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In the Name of God بسم الله

Sunnis vs Shias

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shia and sunni relations can never work out ur asking us to accept ayesha, abu bakr, umar as good people when we know they are not. what they did to the ahlulbayt i can never support that. im against shia - sunni unity, relations cuz its fake and the only relation is shia - shia im not gna accept a false version of islam called "sunni" got it? the only solution is war ur rite or mabey patience wait till the imam reappears and teaches them a lesson

put a 5th option

5) Sunnis and Shias cannot relate cuz one sect is completely misguided and deceived. We will wait till the reappareance of the imam (hf) to guide the sunnis to the true way of Islam

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(bismillah)

(salam)

shia and sunni relations can never work out ur asking us to accept ayesha, abu bakr, umar as good people when we know they are not. what they did to the ahlulbayt i can never support that. im against shia - sunni unity, relations cuz its fake and the only relation is shia - shia im not gna accept a false version of islam called "sunni" got it? the only solution is war ur rite or mabey patience wait till the imam reappears and teaches them a lesson

put a 5th option

5) Sunnis and Shias cannot relate cuz one sect is completely misguided and deceived. We will wait till the reappareance of the imam (hf) to guide the sunnis to the true way of Islam

With this type of mentality, we will end up like the Bhoris. Let's not have this happen please.

Unite for the sake of Allah (swt) and His Messenger (pbuh).

(salam)

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(salam)

(bismillah)

What exactly is lost if Shi`ah and Sunnis unite? I only see what there is to gain.

(salam)

its not that there is anything wrong with the concept itself but u just dont understand u think its gonna be tht easy just unite, r u kidding? unity requires acknowling and accepting eachothers beliefs as far as i know most sunnis dont know anything about shias and think we are lunatics cuz of all the stuff they tell them, we worship rocks, we hit ourselves now sunnis ownt tell u this but they hate shias like u have no idea how much they hate them. secondly, uniting with sunnis u also have to respect the caliphs abu bakr, umar etc and ayesha as welll. there is no way i can respect the enemies, which is required in unity, therefore making unity with sunnis impossible, i like the idea but its not gonna work. im telling u

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WA wr wb..

i agree we should try to unite. what i mean by unity is when you're with them give only hadiths from Ale Muhammad. i think eventually it'll rub off on them if you play your part the right way, but you have to be a walking example and not a hypocrite because they will sense you don't understand what you're talking about.

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I vote first choice (harmony in relations) but only for individuals who also feel the same towards people of different faith. Be it Sunni, Salafi/Wahabi/Ahle Hadith, Barelvi/Deobandi, Sufi, Ismaili, Mirzai, Christian, Jew, Hindu etc.

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yea shias like darul islam just dont get it how the hell r we suppose to unite when sunnis think imam ali is our God? we worship rocks, we hit ourselves with swords every month, and curse their caliphs and ayesha lool u think sunnis wud unite? they hate shias more then zionist how do u expect us to unite in fact either group wud unite with the zionist more

Edited by interesting_guy
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how the hell r we suppose to unite when sunnis think imam ali is our God? ....

lol ur right ... but i think the majority of them don't think like that.

Edited by Alhumdolilllah
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yea shias like darul islam just dont get it how the hell r we suppose to unite when sunnis think imam ali is our God? we worship rocks, we hit ourselves with swords every month, and curse their caliphs and ayesha lool u think sunnis wud unite? they hate shias more then zionist how do u expect us to unite in fact either group wud unite with the zionist more

(bismillah)

(salam)

You described here one group of the Sunnis who do not want unite with us. But there are another group of Sunnis who are open to unite with us.

Edited by Zufa
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and whos dat group of sunnis...?

(bismillah)

(salam)

Open-minded muslims who seek for knowledge and guidance. The same inviduals who care not for the reproach of anybody in matters concerning Allah. Inviduals who fear Allah (SWT) and trying their best to following His laws. The same inviduals who "hold fast by the covenant (or rope) of Allah and who not want disunite, Quran 3:103 ". The same inviduals who do not boast nor indulge in self conceit, nor misappropriate, nor create mischief. But their hearts are in Paradise while their bodies are busy in (good) acts.

