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rajput iqbal

am i allowed 2 marry a syed

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salam people

i was wondering what is this syed thing and i thought the casting system was haram and abolised

i know syed men can marry any1

but i like a syed girl and im from the rajput cast

i was wondering would i be allowed to marry her

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There is no cast system in Islam, theoretically at least. In subcontinent it is still prevalent among Muslims so you might not be able to achieve you goal of marrying her because of social pressure.

Edited by sayedzeeshan

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salam people

i was wondering what is this syed thing and i thought the casting system was haram and abolised

i know syed men can marry any1

but i like a syed girl and im from the rajput cast

i was wondering would i be allowed to marry her

Syed isn't a thing its just a caste and ya can marry that girl if she's interested in ya.Ya should ask Ur marja about this.If ya follow Syed Sistani then its permissible.

Edited by saba fatima naqvi

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ya Ali a.s madad

when talking about marriage one should look at their religion because marriage is an religious obligation,like you i am an ummati and it is deemed haram for an non sayid to marry an sayidzadi looking closer to home non of the aulia Allah's permitted it.

maula waris

Where did you hear this?

Thanks,

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Where did you hear this?

Thanks,

who cares, its non-sense.

he contradicts himself by saying we have to look at the partner religion and then he goes to say syed can't marry a non-syed. i didn't know syed was a religion bro

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who cares, its non-sense.

he contradicts himself by saying we have to look at the partner religion and then he goes to say syed can't marry a non-syed. i didn't know syed was a religion bro

I agree with you, but maybe someone has presented him with an argument that appears to be strong.

If we can hear his evidence, and see if it stands up to some analysis, we can perhaps undue some of the misinformation.

I dont think its a good idea just saying, "your wrong", as people dont seem to accept it, regardless of if its true or not, I wish they would though!!

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Salaam,

i dont understand why this question comes up so often, the imams (as) have married non sayeds, actually, all of them did except Imam Ali (as) and i THINK imam zayn ul abideen (as) married fatima (sa) daughter of Imam hassan, his cousin.

Wa salam

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I agree with you, but maybe someone has presented him with an argument that appears to be strong.

If we can hear his evidence, and see if it stands up to some analysis, we can perhaps undue some of the misinformation.

I dont think its a good idea just saying, "your wrong", as people dont seem to accept it, regardless of if its true or not, I wish they would though!!

Why would you do that.

No argument can be strong when it defends nothing but stupid lies.

It's like saying This Imam has arguments against the prohibition of alcohol, no no no, who cares, its non-sense and stupid. There can be NO evidence in suh case. ^_^

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I agree with you, but maybe someone has presented him with an argument that appears to be strong.

If we can hear his evidence, and see if it stands up to some analysis, we can perhaps undue some of the misinformation.

Here are a few.

1. Not a single daughter of any Imam was married off to a non-sayyed, therefore sayyedah/non-sayyed marriages are haram.

2. Some of the daughters of Imam Musa Kadhim remained unmarried because there were no suitable matches among the sayyeds at that time. If marriage to non-sayyed men was allowed, he would have married his daughters off to pious non-sayyed Shia men.

3. Sayyeds are not only the descendants of Ali and Fatimah; Hashmis are also sayyeds. So the marriage of Zainab b. Ali to Abdullah b. J'afar Tayyar was not a sayyedah/non-sayyed marriage. Same is the case with Umm-e-Khulthum b. Ali's marriage with Muhammad b. J'afar Tayyar. So don't bring up these marriages.

Edited by Marbles

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Here are a few.

1. Not a single daughter of any Imam was married off to a non-sayyed, therefore sayyedah/non-sayyed marriages are haram.

2. Some of the daughters of Imam Musa Kadhim remained unmarried because there were no suitable matches among the sayyeds at that time. If marriage to non-sayyed men was allowed, he would have married his daughters off to pious non-sayyed Shia men.

