Thinking about Telepathy

[.InshAllah.]

[This sort of stuff is usually struck off as ''pseudo science'' but Ive been looking into it and Im convinced the evidence is strong. I bought a famous intro to psychology the other day (Gross), and to my surprise it has a chapter on parapsychology but it doesnt completely slag it off. It quotes scientists who are (according to it) serious and rigorous about scientific methodology, and they say the evidence is in its favor. So dont be put off by the materialist barking and look into it yourself before rejecting it]

Thinking about Telepathy

Dr Radin's blog - http://deanradin.blogspot.com

Interview with Radin - http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4482243720228695882

I love the idea of wishing things better. Maybe thats partially how dua works. What he said about a bit of ''mind stuff'' in every bit of matter reminded me of the Quranic verses that say everything in creation is in constant praise of Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى).

[Marbles]

I have had my chunk of it. And after months of fascination I finally found out that it is nothing but bonkers. Chicanery and trickery, charlatanry and sophistry but nothing else.

[TheHealer]

(bismillah)

(salam)

Telepathy as a concept is attractive, no doubt. But i guess the so called reading whats on others mind, well possible sometimes, but more so due to prior knowledge of that person , and the facial expressions etc....ummmm sometimes comes off. But to consider Telepathy , so as to say as a branch of science, well i do have my reservations. I know a person who read this novel, concept of telepathy and paranorma et all were mentioned in it, and he actually then started gazing on a lighted candle for minutes on end , apparently by doing so one could gain this power etc, according to the novel. But common.........

Interesting is the thing though , that i remember reading this Hadith that when Imam -e-Zamman(AS) comes, Allah will bestow him with the ability to read other peoples mind and then judge their sincerity.........

But for us to study Telepathy in detail as a science, honestly i do have my reservations to put it polietly.....

Wasallam

[MajiC]

In one book I've read about Imam al-Zaman [AJ] it's mentioned that in his era humans will possess the ability to communicate without instuments over long distances. Now this to me is a description of what we today call telepathy. We should not be surprised that the field of parapsychology is scoffed at today. All new ideas, sciences and fields of knowledge were at their inception oppossed and mocked because they were foreign and challenged the status quo of human knowledge and understanding. However, they were gradually given more widespread consideration and hence validation and acceptance . It's not far fetched at all nor counter-intuitive that humans possess a kind of spiritual ability or that of mind over matter as alluded to in fields such as parapsychology, or at least definately so in Islamic mysticism/gnosis.

Edited April 29, 2009 by MajiC

[zainab_]

In one book I've read about Imam al-Zaman [AJ] it's mentioned that in his era humans will possess the ability to communicate without instuments over long distances. Now this to me is a description of what we today call telepathy. We should not be surprised that the field of parapsychology is scoffed at today. All new ideas, sciences and fields of knowledge were at their inception oppossed and mocked because they were foreign and challenged the status quo of human knowledge and understanding. However, they were gradually given more widespread consideration and hence validation and acceptance . It's not far fetched at all nor counter-intuitive that humans possess a kind of spiritual ability or that of mind over matter as alluded to in fields such as parapsychology, or at least definately so in Islamic mysticism/gnosis.

this post is too true..... this is taught in islam and is real not something to scoff at.,... this is absolutely real

and easier than one would think

[Guest JacobM]

this post is too true..... this is taught in islam and is real not something to scoff at.,... this is absolutely real

and easier than one would think

Really? I guess I should shred my biology degree.

Telepathy does not exist. If you guys want me to demonstrate why it's impossible from a physiological standpoint, I will. However, I would recommend taking a bio class at your local community college.

Edited April 30, 2009 by JacobM

[zainab_]

Really? I guess I should shred my biology degree.

