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In the Name of God بسم الله
wonderer

Thoughts (2010-2016) [ARCHIVE]

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I once read that, according to the rules of probability, I have a greater chance of dying in a road accident than winning the lottery (It was said about British-based Lotto).

I have read that I have a greater chance of being struck by lightning than winning a major lottery prize. Thousands of people die in car wrecks every day (in the US).

I have a relative who won a significant lottery prize twice.

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I once read that, according to the rules of probability, I have a greater chance of dying in a road accident than winning the lottery (It was said about British-based Lotto).

 

Hold on, I think it was about dying in an air crash, which makes sense as road accidents are far more common, whereas air crashes not so, but still I have more chances of being caught a passenger on MH370 than hitting a multimillion dollars jackpot.

 

Sad world of statistics we live in, but if it was only about the stats, people most probably wouldn't take chances to do improbable, nearly impossible things, and the world would be such a dull, boring, predictable place.

It's only by going against the odds that makes our lives interesting.

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If the probability of winning a lottery is insignificant to the point where you can only win by luck, than why is it haram? And how exactly is it gambling, because unlike in a gamble where the setter can keep all the money if you lose, here someone from the public will always win.

 

 

 

Just curious. 

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If the probability of winning a lottery is insignificant to the point where you can only win by luck, than why is it haram? And how exactly is it gambling, because unlike in a gamble where the setter can keep all the money if you lose, here someone from the public will always win.

 

 

 

Just curious. 

 

Me too. The modern state-run lottery systems defy conventional gambling scenarios which we are very familiar with and which are explicitly banned in Islam.

 

In national lotteries they also fund a lot of charitable causes with the proceeds while letting people win from big to modest to small prizes.

 

Perhaps there's something common between lotteries and lucky draw schemes. I once bought a bottle of cooking oil and sent in its label and entered a draw. I won a diamond ring! Is that gambling?

 

It was my mother; not I. It was 20+ years ago. The brand was Dalda.

Edited by Marbles

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If the probability of winning a lottery is insignificant to the point where you can only win by luck, than why is it haram? And how exactly is it gambling, because unlike in a gamble where the setter can keep all the money if you lose, here someone from the public will always win.

Just curious.

I think it depends on your intentions.

I don't buy lottery tickets, but I have sometimes bought raffle tickets with the intention of the ticket price being a donation to the organization the raffle was funding.

If you buy with the hope of winning, it is gambling on small odds. So maybe you can play lottery if you can do so with the intention of paying extra taxes. Extra taxes, woohoo!

As for some player always eventually winning, you know the winner only gets a portion of the proceeds, right? Most of the money goes to the organizer.

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If the probability of winning a lottery is insignificant to the point where you can only win by luck, than why is it haram? And how exactly is it gambling, because unlike in a gamble where the setter can keep all the money if you lose, here someone from the public will always win.

 

 

 

Just curious. 

 

What is gambling? It is a game of chance.

 

“They ask you about intoxicants and games of chances. Say: in both of them there is a great sin...”(Surah al-Baqarah 2:219)

 

It isnt dependent on the percentage of probability or if there will always be winners. If you are waging money in which the outcome is uncertain on your part then it is haram. Meaning, if you are losing money in which you can never be certain you will gain it back then it is haram, even if someone else wins. You are betting your hard earned money on a foolish system in which the outcome is by chance, if any to begin with. It also can become an addiction and thus adds more reason to its permissibility. Also it is an OBLIGATION upon a muslim to give to the poor, so by doing such a thing in which it is reasoned upon chance, giving to the poor out-weighs such a doing.

 

If the lottery was with no condition (ie no money loan to the lottery company to chance out a winning ticket) then it would have been fine. Here is an example:

 

Is the bank allowed to run such lotteries? If the bank is conducting the raffle without any conditions from their customers, but only to promote their business, then there is nothing wrong with it and whoever wins is allowed to receive the prize amount, as this falls under Unknown Owner after obtaining the consent of the Imam or his representative, in case of Government banks or Company banks. In case of Public or individual banks. This permission is not required. However, such raffle is not allowed if the prize amount is paid to a customer under an agreement for loan etc. even if amount is paid after winning the raffle, as this was previously promised by the bank

 

I think it depends on your intentions.

