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Dirac Delta function

Qasr prayers when ill?

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Illness doesn't give anyone excuse to make a salat qasr. Even if you're ill, you have to make the obligatory number of rakat for each salah, but depends on your level of sickness. If you can stand without unbearable pain, then you have to make the 4 rakat standing. If you can't stand, then you have to make the 4 rakat sitting down, and if it's so bad that you still can't sit up, you have to make the 4 rakat laying down....

Hope that helps.

Edited by jund_el_Mahdi

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Salam

As far as i know (and i know how that sounds, but i really do know my fiqh laws well :P) the only time you pray qasr is when you are traveling...if you are sick you still have to pray full prayers, unless you cant physically move a part of your body, for example your legs, which would then allow you to pray while sitting down (in order to make it easy on you).

If there is an exception to that ruling then i will truly be surprised, as i highly highly doubt it.

Wasalam.

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Illness doesn't give anyone excuse to make a salat qasr. Even if you're ill, you have to make the obligatory number of rakat for each salah, but depends on your level of sickness. If you can stand without unbearable pain, then you have to make the 4 rakat standing. If you can't stand, then you have to make the 4 rakat sitting down, and if it's so bad that you still can't sit up, you have to make the 4 rakat laying down....

Hope that helps.

I don't want to make excuses, that's why I asked if it's obligatory to pray Qasr. My understanding is that it is obligatory to pray qasr for long travels, hence you can't choose to do 4 even if you want to.

Thanks both of you.

Edited by Dirac Delta function

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Guest JacobM
Illness doesn't give anyone excuse to make a salat qasr. Even if you're ill, you have to make the obligatory number of rakat for each salah, but depends on your level of sickness. If you can stand without unbearable pain, then you have to make the 4 rakat standing. If you can't stand, then you have to make the 4 rakat sitting down, and if it's so bad that you still can't sit up, you have to make the 4 rakat laying down....

Hope that helps.

What happens if your medical ailment disables brain functionality, like an intense stroke?

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Guest JacobM
If a person's brain cannot function, it's not his fault then, he can't control that. Nothing's wajib on him...

but he can control it if he's sick? What happens if he's constantly vomiting from the flu?

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but he can control it if he's sick? What happens if he's constantly vomiting from the flu?

As long as his/her brains are functioning and they can think, it would still be obligatory to pray.

Don't ask me I miss plenty even when I am hale and hearty. :squeez:

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Guest JacobM
As long as his/her brains are functioning and they can think, it would still be obligatory to pray.

Don't ask me I miss plenty even when I am hale and hearty. :squeez:

Am I the only one who fails to see the logic in this? Shouldn't we only pray to Allah (swt) if we can actually focus on praising him and not holding back our projectile vomit? Or does Allah (swt) want me utter words like a robot with no passion?

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Am I the only one who fails to see the logic in this? Shouldn't we only pray to Allah (swt) if we can actually focus on praising him and not holding back our projectile vomit? Or does Allah (swt) want me utter words like a robot with no passion?

If you can't focus and concentrate because your illness is so severe, then you shouldn't do any salah.

Edited by jund_el_Mahdi

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Oh my God. He's getting seriously annoying now, i can't stand to read any of his posts. He reminds me of an old member servidor.

If you get up to pray when you are so sick, Allah swt will probably give you more hasanat and rewards than regularly praying with concentration. Why? Because you are basically telling him "this is difficult for me but you are so great and i love you so much that i will do my best to continue to do my daily worship of you and try my best to concentrate."

I am willing to bet that 8/10 of your regular prayers are done with minimal to no concentration on the meaning behind it. But when it comes to being sick suddenly you have excuses about no being able to concentrate.

I have in the past missed prayers because i was sick, so i am not saying i am immune to the pain of sickness and the difficulty of getting up to pray when you are ill in bed, HOWEVER this does not mean that i was right, and all that i said before still applies.

If you are so ill that if you stand up you are so dizzy you need to sit back down or lay down again then fine, redo your prayers, but if you have 5 min of prayer strength in you, then get up and use up all of your energy and then collapse back on your bed afterward.

Stop trying to change Gods law in order to fit what you want it to be. Your tiny limited mind is not more logical and knowledgeable than that of the prophet (SAWW).

Geez.

Edited by 3ashiqat-Al-Batoul

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Am I the only one who fails to see the logic in this? Shouldn't we only pray to Allah (swt) if we can actually focus on praising him and not holding back our projectile vomit? Or does Allah (swt) want me utter words like a robot with no passion?

That's one way of looking at it. :D

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JacobM, I've been taught that you should still pray but you only need do so according to your capabilities. For instance, if a person is paralyzed so he can't move a single muscle, he can still think the prayers. So, if someone were throwing up every other minute, I would think that he wouldn't be required to do the five daily prayers in the same way that healthy people would.