Telepathy does not exist. If you guys want me to demonstrate why it's impossible from a physiological standpoint, I will. However, I would recommend taking a bio class at your local community college.

this is something liike a gift from Maula not something you learn in school

there is a hadith that says when a momin is hurt another momin can FEEL the pain.,..... this is not a metephorical statement... when you are connected with another momin (which i believe has to be a real momin) then you can physically feel everything they feel.....

we can connect with one another, there is someone that i can telepathically get their attention so they call me or come online to talk when i need them to.....

this is something that you practice and get better at and the abilities get stronger in time

but it is not a degree not a schooling thing but a gift from Maula

[Guest JacobM]

this is something liike a gift from Maula not something you learn in school

there is a hadith that says when a momin is hurt another momin can FEEL the pain.,..... this is not a metephorical statement... when you are connected with another momin (which i believe has to be a real momin) then you can physically feel everything they feel.....

we can connect with one another, there is someone that i can telepathically get their attention so they call me or come online to talk when i need them to.....

this is something that you practice and get better at and the abilities get stronger in time

but it is not a degree not a schooling thing but a gift from Maula

Right, and what empirical data do you draw your conclusions from? What methodologically studies have your run?

I'm waiting. (I take it you have not applied any sense of rationality to your beliefs.)

Islam is not this new age nonsense that westerners love to embrace. Islam is a religion of science and reason which comes from school. Instead of muslims wasting their time on trying to tap into their "telepathic" abilities, they should be studying the anatomy of the human brain.

[.InshAllah.]

^Did you click on the links??

[Musa]

In one book I've read about Imam al-Zaman [AJ] it's mentioned that in his era humans will possess the ability to communicate without instuments over long distances. Now this to me is a description of what we today call telepathy. We should not be surprised that the field of parapsychology is scoffed at today. All new ideas, sciences and fields of knowledge were at their inception oppossed and mocked because they were foreign and challenged the status quo of human knowledge and understanding. However, they were gradually given more widespread consideration and hence validation and acceptance . It's not far fetched at all nor counter-intuitive that humans possess a kind of spiritual ability or that of mind over matter as alluded to in fields such as parapsychology, or at least definately so in Islamic mysticism/gnosis.

2012 maybe....

[MajiC]

(bismillah)

Really? I guess I should shred my biology degree.

Telepathy does not exist. If you guys want me to demonstrate why it's impossible from a physiological standpoint, I will. However, I would recommend taking a bio class at your local community college.

That is quite a sure and unambiguous claim you have. The blunder is to assert that it's totally impossible while basing this on some narrow criteria. However what’s for sure not impossible, at least, is the idea that looking for telepathy in some bio-chemical interactions in the brain is the erroneous approach. You can’t find something where it’s not to be found no matter how hard you look and as such this does not render the object of your search unavailable within the realm of possibility (which encompasses the immaterial) that extends far wider than the confines of the narrow reductionist criteria you have chosen for your research.

Islam is not this new age nonsense that westerners love to embrace. Islam is a religion of science and reason which comes from school. Instead of muslims wasting their time on trying to tap into their "telepathic" abilities, they should be studying the anatomy of the human brain.

Islam is a religion of science and reason indeed but those are not imprisoned by the narrow empiricist and reductionist criteria which you propose. As far as Islam is concerned, the realm of existence, possibility and hence that which is knowable extends, for us, to infinity. As such no avenue of research is a waste of time and no idea should be ridiculed and abandoned without due reason. This is what separates the true Muslim scientist, who is by definition more embracing, from the materialist. You suggest limiting ourselves to the ‘anatomy of the brain’ but this is a strange mindset if you consider yourself to be a Muslim. This kind of talk resembles that of the materialist who reduces the entirety of existence in all its glory to the interactions of atoms and particles in a test tube and the observable (although many things are fundamentally unobservable). I fail to understand how then you can believe in the possibility of immaterial realities, the principal of those being God.

All in all, my suggestion is that we always keep an open mind vis a-vis existence and the realm of possibility which is said/proven to be exhaustive beyond imagination. How many times have so-called men of science and knowledge scoffed at the seemingly impossible only to later bow down to the truth and elegance of reality? The Imam [AJ] with his appearance is said to bring forth 26 further degrees in human knowledge at a time when man has only attained 3, of which telepathy appears to be described. Muslim scholars as far as I understand are also open to such ideas. The most reasonable position for the honest skeptic then is neutrality, unless there is sufficient reason otherwise, which there clearly is not.

