  Or the superior leadership qualities of Imam Ali (as).  

It is you, my dear brother, who needs to wake up.  

Dear Brother

I am truly amazed & surprised that most of us have not read the Quran with understanding and are dependent on our respective scholars. BUT i never have consulted any scholars in my life be it a shea, sunni or wahabi nor have associated with any sect or denomination. Rights? I am just a plain Muslim as per last verse of Sura Al-Hajj. I have Quran & sunnah with me to seek guidance. Dear Brother, can you convince Allah with your circuling arguments? Quran is "La Raiba Fe". Please read Quran with understanding. Please don't prefer your logic over God's infinite wisdom. :)

Brother's just leave him alone. One of the brother clearly said that Imam Ali (r.a) said don't argue with the fools so leave it. He doesn't even know what he is asking and he is just repeating himself like a parrot saying "show me a proof in the Quran" etc... The Quran talks about Shia as a follower like the brother has said about Ibrahim (A.S). There for the Quran does not tell us to create a sect or group don't your brain take this, or are you just trying to take us as a fool. If you wana follow sunni group then go follow. But just leave us alone. We don't need stupid question's which don't have any sense of humor in it. Look at your question and look at your answer. Ive scrolled up and down about 10 times and all i see is "SHOW ME A PROOF IN THE QURAN " but nothing else from you. Go see a doctor please because you either aint making any sense or your having understanding difficulties. Wa salam. (and sorry about my temper)

And finally i just want to say do you actually know the meaning of Shi'ah, Because from your words i have come to a conclusion that you seem to not know what a shia means. Either way i hope this helps..

Shia mean's a FOLLOWER. There for if they say "Shia'tul Allah" means = The Follower of Allah. There for aren't you the follower of Allah ?

If they say "Shia'tul Mohammad (pbuh)" means= The Follower of Prophet Mohammad (pbuh). There for aren't you the follower of our beloved prophet ?

And there for because we have followed the true Sunnah of our prophet (pbuh) his true Sunnah was thought to us by his Ahlulbayt (a.s).. So i don't know if others agree with me but I am so so proud to be the Shia'tul Allah, Shia'tul Mohammad (pbuh), Shia'tul Ali.(a.s) Wa salam

Dear Brother

May Allah ease you with your temper. Bad temperament is always from Satan. :)

Its a matter of my salvation. Please show me a verse that clearly and directly commands to be a Shea and be a part of Shea sect, wear a label of Shea. I want to convert as Shea. Bring your proof if you are truthful. Never loose your temper. Bad temper has nothing to do with Islam. :)

May Allah guide you to the straight path. :)

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Dear Brother

I am truly amazed & surprised that most of us have not read the Quran with understanding and are dependent on our respective scholars. BUT i never have consulted any scholars in my life be it a shea, sunni or wahabi nor have associated with any sect or denomination. Rights? I am just a plain Muslim as per last verse of Sura Al-Hajj. I have Quran & sunnah with me to seek guidance. Dear Brother, can you convince Allah with your circuling arguments? Quran is "La Raiba Fe". Please read Quran with understanding. Please don't prefer your logic over God's infinite wisdom. :)

Dear Brother

May Allah ease you with your temper. Bad temperament is always from Satan. :)

Its a matter of my salvation. Please show me a verse that clearly and directly commands to be a Shea and be a part of Shea sect, wear a label of Shea. I want to convert as Shea. Bring your proof if you are truthful. Never loose your temper. Bad temper has nothing to do with Islam. :)

May Allah guide you to the straight path. :)

Just stay as you are and don't convert to anything. Your very confused your self. You still don't get it do you.. why are you keep repeating your self. Read as much as page of Quran you can, you wont find anything that says be in this group or be in that group. What are you trying to get convinced on. Shia just means a follower and thats it. you could be shia of anything (all depends on what u wana be the follower of) why have the sunnis made the name Shia look so wrong look so bad i wonder... they even confuse their own shias (followers)..

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I am just a plain Muslim as per last verse of Sura Al-Hajj.

Yeah, you've said it about 20 times :lol:.

I request you (unless your name already is :lol: ) to change your name to: Muslim Muslim, because obviously it's against the Quran to label ourselves anything other than muslim.

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(bismillah)

What Ahadeeth books do you follow? Then we'll see who's "just muslim" with no details to the label.

(salam)

I don't follow any Ahadeeth books. Does Quran commands so? :yaali:

(wasalam)

Edited by Be Good
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I don't follow any Ahadeeth books. Does Quran commands so? :yaali:

(wasalam)

Lol, the Quran commands us to follow the Holy Prophet, as you admitted in another post. The question is how can we follow the Prophet, he's long since passed away? The answer is, look at how he acted when he was alive and that can only be done through looking at narrations.

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Lol, the Quran commands us to follow the Holy Prophet, as you admitted in another post. The question is how can we follow the Prophet, he's long since passed away? The answer is, look at how he acted when he was alive and that can only be done through looking at narrations.