3. Sayyeds are not only the descendants of Ali and Fatimah; Hashmis are also sayyeds. So the marriage of Zainab b. Ali to Abdullah b. J'afar Tayyar was not a sayyedah/non-sayyed marriage. Same is the case with Umm-e-Khulthum b. Ali's marriage with Muhammad b. J'afar Tayyar. So don't bring up these marriages.

As for number 1, that is not a rule really is it?

I mean you are just ASSUMING its a rule, for example you could say, no Imam AS ever married their daughter to a chinese man, therefore marrying chinese men is haram. This logic is not acceptable.

As for number 2, again you are assuming.

Have a read of these :

http://www.*******.org/hadiths/marriage/hashimid-woman-marrying-the-non-hashimid-man-and-otherwise

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As for number 1, that is not a rule really is it?

I mean you are just ASSUMING its a rule, for example you could say, no Imam AS ever married their daughter to a chinese man, therefore marrying chinese men is haram. This logic is not acceptable.

As for number 2, again you are assuming.

Have a read of these :

http://www.*******.org/hadiths/marriage/hashimid-woman-marrying-the-non-hashimid-man-and-otherwise

LOL

I was merely reporting. I do not hold on to this view. This is crazy to me.

Bro, my mother is a product of sayyedah/non-sayyed marriage. So calm down.

Maybe I should have made it clear in the post. Someone neg repped it :(

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1. Not a single daughter of any Imam was married off to a non-sayyed, therefore sayyedah/non-sayyed marriages are haram.

2. Some of the daughters of Imam Musa Kadhim remained unmarried because there were no suitable matches among the sayyeds at that time. If marriage to non-sayyed men was allowed, he would have married his daughters off to pious non-sayyed Shia men.

3. Sayyeds are not only the descendants of Ali and Fatimah; Hashmis are also sayyeds. So the marriage of Zainab b. Ali to Abdullah b. J'afar Tayyar was not a sayyedah/non-sayyed marriage. Same is the case with Umm-e-Khulthum b. Ali's marriage with Muhammad b. J'afar Tayyar. So don't bring up these marriages.

Not everything the Imams and their daughters abstained from means it is a sin if we don't do the same. The examples are many but here is one: The daughters of all Imam covered their faces when it is not obligatory on us to cover our faces.

Maybe I should have made it clear in the post. Someone neg repped it :(

I've neutralized it for you.

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ya Ali a.s madad

when talking about marriage one should look at their religion because marriage is an religious obligation,like you i am an ummati and it is deemed haram for an non sayid to marry an sayidzadi looking closer to home non of the aulia Allah's permitted it.

maula waris

LOL@ummati. Man it doesn't make any sense. Do ya know that Imam khomeini's daughter was married to a non-syed? So wat does it actually convey? He has set an excellent example for the other ppl to follow and i guess nobody's gonna contradict with such a great marja of his time. Wat ya are talking about is just an old concept. Yup,i do agree that we should take care of,"Religion" when it comes to marrying someone but Syed isn't a religion its just a Caste. According to Syed Sistani its permissible to marry any non-syed

Question: Can a Sayyid girl marry a non-Sayyid man? Answer: It is permissible and there is no objection to it.

here's a link http://www.sistani.org/local.php?modules=nav&nid=5&cid=530&sid=0&eid=0&page=2

Moreover this is a response that I'd received from his office

ÈÓãå ÊÚÇáí

ÇÒÏæÇÌ ÏÎÊÑ ÓíÏ ÈÇ ãÑÏ ÛíÑ ÓíÏ ÌÇíÒ ÇÓÊ.

It is permissible for a Sayyid girl to marry a non-Sayyid Shia man and there

is no objection to it.