I don't buy lottery tickets, but I have sometimes bought raffle tickets with the intention of the ticket price being a donation to the organization the raffle was funding.

If you buy with the hope of winning, it is gambling on small odds. So maybe you can play lottery if you can do so with the intention of paying extra taxes. Extra taxes, woohoo!

As for some player always eventually winning, you know the winner only gets a portion of the proceeds, right? Most of the money goes to the organizer.

 

Sorry sister, but it is still haram no matter what the intention for it is the action itself is the root of all evil. Let me give you an example, you cannot steal from the rich to feed the poor.

 

To reiterate, see, giving money for a raffle is totally different from lottery because,  first and foremost you are not gambling. You are donating your money to an organization (usually of need) and getting a prize is just a plus. The prize has nothing to do with your donation, there is no chance on the money you have given.

 

http://www.al-islam.org/contemporary-legal-rulings-in-shii-law-ayatullah-ali-al-husayni-as-seestani/6-lottery

http://www.al-islam.org/greater-sins-volume-1-ayatullah-sayyid-abd-al-husayn-dastghayb-shirazi/fourteenth-greater-sin#gambling-and-wine-cause-avarice-and-enmity

Edited by PureEthics

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Sorry sister, but it is still haram no matter what the intention for it is the action itself is the root of all evil. Let me give you an example, you cannot steal from the rich to feed the poor.

Raffle is sometimes allowed with the intention of donation, but AFAIK lottery never is. Who in their right mind would voluntarily pay extra taxes?

We need sarcasm tags.

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Raffle is sometimes allowed with the intention of donation, but AFAIK lottery never is. Who in their right mind would voluntarily pay extra taxes?

We need sarcasm tags.

 

LOOOL

 

let alone, not knowing where "these taxes" go.... ^_^

Edited by PureEthics

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I do have a non-Muslim relative who won nearly $20K (after taxes) in lottery though. Wasn't a large enough prize to make the news, but significant nonetheless. It was enough that they were able to pay off all their debts and retire.

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I do have a non-Muslim relative who won nearly $20K (after taxes) in lottery though. Wasn't a large enough prize to make the news, but significant nonetheless. It was enough that they were able to pay off all their debts and retire.

 

Damn, that much money won't even pay my student debt for university tuition :dry: 

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Damn, that much money won't even pay my student debt for university tuition :dry:

I was made to pay mine with all of my savings a few years back and since I've remained unable to save even near the amount I had. They tell us that the taxation office cannot see how much money we save but obviously they could to be able to see that my savings amount was equal to that of my student loan amount and I was forced to pay it back immediately rather than in part from each pay I receive from my job.

Damn, that much money won't even pay my student debt for university tuition :dry:

I was made to pay mine with all of my savings a few years back and since I've remained unable to save even near the amount I had. They tell us that the taxation office cannot see how much money we save but obviously they could to be able to see that my savings amount was equal to that of my student loan amount and I was forced to pay it back immediately rather than in part from each pay I receive from my job.

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Damn, that much money won't even pay my student debt for university tuition :dry:

Loans are haram! :shaytan:

It would put a good dent in my student loan debt. It is more than my degree earned me from 2009 to 2012.

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How about credit cards? Are they haram?

No, I think they are fine as long as you pay the balance in full each month. It is the interest which is haram, not borrowing.

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Student loans are not.

(wasalam)

True. Exceptions are made when it is made too difficult to function in society without borrowing. As far as I know, mortgages and student loans are allowed as long as it is nearly impossible for the person to pay for house or education without them.

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True. Exceptions are made when it is made too difficult to function in society without borrowing. As far as I know, mortgages and student loans are allowed as long as it is nearly impossible for the person to pay for house or education without them.