"The believers are but a single brotherhood. Make peace and reconciliation between your two (contending) brothers and fear Allah so that you may receive mercy." (49-10)

Edited by Zufa
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what i understood from imam ali history and imam hassan policy that a muslim momen should keep an eye on what he says and what he dose

they keep an equlibruim btw sseking justice and seeking unity

what good of your true words if it only bring fitna and firqa ?

was prophet haroon wrong when he didnt force bani israel to stop worshipping the golden animal?

what was his answer to prophet mosa?

if we belive in quran we should belive in it all including unity verses ,we are not wiser than Allah

and if we love ahlul bayet we should follow thier steps not only cries on them

if we didnt bother to follow ahlul bayet we wouldnt be any diffrent than any sunni

salam

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and whos dat group of sunnis...?

Dr Tahir ul Qadri

Dr Tahir ul Qadri is the founding leader of Minhaj ul Qur'an International, a worldwide organisation whose stated aim is the establishment of unity and understanding between communities,[1] and education for the young in the classical Islamic sciences for the promotion of peace.[2][3] He is also founder of the Minhaj Welfare Foundation which is for the provision of welfare for the needy[4] and of the Minhaj International University based in Lahore. Tahir-ul-Qadri is also the founding chairman of the political party Pakistan Awami Tehreek (PAT).

this man was one of the first to condemn zakir naLAik and did a speech against him, is pro azadari and actively has spent his life approaching shias in brotherhood. and he has a massive following.

his followers in the UK took part in our jaloos last muharram with their own halka at the start as a mark of unity. they also provide first aid and free food for azadaars.

he has even written books about the event of ghadeer and tawassul.

this is unity. merging sunnis and shias into one mongrel religion is BS.

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Salam

Please do not start inflammatory threads. Shia-Sunni war is a sad reality in some places as we know and many people have lost their lives due to this conflict. We should try to improve relations rather than encourage fighting and hatred.

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Whoever wants a war between the 2 schools is ignorant of history. If we want Sunnis and shias to fight each other then we are following the sunnah of Muawiyah who used the arbitration to distract the Muslims from the real enemy. On the contrary, if we see each other as brothers and sisters then we are following the sunnah of Imam Hassan (as) and the Ahlul bayt who hated to see the Muslim blood being dropped.

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If we are done with the wishy washy wishes then lets get realistic for a moment. How do you expect Sunnis to treat you like their brothers when its a known fact you curse the very people he (sunni) respects? How do you expect Shias to treat Sunnis like their brother when they are completely oblivious to Shia sentiments?

Personally i dont see it happening. With the current Salafi surge going around in the next few years more and more Sunnis are starting to have radical views about Islam. Which only adds up to more trouble for the Shias.

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If we are done with the wishy washy wishes then lets get realistic for a moment. How do you expect Sunnis to treat you like their brothers when its a known fact you curse the very people he (sunni) respects?

The 12rs are not suppose to curse the sunni imams upfront. It is a sin.

Shia scholar condemns open tabara

How do you expect Shias to treat Sunnis like their brother when they are completely oblivious to Shia sentiments?

If Sunnis cannot see the contributions that imam Khomeini and Hezbullah have done for this Ummah then they are blind.

Personally i dont see it happening. With the current Salafi surge going around in the next few years more and more Sunnis are starting to have radical views about Islam. Which only adds up to more trouble for the Shias.

Of course it won't happen. The full unity will only happen when the last imam appears. In fact there will be many sunnis and even shias who will oppose the 12th imam.

Shia Scholar on the Preparation of Imam-e-Zamaan

The reality is both schools have extreme and closed minded people whose main source of life is to create more and more fitna. To them leaving in peace is a problem.

