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In the Name of God بسم الله

What Do We Know About Neda’s Death?

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What Do We Know About Neda’s Death?

There are a number of questions circulating about the authenticity of the film of the dying protestor in Iran.

The reasons why this video have come into question are the typical in a document of this type. Like any piece of visual evidence, the video is compelling and emotional, but it cannot document the reasons why these events took place, or what happened before and after the camera was rolling.

In this article, I will explain why I have reservations about the story as told.

Some media commentators have raised the question of whether the entire scene was staged. An article on this topic is here:

http://www.nolanchart.com/article6565.html

Also, a YouTube video looking at discrepancies between the two visual recordings of Neda’s death is to be found here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ruo4NroXTGk

One reason why these questions are asked, is that there are two, not one, video recordings of Neda’s death. There are different features in each viewing.

However, in this article, I will concentrate on the verbal and written accounts by witnesses to the shooting. There are some puzzling features, and I believe that the best we can say is that we do not know who shot Neda.

Evolution of the Story

This is the original email, which accompanied the video, when it was posted in the Netherlands:

A young woman who was standing aside with her father watching the protests was shot by a basij member hiding on the rooftop of a civilian house. He had clear shot at the girl and could not miss her. However, he aimed straight her heart.

I am a doctor, so I rushed to try to save her. But the impact of the gunshot was so fierce that the bullet had blasted inside the victim’s chest, and she died in less than 2 minutes.

The protests were going on about 1 kilometers away in the main street and some of the protesting crowd were running from tear gass used among them, towards Salehi St.

The film is shot by my friend who was standing beside me.

Please let the world know.

Quotations from this email were widely used in press reports, for instance here:

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/...4249417475.html

This is a very clear account, and it appears that the witness could not have been mistaken. Soon, the doctor was identified as Arash Hejazi, an Iranian expatriate in Britain.

The other witness is her music teacher, Hamid Panahi, who was interviewed at her home.

His description of the shooting is brief:

"We were stuck in traffic and we got out and stood to watch, and without her throwing a rock or anything they shot her," he said. "It was just one bullet."

Then they paraphrase his account of events:

Panahi said witnesses at the scene said the shooter was not a police officer but among a group of plainclothes security officials or militiamen lurking in the area.

That implies that he has seen the shooter.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/wo...92.story?page=3

Questions Raised

Anyone can see that there is a huge problem in reconciling these two accounts of events.

All witnesses agree that Neda was shot only once. If she was shot by a sniper on a roof, then she cannot have been shot by a plainsclothes man on the street. Also, if she was the victim of a sniper, no member of the crowd would have much idea of his position or appearance – it is very difficult to judge where a shot comes from.

So why did the sniper disappear from the story? His ruthless scoping her out from a rooftop is was vividly told.

Probably, the sniper was dropped because too many people who viewed the video noticed that her injuries were totally inconsistent with sniper fire. Neda was not shot by a high-powered rifle – we know that because she is still on her feet, although wounded, at the beginning of the video. Any person who takes a shot in the upper body from a high-powered rifle will immediately be prostrate – especially from such close range as across the street. A slightly built woman would be knocked flying.

Neda is standing, then helped to the ground by bystanders. She has a wound in her chest. This is like someone hit at close range by a hand gun. For comparison, look at this Iraqi insurgent, who really has been hit by a sniper, once in the chest – he drops instantly – and then in the head as he is flat on the ground. See how fast he goes down:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4qHJ72MlPQ

The later description, by the music teacher, of Neda being shot by a plain clothes security officer standing in the street therefore appears to be more in accordance with the content of the film.

But why then did the doctor – at first - give such a definite account of the sniper?

And also … the music teacher’s mention of a person in plain clothes raises the uncomfortable notion that we might not know who he is. If he is not in uniform, nor carrying a military style of weapon, then how can we be sure that she was indeed a victim of the Iranian government, as distinct from a random shooting.

Then, in a perfectly marvellous turn of events, a new testimony appeared which addressed exactly these points.

Dr Hejazi, who had now returned to England, gave an interview with the BBC. In this he does acknowledge that he originally thought that the shot came from a sniper, but that in fact, it was from the street. In addition, he says that the shooter was seized by the crowd, and identified.

Dr Hejazi said he first thought the gunshot had come from a rooftop.

But later he saw protesters grab an armed man on a motorcycle.

"People shouted 'we got him, we got him'. They disarmed him and took out his identity card which showed he was a Basij member. People were furious and he was shouting, 'I didn't want to kill her'.

"People didn't know what do to do with him so they let him go. But they took his identity card. There are people there who know who he is. Some people were also taking photos of him." http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8119713.stm

The problems with this account are numerous.

