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In the Name of God بسم الله

Was The Prophet (pbuh) Unlettered

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Those who follow the Apostle, the unlettered Prophet... (Surah al-A'raf, 7:157)

It is He who has sent amongst the unlettered an Apostle from amongst themselves

... (Surah Jummah, 62:2)

And you were not (able) to recite a book before this (Book came), nor are you

(able) to transcribe it wth your right hand: in that case, indeed, would the talkers

of falsehood have doubted. (Surah al-Ankabut, 29:48)

How would you explain these verses or let me guess did uthman compile them purposely and changed the words lol

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Those who follow the Apostle, the unlettered Prophet... (Surah al-A'raf, 7:157)

It is He who has sent amongst the unlettered an Apostle from amongst themselves

... (Surah Jummah, 62:2)

And you were not (able) to recite a book before this (Book came), nor are you

(able) to transcribe it wth your right hand: in that case, indeed, would the talkers

of falsehood have doubted. (Surah al-Ankabut, 29:48)

How would you explain these verses or let me guess did uthman compile them purposely and changed the words lol

(salam)

our tafsir is different

what aimmah (as) taught is like this

Narrated Ja'far ibn Muhammad al-Sufi:

I asked Abu Ja'far Muhammad ibn Ali al-Rida, peace be upon them both, saying: "O son of the Allah's Apostle, why was the Prophet called the Ummi?" He answered: "What do the people say?". I said: "They claim that he was called the Ummi because he was illiterate." He replied: "They lie! May the curse of Allah be upon them for this. Allah has clearly said in His Book: "He it is Who sent among the Ummi a Messenger from among themselves, to recite to them His Verses (i.e. the Qur'an), to purify them, to teach them the book (i.e. literacy) and to teach them wisdom (i.e. knowledge and ethics). [Qur'an 62:2]." How would he teach what he himself could not do? By Allah, Allah's Apostle used to read and write in 72, or he said 73, languages. He was called the Ummi because he was from Makkah. Makkah is one of the mother (umm) towns, and this is why Allah the High and Exalted said: 'So that you (Muhammad) may warn the mother (umm) town (i.e. Makkah) and whoever is round about it'."

Muhammad ibn Ali ibn al-Husayn ibn Babuyah al-Saduq, Ilal al-Sharai (Beirut, Lebanon: Muasassat al-A'lami lil Matbu'aat; first edition, 1988) vol. 1, p. 151, Chapter 105, Hadith Number 1.

fi aman Allah

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(salam)

our tafsir is different

what aimmah (as) taught is like this

Narrated Ja'far ibn Muhammad al-Sufi:

I asked Abu Ja'far Muhammad ibn Ali al-Rida, peace be upon them both, saying: "O son of the Allah's Apostle, why was the Prophet called the Ummi?" He answered: "What do the people say?". I said: "They claim that he was called the Ummi because he was illiterate." He replied: "They lie! May the curse of Allah be upon them for this. Allah has clearly said in His Book: "He it is Who sent among the Ummi a Messenger from among themselves, to recite to them His Verses (i.e. the Qur'an), to purify them, to teach them the book (i.e. literacy) and to teach them wisdom (i.e. knowledge and ethics). [Qur'an 62:2]." How would he teach what he himself could not do? By Allah, Allah's Apostle used to read and write in 72, or he said 73, languages. He was called the Ummi because he was from Makkah. Makkah is one of the mother (umm) towns, and this is why Allah the High and Exalted said: 'So that you (Muhammad) may warn the mother (umm) town (i.e. Makkah) and whoever is round about it'."

Muhammad ibn Ali ibn al-Husayn ibn Babuyah al-Saduq, Ilal al-Sharai (Beirut, Lebanon: Muasassat al-A'lami lil Matbu'aat; first edition, 1988) vol. 1, p. 151, Chapter 105, Hadith Number 1.

fi aman Allah

This is against quranic as well as general concepts.