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(bismillah)

(salam)

If there isn't a 100% for the first answer choice at all times, it is a disgrace.

(salam)

I'm sorry if I offend you, but Sunnis do not consider us, Shias. muslims. They call us 'innovators'.

Would you really want to team up with and have peace with people liket these? I wouldn't!

But I voted for peace for the sake of voting.

When we think of it, we have little common ground with Sunnis :(

I sure wich, Abu Hurraira and Ayesha, shouldn't have lied so much, then maybe there would have been more similarites between Shias and Sunnis. :(

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We should stop cursing them...

Link as you know i dont curse them but i still hold them responsible for their enmity against the Ahlelbayt. Now do you really think all those fatwas against Shias are due to us cursing the Sahabas?

With the Salafi surge Mauwiyah is gaining extreme popularity as well infact SSP leader Tariq Azam named his son as such. Now are we gonna stop cursing him as well.

Abdaal

The reality is both schools have extreme and closed minded people whose main source of life is to create more and more fitna. To them leaving in peace is a problem

Thats not true cause

A) Our Marjaes never oppose Ahlesunnah

B- India and Lebanon are examples where both parties are living in harmony. When you got bigger fish to fry you tend to overlook the smaller problems. People in Pakistan also lived in harmony till mid 80's and then came the radical so called Sunni scholars with their hate speech. You can view them online at youtube if you wish.

Now what bothers me is the fact that majority of the Sunni major scholars (who have authority) decided to keep their mouths shut on this issue.

The 12rs are not suppose to curse the sunni imams upfront. It is a sin.

Shia scholar condemns open tabara

I agree with Jan Ali. Tabarra should not be done openly especially on these forums. Just because you have the option of cursing does not allow you to inflame the sentiments of others. The fact still remains that under Shia jurisprudence i am allowed to curse your calipha and obviously you have the right not to tolerate this.

Edited by Logic
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A) Our Marjaes never oppose Ahlesunnah

B- India and Lebanon are examples where both parties are living in harmony. When you got bigger fish to fry you tend to overlook the smaller problems. People in Pakistan also lived in harmony till mid 80's and then came the radical so called Sunni scholars with their hate speech. You can view them online at youtube if you wish.

Now what bothers me is the fact that majority of the Sunni major scholars (who have authority) decided to keep their mouths shut on this issue.

I wouldn't say that is true. My parents are from India and they hate shias. I really can't do much to change their mind. The only reason the Indian Muslims live in peace is because the bigger focus is not shia or sunni. The bigger focus is the Hinduvita movement which wants Muslims out of India. As for Pakistanis some of them are really messed. They have disputes against each other. Also, many of them don't even consider Indian Muslims to be legitimate Muslims. Now for the Sunni scholars they think shias are a minority so they don't focus on them. For the sunni scholars who do care about shia muslims they get labeled as shia. Look at Imam Al Asi and Syed Ninowy. Syed Ninowy actually gets death threats from the wahabis. Imam Al Asi is banned from Saudi Arabia.

I agree with Jan Ali. Tabarra should not be done openly especially on these forums. Just because you have the option of cursing does not allow you to inflame the sentiments of others. The fact still remains that under Shia jurisprudence i am allowed to curse your calipha and obviously you have the right not to tolerate this.

I'm sure you have seen the clip of Maluana Ishaaq. They are really good.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0YFV1Z7ASQ

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Link as you know i dont curse them but i still hold them responsible for their enmity against the Ahlelbayt. Now do you really think all those fatwas against Shias are due to us cursing the Sahabas?

The Fatwas against us are for many reasons, but the main thing Sunnis hold against us is that we curse.

Mauwiya is not considered among the rightly guided Caliphs - so I don't think it's a problem with cursing him.