The inconsistency of the story is noticeable. Why did the witness not remember the armed man on the motorcycle until later interviews?

Why is it that although the Neda death video has been distributed thousands of times, we do not have one single picture of this shooter, who was apparently photographed at the scene?

What sort of armed militiaman on a motorcycle allows himself to be captured by a crowd? If he has just shot someone dead, then he is showing considerable force. He cannot be easily seized by unarmed people who are on foot – he can rev up his motorcycle and speed away.

The people around Neda, in the video, show no sign of pursuing the shooter, or even of acting as if they have been under fire. Their reactions are of surprise and focus on the victim, as if the shot has come from nowhere.

We all mourn the deaths of innocent people in Iran. But we need more information about this incident before ascribing any meaning to it.

The Iranian government claims that Neda was killed by an unidentified protestor in the crowd, who was firing a gun. That explanation is consistent with what we see in the film. But other explanations are also possible.

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May she rest in peace!

Lets just get over it. It is the duty of the local police and Iran's intelligence to find the real murderer and bring them to justice... hang them publicly for murder and creating 'fesad' on earth. The best way to proof she was a victim of trouble makers and foreign agents, is to find the killers!

What do we know about 1 million Iraqis died since 2003? more than 100 thousands in Afg.? Some western media and their hypocrite staffs have no shame by placing these incidents as the top stories and using them for propaganda, then some of us too fall for that trying hard to fight the case.

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She was shot with an assault rifle and the evidence is in the vid. Please notice the huge amount of blood already on the ground before she falls in the vid. This means she must have a hole in her back the size of a pie plate. Also, notice the blood on both pants legs. These are secondary exit wounds. Modern military grade ammunition is designed to tumble and come apart in the body with explosive effects. For example, a bullet hit in the hand with this type of ammunition can, and often does, exit through the top of the head. The wound this ammunition inflicts is horrific.

It does not take a scope to get a center of mass hit with an assault rifle up to 300 meters. I’m almost sure this was done over iron sights. Most scope mounted sniper rifles fire a heavy bullet to reach extreme ranges. The lighter assault rifle rounds lose their spin at these longer ranges as they are made unstable to achieve their increase lethality. Pistols do not have a long enough barrel to give their rounds this stability as the assault rifle rounds have their center of mass in the rear of the bullet to get the tumbling effect as soon as it meets the resistance of human flesh.

It is my belief that Neda was indeed knocked down by the round and immediately jumped back to her feet. This must have been when the film began.

I will never forget when I shot my first deer. The range was 5 feet. I had held my fire from 200 meters out tracking over my sights because I could not see it’s horns until it dropped it ears. I shot the poor thing 5 time with 00 buck shot which is the equivalent of being shot with a policeman’s 38 pistol 60 times. Each time I fired the poor animal popped to it feet and attempted to run again. It weight out at barely 90 pounds! Though I fired the fatal round, another hunter finished my kill and ended its suffering. I was out of ammunition.

I base my observation on a life time of familiarity with guns and years of experience as a career soldier in the infantry.

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It is very evident from the vid that competent medical help for Neda is not available. An attempt is made to stop the bleeding in chest, but no one rolls her over to stanch the blood flowing from the large exit wound in her back. Also, no one attempts to elevate her legs is made so that this blood from the extremities can be used to nourish the vital organs in the center of the body.

I read the accounts of the frenzied attempts to get her to a hospital. If a doctor had been on site, he would have pronounced her dead and there would not have been valiant attempts to save her life by rushing Neda to the hospital.

Also, the accounts that say she utter the words, “it burns” seems false for a person whose lungs have been pierced and are rapidly filling with blood. She would have had difficulty uttering anything. I think these are the words of a propagandist who wants to confirm in the minds of many observers as to her ultimate destination for her unwise choice in western blue jean pants. This is why she was picked out of the crowd by the murderer who also judged her.

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I read the accounts of the frenzied attempts to get her to a hospital. If a doctor had been on site...

No, you have not read the accounts carefully. A doctor was present, and he is the chief witness to these events. The problems with the changes in his testimony are set out in the above article.

It is very evident from the vid that competent medical help for Neda is not available. An attempt is made to stop the bleeding in chest, but no one rolls her over to stanch the blood flowing from the large exit wound in her back. Also, no one attempts to elevate her legs is made so that this blood from the extremities can be used to nourish the vital organs in the center of the body.

Those points are correct. I would add - no one attempts to clear her airways or support her breathing - putting her on her back with her head leaning out is the worst thing. Many people who watch the video comment that the CPR is not being done properly. However, he is a qualified doctor - but he does not practice medicine, he became a writer.