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LOL@ummati. Man it doesn't make any sense. Do ya know that Imam khomeini's daughter was married to a non-syed? So wat does it actually convey? He has set an excellent example for the other ppl to follow and i guess nobody's gonna contradict with such a great marja of his time. Wat ya are talking about is just an old concept. Yup,i do agree that we should take care of,"Religion" when it comes to marrying someone but Syed isn't a religion its just a Caste. According to Syed Sistani its permissible to marry any non-syed

Question: Can a Sayyid girl marry a non-Sayyid man? Answer: It is permissible and there is no objection to it.

here's a link http://www.sistani.org/local.php?modules=nav&nid=5&cid=530&sid=0&eid=0&page=2

Moreover this is a response that I'd received from his office

بسمه تعالي

ازدواج دختر سيد با مرد غير سيد جايز است.

It is permissible for a Sayyid girl to marry a non-Sayyid Shia man and there

is no objection to it.

[Edited out] i don't know i am not a follower,anyway i don't get much time to be online as you can see from my history if any one require more information on the OLD authentic Islam there is a great website at www.hubeali.com you will find more in depth answers to,can a sayidzadi marry a non sayid plus many other answers to questions caused by the many NEW prophets who seems to have appeared like the black plague and have made people clinically ill,

i was going to log but let me give you an example this is from authentic shia books i dont remember the name but her go's,this narration is set at the time of the bani abbasid la dynisty when a sayyidzada a son of an holy imam settled in land away from madina and raised a family amongst which the sayyid had a

daughter who was the eldest and their neighbor was a wealthy lord of the area and had a son similar age to this sayyid's daughter and when this wealthy lords son achieved the age of maturity his parents began to look for a suitable partner to marry and after some time when they failed to find suitable bride the husband and wife talking between them realised that their neighbor had a daughter and the family although poor was in fact honest trustworthy and reliable thus meets all the criteria for marriage proposal.

the wealthy lord ask his wife to go and ask their neighbor's daughter's hand in marriage and after this took place they wife of the sayyid replied that her husband was away and upon his return would convey this proposal happy,when this sayyid did return the informed him of the proposal and the sayyid immediately got up without saying a word in response and did woozo and prayed two rakat namaz and at the end of which he prayed that Allah swat should remove his daughter from this world and no sooner did his hands came down that his daughter passed from this world hearing this the sayyid started to cry when the wife noticed him crying she rebuked him saying that she saw hih praying for her death with her own eyes and now crying why? the sayyid grabbed his wife by the hand and lead her in their room saying let him explain.

the sayid explained that he was a sayyid aulad e Aimmas a.s and hid his identity(taqqya)because of the fear of persecution from the zalam ruling ragime and he was sorry that he did not teach his daughter was in fact daughter of sayidah Faima tu zahra s.a(Allah huma sall e ala Mohammadan wa ale Mohammadan) and marriage out side the sadath was haram,as i said before make what you like of this and many many other proof of evidence which you of course will deny and this is what Set's haram annd halal apart there were people like me and will alway be who will say it is haram for a sayidzadi to marry a non sayid and to follow one who set'a abad example

Edited by ~RuQaYaH~
Insulting scholars and cursing

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[Edited out] i don't know i am not a follower,anyway i don't get much time to be online as you can see from my history if any one require more information on the OLD authentic Islam there is a great website at www.hubeali.com you will find more in depth answers to,can a sayidzadi marry a non sayid plus many other answers to questions caused by the many NEW prophets who seems to have appeared like the black plague and have made people clinically ill,

i was going to log but let me give you an example this is from authentic shia books i dont remember the name but her go's,this narration is set at the time of the bani abbasid la dynisty when a sayyidzada a son of an holy imam settled in land away from madina and raised a family amongst which the sayyid had a

daughter who was the eldest and their neighbor was a wealthy lord of the area and had a son similar age to this sayyid's daughter and when this wealthy lords son achieved the age of maturity his parents began to look for a suitable partner to marry and after some time when they failed to find suitable bride the husband and wife talking between them realised that their neighbor had a daughter and the family although poor was in fact honest trustworthy and reliable thus meets all the criteria for marriage proposal.