Quran 7:157 says: Allatheena yattabiAAoona alrrasoola alnnabiyya al-ommiyya allathee yajidoonahu maktooban AAindahum fee alttawrati waal-injeeli ya/muruhum bialmaAAroofi wayanhahum AAani almunkari wayuhillu lahumu alttayyibati wayuharrimu AAalayhimu alkhaba-itha wayadaAAu AAanhum israhum waal-aghlala allatee kanat AAalayhim faallatheena amanoo bihi waAAazzaroohu wanasaroohu waittabaAAoo alnnoora allathee onzila maAAahu ola-ika humu almuflihoona

(surah juma) Quran 62:2 says: Huwa allathee baAAatha fee al-ommiyyeena rasoolan minhum yatloo AAalayhim ayatihi wayuzakkeehim wayuAAallimuhumu alkitaba waalhikmata wa-in kanoo min qablu lafee dalalin mubeenin

Few points to note:

1. Allah uses two words above i.e. OMMIYY & OMMIYYEEN

OMMIYYA IS SINGULAR & OMMIYYEEN IS PLURAL.

IF WE CONSIDER OMMIYYA AS FOR (as ghulam-e-ali said): "Makkah is one of the mother (umm) towns, and this is why Allah the High and Exalted said: 'So that you (Muhammad) may warn the mother (umm) town (i.e. Makkah) and whoever is round about it"

According to surah juma 62:2, then Allah uses word OMMIYYEEN for peoples of makkah. Then why Allah uses the word OMMIYY for prophet muhammad(pbuh) in 7:157?

i.e. Allah uses word OMMIYY in 7:157 this means Allah is talking about single person i.e. prophet muhammad(pbuh) as we can see words of 7:157 i.e. 'Allatheena yattabiAAoona alrrasoola alnnabiyya al-ommiyya'. Here none other than rasool-Allah is present.

Then why Allah said OMMIYY here i.e. singular

2. If we consider Makkah is considered as ummul-qura means un-lettered then please answer this:

Lets suppose, I know that my friend's(sana) complete family tree, is completely jahil (& i call them "Umul Qura") but only my friend(sana) is scientist (in whole world) means she have knowledge.

Then what do you think when ever i call her or say her something then i will call her jahil sana?

Absolutely not at all. Why?

Because i know that she is knowledgeble person & completely different from her family.

The same funda is also applied here.

3. If you are considering OMMIYYEEN as OMM+IYYEEN then this do not make any sense because OMM means mother the what is the meaning of IYYEEN!

As you applied in surah juma 62:2 above.

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The prophet (pbuh) did not attend any school, he was taught by Allah according to Quran.

[shakir 53:2] Your companion does not err, nor does he go astray;

[Pooya/Ali Commentary 53:2] (see commentary for verse 1)

æóãóÇ íóäØöÞõ Úóäö Çáúåóæóì {3}

[shakir 53:3] Nor does he speak out of desire.

[Pooya/Ali Commentary 53:3] (see commentary for verse 1)

Åöäú åõæó ÅöáøóÇ æóÍúíñ íõæÍóì {4}

[shakir 53:4] It is naught but revelation that is revealed,

[Pooya/Ali Commentary 53:4] (see commentary for verse 1)

Úóáøóãóåõ ÔóÏöíÏõ ÇáúÞõæóì {5}

[shakir 53:5] The Lord of Mighty Power has taught him,

[Pooya/Ali Commentary 53:5]

To know who is the teacher of the Holy Prophet see commentary of verses 2 to 4 of Ar Rahman.