I love to follow Prophet Muhammed (pbuh) thru Sunnah. The Sunnah has been passed down to me thru my previous generations. :yaali:

Edited by Be Good
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I love to follow Prophet Muhammed (pbuh) thru Sunnah. The Sunnah has been passed down to me thru my previous generations. :yaali:

How can you be sure that every single minute detail was passed down correctly? Do you think that each of your ancestors had memory that impeccable that they could pass down the whole seerah of the Holy Prophet through the generations without fault? That's highly improbable.

So does that mean that you completely disregard all ahadith books?

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I love to follow Prophet Muhammed (pbuh) thru Sunnah. The Sunnah has been passed down to me thru my previous generations. :yaali:

Gotta love when retarded disillusioned people like him contradict themselves then put up happy smileys. You're funny. Keep amusing me more please.

Kthnxlol

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How can you be sure that every single minute detail was passed down correctly? Do you think that each of your ancestors had memory that impeccable that they could pass down the whole seerah of the Holy Prophet through the generations without fault? That's highly improbable.

So does that mean that you completely disregard all ahadith books?

Dear Brother

Read The Quran with understanding that you may learn it. The basic theme of Quran is about purification of one's self. How do we purify our hearts?

1- By establishing salah

2- By paying zakah. Our money to poor n needy.

3- By fasting

4- By feeding miskeen.

The above rituals purify our spiritual and physical heart as well and nourish our soul for life hereafter.

ÇáøóÐöí íõÄúÊöí ãóÇáóåõ íóÊóÒóßøóìٰ92:18

Allah does NOT need our sects. Allah needs our sincerity & purity of the heart. Allah needs our Qalb -e- Saleem

26:89 ÅöáøóÇ ãóäú ÃóÊóì Çááøóåó ÈöÞóáúÈò Óóáöíãò

ÅöÐú ÌóÇÁó ÑóÈøóåõ ÈöÞóáúÈò Óóáöíãò37:84

Those are successful who purified themselves.

87:14 ÞóÏú ÃóÝúáóÍó ãóä ÊóÒóßøóìٰ

Allah needs our pure heart NOT divided hearts into sects & denominations. :yaali:

Quran & Islam is all about self purification, This is the crux of Quran & Islam

Gotta love when retarded disillusioned people like him contradict themselves then put up happy smileys. You're funny. Keep amusing me more please.

Kthnxlol

Dear Brother

Thanks for your remarks. May Allah guide you. :)

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Dear Brother

Read The Quran with understanding that you may learn it.

Thanks for the advice.

How do you pray salah?

In order for one to perfect themselves they must act on everything that has been ordained in the Quran, do you agree? One cannot act upon some verses and reject others, yes?

Edited by MFAHH
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(salam)

One word brother: Google. That's probably what he's using right now...

This is a question google cannot answer for our brother.

As for reliance on past generations, that reminds me of the excuse the Meccans gave Muhammed (pbuh) for not initially converting to Islam. Abandon your forefathers and embrace the truth.

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Thanks for the advice.

How do you pray salah?

In order for one to perfect themselves they must act on everything that has been ordained in the Quran, do you agree? One cannot act upon some verses and reject others, yes?

I pray salah as i have seen other Muslims praying, when i went abroad i found the same method of praying nothing different. What's your point?

Here i presented you just few verses to give you an idea as to what is required. Quran is full of other commandments too. Why your arguments are circling like a whirlpool. Read Quran that you may learn.

Edited by Be Good
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I pray salah as i have seen other Muslims praying, when i went abroad i found the same method of praying nothing different. What's your point?

Here i presented you just few verses to give you an idea as to what is required. Quran is full of other commandments too. Why your arguments are circling like a whirlpool. Read Quran that you may learn.

There are a few methods of how to pray salaah, each method has it's foundations in hadith. Oh, and you forgot to put a wee smiley at the end of your post. :)

Edited by MFAHH
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I love to follow Prophet Muhammed (pbuh) thru Sunnah. The Sunnah has been passed down to me thru my previous generations. :yaali:

So, eventually in the end you turned out to be Quran Only Muslim. I was right about you. Here is the site where you should be spending your time.

http://free-minds.org/

BTW, you probably believe that rasool Allah Mohammad (pbuh) was born in Bekka Valley, Syria. Of course, the verse about "Safa and Marwa ......" was translated by them as "Goats and Cows laden with milk ......" to prove that it is in Syria and not in Mecca. When I caught them with their pants down they changed the translation to "Rocks and Flint Stones ....."

And, you probably belong to the Coptic Lunatic Rashad Khalifa, the number 19 nut, who had to add two more verses to the Holy Quran to prove his number 19.

http://www.submission.org/

Yes, according to him, he believes like the Christians that Satan is in constant fight with God and he rule the World and not God.

Dealt with thousand like you. You probably do the same thing on the Sunni sites too!

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