the wealthy lord ask his wife to go and ask their neighbor's daughter's hand in marriage and after this took place they wife of the sayyid replied that her husband was away and upon his return would convey this proposal happy,when this sayyid did return the informed him of the proposal and the sayyid immediately got up without saying a word in response and did woozo and prayed two rakat namaz and at the end of which he prayed that Allah swat should remove his daughter from this world and no sooner did his hands came down that his daughter passed from this world hearing this the sayyid started to cry when the wife noticed him crying she rebuked him saying that she saw hih praying for her death with her own eyes and now crying why? the sayyid grabbed his wife by the hand and lead her in their room saying let him explain.

the sayid explained that he was a sayyid aulad e Aimmas a.s and hid his identity(taqqya)because of the fear of persecution from the zalam ruling ragime and he was sorry that he did not teach his daughter was in fact daughter of sayidah Faima tu zahra s.a(Allah huma sall e ala Mohammadan wa ale Mohammadan) and marriage out side the sadath was haram,as i said before make what you like of this and many many other proof of evidence which you of course will deny and this is what Set's haram annd halal apart there were people like me and will alway be who will say it is haram for a sayidzadi to marry a non sayid and to follow one who set'a a bad example

ps

we are discussing a sayyid girl(sayyidzadi) and a non sayyid(ummati) which is haram and not vise versa which is halal and permitted in Islam

Edited by ~RuQaYaH~
Quote edited out

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Not everything the Imams and their daughters abstained from means it is a sin if we don't do the same. The examples are many but here is one: The daughters of all Imam covered their faces when it is not obligatory on us to cover our faces.

Well, there have been and there still are some scholars who consider it obligatory upon women to cover their faces. But yes, there are many things that Ahlul bayt did in their capacity as Imams and leaders of Ummah which are not obligatory on the laity.

I've neutralized it for you.

Thanks a bunch. :)

Edited by Marbles

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LOL

I was merely reporting. I do not hold on to this view. This is crazy to me.

Bro, my mother is a product of sayyedah/non-sayyed marriage. So calm down.

Maybe I should have made it clear in the post. Someone neg repped it :(

Sorry brother I misunderstood.

As for aliunwalliulla wajib,

brother, I actually read your posts, and you did the classic malang move. You made constand assumptions about hadiths and stories that probably dont even exist, and if they do have been brutally translated for you.

If you have no actual evidence for your comments, just say so, if you do have evidence please show us, perhaps you are right, but saying things like this:

"i was going to log but let me give you an example this is from authentic shia books i dont remember the name "

I was bored so I went to your site, the article didnt have any evidence for it, just looked like assumptions again im afraid.

Edited by iraqi_shia

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[Edited out] i don't know i am not a follower,anyway i don't get much time to be online as you can see from my history if any one require more information on the OLD authentic Islam there is a great website at www.hubeali.com you will find more in depth answers to,can a sayidzadi marry a non sayid plus many other answers to questions caused by the many NEW prophets who seems to have appeared like the black plague and have made people clinically ill,

marriage out side the sadath was haram,as i said before make what you like of this and many many other proof of evidence which you of course will deny and this is what Set's haram annd halal apart there were people like me and will alway be who will say it is haram for a sayidzadi to marry a non sayid and to follow one who set a bad example

With all due respect if you're not a follower so you're nobody to disgrace such a prestigious and an exalted scholar of Islam. If you're taking Imam khomeini as a Prophet so let me correct Ur apprehension. He's not a prophet. He's an eminent marja and ppl do his pursuance so ya need to have a closer look in Islam as ya barely know the semantic difference b/w a Prophet and a Marja.I'm surprised that yet you're disgracing someone who's a spiritual leader and founder of Islamic revolution.

and to Ur last sentence its nothing more than a mere stubbornness

(wasalam)