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Guest JacobM
Oh my God. He's getting seriously annoying now, i can't stand to read any of his posts. He reminds me of an old member servidor.

Because I question and think? I apologize for asking questions. You are right. We should all be robots and adapt whatever our marja tells us to think.

If you get up to pray when you are so sick, Allah swt will probably give you more hasanat and rewards than regularly praying with concentration. Why? Because you are basically telling him "this is difficult for me but you are so great and i love you so much that i will do my best to continue to do my daily worship of you and try my best to concentrate."

Why are you praying so you can be rewarded? Shouldn't we make salah for the sole reason of our love for Allah (swt)?

I have in the past missed prayers because i was sick, so i am not saying i am immune to the pain of sickness and the difficulty of getting up to pray when you are ill in bed, HOWEVER this does not mean that i was right, and all that i said before still applies.

Mashallah. May Allah (swt) bless you for your salah.

Stop trying to change Gods law in order to fit what you want it to be. Your tiny limited mind is not more logical and knowledgeable than that of the prophet (SAWW).

Geez.

Why are you so afraid of simple questions? Is your faith so weak that it can't sustain questions from a random person on the internet? Is Sharia law really this weak?

If sharia is God's law, how could any man change a law which is eternal? I'm not a marja, so what am I changing?

I am not claiming to be more logical or knowledgeable than the Prophet (pbuh). I apologize if you think I was intending to offend our beloved Prophet.

May Allah (swt) shower his infinite mercy on you.

~Yacoub

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^ listen. My passion is psychology and i read people really well. I am not stupid or ignorant, i can easily tell the difference between somebody who is asking questions because they genuinely want to know the answer, and between someone who keeps questioning things for the sake of it, to create argument, not to benefit.

You can ask 1000 questions and be ignorant, and never ask any and be extremely intelligent. I don't know why i even reply to your posts, you always reply to me as if you are so innocent and just want to learn more about the religion and as if i am misjudging you, whereas every single one of your other posts has an entirely different tone.

I honestly don't know why i bother. People will get bored of answering questions which you never accept sooner or later.

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Guest JacobM
^ listen. My passion is psychology and i read people really well. I am not stupid or ignorant, i can easily tell the difference between somebody who is asking questions because they genuinely want to know the answer, and between someone who keeps questioning things for the sake of it, to create argument, not to benefit.

You can ask 1000 questions and be ignorant, and never ask any and be extremely intelligent. I don't know why i even reply to your posts, you always reply to me as if you are so innocent and just want to learn more about the religion and as if i am misjudging you, whereas every single one of your other posts has an entirely different tone.

I honestly don't know why i bother. People will get bored of answering questions which you never accept sooner or later.

You should study more psychology before you come to conclusions about people you meet on the internet.

I'm waiting for an answer to my questions.

Jazak Allahu Khairan for your time.

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(salam)

Several years back, the news of imam Khomeini's death was aired on the TV. They showed a few recordings from his life. I still remember that scene vividly where ruhollah khomeini was praying (standing! despite being very ill, frail and weak) with 2 men on each side holding his i.v glucose/saline bottles and bending down with him when he went into rukoo and sujood :cry: That was so touching & inspiring. I resolved to be punctual in my prayers after that.

Edited by Alhumdolilllah

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Guest JacobM

(bismillah)

Brother that should be the goal in all our prayers, but even when 100% healthy people are unable to do what you have said. Offering prayers is obligatory even if it is like a robot. Many people are unable to fully concentrate on prayers, doesn't make it not obligatory on them. So you pray to the best of your ability always even if it means trying not to vomit during prayers, your intention matters most to Allah (swt).

Hasan Sajjad

President

What is Salah in its essence? I was taught that Salah was the formal method of connecting to Allah (swt) by praising his name. If your 'salah' is mere utterances of words and simply robotic motions, how can you claim it is still salah?

Look at the following Hadith:

On the authority of Hadrat Abu Huraira (may Allah be pleased with him), who said that Allah's Messenger (may Allah's blessings and peace be upon him) said:

The first of his actions for which a servant of Allah (The Glorified and the Exalted) will be held accountable on the Day of Resurrection will be his prayers. If they are in order, then he will have prospered and succeeded; and if they are wanting, then he will have failed and lost. If there is something defective in his obligatory prayers, the Lord (The Glorified and the Exalted) will say: See if My servant has any optional prayers with which may be completed that which was defective in his obligatory prayers. Then the rest of his actions will be judged in like fashion. (Tirmidhi, Abu Dawud, an-Nasai, Ibn Majah and Ahmad). (Hadith Qudsi)

Wouldn't saying your Salah in a robotic fashion be inherently defective?