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I hold a negative view on neither the Sunni schools, or Shia schools of thought, but I am still in the process of learning. I have studied the Hanifi school of thought, and personally I find it a perfectly viable school for a Muslim. Likewise I feel the same about the Twelever, school of thought as well. I try to distance myself from being called a "Sunni" or a "Shia" because in my opinion, there is no Shia, no Sunni, there is only Islam, and both school have to potential to be pious people who go to paradise, and I have seen some Shia thinking they are superior to their Sunni brothers because school of thought, and the opposite as well. Therefore, a lot really matters how devote you are to your school, rather than which school you learned. There is a lot of good Sunnis, and Shias, but unfortunately some bad ones as well. So I think that instead of the sides trying to prove one or the other wrong, they should focus on greater issues such as the sad state of our ummah, and let Allah judge on which we defer.

However, I think (at the current moment in history), that the Shia have been doing more to defend Islam than the Sunni brothers, and that Iran and Imam Khomeni, are the greatest nation, and leaders of modern times respectively. In that since, I identify with my Shia brothers more than many of my Sunni ones. I would go as far as to say that most Sunnis in modern times would probably agree, because the most beloved leaders in the Middle East region are all Shia Muslims, Hassan Nasrallah, and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad are both Shia Muslims. I hope that my Sunni brothers catch up soon. :P

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I hold a negative view on neither the Sunni schools, or Shia schools of thought, but I am still in the process of learning. I have studied the Hanifi school of thought, and personally I find it a perfectly viable school for a Muslim. Likewise I feel the same about the Twelever, school of thought as well. I try to distance myself from being called a "Sunni" or a "Shia" because in my opinion, there is no Shia, no Sunni, there is only Islam, and both school have to potential to be pious people who go to paradise, and I have seen some Shia thinking they are superior to their Sunni brothers because school of thought, and the opposite as well. Therefore, a lot really matters how devote you are to your school, rather than which school you learned. There is a lot of good Sunnis, and Shias, but unfortunately some bad ones as well. So I think that instead of the sides trying to prove one or the other wrong, they should focus on greater issues such as the sad state of our ummah, and let Allah judge on which we defer.

However, I think (at the current moment in history), that the Shia have been doing more to defend Islam than the Sunni brothers, and that Iran and Imam Khomeni, are the greatest nation, and leaders of modern times respectively. In that since, I identify with my Shia brothers more than many of my Sunni ones. I would go as far as to say that most Sunnis in modern times would probably agree, because the most beloved leaders in the Middle East region are all Shia Muslims, Hassan Nasrallah, and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad are both Shia Muslims. I hope that my Sunni brothers catch up soon. :P

No offense, but if you're always in the middle of being a Shia and a Sunni, so be it. But be warned, there is not middle for the Day of Judgement, either Hell or Heaven, so I advise you to choose fast, Hell(Sunni) or Heaven(Shia).

Hanafi-sensible????

:!!!: :!!!:

Funny guy, you are......

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As-Salamu Alaykum Basim Ali,

I do not live in a Muslim country like many of you do, so what I know is from what my father has taught me who is more akin to the Hanafi school. Having that said I do not consider myself a Sunni Muslim, I am simply a Muslim. However, I am interested in following a school of thought, and I was thinking between Hanafi and Twelver.

I agree with you that there is no middle of the road on the day of Judgment, but nor is there any Sunni and Shia in the Quran; only Muslims. Did prophet Muhammad (pbuh) say he was either a Sunni or Shia? No. So by "Hell(Sunni)" are you implying they are non believers? Can you prove that Sunnis would go to hell simply because they do not believe the 12 Imams, despite the fact that millions of them are devote and pious people, who love the holy prophet (pbuh), and his family, who forbid the wrong, and enjoy the right? Simply because they disagree on the issue of succession they will go to hell? Please provide some proof.

And are you implying Hanafi is non sensible? Again please provide some proof.

Edited by Shaheen
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As-Salamu Alaykum Basim Ali,

I do not live in a Muslim country like many of you do, so what I know is from what my father has taught me who is more akin to the Hanafi school. Having that said I do not consider myself a Sunni Muslim, I am simply a Muslim. However, I am interested in following a school of thought, and I was thinking between Hanafi and Twelver.