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With all due respect if you're not a follower so you're nobody to disgrace such a prestigious and an exalted scholar of Islam. If you're taking Imam khomeini as a Prophet so let me correct Ur apprehension. He's not a prophet. He's an eminent marja and ppl do his pursuance so ya need to have a closer look in Islam as ya barely know the semantic difference b/w a Prophet and a Marja.I'm surprised that yet you're disgracing someone who's a spiritual leader and founder of Islamic revolution.

and to Ur last sentence its nothing more than a mere stubbornness

(wasalam)

RuQaYaH~ sent you a new conversation

Subject: Warning

Replies: 0

Sent: Yesterday, 08:31 PM

Salam, Insulting scholars and cursing the 3 caliphs are against the site rules and you have thereby recieved a warning. wasalaam

may be you should name the forurm

umar(la)loverschat.com

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if you consider marrying a syed girl when you are a non-syed, think twice about it. By you doing so you will stop the syed heritage.

Strange, since in another thread you have said:

"sayed is from the bloodline of your father!

How then would the sayyida marrying a non-sayyid stop the sayyid heritage since it's not passed through her anyhow?

Filled with speculation and qiyas from people who claim to follow the letter of the tradition. There are many hadiths (and of course the Holy Quran) that clearly lay out the ahkam of marriage, of what is permissible and not permissible. If this were really a rule, you might expect there'd be _some_ clear mention of it least somewhere in there. But there isn't. Instead you see claims like the above trying to take different things and trying to squeeze out of that some argument to fill what they already want to believe.

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Strange, since in another thread you have said:

"sayed is from the bloodline of your father!

How then would the sayyida marrying a non-sayyid stop the sayyid heritage since it's not passed through her anyhow?

.

if a syeda marries a non-syed then her/their kids will not be syed.

whereas if a syed man marries a nonsyeda then his kids will still be syed. yes sadaat comes from the father

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Sorry brother I misunderstood.

As for aliunwalliulla wajib,

brother, I actually read your posts, and you did the classic malang move. You made constand assumptions about hadiths and stories that probably dont even exist, and if they do have been brutally translated for you.

If you have no actual evidence for your comments, just say so, if you do have evidence please show us, perhaps you are right, but saying things like this:

"i was going to log but let me give you an example this is from authentic shia books i dont remember the name "

I was bored so I went to your site, the article didnt have any evidence for it, just looked like assumptions again im afraid.

like i have said malangs are halalis and don't marry their mothers and malangs don't lie even if they are hung from trees and have their tongues cut out like haz meesum e tamar(a.r) you say you went to www.hubeali.com and read and found nothing which supports my views,well here is an extract from that website from their file artical-sayyidzadi marriage to non sayid is haram;

AN INCIDENT FROM HISTORY

In brief, Isa bin Zaid Bin Imam Zain – Al – Abideen (as) was into hiding and got married with the daughter of the person he was living with who did not know that Isa bin Zaid (ra) was a Syed. A daughter was born and on reaching the marriageable age his wife got the message for the son of a well to do person who did watering services. Isa’s (ra) wife happily asked him for approval however, Isa (ra) got highly upset as he could not disclose his identity as being Syed. His wife’s continued insistence became unbearable and he prayed for the death of his daughter as a help from Allah (swt), and she died freeing him of his worries. But sorrow over came him for the reason that he could not tell her that she was the daughter of a Syed and not an ordinary labourer. And so her marriage was not valid being a none ‘kufv’. This incident is quoted in Umdat – Ul – Matalab page 278, Zaid Shaheed by Ayatullah Abd – Ar – Razzaq Najfi P177, muqaatlut-talibeen, and Chouda (fourteen) Sitaaray by Allama Syed Najamul – Hassan Kararvi page 309.

this is what i was referring to the "stories that don't probably exit"according to you, you have probably read it with your eyes closed now go back and be honest i know it is difficult for one who follows the "new age prophets" you marjas,i say this when ever i have discussions with an assooli's and i quote from the holy quran and the saying of the prophet Mohammad(saw) and ahle Mohammad(asws) the assoolies in return quote from tauziel and maraja's,therefore i take that to mean that the quran of the assoolii is tauziel and their prophet must be the marajas.