In reality one can’t assert the impossible unless they have traversed every inch of the realm of possibility to find impossibility. This is an important point to bear in mind and one which will hopefully keep our minds wider open.

APBA

[zainab_]

Right, and what empirical data do you draw your conclusions from? What methodologically studies have your run?

I'm waiting. (I take it you have not applied any sense of rationality to your beliefs.)

Islam is not this new age nonsense that westerners love to embrace. Islam is a religion of science and reason which comes from school. Instead of muslims wasting their time on trying to tap into their "telepathic" abilities, they should be studying the anatomy of the human brain.

its real because I can personally do it

if you cant do it yourself then how can you understand one who can,....

all I am saying is dont throw out the possibility because this is true

[Ali Huzaifa]

telepathy works...and i agree with sis zainab when she says its just possible between 2 real momeen...there is an unseen bonds between momeen

[Guest JacobM]

(wasalam)

Okay, I will take the time to respond to your MasjiC because you seem to be a man of reason and not someone who should goto their local shrink.

That is quite a sure and unambiguous claim you have. The blunder is to assert that it's totally impossible while basing this on some narrow criteria. However what�s for sure not impossible, at least, is the idea that looking for telepathy in some bio-chemical interactions in the brain is the erroneous approach. You can�t find something where it�s not to be found no matter how hard you look and as such this does not render the object of your search unavailable within the realm of possibility (which encompasses the immaterial) that extends far wider than the confines of the narrow reductionist criteria you have chosen for your research.

Telepathy is possible, but highly unlikely (It's also possible that an invisible pink unicorn exists as well). We're delving into the fallacy of Russell's teapot. I refute the idea that the burden of proof lies upon the skeptic to disprove unfalsifiable claims of religion. People on this forum are the ones arguing for telepathy so the burden of proof lays on them to show it. Zainab's proof is, "I can do it!" Well, that isn't proof but rather evidence of a delusional state of the brain. Her words are analogous to someone saying, "The Flying Spaghetti Monster exists because I've see him!" Until you show me evidence for these outlandish claims, I'm going to make the rational deduction that you are delusional.

Russel explains it best:

If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes. But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is an intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense. If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time.

Capisce?

Islam is a religion of science and reason indeed but those are not imprisoned by the narrow empiricist and reductionist criteria which you propose. As far as Islam is concerned, the realm of existence, possibility and hence that which is knowable extends, for us, to infinity. As such no avenue of research is a waste of time and no idea should be ridiculed and abandoned without due reason. This is what separates the true Muslim scientist, who is by definition more embracing, from the materialist. You suggest limiting ourselves to the �anatomy of the brain� but this is a strange mindset if you consider yourself to be a Muslim. This kind of talk resembles that of the materialist who reduces the entirety of existence in all its glory to the interactions of atoms and particles in a test tube and the observable (although many things are fundamentally unobservable). I fail to understand how then you can believe in the possibility of immaterial realities, the principal of those being God.

I'm not a dialectical materialist (nor a marxist for that matter). I am theistic existentialist living in the mold of Shia Islam. We can not prove the validity of our faith by reason or science.

Good description on theistic existentialism:

existentialism can be broken into atheistic and theistic forms. Therefore, just as atheistic existentialism dictates that we can never really know the truth, theistic existentialism insists that each person must take the "blind leap of faith" to believe in God. Therefore, although both forms believe that no one can ever really know "transcendent" truth, theistic existentialists choose to cope in such a world by believing that there is a meaning, even if we can't understand it. To a theistic existentialist, as with an atheistic existentialist, we start with ourselves, not with God. Therefore, a theistic existentialist realizes the absurdity of life in the same way an atheistic existentialist does. Although s/he does not immediately perceive that God exists, s/he chooses to believe so based upon the very real need for meaning in a seemingly meaningless world. Thus, the question of whether or not God exists is not solved by reason, but rather by faith.

However, I do believe that muslims should be studying evolution, the anatomy of the human body, instead of wasting their intellect on spiritual endeavors that can not be solved by rationality.