Shadidul Quwa, "the supreme in power", is Allah. To translate and interpret it as the angel Jibrail is to belie the verses 30 to 38 of Baqarah (see commentary) and verse 75 of Sad, because Jibrail was one of the angels who prostrated themselves before Adam when Adam taught them "the names" they did not know. As mentioned in the commentary of the verses of al Baqarah, on the authority of well known Muslim scholars. (Refer to Durr al Manthur, Kanzul Ammal, Yanabi al Mawaddat, Riaz al Nuzra and Arjah al Mutalib), "the names" were-Muhammad, Ali, Fatimah, Hasan, Husayn. Even if "the names" are interpreted as wisdom, then too Jibrail cannot be the teacher of the Holy Prophet, as the Holy Prophet is the superior most prophet among all the prophets of Allah in wisdom and all other attributes. In verse 75 of Sad Allah asks Shaytan: "Are you arrogant, or are you one of the alin (the high ones)?" It means there were some servants of Allah described as alin (plural of ali) who were superior to Adam, therefore, exempted from prostrating themselves before Adam on account of their superiority over him. So it is proved that it is Allah who taught the Holy Prophet and from no mortal created being he received any kind of knowledge as mentioned in the commentary of Baqarah: 78 and other verses in connection with the interpretation of the word "ummi".

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This is against quranic as well as general concepts.

Quran 7:157 says: Allatheena yattabiAAoona alrrasoola alnnabiyya al-ommiyya allathee yajidoonahu maktooban AAindahum fee alttawrati waal-injeeli ya/muruhum bialmaAAroofi wayanhahum AAani almunkari wayuhillu lahumu alttayyibati wayuharrimu AAalayhimu alkhaba-itha wayadaAAu AAanhum israhum waal-aghlala allatee kanat AAalayhim faallatheena amanoo bihi waAAazzaroohu wanasaroohu waittabaAAoo alnnoora allathee onzila maAAahu ola-ika humu almuflihoona

(surah juma) Quran 62:2 says: Huwa allathee baAAatha fee al-ommiyyeena rasoolan minhum yatloo AAalayhim ayatihi wayuzakkeehim wayuAAallimuhumu alkitaba waalhikmata wa-in kanoo min qablu lafee dalalin mubeenin

Few points to note:

1. Allah uses two words above i.e. OMMIYY & OMMIYYEEN

OMMIYYA IS SINGULAR & OMMIYYEEN IS PLURAL.

IF WE CONSIDER OMMIYYA AS FOR (as ghulam-e-ali said): "Makkah is one of the mother (umm) towns, and this is why Allah the High and Exalted said: 'So that you (Muhammad) may warn the mother (umm) town (i.e. Makkah) and whoever is round about it"

According to surah juma 62:2, then Allah uses word OMMIYYEEN for peoples of makkah. Then why Allah uses the word OMMIYY for prophet muhammad(pbuh) in 7:157?

i.e. Allah uses word OMMIYY in 7:157 this means Allah is talking about single person i.e. prophet muhammad(pbuh) as we can see words of 7:157 i.e. 'Allatheena yattabiAAoona alrrasoola alnnabiyya al-ommiyya'. Here none other than rasool-Allah is present.

Then why Allah said OMMIYY here i.e. singular

2. If we consider Makkah is considered as ummul-qura means un-lettered then please answer this:

Lets suppose, I know that my friend's(sana) complete family tree, is completely jahil (& i call them "Umul Qura") but only my friend(sana) is scientist (in whole world) means she have knowledge.

Then what do you think when ever i call her or say her something then i will call her jahil sana?

Absolutely not at all. Why?

Because i know that she is knowledgeble person & completely different from her family.

The same funda is also applied here.

3. If you are considering OMMIYYEEN as OMM+IYYEEN then this do not make any sense because OMM means mother the what is the meaning of IYYEEN!

As you applied in surah juma 62:2 above.

(salam)

well, i believe that prophet in deed was literate, for if he was not

how could he TEACH us quran,

As per quran, the characteristic of this book is

From surat un nahl, verse 89

. And (remember) the Day when We

shall raise up from every nation a

witness against them from amongst

themselves. And We shall bring you

(O Muhammad SAW) as a witness

against these. And We have sent down

to you the Book (the Quran) as an

exposition of everything, a guidance, a

mercy, and glad tidings for those who

have submitted themselves (to Allah

as Muslims).

And also we find in quran that

From surat ul anaam ,verse 38

. There is not a moving (living)

creature on earth, nor a bird that flies

with its two wings, but are

communities like you. We have

neglected nothing in the Book, then

unto their Lord they (all) shall be

gathered.