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I think all threads about neda should be closed, what is the point of this discussion? no one knows who killed her.. every one used her death to attack the iranian government and blame them for her death. Thousands of woman are raped and murdered in usa every year we never year or see them paraded like this young girl has. What about the 14 year iraqi girl who got raped and burned along with her family by american forces, what about the daily killings that occur in afghanistan, iraq and gaza? we have kids still getting blown up weekly by the cluster bombs israel dropped in south lebanon. Are the innocent people that are killed different because they are killed by the democratic west?

Every westerner that brings up the death of this girl is a hypocret and a coward, talk about your own government first.

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I think all threads about neda should be closed, what is the point of this discussion? no one knows who killed her.. every one used her death to attack the iranian government and blame them for her death. Thousands of woman are raped and murdered in usa every year we never year or see them paraded like this young girl has. What about the 14 year iraqi girl who got raped and burned along with her family by american forces, what about the daily killings that occur in afghanistan, iraq and gaza? we have kids still getting blown up weekly by the cluster bombs israel dropped in south lebanon. Are the innocent people that are killed different because they are killed by the democratic west?

Every westerner that brings up the death of this girl is a hypocret and a coward, talk about your own government first.

They shot her dead. Her spirit seeks revenge. I am serious.

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How can the Iranian government blame any group when they have not produced any evidence or cornered a suspect? It seems to me they are as guilty of speculation as anybody on this board if you forget they are the number one suspect. This idle speculation just makes them "look" guilty. Maybe they are.

Edited by Spriglief
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How can the Iranian government blame any group when they have not produced any evidence or cornered a suspect? It seems to me they are as guilty of speculation as anybody on this board if you forget they are the number one suspect. This idle speculation just makes them "look" guilty. Maybe they are.

As a former soldier from Dixie hick country, you should know that the calibre of the bullet is a tell-tale sign: According to the authorities, it belonged to a gun not issued amongst Iranian military servicemen.

Also, we can rule out the possibility of a basij militiaman being responsible as it required the expertise of a professional sniper, Iranian or foreign.

The Neda case has all the hallmarks of what happened to PC Yvonne Fletcher in 1986. Her death was blamed on gunfire emanating out of the Libyan embassy, but evidence shows she was shot from behind by a CIA marksman.

Participants who appeared in Murder at Saint James's, highlighted such issues as the velocity of the bullet and the angle at which it entered WPC Fletcher's body. The programme suggested a contentious theory that alleged that elements of British MI5, American CIA and Israeli Mossad intelligence, installed in a penthouse above Number 8, Saint James's Square, used a high-velocity weapon such as the Heckler and Koch G3-A4ZF (with a telescopic sight) to fire a three-shot burst at their target. According to this theory, Fletcher was murdered to portray Gaddafi's Libya in a bad light, and perhaps to provoke the severing of bi-lateral diplomatic relations.
Lets just blame it on Zionists and call it a day, shall we?:P

שָׁלוֹם

Edited by Muraqib ul tarighat
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salaam

you didnt include this in your article

press TV interviewed the music teacher and her driver and for me it just adds to the confusion because none of them mention police or baseej and in fact they say there was none of them at the scene. so where did all these baseeej blaming reports come from ?

and whats the coincident that the doctor was from britain?

here is the link where press TV interviewed the eyewitnesses.

Edited by alimohamad40
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I dont think we should trust the PressTV report. Obviously there would be repercussions for them if they did not give the right answers. Furthermore, they just say "there was no basij" but then offer no alternative of what happened, or what they think happened....

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I dont think we should trust the PressTV report. Obviously there would be repercussions for them if they did not give the right answers. Furthermore, they just say "there was no basij" but then offer no alternative of what happened, or what they think happened....

I honestly don't believe that press TV goes around with guns in their hands hunting the eyewitnesses and forcing them to lie and say there was no police in the scene.

I honestly can not digest that because when i was in Iran i saw the type pf freedom and the president and even khamenai got cursed in front of me many times and mujaheedeen khalq were praised many times. .,,

no matter how bias press TV might be but they will not create eyewitnesses i don't believe. If they have false witnesses then the true witness will post a youtube and the next day every fox and news channel will have it on the front page.

the verse in the quraan says : "if a fasiq comes to you with a news then investigate you might harm a group due to ignorance then regret what you have done"

so the channels that we really need to suspect their news are the ones that encourage fornication and homosexuality blatantly even though they know clearly that its an abomination based on their claimed religion. This is the exact definition of fasiq when they know some thing is wrong and they do it.

from the Muslim channels also the women that don't wear hijab knowing that its compulsory are fasiq.. so i would trust them less and investigate more.

Edited by alimohamad40
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