All in all, my suggestion is that we always keep an open mind vis a-vis existence and the realm of possibility which is said/proven to be exhaustive beyond imagination. How many times have so-called men of science and knowledge scoffed at the seemingly impossible only to later bow down to the truth and elegance of reality? The Imam [AJ] with his appearance is said to bring forth 26 further degrees in human knowledge at a time when man has only attained 3, of which telepathy appears to be described. Muslim scholars as far as I understand are also open to such ideas. The most reasonable position for the honest skeptic then is neutrality, unless there is sufficient reason otherwise, which there clearly is not.

In reality one can�t assert the impossible unless they have traversed every inch of the realm of possibility to find impossibility. This is an important point to bear in mind and one which will hopefully keep our minds wider open.

Yes, the the possibility of the flying spaghetti monster should also be left open.

Cheers!

-jM

Edited May 2, 2009 by JacobM

[iraqi_shia]

this is something liike a gift from Maula not something you learn in school

there is a hadith that says when a momin is hurt another momin can FEEL the pain.,..... this is not a metephorical statement... when you are connected with another momin (which i believe has to be a real momin) then you can physically feel everything they feel.....

we can connect with one another, there is someone that i can telepathically get their attention so they call me or come online to talk when i need them to.....

this is something that you practice and get better at and the abilities get stronger in time

but it is not a degree not a schooling thing but a gift from Maula

What makes you think your interpretation of the hadith is correct?

all the scientific evidence is against you, and probably the religious evidence as well.

Just about sums it up.

[.InshAllah.]

It is unfortunate that we have muslims reacting to this like stubborn materialists. Its beyond me how someone can claim that all the scientific evidence is against something they know absolutely nothing about.

I just realized that the first link doesn't work. Here's the proper one: www.scribd.com/doc/2595842/03-Dean-Radin-Thinking-About-Telepathy

Edited May 3, 2009 by .InshAllah.

[.InshAllah.]

Runs through some of the evidence:

[Google tech talks]

[.InshAllah.]

http://www.sheldrake.org/homepage.html

Includes debates and dialogues. Here's something on Dawkins.

[MajiC]

(bismillah)

Telepathy is possible, but highly unlikely (It's also possible that an invisible pink unicorn exists as well). We're delving into the fallacy of Russell's teapot.

The subject of telepathy and that of the pink unicorn are different issues and as such the comparison is entirely rejected. There is at least some ‘reason’ to posit telepathy beyond the mere assertion whereas the pink unicorn is an arbitrary mental abstraction not spurred by potential fact.

I refute the idea that the burden of proof lies upon the skeptic to disprove unfalsifiable claims of religion. People on this forum are the ones arguing for telepathy so the burden of proof lays on them to show it.

Firstly, it’s not a claim of religion but more so that of scientific research – regardless of whether there is yet any decisive evidence for it. There is no official religious position on this as far as I know – it’s not Aqeeda. However, I mentioned my reading of the concept in some text(s). Secondly, I didn’t ask you to prove anything.

Zainab's proof is, "I can do it!" Well, that isn't proof but rather evidence of a delusional state of the brain.

…Until you show me evidence for these outlandish claims, I'm going to make the rational deduction that you are delusional.

I can't comment on Zainab's claim. However, it's worth mentioning that telepathy might sometimes be confused with empathy and this is probably what the mentioned hadith refers to.

Incidentally, the Prophet [pbuh] was also regarded as delusional for having claimed what he did – that he received Revelation through the Archangel. Did that render his assertions irrational and delusional by very logical necessity only because others didn’t witness the same? Can you prove to me your real emotional state or your feelings? Can you make me feel a pain which you are experiencing to prove it to me? No. But does this render my assertions delusional by very logical necessity, as you seem to suggest? Of course not.

Her words are analogous to someone saying, "The Flying Spaghetti Monster exists because I've see him!"

Read the previous comment. Besides, it may not be outside the realm of possibility to witness a ‘flying spaghetti monster’.