So these verses show that there is nothing which is not mentioned in quran,

and we find in quran

From surat ul baqara 129

Our Lord! and raise up in them a Messenger from among them who shall recite to them Thy communications and teach them the Book and the wisdom, and purify them; surely Thou art the Mighty, the Wise.

and also

From surat ul jum’aa,verse 2

[shakir] He it is Who raised among the inhabitants of Mecca an Messenger from among themselves, who recites to them His communications and purifies them, and teaches them the Book and the Wisdom, although they were before certainly in clear error,

so it is clear from quran that prophet was ordered to teach a book which has everything, and nothing is left out of it.

so he should know everything

i accept that he was taught this by almighty Allah,

but he should be taught such

that nothing should be left out

and that is why we find in quran

From surat un nisa , verse is 113

. Had not the Grace of Allah and

His Mercy been upon you (O

Muhammad SAW), a party of them

would certainly have made a decision

to mislead you, but (in fact) they

mislead none except their own selves,

and no harm can they do to you in the

least. Allah has sent down to you the

Book (The Quran), and AlHikmah

and taught you that

which you knew not. And Ever Great

is the Grace of Allah unto you (O

Muhammad SAW).

now, concentrate on the words of Allah

æóÚóáøóãóßó ãóÇ áóãú Êóßõäú ÊóÚúáóãõ

now, let us see the meaning of ummi

one meaning, as is given by sunni, that he did not know how to read or write

if i have to accept that

the problem would be that Allah said

[taught you that which you knew not]

now, if he did not know how to write or read, as per this verse, it was upon Allah to teach him

so did he teach him?

if yes, how could he be illiterate then?

if no, how can this verse be then correct?

that is why holy imam said what i had quoted.

and i believe in what my imam said

rest every one is free

if some one is happy to follow unlettered prophet

he should go ahead

i follow the prophet who knew everything as he was taught by Allah.

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(salam)

well, i believe that prophet in deed was literate, for if he was not

how could he TEACH us quran,

My point of concentration is before revelation of quran.

As per quran, the characteristic of this book is

From surat un nahl, verse 89

. And (remember) the Day when We

shall raise up from every nation a

witness against them from amongst

themselves. And We shall bring you

(O Muhammad SAW) as a witness

against these. And We have sent down

to you the Book (the Quran) as an

exposition of everything, a guidance, a

mercy, and glad tidings for those who

have submitted themselves (to Allah

as Muslims).

And also we find in quran that

From surat ul anaam ,verse 38

. There is not a moving (living)

creature on earth, nor a bird that flies

with its two wings, but are

communities like you. We have

neglected nothing in the Book, then

unto their Lord they (all) shall be

gathered.

So these verses show that there is nothing which is not mentioned in quran,

and we find in quran

From surat ul baqara 129

Our Lord! and raise up in them a Messenger from among them who shall recite to them Thy communications and teach them the Book and the wisdom, and purify them; surely Thou art the Mighty, the Wise.

and also

From surat ul jumaa,verse 2

[shakir] He it is Who raised among the inhabitants of Mecca an Messenger from among themselves, who recites to them His communications and purifies them, and teaches them the Book and the Wisdom, although they were before certainly in clear error,

so it is clear from quran that prophet was ordered to teach a book which has everything, and nothing is left out of it.

so he should know everything

i accept that he was taught this by almighty Allah,

but he should be taught such

that nothing should be left out

When i said prophet muhammad(pbuh) left something while teaching verses of quran!

Allah is preserving quran.

and that is why we find in quran

From surat un nisa , verse is 113

. Had not the Grace of Allah and

His Mercy been upon you (O

Muhammad SAW), a party of them

would certainly have made a decision

to mislead you, but (in fact) they

mislead none except their own selves,

and no harm can they do to you in the

least. Allah has sent down to you the

Book (The Quran), and AlHikmah

and taught you that

which you knew not. And Ever Great

is the Grace of Allah unto you (O

Muhammad SAW).

