Living with guys in student accomadation!

pagal_ladoo · December 12, 2009

Salaam, inshAllah I hope everyone is well. I am really confused at the moment and need some advice! My younger sister moved out for university in September and she is currently living with two girls in student accomodation on campus. The main problem is that where shes studying is a little town and there are hardly any muslims there. At her university she is required to sort out her accomodation for next year around this time. It so happens that 2nd year students are not eligable to live on campus as this priority to given to first year student, so she has to look outside for a houseshare or something. She only wants to go through estate agents which are linked to the university (as opposed to private housing) as its cheaper and safer option if something happens to go wrong. She was planning on living with two other girls again, but it so happens that all the 3 room houses have been taken and one of the girls has backed out. So now she tells me she found a 5 room house and that her only option is to share with one of the girls she was originally going to share with and 3 guys on her course who she knows she says are decent and dont drink much dont go clubbing etc. When I heard this I freaked out!!! How can this be islamically permissable??? I got really upset because she was trying to justify it by saying they are decent people and they wont be hanging around much coz they have busy schedules and its the only option she has, and she has her own bathroom aswell and its just the kitchen theyll be sharing. I know in Islam in certain circumstances there are exceptions, but even if it is a last resort living with guys under the same house (who are non-mahram) is still haraam right???? she says im over-reacting and its not the crisis that I imagine, i need a second opinion and some advice about how i can make her understand that shes compromising her religion, please help!

Pagal_ladoo

**Maryaam** · December 12, 2009

You can compromise your religion without being in a loaded situation - but this one is definitely loaded. It is difficult enough sharing with girls and all their friends - but these guys have friends too and they will be coming over. At best it would be uncomfortable and at worst unsafe. Add drinking to that and it could be really difficult. I could not always find Muslim roomates (only had one) so always went with practising Christians - I wasnt converted and had a safe quiet home....for the most part :P

Meant to add that she could check out some of the organizations or clubs to her liking and see if they have any openings in their houses. Not sure how it works there though.

Edited December 12, 2009 by Maryaam

dawud · December 12, 2009

Wow, its frustrating enough living with 2 Muslim guys cuz they never wash the dishes or take out the garbage and leave the toilet messy....imagine living with non-Muslims if this is the case with Muslims :Hijabi: :unsure:

_jen_ · December 12, 2009

You're over reacting. She should share with guys because

1) she'll be safer

2)there will be less arguments and

3)living at uni is supposed to be fun

These things are more important than the "potential" of the situation turning haram.

**Maryaam** · December 12, 2009

You're over reacting. She should share with guys because
1) she'll be safer
2)there will be less arguments and
3)living at uni is supposed to be fun
These things are more important than the "potential" of the situation turning haram.

Well - the most "haram" I ever got into was with a group of Iranian GIRLS... so something to consider.

_jen_ · December 12, 2009

Definately, a lot of people are more likely to get into haram if they are comfortable with who they are with!

Awakened · December 13, 2009

Salam

She can find a person, share an apartment with her, and you guys pay the extra that person would pay more for an apartment then sharing a house with students. You would sacrifice some money, but what the hell is money good for if you don't use to it to prevent something like this.

Definately, a lot of people are more likely to get into haram if they are comfortable with who they are with!

What if it isn't simply about getting in haram, I think by Shariah, it itself is impermissible (haram). I'm not sure, this what I been told, maybe someone can verify.

**Rohani** · December 13, 2009

(salam)

it seems to me that too much haram would me too close in such a situation!

and we are not allowed to take the nonbelievers as auliya (friends - helpers - protectors)

(wasalam)

Edited December 13, 2009 by theunknownpreacher

sukaina_08 · December 13, 2009

If her hijab isn't compromised, what's the big deal? She's not sharing a bathroom or a bedroom with them, only the kitchen. So she would just cover when she goes outside. Not all Americans are wild, dirty pigs, by the way. Even if they aren't Christian, it doesn't necessarily mean they'll be drunk and partying nonstop either. When I was an undergrad (and a Christian) I lived in a house with 3 guys for a year. Any time I went down there they were all in their rooms, doing their own thing. Even eating was a separate affair. Even when I had female (American) roommates, we were mostly in our rooms. When we crossed paths every once in a while we'd greet each other, or if mutual friends came over, we would both come out and hang out. In contrast, If I had friends over, she'd stay in her room, or if she had friends over, I'd stay in my room. (White) Americans are pretty good at keeping their distance and giving you your personal space.