It’s interesting that you are quite obsessed with this flying spaghetti character. You adopt this mentality/way of thinking while simultaneously regarding yourself a Muslim thinker. Do you happen to do taqleed (emulation) of Richrad Dawkins by any chance? :P

Russel explains it best:

If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes. But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is an intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense.

Again this comparison is not suitable. The case of the revolving teapot situated between Earth and Mars, while being an occurrence not outside the realm of possibility, is not supported by anything more than assertion. The case of telepathy on the other hand is not merely an assertion but there is at least evidence – if not proof – to support it over and above the mere assertion.

If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time.

With regard to religion, the teapot theory is again quite childish although I assume it was moreso directed at Christianity. Agian, the case of Islam is not identical to the case of the flying space teapot and hence the analogy is invalid. Islam is not based on mere assertion but rather is substantiated philosophically, rationally as well as historically.

I never really valued Russell as a philosopher. I thought his space teapot theory was always quite childish, inadequate and not befitting an apparently professional philosopher.

I'm not a dialectical materialist (nor a marxist for that matter). I am theistic existentialist living in the mold of Shia Islam. We can not prove the validity of our faith by reason or science.

We can prove the validity of our faith by reason, and science can offer evidence if not proof. The scholars inform us that it’s incumbent on every Shi’i Muslim to attain certitude of the 5 fundamentals of doctrine independently and by reason. The 5 fundamentals are akin to the laws of physics that direct inanimate entities in its evolution/ascension and order, with the difference that the former pertain to spiritual-rational entities and their evolutionary ascension towards perfection and order. Hence they are discoverable with the aid of reason.

Good description on theistic existentialism:

Well this is not the theism I have in mind nor do I believe it is befitting a Muslim; an insecure and intellectually and intuitively hopeless blind belief in God - or to live a lie, essentially. I prefer and would recommend for your pursuit the worldview of existential philosophy as explicated by Mulla Sadra in his Transcendent Philosophy. It is vastly more comprehensive, intuitive, certain, empowering and doubt-free.

However, I do believe that muslims should be studying evolution, the anatomy of the human body, instead of wasting their intellect on spiritual endeavors that can not be solved by rationality.

I believe Muslims should investigate evolution and human anatomy as well as less conventional subjects. The difference here is that I do not believe that reality in all its glory is reducible to the interactions of particles on the sub-atomic realm. Based on the above mentioned worldview, existence is exhaustive and the possibilities are hence many. Reality is far, far more comprehensive than we could possibly imagine and hence the corresponding potential for knowledge. As such no avenue of knowledge should be rejected and there is knowledge to be found in both the material and immaterial realms. Based on this thinking Muslims are also much more progressive and open to the possibilities than their caged atheistic counterparts who are fettered by the shackles of materialist philosophy.

APBA

Edited May 5, 2009 by MajiC

[Jubei]

The difference here is that I do not believe that reality in all its glory is reducible to the interactions of particles on the sub-atomic realm.

Why not? Subatomic particles are inherently unpredictable and there is a whole lot of chaos theory in between electrons and dogs.

If you want some type of mystic trickery in the world instead of things that are understandable, then the chaotic aspect should be enough. You can never predict that an electron exciting to a higher orbital caused a ninja to garrote a chicken on the roof of the house of his lord, so the mystery is still there, if not even more, because it is tantalizingly within our grasp but always one step ahead.

Non-materialistic philosophy is just people trying to fudge their way around chaotic systems. Feel free to disagree. There is no black and white when it comes to philosophy.

Edited May 5, 2009 by Jubei

[MajiC]

(bismillah)

Why not? Subatomic particles are inherently unpredictable and there is a whole lot of chaos theory in between electrons and dogs.

If you want some type of mystic trickery in the world instead of things that are understandable, then the chaotic aspect should be enough. You can never predict that an electron exciting to a higher orbital caused a ninja to garrote a chicken on the roof of the house of his lord, so the mystery is still there, if not even more, because it is tantalizingly within our grasp but always one step ahead.