(salam)

Several years back, the news of imam Khomeini's death was aired on the TV. They showed a few recordings from his life. I still remember that scene vividly where ruhollah khomeini was praying (standing! despite being very ill, frail and weak) with 2 men on each side holding his i.v glucose/saline bottles and bending down with him when he went into rukoo and sujood :cry: That was so touching & inspiring. I resolved to be punctual in my prayers after that.

subhan'Allah!!! I really love Ayatollah Khomeini (ra). He was a great marja.

However, how do you know that he was not concentrating on Allah (swt) during Salah? The point I'm trying to make is a I fail to see the purpose in Salah if it's robotic and lacks passion. Simply uttering a few words in arabic and sticking your butt up in the air is not salah. Salah is very real connection and praising of our lord.

Therefore, my conclusion is that unless you made a real 'salah' and not simply going through the motions, you must make up for it by optional prayers.

(wasalam)

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Guest JacobM
^ There are many hadith that point to saying "Majority of one's salat is rejected". Like I said above, you might as well not pray when you are healthy either because many times you cannot concentrate on prayer regardless of your condition. Lol and what makes you think you will concentrate on optional prayers if you can't do the bare minimum?

There is substantial difference between day dreaming during salah when you're healthy and not being able to concentrate because you're constantly vomiting. You're using a logical fallacy called the slippery slope argument.

A slippery slope is a classical informal fallacy. A slippery slope argument states that a relatively small first step inevitably leads to a chain of related events culminating in some significant impact, much like an object given a small push over the edge of a slope sliding all the way to the bottom.[1] The fallacious sense of "slippery slope" is often used synonymously with continuum fallacy, in that it ignores the possibility of middle ground and assumes a discrete transition from category A to category B. The heart of the slippery slope fallacy lies in abusing the intuitively appreciable transitivity of implication, claiming that A lead to B, B leads to C, C leads to D and so on, until one finally claims that A leads to Z. While this is formally valid when the premises are taken as a given, each of those contingencies needs to be factually established before the relevant conclusion can be drawn. Slippery slope fallacies occur when this is not done — an argument that supports the relevant premises is not fallacious and thus isn't a slippery slope fallacy.

( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope ). In summary, just because I miss salah because of the flu does not mean I stop making my obligatory salah when I'm healthy.

You pray even if it is like a robot because it is obligatory. In the mean time you educate yourself about the prayers and the religion so eventually that robotic movement has more meaning. There is a reason you have children read prayers, so that they get used to it and it becomes a habit.

What is Salah? What is the essence of Salah?

Look you can disagree all you want but if you can justify yourself in front of Allah (swt) for missing what He has made obligatory then so be it but I am not willing to take such a chance.

Ah, once again you're using a logical fallacy, but this one is called argumentum ad metum which is 'appeal to fear'. You're using the prospect of Allah (swt) punishing us and instilling fear to prove a point, but fail to use reason.

Do you really think Allah (swt) is going to punish someone because they missed a salah when they were vomiting because of the flu? I thought Allah (swt) was merciful? No?

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Guest JacobM
But don't make the decision yourself if Allah (swt) will accept your prayers or not. Offer them and inshAllah He will accept them. You speak of His mercy, won't His mercy lead to Him accepting your prayers even if an illness prevents you from concentrating 100%?

(wasalam)

You have yet to tell me what the essence of Salah is. How can we come to conclusion on any matter concerning prayer if you do not know what prayer actually is? If you can tell me what the essence of Salah is, I would greatly appreciate it.

Take Care,

-jM

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as salaam alaykum Br. Jacob,

It is true that one of the purposes of salaat is to connect with the divine. It actually has many benefits which include softening the heart, erasing the sins that cause us a myriad of problems in this world and the hereafter, humbles us etc.

The issue, though, is that we connect on Allah's (swt) terms, not our own. Allah (swt) has made salaat an obligation even when we don't "feel" like it, even when we are having a hard time concentrating, even when we are sick. If you can't make sujood w/o vomiting, then make the motion as much as possible. You do whatever is possible in the effort to fulfill God's commands. And yes, it's fine to worship Allah (swt) out of desire for his mercy or fear of His wrath. They are real. It's wonderful to say "I won't play soccer on the freeway because I love Allah (swt) so greatly that I value human life too much to risk my own," but the truth is most of us don't because we're terrified of death and dismemberment. We all hope to reach the point of spiritual purification and love that we act only out of love, but acting out of fear or seeking God's mercy are ALSO highly valued acts of worship. They acknowledge the reality of Allah's (swt) supremacy which is an acknowledgement of ultimate truth. These things are psychologically and spiritually valuable as well.