You took whole my quote out of context.

now, let us see the meaning of ummi

one meaning, as is given by sunni, that he did not know how to read or write

if i have to accept that

the problem would be that Allah said

[taught you that which you knew not]

Do any human only teach something when he is able to read or write!

Jibraeel(as) taught prophet muhammad(pbuh) the verses of quran & prophet muhammad(pbuh) feed them in his memory & then he recite those verses infront of sahaba.

This is the logic. A VERY BASIC LOGIC.

I ask you: Tell me is there any quran written by prophet muhammad(pbuh) himself in his complete life? Can you show me single hadith regarding this.

now, if he did not know how to write or read, as per this verse, it was upon Allah to teach him

so did he teach him?

if yes, how could he be illiterate then?

if no, how can this verse be then correct?

Allah taught prophet muhammad(pbuh) & zaria was jibraeel(as).

When i said illiterate! I said un-lettered.

Verse is correct because Allah garranted in the quran about its protection (of any type).

that is why holy imam said what i had quoted.

and i believe in what my imam said

rest every one is free

if some one is happy to follow unlettered prophet

he should go ahead

i follow the prophet who knew everything as he was taught by Allah.

ghulam-e-ali here discussion is not about what you believe & what i believe. Here discussion is what is correct & what is wrong.

I only gave you some points in my previous quote i.e. what is proved from quran.

If you believe that prophet muhammad(pbuh) can write & read then ask this question to yourself: why prophet muhammad(pbuh) never wrote quran by himself?

& before believing any hadith of 72-73 languages. You have to check the hadith first i.e. it is authentic or not.

& i love to see that sahih hadith regarding 73 languages.

My advise to you: use brain not emotion, while seaching true path of Allah.

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I ask you: Tell me is there any quran written by prophet muhammad(pbuh) himself in his complete life? Can you show me single hadith regarding this.

Salam sister,

What about the "Calamity of Tuesday", did the Prophet ask someone to write his will or he said to bring pen and paper so that he can write?

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Those who follow the Apostle, the unlettered Prophet... (Surah al-A'raf, 7:157)

It is He who has sent amongst the unlettered an Apostle from amongst themselves

... (Surah Jummah, 62:2)

And you were not (able) to recite a book before this (Book came), nor are you

(able) to transcribe it wth your right hand: in that case, indeed, would the talkers

of falsehood have doubted. (Surah al-Ankabut, 29:48)

How would you explain these verses or let me guess did uthman compile them purposely and changed the words lol

The Surah Jumuah verse talks about the Prophet educating the people, how can an unlettered person educate?

Ummi does not mean unlettered. End of.

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what???? shias believe the prophet was NOT illiterate???

ofcourse he was....

Read "The Illiterate Prophet" by Morteza Motahhari for a comprehensive analysis.

Volume 9, Book 92, Number 468:

Narrated Ibn 'Abbas:

When the time of the death of the Prophet approached while there were some men in the house, and among them was 'Umar bin Al-Khatttab, the Prophet said, "Come near let me write for you a writing after which you will never go astray." 'Umar said, "The Prophet is seriously ill, and you have the Quran, so Allah's Book is sufficient for us." The people in the house differed and disputed. Some of them said, "Come near so that Allah's Apostle may write for you a writing after which you will not go astray," while some of them said what 'Umar said. When they made much noise and differed greatly before the Prophet, he said to them, "Go away and leave me." Ibn 'Abbas used to say, "It was a great disaster that their difference and noise prevented Allah's Apostle from writing that writing for them.

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Those who follow the Apostle, the unlettered Prophet... (Surah al-A'raf, 7:157)

It is He who has sent amongst the unlettered an Apostle from amongst themselves

... (Surah Jummah, 62:2)

And you were not (able) to recite a book before this (Book came), nor are you

(able) to transcribe it wth your right hand: in that case, indeed, would the talkers

of falsehood have doubted. (Surah al-Ankabut, 29:48)

How would you explain these verses or let me guess did uthman compile them purposely and changed the words lol

An article by a well known Ahl Sunnah scholar from the UK, challenging the concept that the majority hold in regards to the illiteracy of our beloved Prophet (saw)

Article

Edited by carlos
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When i said prophet muhammad(pbuh) left something while teaching verses of quran!