I agree with you that there is no middle of the road on the day of Judgment, but nor is there any Sunni and Shia in the Quran; only Muslims. Did prophet Muhammad (pbuh) say he was either a Sunni or Shia? No. So by "Hell(Sunni)" are you implying they are non believers? Can you prove that Sunnis would go to hell simply because they do not believe the 12 Imams, despite the fact that millions of them are devote and pious people, who love the holy prophet (pbuh), and his family, who forbid the wrong, and enjoy the right? Simply because they disagree on the issue of succession they will go to hell? Please provide some proof.

And are you implying Hanafi is non sensible? Again please provide some proof.

i blv

Loving to enimies of ZAHRA(A) will be enough to take them in hell.

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Did prophet Muhammad (pbuh) say he was either a Sunni or Shia?

(bismillah)

(salam)

Just one thing bro,

Holy Prophet pbuh said, "After me, I am going to leave two precious weighty things(for Hidaayat ): one is the holy book of Allah ( Quran ) and the other is my Etratt (progeny), Both of them shall never leave each other till they've reached me by the pool of Kauser in paradise"

Sunni References: Tirmizi in his Sahih narrates from Zaid Ibne Arqum; Kunzul Ammal Part-1, Page-44; Musnad Imam Ahmed ibn Hanbal Part-5, Page-182; Mustadrak part-3, page-109 and page-148

Just think about it! The Ahl ul Sunnah wal Jam'at sect (who are sunni merely by label) can be best described as follows:

Their Khulfa (Caliphs) are not from ............. Ahlulbayt a.s !!!

Their A-Emma (Imams) are not from ......... Ahlulbayt a.s !!!

Their Raavees (Narrators of Hadith) are not from ...... Ahlulbayt a.s !!!

Their Mohadeseen (collectors of Hadith) are not from .......... Ahlulbayt a.s !!!

NOW BROTHER, REGARDING WHY TO BE A SHIA OF IMAM ALI(as) , WELL HERE IS WHY :

http://www.shiabooks.ca/GT.htm

"Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy handhold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things. (The Noble Quran, 2:256)"

TRUTH STANDS OUT CLEAR FROM ERROR................

Wasallam

Edited by fahim
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http://ammanmessage.com/index.php?option=c...0&Itemid=74

I am sure you guys hear of the Amman message correct? It states than anyone who follows the Sunni or Shia schools are Muslim, and all such school are valid. And yes, the greatest Shia minds in our times, such as Imam Sistani, agreed with this as well.

"Based on the fatwas provided by these great scholars (who included the Shaykh Al-Azhar; Ayatollah Sistani and Sheikh Qaradawi), in July 2005 CE, King Abdullah II of Jordan convened an international Islamic conference of 200 of the world's leading Islamic scholars or 'Ulama) from 50 countries. In Amman, the scholars unanimously issued a ruling on three fundamental issues (which became known as the 'Three Points of the Amman Message'):

1. They specifically recognized the validity of all 8 Mathhabs (legal schools) of Sunni, Shi'a and Ibadhi Islam; of traditional Islamic Theology (Ash'arism); of Islamic Mysticism (Sufism), and of true Salafi thought, and came to a precise definition of who is a Muslim.

2. Based upon this definition they forbade takfir (declarations of apostasy) between Muslims.

3. Based upon the Mathahib they set forth the subjective and objective preconditions for the issuing of fatwas, thereby exposing ignorant and illegitimate edicts in the name of Islam."

http://ammanmessage.com/index.php?option=c...4&Itemid=42

http://ammanmessage.com/index.php?option=c...0&Itemid=42

http://ammanmessage.com/index.php?option=c...9&Itemid=42

I cannot read this can someone please translate it for me I greatly appreciate it. I think its what some of the Shia Imams opinions on the issue of unity, and validity.

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