Now come all you assoolies be honest and go and read the true facts reguarding the haram act of sayyidzadi marring a non sayid, for it will stop you all committing a very big act of haram it is for your own good ,there is plenty to read on this subject although concise ,there is a saying in urdu which translates as"for human a hint is enough and for an ass a stick"read and then see which are you a human or an ass(donkey)mothers are haram to marry and sayyidzdi's are of the status in respect of mothers for non sayyids,read all about the "kuff" and "status" and "sadakah" which i always quote in this argument ,all these point of great sharial importence are easy for halali born to understand,and require lots of time and effort by other to understand,DONT! reply back until you have read all the article at WWW.HUBEALI.COM

Edited by aliunwalliulla wajib

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AN INCIDENT FROM HISTORY

In brief, Isa bin Zaid Bin Imam Zain – Al – Abideen (as) was into hiding and got married with the daughter of the person he was living with who did not know that Isa bin Zaid (ra) was a Syed. A daughter was born and on reaching the marriageable age his wife got the message for the son of a well to do person who did watering services. Isa’s (ra) wife happily asked him for approval however, Isa (ra) got highly upset as he could not disclose his identity as being Syed. His wife’s continued insistence became unbearable and he prayed for the death of his daughter as a help from Allah (swt), and she died freeing him of his worries. But sorrow over came him for the reason that he could not tell her that she was the daughter of a Syed and not an ordinary labourer. And so her marriage was not valid being a none ‘kufv’. This incident is quoted in Umdat – Ul – Matalab page 278, Zaid Shaheed by Ayatullah Abd – Ar – Razzaq Najfi P177, muqaatlut-talibeen, and Chouda (fourteen) Sitaaray by Allama Syed Najamul – Hassan Kararvi page 309.

We have to follow the authentic narrations of Imams of Ahlul Bayt (as) and not what is narrated by (or attributed to) majhool waqifis / zaydis.

Here is the sanad of what you have pasted from the fitna website(hubeali.com)

ãÍãÏ Èä ÇáãäÕæÑ ÇáãÑÇÏí ÞÇá : ÞÇá íÍíì Èä ÇáÍÓíä Èä ÒíÏ : ÞáÊ áÇÈí : íÇ ÃÈÉ ¡ Åäì ÃÔÊåí Ãä ÃÑì Úãí ÚíÓì Èä ÒíÏ

. . .

http://www.shiaweb.org/books/muqatel/pa37.html

^Both narrators are majhool.

íÍíì Èä ÇáÍÓíä Èä ÒíÏ : Èä Úáí Èä ÇáÍÓíä ( Ú ) æÇÞÝí - ãÌåæá

w/s

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Here are a few.1. Not a single daughter of any Imam was married off to a non-sayyed, therefore sayyedah/non-sayyed marriages are haram.2. Some of the daughters of Imam Musa Kadhim remained unmarried because there were no suitable matches among the sayyeds at that time. If marriage to non-sayyed men was allowed, he would have married his daughters off to pious non-sayyed Shia men.3. Sayyeds are not only the descendants of Ali and Fatimah; Hashmis are also sayyeds. So the marriage of Zainab b. Ali to Abdullah b. J'afar Tayyar was not a sayyedah/non-sayyed marriage. Same is the case with Umm-e-Khulthum b. Ali's marriage with Muhammad b. J'afar Tayyar. So don't bring up these marriages.

Dont mislead with your discriminatory behaviour. Islam do not have such rulings.

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Dont mislead with your discriminatory behaviour. Islam do not have such rulings.

If you cared to read subsequent posts, you'd see that he was not supporting this position, simply mentioning it.

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