Jump to content
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!) ×
Guests can now reply in ALL forum topics (No registration required!)
In the Name of God بسم الله
Sign in to follow this  
wonderer

Thoughts (2010-2016) [ARCHIVE]

Recommended Posts

That's what I was inferring. But I honestly think the Hadith is taken wrongly. I think it may mean judging a person by not how they outwardly look but the way they speak. Where as the the Hadith I posted is speaking of taking knowledge specifically. Maybe I am mistaken but I think the Hadith from Imam Baqir A.S seems more rational and legit. When we start taking knowledge from anyone. They tend to end up becoming our role models or we unconsciously take them as such, therefore I believe who this individual is just as vital for accepting his/her knowledge. Many have knowledge but not everyone is allowed to teach. Teachers are responsible for the future generations, not only by what they teach but how they mold their students.

(wasalam)

 

What does knowledge mean anyway? Are we supposed to reject objective knowledge coming our way because the person who discovered it does not agree with our version of morality? Objective knowledge bears out regardless of the character of its discoverer. 

 

Ideas should be taken on merit. The notion that ideas should be judged on the basis of their origin and not on their efficacy is dubious. That would probably be a form of ad hominem - a logical fallacy. Reminds me of the guy asking us to reject Keynesian economics in its entirety because Keynes was allegedly a homosexual.

Take what's good and reject the bad. Judge ideas on their inherent qualities and nothing more.

 

I think Imam Baqir's (A.S) hadith refers to religious knowledge, a particular case where one can argue that piety of its bearer constitutes a factor to be considered. For all else, I think Imam Ali's (A.S) hadith makes more sense.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

What does knowledge mean anyway? Are we supposed to reject objective knowledge coming our way because the person who discovered it does not agree with our version of morality? Objective knowledge bears out regardless of the character of its discoverer. 

 

Is knowledge not just knowledge? It is true that it is logically incoherent that one cannot refute a claim by attacking the character of a person (Ad Hominem) however, that is not what we are talking about. You see, when speaking about taking knowledge from a being, it is presupposed that the being giving knowledge is truthful [institutes the character of the person] in their claim [knowledge]. When it logically is not the case at all times. There are two factors at play. One, being authenticating the person, seeing whether he/she is truthful in sharing their knowledge [seeing whether what they claim as knowledge is in fact true]. Two, being careful of whom we get our knowledge from. For example, those who tend to side and favor with Stephen Hawking are mostly atheists, since their knowledge came from the man himself, thus they tend to agree [take his "knowledge" as to God not existing] with everything he says/believes.  It is not to say we should blindly accept "knowledge" from anyone, nor is it to say we cannot take knowledge from anyone. Thus goes back to the first factor, in which I believe coincides with the Hadith from Imam Baqir A.S which states, we should take heed of the person proclaiming his knowledge.

 

(wasalam)

Edited by PureEthics

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Question: isn't there a hadith attributed to Imam Ali (as) that goes something along the lines of, "Don't look at who is speaking, look at what he says"?

Thoughts: for those who have downloaded Facebook Messenger: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2724728/The-Facebook-Messenger-backlash-Reviewers-flock-complain-experts-raise-concerns-privacy-controls.html

A man came to Imam Ali camp and said "O Aba Al Hassan, I fought against you in previous battle and I did so for a good reason." Imam Ali replied  "what was your reason?" The man answered " I did not fought against you to own anything or gain or to destroy (not exact words mind you, i am extracting this from memory) but i've looked at the other camp and saw Talha, Zubair and Ayisha then said to myself Subhana Allah, can all of these known personalities be on the wrong path?

(The man was comparing the social titles of Talha, Zubair and Ayshia with Imam Ali social title as prophet's cousin and husband of prophet's daughter)

 

Imam Ali answered him "You are  confused , Haqq (Truth) and Batil (falsehood ) cannot be defined through the titles of men. The right way to go is to know what Haq is and what Batil is,then you will know who are the people of Haq and who has committed falsehood.

 

 

The hadith that PureEthics brought dose not contradict this hadith. Haq and Imam Ali are one. Haq and prophet Muhamad are one thing. So by acknowledging  the hadiths that designated imam Ali as honest truthful man loved by Allah and his messenger and by knowing the hadiths that says that those who fight imam ali are hypocrites, then we will know who is on the haq and who is on the batil.