I also have a Muslim (convert) friend who lived with 3 other guys - she was the only girl - for about a year. She had no problems maintaining hijab - they gave her privacy and things went very smoothly. She said it was a rough neighborhood as well, so having men in the house was definitely a positive for protection. Two of the guys were practicing Christians, and the other wasn't really anything, but all of them were calm, respectful, and sober.

So, my advice is that she needs to know their character first. I could understand though her parents' reaction to it, especially if she's still young (only a sophomore), and still under her parents' support and protection.

Awakened · December 13, 2009

If her hijab isn't compromised, what's the big deal?

What's the big deal if they pay a little more (share an apartment with someone and pay the extra?)?

Is money that big a deal?

Awakened · December 13, 2009

Also, people on their personal experience, here is some questions to ask.

Did any of the guys find you attractive? Did you find any them attractive? And what level of attraction if so (especially if was two way). please don't answer those questions, just bringing the factors up/

Cause stuff didn't happen in your situation and there was no "risk", doesn't mean it's ok for anyone. And if your strong, don't think everyone is strong. And if you got lucky with "good" people (society doesn't regard sex outside bad, so they are being "good" by their standards), don't expect everyone to get lucky.

When did the world become mostly saints that you let sister/daughter in a house full of guys, sleep with no worries, all of course, cause that is no big deal but spending some extra money is a big deal.

Edited December 13, 2009 by Awakened

zaigham abbas · December 13, 2009

Tell her to use the blessing of Mutah. Do it with one of the 3 guys and it will solve the problem without having to commit a sin.

**Rohani** · December 13, 2009

Tell her to use the blessing of Mutah. Do it with one of the 3 guys and it will solve the problem without having to commit a sin.

(salam)

Actually i would say that is impermissible as muta with a disbeliever is forbidden as Allah advised us that disbelievers should marry disbelievers and believers should wed believers.

(wasalam)

Abu Ali 2 · December 13, 2009

Tell her to use the blessing of Mutah. Do it with one of the 3 guys and it will solve the problem without having to commit a sin.

Salam,

A Muslim women cannot marry a non-Muslim man (mutah or permanent).

o0o0o · December 13, 2009

SubhanAllah how can some people here try to justify this Muslim sister living with non-mahram, non-muslim men?

I'd like to see some fatawa from shia scholars and maraje' which allow what you are saying, i'm sure they would not allow this. You have to do all that you can to stop her from moving in with them, this is a serious fitnah and she is definately compromising her deen. A Muslimah who places Allah s.w.t and her religion above all else, would even leave university and move back in with her parents rather than live with non mahram males.

Doctor_Naqvi · December 13, 2009

Tell her to use the blessing of Mutah. Do it with one of the 3 guys and it will solve the problem without having to commit a sin.

Gosh,why do ya ppl always love to involve this," sin factor" of yours into each and everything. She's over there to acquire knowledge not to hook-up with anyone.

To the OP,it truly does defeat the purpose of hijab so try to find-out another better accommodation for her.When you're living in the west then you've to deal with these perplexed problems.Its almost difficult to share Ur room or apartment with a na-mehram.Ya can't practice hijab all the time.Moreover,its gonna be a [Edited Out] and bull story to trust them.

Edited December 13, 2009 by saba fatima naqvi

BintAlHoda · December 13, 2009

Salaam

Guys, be serious please and don't joke around.

It is very unadvisable for a young lady without a lot of experience in life to live in the same household as young men, especially if they or their friends are into alcohol at all. (I wouldn't say the same thing if she were a 50 year old widow or something - I'd assume someone that age would have enough life experience to make the best decisions)

Part of being young is thinking everything is ok and not seeing a potentially uncomfortable or unsafe situation for what it is

Although I'm sure she could be just fine in that situation, it's not a good situation for a young woman, especially a young Muslim woman. It's better that you do whatever you can do help her find some other arrangement (beginning with du'a).

Hussian · December 14, 2009

(salam)
it seems to me that too much haram would me too close in such a situation!
and we are not allowed to take the nonbelievers as auliya (friends - helpers - protectors)
(wasalam)

(salam)

As far as I know, friendship with non believers is permissible.

(wasalam)

**Rohani** · December 14, 2009

(salam)
As far as I know, friendship with non believers is permissible.
(wasalam)

(salam)

Who says? Allah or Man?

(wasalam)

Hussian · December 14, 2009

(salam)
Who says? Allah or Man?
(wasalam)

(salam)

What makes you say:

and we are not allowed to take the nonbelievers as auliya (friends

(wasalam)

**Rohani** · December 14, 2009

(salam)

The word Allah has spoken in his qu'ran, makes me say this.

(wasalam)

Hussian · December 14, 2009

(salam)
The word Allah has spoken in his qu'ran, makes me say this.
(wasalam)

(salam)

Which verse?