Allah is preserving quran.

Do any human only teach something when he is able to read or write!

Jibraeel(as) taught prophet muhammad(pbuh) the verses of quran & prophet muhammad(pbuh) feed them in his memory &]then he recite those verses infront of sahaba.

This is the logic. A VERY BASIC LOGIC.

I ask you: Tell me is there any quran written by prophet muhammad(pbuh) himself in his complete life? Can you show me single hadith regarding this.

Allah taught prophet muhammad(pbuh) & zaria was jibraeel(as).

When i said illiterate! I said un-lettered.

Verse is correct because Allah garranted in the quran about its protection (of any type).

(salam)

you see it is proven from quran that there is nothing left from quran, and prophet was told to teach us what has everything

secondly, i proved to you FROM QURAN that Allah taught him EVERYTHING, and everything means everything ; rather Allah said i taught you what you knew not

i am asking you, did he know how to read or write?

yes or no?

i had given my reason, and its proof from quran; rest i told u

you can believe in what u believe

i believe in what my imam (as) said

& before believing any hadith of 72-73 languages. You have to check the hadith first i.e. it is authentic or not.

& i love to see that sahih hadith regarding 73 languages.

ok

take this sahih hadeeth from bukhari that he could write

Volume 3, Book 49, Number 863:

Narrated Al-Bara:

When the Prophet intended to perform 'Umra in the month of Dhul-Qada, the people of Mecca did not let him enter Mecca till he settled the matter with them by promising to stay in it for three days only. When the document of treaty was written, the following was mentioned: 'These are the terms on which Muhammad, Allah's Apostle agreed (to make peace).' They said, "We will not agree to this, for if we believed that you are Allah's Apostle we would not prevent you, but you are Muhammad bin 'Abdullah." The Prophet said, "I am Allah's Apostle and also Muhammad bin 'Abdullah." Then he said to 'Ali, "Rub off (the words) 'Allah's Apostle' ", but 'Ali said, "No, by Allah, I will never rub off your name." So, Allah's Apostle took the document and wrote, 'This is what Muhammad bin 'Abdullah has agreed upon: No arms will be brought into Mecca except in their cases, and nobody from the people of Mecca will be allowed to go with him (i.e. the Prophet ) even if he wished to follow him and he (the Prophet ) will not prevent any of his companions from staying in Mecca if the latter wants to stay.' When the Prophet entered Mecca and the time limit passed, the Meccans went to 'Ali and said, "Tell your Friend (i.e. the Prophet ) to go out, as the period (agreed to) has passed." So, the Prophet went out of Mecca. The daughter of Hamza ran after them (i.e. the Prophet and his companions), calling, "O Uncle! O Uncle!" 'Ali received her and led her by the hand and said to Fatima, "Take your uncle's daughter." Zaid and Ja'far quarrel ed about her. 'Ali said, "I have more right to her as she is my uncle's daughter." Ja'far said, "She is my uncle's daughter, and her aunt is my wife." Zaid said, "She is my brother's daughter." The Prophet judged that she should be given to her aunt, and said that the aunt was like the mother. He then said to 'All, "You are from me and I am from you", and said to Ja'far, "You resemble me both in character and appearance", and said to Zaid, "You are our brother (in faith) and our freed slave."

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(salam)

our tafsir is different

what aimmah (as) taught is like this

Narrated Ja'far ibn Muhammad al-Sufi:

I asked Abu Ja'far Muhammad ibn Ali al-Rida, peace be upon them both, saying: "O son of the Allah's Apostle, why was the Prophet called the Ummi?" He answered: "What do the people say?". I said: "They claim that he was called the Ummi because he was illiterate." He replied: "They lie! May the curse of Allah be upon them for this. Allah has clearly said in His Book: "He it is Who sent among the Ummi a Messenger from among themselves, to recite to them His Verses (i.e. the Qur'an), to purify them, to teach them the book (i.e. literacy) and to teach them wisdom (i.e. knowledge and ethics). [Qur'an 62:2]." How would he teach what he himself could not do? By Allah, Allah's Apostle used to read and write in 72, or he said 73, languages. He was called the Ummi because he was from Makkah. Makkah is one of the mother (umm) towns, and this is why Allah the High and Exalted said: 'So that you (Muhammad) may warn the mother (umm) town (i.e. Makkah) and whoever is round about it'."