This is still within the narrow framework and confine of materialistic thought, regardless of the ‘mystery’ that is attributed to the chaos phenomenon which is still within the material domain. When I say I believe in God, who is immaterial, the particular philosophy to which I subscribe also implies an ontological chain stretching from the prima materia, the realm you described, to the Absolute. Furthermore, while this knowledge crosses the barriers of the immaterial it is still rationally intelligible. There’s no implication or need for ‘mystery’ as you suggest.

Non-materialistic philosophy is just people trying to fudge their way around chaotic systems. Feel free to disagree. There is no black and white when it comes to philosophy.

The issues of non-materialistic philosophy in mind transcend chaotic systems which are a property of material systems.

Non-materialistic philosophy employs the same fundamental tool as does materialistic and is hence equally valid, even if more comprehensive and penetrative. That tool being the faculty of reason. Empirical and scientific observation in the physical world would itself reduce to nothing without the subsequent employment of mental analysis, synthesis and rational thought to provide the conceptual conclusions of what are otherwise mere mechanical observations.

People shy away from the non-material as they place more faith and confidence in the faculty of physical sight than the power of reason. Needless to say, the former is the sole hope and implement of the wild beast, whereas the latter is what distinguishes humankind from the animal kingdom. We ought to prioritise wisely.

APBA

Edited May 6, 2009 by MajiC

[Jubei]

People shy away from the non-material as they place more faith and confidence in the faculty of physical sight than the power of reason. Needless to say, the former is the sole hope and implement of the wild beast, whereas the latter is what distinguishes humankind from the animal kingdom. We ought to prioritise wisely.

Very good, but you have too much faith in reason.

Relying on pure human reasoning has proved itself to be flawed at describing the physical world, why should it fare better when discussing anything else.

I think the mind is incapable of assimilating and calculating upon the vast quantities of data required to analyze the situation, and the tendency to simplify, overlook and invent information to yield intuitive answers is where reason alone fails.

Non-materialistic philosophy employs the same fundamental tool as does materialistic and is hence equally valid, even if more comprehensive and penetrative. That tool being the faculty of reason. Empirical and scientific observation in the physical world would itself reduce to nothing without the subsequent employment of mental analysis, synthesis and rational thought to provide the conceptual conclusions of what are otherwise mere mechanical observations.

I agree that non-materialistic philosophy is more comprehensive, intuitive and 'make more sense', for the want of a better phrase. But I think this is partly due to the lack of ability to fully explain the world due to the complexity and the inability of the mind to comprehend the result.

I think that the reason that non-material philosophy is appealing is that it is so very intuitive and easy to grasp. I don't think that it is a good enough reason however it to automatically supersede pure materialistic philosophy. In fact experience would dictate that the oversimplification of natural phenomenon that the mind tends to do would be detrimental to the outcome of non-material thought.

In a simple sentence, I am afraid that I just don't trust reason as much as most people do. And I have no reason to.

[zainab_]

However, it's worth mentioning that telepathy might sometimes be confused with empathy and this is probably what the mentioned hadith refers to.

empathy is one thing, and no doubt we can also seriously empathise with people, things such as what men do when their wives are pregnant ect I also think the hadith does refer to this kind of empathy as well

however, someone i am very close to who happens to be momin was in another country, i had gone to sleep and woke up an hour later (or so) after having a dream that they had been hurt, that someone had grabbed them hard and hurt them in the throat, my throat also hurt me badly when i woke up, i didnt know if it was a dream or real so i wrote to them and asked as soon as i woke up, later, when they got my mail they said yes, at the exact time i had had the dream they had been wrestling with their cousin and had gotten hurt (though according to them not badly) but that their cousin had grabbed their throat too hard and hurt them....for two days i had a sore throat and so did they from the incident

I asked a shiekh on the matter and he quoted me that hadith, and said yes, the bond between us is very close so this would not be abnormal or impossible....

and things like this happen to me a lot

so I see that hadith as being able to be both an empathetic as well as a literal way it can be interpreted

[Guest Zahrah]

^yours is an empathy I guess

I guess those who want to know about telepathy are the ones tha twant to know others better. but there is this diference between understanding and knwing. many people may know us well but they may not be able to understand us well. telepathy, reading minds and that stuff is dangerous since one gets into some other's minds...this is a hidden place preserved by God....we have it in tradition that Muslims should not do such practices cuz they must be like God and Sattaral'oyub.