Arman · December 14, 2009

Salam,

Do everything in your power to prevent your sister from coming in this situation. Its absolutely unacceptable.

God help you.

PrincessFatema · December 14, 2009

It is not the question of how much you can take care. It is the question of haram. Therefore the outcome can never be good.

**Rohani** · December 14, 2009

(salam)
Which verse?

(salam)

Let not the believers take the disbelievers as auliya instead of the believers, and whoever does that will never be helped by Allah in any way, except if you indeed fear a danger from them. And Allah warns you against Himself , and to Allah is the final return.

( سورة آل عمران , Aal-e-Imran, Chapter #3, Verse #28)

They wish that you reject Faith, as they have rejected, and thus that you all become equal . So take not auliya' from them, till they emigrate in the Way of Allah. But if they turn back , take them and kill them wherever you find them, and take neither auliya' nor helpers from them.

( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #89)

Those who take disbelievers for auliya' instead of believers, do they seek honour, power and glory with them? Verily, then to Allah belongs all honour, power and glory.

( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #139)

O you who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians as auliya', they are but auliya' of each other. And if any amongst you takes them, then surely he is one of them. Verily, Allah guides not those people who are the Zalimun (polytheists and wrong-doers and unjust).

( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #51)

O you who believe! Take not as auliya' those who take your religion as a mockery and fun from among those who received the Scripture before you, and nor from among the disbelievers; and fear Allah if you indeed are true believers.

( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #57)

You see many of them taking the disbelievers as their auliya'. Evil indeed is that which their ownselves have sent forward before them; for that Allah's Wrath fell upon them, and in torment they will abide.

( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #80)

77Say: "O people of the Book! exceed not in your religion the bounds, trespassing beyond the truth, nor follow the vain desires of people who went wrong in times gone by,- who misled many, and strayed from the even way.

78Curses were pronounced on those among the Children of Israel who rejected Faith, by the tongue of David and of Jesus the son of Mary: because they disobeyed and persisted in excesses.

79Nor did they forbid one another the iniquities which they committed: evil indeed were the deeds which they did.

80Thou seest many of them turning in friendship to the Unbelievers. Evil indeed are (the works) which their souls have sent forward before them (with the result), that Allah.s wrath is on them, and in torment will they abide.

81If only they had believed in Allah, in the Messenger, and in what hath been revealed to him, never would they have taken them for friends and protectors, but most of them are rebellious wrong-doers.( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #78/81)

(wasalam)

Edited December 14, 2009 by theunknownpreacher

BintAlHoda · December 14, 2009

don't overexaggerate; 'awliya' here doesn't mean 'friends' or 'buddies' (or 'roommates') but means guardianship and authority.

i'm not sure that the situation is haram, as i'm not sure there is a shari'a ruling against renting in a shared home with non mahrams...... but in any case it is better to avoid, especially for a young lady.

i would personally be very uncomfortable in that type of situation myself.

if she has no other choice she should at least get a lock for the door of her room and also should minimize the time she spends socializing or associating with the male members of the house. they may find that rude and antisocial but that is their problem.

khuram · December 14, 2009

i think its dangerous but u should ask your marjeh, http://www.leader.ir http://www.sistani.org

**Abu Hadi** · December 14, 2009

i think its dangerous but u should ask your marjeh, http://www.leader.ir http://www.sistani.org

I think a much better choice for her would be to find a room for rent with a family (preferably a practicing Christian or Jewish family w/ kids).

I did this for a while when I was in college and although it might be uncomfortable for her, it probably wouldn't be unsafe.

If you are living in a house with non muslims, college age, then definitely alcohol will be consumed in the house at some point.

I am not saying all non muslims who drink will do something to her, but why take the chance. You are not just having to trust the

guys she is living with but also their friends and their friends-friends. That is alot of people and statistically, increases your chances for a bad incident

In a house with a family with kids, their is usually less traffic, in terms of people, and more monitoring of those going in and out since

the family will definitely want to protect their own kids from bad situations and you/she will benefit from this.

PrincessFatema · December 15, 2009

Not haram? :o

Edited December 15, 2009 by PrincessFatema

December 15, 2009

Salam

Im not exactly an old fogie but I can say this is a BAD IDEA!!!!!!!!! Simply cus even with just girls u can get into some dodgy situations with innocent intent. It is in no way safe, acceptable and I would not advise it. I would talk to your sister if she is willing to see sense. Would your parents actually allow her to live with guys??

Forgotten · December 15, 2009

isn't living with men who are not your mahram haram? how will hijab be maintained?...

there is too much potential for fitnah.

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