Muhammad ibn Ali ibn al-Husayn ibn Babuyah al-Saduq, Ilal al-Sharai (Beirut, Lebanon: Muasassat al-A'lami lil Matbu'aat; first edition, 1988) vol. 1, p. 151, Chapter 105, Hadith Number 1.

fi aman Allah

^How can you say for sure that this is from the teachings of Imams of Ahlul Bayt (as)?

The above narration you quoted has reached us through weak sanad. . .

أبى رحمه الله قال حدثنا سعد بن عبد الله عن احمد بن محمد بن عيسى عن ابن عبد الله محمد بن خالد البرقى عن جعفر بن محمد الصوفى قال

First, there are different opinions regarding the reliability of Ibn Abdallah Muhammad b. Khalid al-Barqi. Najashi and Ibn al-Ghadheiri considered him daeef and Shaykh Tusi (ar) considered him thiqa.

Second, the sanad has majhool narrator Jafar b. Muhammad al-Sufi.

The following narration from the same chapter is authentic which says that Prophet (saw) read and(but?) not write:

حدثنا محمد بن الحسن رضى الله عنه قال: حدثنا سعد بن عبد الله قال حدثنا احمد بن محمد بن عيسى عن الحسين بن سعيد ومحمد بن خالد البرقى عن محمد ابن ابى عمير عن هشام بن سالم عن أبى عبد الله " ع " قال: كان النبي (ص) يقرأ الكتاب ولا يكتب

w/s

Edited by Jondab_Azdi
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^How can you say for sure that this is from the teachings of Imams of Ahlul Bayt (as)?

The above narration you quoted has reached us through weak sanad. . .

ÃÈì ÑÍãå Çááå ÞÇá ÍÏËäÇ ÓÚÏ Èä ÚÈÏ Çááå Úä ÇÍãÏ Èä ãÍãÏ Èä ÚíÓì Úä ÇÈä ÚÈÏ Çááå ãÍãÏ Èä ÎÇáÏ ÇáÈÑÞì Úä ÌÚÝÑ Èä ãÍãÏ ÇáÕæÝì ÞÇá

First, there are different opinions regarding the reliability of Ibn Abdallah Muhammad b. Khalid al-Barqi. Najashi and Ibn al-Ghadheiri considered him daeef and Shaykh Tusi (ar) considered him thiqa.

Second, the sanad has majhool narrator Jafar b. Muhammad al-Sufi.

The following narration from the same chapter is authentic which says that Prophet (saw) read and(but?) not write:

ÍÏËäÇ ãÍãÏ Èä ÇáÍÓä ÑÖì Çááå Úäå ÞÇá: ÍÏËäÇ ÓÚÏ Èä ÚÈÏ Çááå ÞÇá ÍÏËäÇ ÇÍãÏ Èä ãÍãÏ Èä ÚíÓì Úä ÇáÍÓíä Èä ÓÚíÏ æãÍãÏ Èä ÎÇáÏ ÇáÈÑÞì Úä ãÍãÏ ÇÈä ÇÈì ÚãíÑ Úä åÔÇã Èä ÓÇáã Úä ÃÈì ÚÈÏ Çááå " Ú " ÞÇá: ßÇä ÇáäÈí (Õ) íÞÑà ÇáßÊÇÈ æáÇ íßÊÈ

w/s

(salam)

thanks for your post

well, i am not a strong believer in rijal; i mean the way people in shiachat seem to take it

i take that as last option

this is because aimmah did not say that you go straight away for rijal

rather aimmah said that first you compare it with quran and sunnah

rijal comes when you do not find it in quran and sunnah

and regarding this, we do find it in quran that prophet was taught by Allah; and i have given u the hadeeth as well

i have given my opinion in detail

fi aman Allah

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An article by a well known Ahl Sunnah scholar from the UK, challenging the concept that the majority hold in regards to the illiteracy of our beloved Prophet (saw)

Article

maybe this might help us,

what school did amirul momineen ali ibn abi talib(asa) attend?