All or nothing thinking is a trap of shaitan and will lead you astray very quickly. It is from Allah's (swt) mercy that He rewards even small steps toward obedience even when we can't live up to the perfection toward which we strive.

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Bismillah ar Rahman ar Raheem. Peace and greetings. Allah says in the Quran that the Insan should try to the best of his or her efforts. Allah is so merciful he doesnt want to much strain on your Body or Soul. He does not give strain on a person more then it can handle. In the end its all about your INTENTIONS. If you pray while sick, then most likely you will gain more respect from Allah. It all depends on how sick you are. As ling as we dont just use sickness as an excuse for not praying depending on the level of sickness. If you are unable to pray standing up then do it sitting down instead. You will have better focusing in your pray. In the end you have to use the best judgement from your collective wisdom knowledge and INTENTIONS. SubhanAllah. I love the power of prayer. If you actually do your prayers slowly patiently with focus and sincereity; you will notice a whole dofferent feeling of spiritual uplifting and a new level of patience. Remember..the Body and Soul work in harmony with each other. The more you purify your heart and soul, the more your body will be purified. Salam

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Salam this dua from bibi Fatimah Zahra  is very helpful when I'm ill it gives me the power for prayers

 

It is reported in Muhaj al Dawat by sayyid bin Tawus that taught this dua'a to Salman. 
The Holy Prophet had given this dua'a to his daughter with instruction that whoso recites it daily, 
in the morning and evening, remains safe from fever.

I hope that you get well soon.:fever::yahoo:

if you doing prayer when you can stand for along time but for a short time it is obligatory that stand (Qiam) after rukuh but you can do other parts of prayers while you are in bed.

 

 

In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.

O Allah, (please do) send blessings to Muhammad and the Household of Muhammad,

(We seek fulfillment of our desires)
in the name of Allah, the light,
in the name of Allah, the light, the light,
in the name of Allah, the light over light,
in the name of Allah, who is He who manages all affairs,
In the. name of Allah who created light from light.
Praise be to Allah who created light from light, and sent down light on the mountain (Tur), in between the inscribed book, in the parchment unrolled, by a measure, well-determined, on the (Holy) Prophet, the giver of glad tidings.
Praise be to Allah; it is He who is remembered with the highest of the high attributes, who is known to be the most glorious.
In joy and happiness, in sorrow and distress, He (alone) is thankfully praised.
Blessings of Allah be on our master, Muhammad, and on his pure children.

بِسْمِ اللهِ الرَّحْمٰنِ الرَّحِيْم

اَللَّهُمَّ صَلِّ عَلَىٰ مُحَمَّدٍ وَآلِ مُحَمَّدٍ

 

‏ بِسْمِ اللهِ‏ النُّوْرِ بِسْمِ اللهِ نُوْرِ النُّوْرِ

 بِسْمِ اللهِ نُورٌ عَلٰى نُوْرٍ بِسْمِ اللهِ الَّذِيْ هُوَ مُدَبِّرُ الْاُمُوْرِ

 بِسْمِ اللهِ الَّذِيْ خَلَقَ النُّوْرَ مِنَ النُّوْرِ

 اَلْحَمْدُ لِلهِ الَّذِيْ خَلَقَ النُّوْرَ مِنَ النُّوْرِ وَ اَنْزَلَ النُّوْرَ عَلَى الطُّوْرِ فِيْ‏ كِتَابٍ مَسْطُوْرٍ. فِيْ رَقٍّ مَنْشُوْرٍ بِقَدَرٍ مَقْدُوْرٍ عَلٰى نَبِيٍّ مَحْبُوْرٍ

 اَلْحَمْدُ لِلهِ الَّذِيْ هُوَ بِالْعِزِّ مَذْكُوْرٌ وَ بِالْفَخْرِ مَشْهُوْرٌ وَ عَلَى السَّرَّاءِ وَ الضَّرَّاءِ مَشْكُوْرٌ

 وَ صَلَّى اللهُ عَلٰى سَيِّدِنَا مُحَمَّدٍ وَ آلِهِ الطَّاهِرِيْنَ

 

 

 

http://duas.org/noor.htm

 

 

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On 5/6/2009 at 9:26 PM, Dirac Delta function said:

Salam

Is it obligatory to pray the 4 rakat prayers as qasr if you are ill? I have a flu.

Sayyid Sistani is my marja'.

You could look on the website of the Sayyed, for the book: Jurisprudence made easy. There you can find different subjects like Salaat, and fasting (sawm. These are not fully explained or covered but if you understand it and how the answer is concluded in various situations will help you a lot. Furthermore, it can help you with answers for some of the important questions on Salaat for example.

Edited by Mohammed-Mehdi

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