 

Then the hadith of imam Baqir can be applied, if we knew that the other camp are hypocrites, can we take the teachings of religion from them?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is knowledge not just knowledge? It is true that it is logically incoherent that one cannot refute a claim by attacking the character of a person (Ad Hominem) however, that is not what we are talking about. You see, when speaking about taking knowledge from a being, it is presupposed that the being giving knowledge is truthful [institutes the character of the person] in their claim [knowledge]. When it logically is not the case at all times. There are two factors at play. One, being authenticating the person, seeing whether he/she is truthful in sharing their knowledge [seeing whether what they claim as knowledge is in fact true]. Two, being careful of whom we get our knowledge from. For example, those who tend to side and favor with Stephen Hawking are mostly atheists, since their knowledge came from the man himself, thus they tend to agree [take his "knowledge" as to God not existing] with everything he says/believes.  It is not to say we should blindly accept "knowledge" from anyone, nor is it to say we cannot take knowledge from anyone. Thus goes back to the first factor, in which I believe coincides with the Hadith from Imam Baqir A.S which states, we should take heed of the person proclaiming his knowledge.

 

(wasalam)

 

Objective knowledge is testable, verifiable and independent of one's biases. Hence, if the truthfulness of the person(the source) is under question, it can be tested. 

 

Stephen Hawking may be an atheist, but my point is we cannot reject his work in cosmology based on his religious beliefs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

so i looked up in google for apocalyptic nice pictures from IslaamAbd as they are having their spring. I wanted a surreal ones like the Ukranians.

sadly there was non BUT..

I stumbled upon this during my search…..now someone gotta correct me, is that house for free?

http://pk.clasifimas.com/land_deals-in-f6-f7-islamabad-and-bahria-town_idd_5830815

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

so i looked up in google for apocalyptic nice pictures from IslaamAbd as they are having their spring. I wanted a surreal ones like the Ukranians.

sadly there was non BUT..

I stumbled upon this during my search…..now someone gotta correct me, is that house for free?

http://pk.clasifimas.com/land_deals-in-f6-f7-islamabad-and-bahria-town_idd_5830815

 

yea there is a clash between police and thousands of protesters in pakistan's capital islamabad.

no this house is not free.picture he used is not real too.

Ad poster is a property dealer who deals in various properties in posh areas of islamabad.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tired of this life. Everything feels so boring and quiet and dark. There's no happiness at all. Nor is there sadness either. Nothing seems to be going on. Its so depressing.

 

Everything is so plain. The world is full of conflict but living here, I don't feel it. I don't feel anything. Here, the trees and forests, the little roads, everything looks nice and rosy and from the outside, there looks like there is so much to do...but there's no people. Nobody to talk too. It feels lonely.

 

I wish there was something going on, anything. Good or bad. Some action which would light a fire and motivate me or give me something to do. Even a massive world war in which many die fighting...idk anything. :/

 

ws  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello people, just stumbled upon this website and joined in. Hope to make new friends and learn more about Islam. ^_^

 

Are you really a Muslim in Japan? Or are you japanese just living in the west? THAT IS AMAZING!!!!! I would love to hear your story.

 
ようこそ。何か質問がある場合。私に知らせてください。^_^

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Messenger of Allah said:



من مات على حب آل محمد ، مات شهيداً


He who dies with love of the family of Muhammad is a Martyr.



ألا ومن مات على حب آل محمد ، مات مغفورا له


And behold! He who dies with love of the family of Muhammad is forgiven.



 ألا ومن مات على حب آل محمد ، مات تائبا


And more! The one who dies with love of the family of Muhammad is died repented.



ألا ومن مات على حب آل محمد ، مات مؤمنا مستكمل الإيمان


Lo! He who dies with love of the family of Muhammad is died as a believer with a COMPLETE belief.



ألا ومن مات على حب آل محمد ، بشره ملك الموت بالجنة ،ثم منكر ونكير 


And no doubt! The one who dies with love of the family of Muhammad, the angle of death gives him the glad tiding of Paradise, and so do the two angels who question him (Munkar & Nakeer).



ألا ومن مات على حب آل محمد ، يزف إلى الجنة كما تزف العروس إلى بيت زوجها


And verily he who dies with love of the family of Muhammad, will be led toward the Paradise as the bride is led to the house of her husband.



ألا ومن مات على حب آل محمد ، فتح له في قبره بابان إلى الجنة


Behold! And he who dies with love of the family of Muhammad, for him there will open two gates in his grave toward the Paradise.