I'd rather others empathy with me instead of telepathining with me.

Edited May 18, 2009 by Zahrah

[Maula Dha Mallang]

Telepathy is real. sis zainab is totally right. i personally know of someone who can do it, not to mention who can see things from far away and near, and what is about to happen. none of this "you are about to meet a dark stranger...." nonsense. im talking solid facts, images, conversations etc. not once or twice either, i known this person for over 10 years now.

there is knowledge linked to ilm e jafar which, if known and recited, can gain you this knowledge. dont knock things you cannot understand.

and sis zaynab can do some freaky things lol, im witness to that myself

[interesting_guy]

telepathy is not secret i have it with my family i can read the minds of 90% of the thing sthey think i know its sounds creepy but i guess some ppl r gifted with it

[MajiC]

(salam)

This sort of stuff is usually struck off as ''pseudo science'' but Ive been looking into it and Im convinced the evidence is strong. I bought a famous intro to psychology the other day (Gross), and to my surprise it has a chapter on parapsychology but it doesnt completely slag it off. It quotes scientists who are (according to it) serious and rigorous about scientific methodology, and they say the evidence is in its favor.

I was recently discussing the subject of the sub-conscious mind with my Islamic Philosophy professor and I mentioned how this had been used by historical geniuses such as Einstein, Tesla, Da Vinci et al in problem solving; aided their famous hypotheses. Then I raised the subject of parapsychology and the related phenomena such as telepathy, out of body experiences (OBE's), remote viewing and astral projection and asked him whether there is basis for this in Islam, especially in the light of the capabilities of the human soul within Islamic mysticism. He confirmed that such phenomena was completely possible and that there exist many accounts of its use by Muslim mystics. He cited that the Prophets and Imams [pbut] possessed these capabilities (in accordance to a Hadith Qudsi) and that many mystics throughout history have exerienced such phenomena. In particular, he cited the many accounts that exist of Allama Tabataba'i [qs] having had the particular ability to 'leave his body and travel'. This idea would be similar to that known as Astral Projection in the west.

He mentioned that these capabilities develop in proportion to one's detachment from the confines of the self, which has its clear parallels in the secular or non-Muslim understanding of this practise. He emphasised in particular that the further the human soul walks away from the ego (or "I-ness") and the false belief in independent existence, the further it enters the realm of Absolute Reality. That is, by virtue of our submission and dependence on Absolute Existence/God we acquire independence of the material realm (e.g. as per Hadith Quddsi). That if it were not for the veils of the material realm the human soul would see, do and understand everything that is possible for it within the capacity of its essence.

However, the professor seemed to caution against pursuing these practises in the secular context and viewed them as 'negative spirituality' used by some to gain fame, fortune and influence, and indeed we can see this exploitation for ourselves on the internet. He called this type of spirituality 'magic', as referred to in the Qur'an. On the other hand, when executed by the Islamic mystic ('Arif) it is known as 'karamaat' (miracle) which are not practised for puropses of the ego, "I-ness" and worldy pursuits such as fame and fortune.

Edited July 2, 2009 by MajiC

[Aboo Fatimah]

What this.

[.InshAllah.]

Some recent research: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19608110

Intuition Through Time: What Does the Seer See?

Dean Radin, PhD1, Ana Borges, JD, MS2.

Objective

A great deal of human activity is involved in anticipating the future, from predicting the next influenza strain to the expectations that underlie the placebo effect. Most models of anticipation take for granted that events unfold in a unidirectional flow of time, from past to future. Two experiments were conducted to test this assumption.

Design

Pupillary dilation, spontaneous blinking, and eye movements were tracked before, during, and after participants viewed photographs with varying degrees of emotional affect. Photos were selected uniformly at random with replacement. Experiment one used 592 photos from the International Affective Picture System; experiment two used a custom-designed pool of 500 photos. Eye data before exposure to the photos were compared by using nonparametric techniques.