 

I would say more than 80% of the western Muslim population falls under this criteria. Your niyah should always be to secure the loan.

 

It would put a good dent in my student loan debt. It is more than my degree earned me from 2009 to 2012.

 

Can't put a price on knowledge though.

Edited by Mushkil Kusha

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Why does knowledge cost money?

They want us to go seek ignorance :(

#FreeEducation

 

Its because the one who gives knowledge struggled and spent time to earn that knowledge. You can't just expect to learn for free. Heard in a majalis that even the righteous sahaba paid Rasullulah to give them knowledge, Imam Ali (as) used to pay Rasullulah as well to learn. He was even quoted saying that it was the best money he ever spent.

Edited by Mushkil Kusha

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Its because the one who gives knowledge struggled and spent time to earn that knowledge. You can't just expect to learn for free. Heard in a majalis that even the righteous sahaba paid Rasullulah to give them knowledge, Imam Ali (as) used to pay Rasullulah as well to learn. He was even quoted saying that it was the best money he ever spent.

I am really not sure about that. Why is going to hawza free then? why doesnt sistani expect to be paid when he gives fatwa?

You know, when the Mahdi reappears, the world would stop working for the sake of money. Everyone would stop asking for money and being greedy, they would only ask the reward from Allah.

I can see a brighter future with education. A lot of people do not have access to it because they are poor!! So they remain ignorant

To add, i agree that an instructor may receive money from time to time, but to force the students to pay them while they are in debts? Vraiment affreux

Edited by -Enlightened

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Why does knowledge cost money?

They want us to go seek ignorance :(

#FreeEducation

 

Education is not up for sale

 

#Socialism

My parents after watching the Barcelona vs Real Madrid soccer game.

 

Mom: Ahmed, do they have these kind of games here in Ameerika?

 

My Dad: No, they only have men in tight pants running around.

 

lol I never understood the concept of American specialness (sic) in sports; they play games no one else plays; they don't play games everyone in the world plays. Have we ever heard American team making headway into a great tournament of football or hockey (ice hockey doesn't count) or rugby or cricket? Heck no.

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My parents after watching the Barcelona vs Real Madrid soccer game.

 

Mom: Ahmed, do they have these kind of games here in Ameerika?

 

My Dad: No, they only have men in tight pants running around.

 

 

Is your name Ahmad? I thought you were a girl?

Edited by Ali-F

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lol I never understood the concept of American specialness (sic) in sports; they play games no one else plays; they don't play games everyone in the world plays. Have we ever heard American team making headway into a great tournament of football or hockey (ice hockey doesn't count) or rugby or cricket? Heck no.

 

Yes we have. Maybe not field hockey or cricket but America definitely has international rugby and football (soccer) teams, how come ice hockey doesn't count? Actually, North America is known to produce the finest of athletes compared to the rest of the world, no matter what the sport. They just lack cricket skills.

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Yes we have. Maybe not field hockey or cricket but America definitely has international rugby and football (soccer) teams, how come ice hockey doesn't count? Actually, North America is known to produce the finest of athletes compared to the rest of the world, no matter what the sport. They just lack cricket skills.

 

Individual athletes, yes, but they lack competing teams in all sports, due to the unpopularity of mainstream sports the rest of the world plays. When was the last time the US made into football world cup final? :donno:

 

Ice hockey is a caricature of hockey, like American football is the caricature of rugby and baseball is the caricature of cricket :D

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lol I never understood the concept of American specialness (sic) in sports; they play games no one else plays; they don't play games everyone in the world plays. Have we ever heard American team making headway into a great tournament of football or hockey (ice hockey doesn't count) or rugby or cricket? Heck no.

 

 

It's like they crown themselves the 'intergalactic world champions' of a sport less than a handful of nations play :dry: 

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^ Oh look! soccer with sticks!

Actually I was just playing the ignorant American. I knew about field hockey.

 

 

Was bored-to -death .... didnt have anything better to do than play along with the ignorant American

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