ألا ومن مات على حب آل محمد ، جعل الله زوار قبره ملائكة الرحمة


Lo! And the one who dies with love of the family of Muhammad, Allah will make his grave a sacred place of visit for the angels of mercy.



ألا ومن مات على حب آل محمد ، مات على السنة


And verily he who dies with love of the family of Muhammad, has died on Sunnah.



 ألا ومن مات على بغض آل محمد جاء يوم القيامة مكتوب بين عينيه "آيس من رحمة الله"


And no doubt! The one who dies with the HATE of the family of Muhammad, will arrive in the day of judgment while it is printed on his forehead that he is desperate from the Mercy of Allah.



ألا ومن مات على بغض آل محمد ، مات كافرأ 


Behold! He who dies with the hate of the family of Muhammad, has died unbeliever.



ألا ومن مات على بغض آل محمد ، لم يشم رائحة الجنة


And verily he who dies with the hate of the family of Muhammad, will never hear the smell of Paradise.


Edited by Chaotic Muslem

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You mean moosla dhaar baarish?

 

:P

No, taez baarish is zabardast baarish! Unless you're saying that it's incorrect to say "zabardast baarish," in which case... whatever :rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was walking once and it was all nice and good....then came the baarish...taaz barish with thunderstorms..

 

Only situation I don't like baarish...actually that wasn't too bad either lol. :P

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No, taez baarish is zabardast baarish! Unless you're saying that it's incorrect to say "zabardast baarish," in which case... whatever :rolleyes:

 

Haha no it's not incorrect. You can relax!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

kawaii @@ Real Waku Waku

 

Konichiwa Schanze San!

 

Watashi wa CM desu! Jyoou no Jyoou no Kyoushi tsu

 

yookoso !

 

Nice to meet you too, Chaotic Muslim. Arigatou!

 

 

 

Are you really a Muslim in Japan? Or are you japanese just living in the west? THAT IS AMAZING!!!!! I would love to hear your story.

 
ようこそ。何か質問がある場合。私に知らせてください。 ^_^

 

 

Google translate or do you speak japanese too brother? Anyway I will, PureEthics. ^_^ It's nice to see this is such a friendly community, I think I'll fit right in and yes I am pure bred japanese but I converted to Islam in another part of the world.

 

Sayonara

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Zabardast baarish!

 

I've been patiently waiting for rain for quite some time now. 

 

Never works out though. The forecast is almost always wrong!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been patiently waiting for rain for quite some time now. 

 

Never works out though. The forecast is almost always wrong!

Inshallah it'll rain soon! Sometimes I envy people who live in snowy areas. You can wear enough layers to keep warm, but unless you have constant access to a/c the heat is unbearable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Inshallah it'll rain soon! Sometimes I envy people who live in snowy areas. You can wear enough layers to keep warm, but unless you have constant access to a/c the heat is unbearable.

 

Wool is the best as a cover underneath.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

(salam)

 

Imam Riḍā (P.B.U.H.), "O' 'Abd al-'Azīm! Send my greetings to my friends and tell them
 not to let Satan find a way to their souls, command them to be truthful in their words
 and to be trustworthy, and command them to keep silent and leave the quarrel which
 is in vain, and welcome each other and pay a visit to one another; verily, it would bring
them closer to me".
 

1924366_10203675543462112_88736798566320

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nah, I just meant that we need active female mods here due to many members not feeling comfortable PMing male mods about issues they may have. If I were a mod I'd probably end up banning members left and right for being annoying :rolleyes:

Naz was an actice female mod, and a dang good one at that. Its sad to see her no longer a mod :(

Maybe the team could hire more qualified females? I would (again) vote for Hameedeh but I don't think she is active much anymore /:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Google translate or do you speak japanese too brother? Anyway I will, PureEthics. ^_^ It's nice to see this is such a friendly community, I think I'll fit right in and yes I am pure bred japanese but I converted to Islam in another part of the world.

 

Sayonara

 

Google Translate :P However, I am learning some basic words in Japanese. Very interesting language, however very hard as well lol. MashAllah, that is awesome. When you are ready and would like to tell your journey please do so, cause I cannot wait to hear it :) .

 

(wasalam)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Naz was an actice female mod, and a dang good one at that. Its sad to see her no longer a mod :(

Maybe the team could hire more qualified females? I would (again) vote for Hameedeh but I don't think she is active much anymore /:

Hmm can't they form some sort of democratically elected council to pick who is mod and admin. I think there should be atleast term limits or something lol.

We need some form of democracy in this forum.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...