Outcome Measures

Eye data were predicted to show larger anticipatory responses before randomly selected emotional photos than before calm photos, under conditions that excluded sensory cues, statistical cues, and other conventional means of inferring the future.

Results

Data contributed by 74 unselected volunteers in two experiments showed that: (a) pupillary dilation and spontaneous blinking were found to increase more before emotional versus calm photos (combined P = .00009), (B.) horizontal eye movements indicated a brain hemisphere asymmetry before viewing photos, appropriate to both the emotionality (P = .05) and the valence of the future images (P = .01), © participants selected for independently obtaining significant differential effects in pupillary dilation showed positive correlations between their eye movements before versus during exposure to randomly selected photos (P = .002), and (d) a possible “transtemporal interference” effect was observed when the probability of observing future images was varied (P = .05 [two-tailed]). Gender splits on these tests showed that overall females tended to perform better than males.

Conclusions

These studies, which replicate conceptual similar experiments, suggest that sometimes seers do see the future. This implies that developing comprehensive models of anticipatory behavior, from understanding the nature of intuition to the placebo effect, may require consideration of transtemporal and teleological factors.

1 Institute of Noetic Sciences, Petaluma, CA

2 Department of Psychology, University of Northampton, England

Edited August 17, 2009 by .InshAllah.

[.InshAllah.]

Sensing the sending of SMS messages: an automated test

Explore: The Journal of Science and Healing (2009) 5, 272-276

by Rupert Sheldrake, Perrott-Warrick Project with Leonidas Avraamides, and Matous Novák Mobifi Ltd, London

ABSTRACT

Objective: To carry out automated experiments to test for telepathy in connection with text messages.

Method: Subjects, aged from 11 to 72, registered online with the names and mobile telephone numbers of 3 senders. A computer selected a sender at random, and asked him to send an SMS message to the subject via the computer. The computer then asked the subject to guess the sender’s name, and delivered the message after receiving the guess. A test consisted of 9 trials.

Interactions evaluated: The effects of subjects’ sex and age and the effects of delay on guesses.

Main outcome measure: The proportion of correct guesses of the sender’s name, compared with the 33.3% mean chance expectation.

Results: In 886 trials there were 336 hits (37.9%), significantly above the 33.3% chance level (p = .001). The hit rate in incomplete tests was 38.4% (p = .03) showing that optional stopping could not explain the positive results. Most tests were unsupervised, which left open the possibility of cheating, but high-scoring subjects were retested under filmed conditions, where no cheating was detected, with 19 hits in 43 trials (44.2%; p = 0.09).

[.InshAllah.]

A very interesting documentary recently aired on BBC 2 called Heartbreak Science. Those in the UK can watch it via the link below. This is a synopsis:

A fascinating popular science documentary that investigates some of the world's most intriguing heart mysteries and follows the scientists on the frontline of heart science.

Incredible stories from around the world appear to suggest that the heart is a far more complex and mysterious an organ than was ever thought.

Is it really possible to die from a broken heart and do the experiences of transplant patients prove that the heart is capable of storing memories?

With heart disease the number one killer in the world today, we're about to look at the body's most important muscle in a revolutionary way. From incredible new connections between the heart and the mind to an intriguing system of neurons dubbed 'the little heart in the brain', this is the secret life of the human heart.

Turning the tables on accepted medical opinion, this documentary explores whether people can die of a broken heart, whether our minds can cause heart disease and whether the heart could share some of the brain's crucial functions.

It seems the poets were right after all - our minds and bodies are in fact closely linked and the phrase 'broken-hearted' contains a literal truth as well as a metaphorical one.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00pd2wg/Heartbreak_Science/

The most interesting part of the docu was when they explored the idea that the heart had its own 'mind' with a memory and ability to apprehend the world independent of the brain. The paradigm in modern day neuroscience and psychology is that humans are nothing more than their brains. I think evidence from parapsychology has already broken that, and this adds to it.

[Haji 2003]

I asked consensus.app (which deals with scientific research) about telepathy

[Lion of Shia]

is telepathy,esp, considered kufr according to islam?