(bismillah)

(salam)

nice article bro carlos

so which school was it?

(wasalam)

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(bismillah)

(salam)

so which school was it?

(wasalam)

(bismillah)

(salam)

It was the school of nabi and rasool Allah Mohammad (pbuh), the best school and the best tulab imam Ali (as), from the best alim and ustad Mohammad (pbuh), and Allah (swt)!

(wasalam)

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(bismillah)

(salam)

It was the school of nabi and rasool Allah Mohammad (pbuh), the best school and the best tulab imam Ali (as), from the best alim and ustad Mohammad (pbuh), and Allah (swt)!

(wasalam)

(bismillah)

(salam)

thank you akhi aladdin

if the student was that great (nahjul balagha), how much greater must the teacher be.

and we still think he was illiterate

(wasalam)

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  • 4 weeks later...

^How can you say for sure that this is from the teachings of Imams of Ahlul Bayt (as)?

The above narration you quoted has reached us through weak sanad. . .

ÃÈì ÑÍãå Çááå ÞÇá ÍÏËäÇ ÓÚÏ Èä ÚÈÏ Çááå Úä ÇÍãÏ Èä ãÍãÏ Èä ÚíÓì Úä ÇÈä ÚÈÏ Çááå ãÍãÏ Èä ÎÇáÏ ÇáÈÑÞì Úä ÌÚÝÑ Èä ãÍãÏ ÇáÕæÝì ÞÇá

First, there are different opinions regarding the reliability of Ibn Abdallah Muhammad b. Khalid al-Barqi. Najashi and Ibn al-Ghadheiri considered him daeef and Shaykh Tusi (ar) considered him thiqa.

Second, the sanad has majhool narrator Jafar b. Muhammad al-Sufi.

The following narration from the same chapter is authentic which says that Prophet (saw) read and(but?) not write:

ÍÏËäÇ ãÍãÏ Èä ÇáÍÓä ÑÖì Çááå Úäå ÞÇá: ÍÏËäÇ ÓÚÏ Èä ÚÈÏ Çááå ÞÇá ÍÏËäÇ ÇÍãÏ Èä ãÍãÏ Èä ÚíÓì Úä ÇáÍÓíä Èä ÓÚíÏ æãÍãÏ Èä ÎÇáÏ ÇáÈÑÞì Úä ãÍãÏ ÇÈä ÇÈì ÚãíÑ Úä åÔÇã Èä ÓÇáã Úä ÃÈì ÚÈÏ Çááå " Ú " ÞÇá: ßÇä ÇáäÈí (Õ) íÞÑà ÇáßÊÇÈ æáÇ íßÊÈ

w/s

Azdi can you please post the link of hadith as well as the claim of weak hadith!

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The problem with trying to understand 1400 year old Quaranic verses is that language has changed over the centuries. Concepts and ideas that were understood 1400 years ago leave us puzzled in the modern era with apparent contradictions.

That is why it is problematical to take a literal translation of the verse and question it. Your literal translation is based on a modern Arabic and common usage of words.

That is why t is important to have a good tafsir and compare it to hadith of the time to gain a better understanding of what was meant. In fact I would argue that one tafsir is not enough you need to study several translations and ponder on the truth.

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(salam)

I personally can not fathom the view that the most knowledgeable man on earth could not read and/or write. Even if he didn't do so during his lifetime and perhaps got others to do the "writing" for him; you're telling me that he is so illiterate that if you gave him the Qur'an in his hands, he won't be able to read the very book he brought to mankind :wacko:?

Wassalam

Edited by Aal-e-Imran
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