Who are the Knights Templar?

[Qaher 0]

(bismillah)

(salam)

I found this posted on the Profile page of one of Shia Chat's member:

The Knights Templar were the first Western Shia Twelvers and their legacy stands at Rosslyn till today. They are a model to be emulated.

So who are they and how are they related to Shias?

(wasalam)

Edited November 22, 2008 by Qaher

[Paul Elliot 1]

Knights templars were early christians whose sole purpose was to re-establish the kingdom of Christ on earth forever and ever so they had an agenda of rebuilding the temple.

[knightstemplar 3]

W/Salaam

Yes the Knights Templar are Shia Twelvers. 99.9% of the Western Scholars deem them as Christian Crusaders but that is wholly untrue.

1 - The Knights Templar were tried as heretics thru a Vatican sponsored Inquisition and convicted. The heresies they were charged of were Islamic in nature.

2 - The Knights Templar were Guardians of the Holy Grail. The Holy Grail comes from the word Sang Real. Sang Real means Holy Bloodline. Although the Da Vinci Code believes that this Holy Bloodline was the extension of Nabi Isa's bloodline thru an alleged marriage between him and Mary Magdalene which produced a daughter called Sarah. And thru Sarah was Nabi Isa descendants spawned called teh Priory of Sion. But that Islamically is untrue cos you can only have dscendants thru sons and not daughters. Furthermore, Imam Ali's sermon rules out this alleged marriage when it states:

Sermon 159 - He had no wife to allure him, nor any son to give grief, nor wealth to deviate (his attention), nor greed to disgrace him.

Thus the Da Vinci Code is a hoax but that does not mean that the Knights Templar were the guardian of the Holy Grail (Holy Bloodline) is also a hoax. It is potentially true.

3 - The Only Islamic sect that glorifies a Holy bloodline is the shia sect. Some are twelvers and some are seveners. Others like Aga Khan Ismailis and Bohras go beyond those numbers where their imamate extends to current leaders.

But the Shia Twelvers glorify the Bloodline of 14 Masoomeen which includes the Prophet, his daughter Fatima and the 12 Imams. This makes a total of 14 and they are signified as Pillars of the Shia Faith.

The Knights Templar symbolised this Holy Bloodline of 14 Pillars at Rosslyn Chapel whose notable feature are 14 pillars of which 2 are unique (Muhammad and Fatima) and 12 are similar (12 Imams)

4 - The Knights Templar also revered the sacred feminine as part of the Holy Grail/Holy Bloodline doctrine.

In 1158, a small town in Portugal was named as Fatima. Although the naming of this town is based on legend, its interesting to note that by 1130, the Templars were not only well entrenched in Portugal but in 1160, established a base in Tomar which is a 30 minute ride from Fatima.

Its thus very plausible that its the Knights Templar who named the town as Fatima since no Crusader would name any town with Islamic/Shia value.

It is therefore with little wonder when i read statements like:

1 - The roots of Templarism itself, and thus of Freemasonry, are actually deeply linked not so much to Christianity, but rather to Islam and particularly to Muhammadism.

2 - The De Payen family's Islamic background (founder of Knights Templar) was Shi'ite and drawn from Sufism, a mystic belief in which Muslims seek to find divine love and knowledge through direct personal experience of God, the very thing the Roman Catholic Church had declared a no go area.

3 - The Templar order's "Muslim" Philosophy which sprang from a Sufi trend of Islamism, was then Shi'ite in concept.

Ref:

1 - The Knights Templar of the Middle East - HRH Prince Michael of Albany and Walid Amine Sahab (Book Link)

Pg XI

2 - Ibid pg 68

3 - Ibid pg 75

Although the authors of this book are attempting to paint the Templars as Sufis/Ismailis, but the reality from the symbolism of the Templars is that they were Twelver Athna Asheri Shia. There is no doubt about that.

Salaams

[Qaher 0]

Very Interesting.

Sorry for the question but do mainstream Shias agree with you on that?

Perhaps my question should not be adressed to you but to Shia Twelvers.

P.S. Thanks Paul Eliot for your answer.

[knightstemplar 3]

Very Interesting.

Sorry for the question but do mainstream Shias agree with you on that?

Perhaps my question should not be adressed to you but to Shia Twelvers.

To the best of my knowledge, mainstream shias are unaware of this phenomenon. So they are technically not in a position to disagree unless they are aware of the facts that i have provided and are in a position to rebut with some verve. That likelihood is virtually nil.

Edited November 22, 2008 by knightstemplar

[Qaher 0]

Sorry for troubling you again but I am always enthusiastic to find about new things. So the "Shia" knight Templars are not a sect that has its followers like other sects do. Your research led you to believe, that they existed in the past and you are receptive/ found of this idea as a personal way of life, right?

[zainab_ 2]

Knightstemplar,

I have knowledge that the holy bloodline that they wee protecting was in actuality the bloodline of the Prophet Isa (as)

The story is, that the Prophet Isa (as) did marry and have a daughter, she ended up in france somehow, to protect her life. I only know this because my family is knightstemplar.

Ya Ali Madad

[knightstemplar 3]

Sorry for troubling you again but I am always enthusiastic to find about new things. So the "Shia" knight Templars are not a sect that has its followers like other sects do. Your research led you to believe, that they existed in the past and you are receptive/ found of this idea as a personal way of life, right?

No trouble at all Bro/Sis

No the Shia Knights Templar are not a sect of their own. They did have followers ofcourse. The legend of King Arthur, His Queen (The sacred feminine) and his round table of 12 nights were spawned around the same time. Not only does this add upto 14 but the common ground is the magic sword called Excalibur and in Islam its called Dhulfiqar if I am not mistaken.

So you can tell from this legend of King Arthur that the Knights Templar probably did have their followers albeit a small minority and seclusive at that but a few nuggets of their beliefs were public knowledge albeit in a cryptic nature like the legend of King Arthur. But they were by and large secretive of their religiosity and only trusted their inner circle. This is very much in rhyme with the shia doctrine of Taqiyyah. But that said, Knights Templar did not create a whole new shia sect. They were Athna Asheri like us but very much in a European mould.

It is also said that the Knights Templar created a sect called Freemasonry but thats completely untrue since Freemasonry's symbolism and theological values do not match the Templars.

As for my personal way of life, I found it rather intriguing that in the 12 century a bunch of white dudes wanted to be shia and were ready to die for their faith and they did die for their faith. The question is how did they know Shi'ism was the right way and why is their message spread thru cryptic symbolism?

That taught me that the Templars were a very very very clever bunch of people wholly submerged in the middle of Christian Muslim acrimony and still survived some 2 centuries without rocking the boat so obviously. Thats why I believe they are a model to be emulated since the Christian Muslim acrimony has resurfaced its ugly head this century. We as Muslims must learn to box clever like the Knights Templar.

A good example is Paul Elliot who said something quite ludicrous about the Templars and did not respond to the facts that I presented. Thats the definition of boxing clever.

Knightstemplar,

I have knowledge that the holy bloodline that they wee protecting was in actuality the bloodline of the Prophet Isa (as)

The story is, that the Prophet Isa (as) did marry and have a daughter, she ended up in france somehow, to protect her life. I only know this because my family is knightstemplar.

Ya Ali Madad

Imam Ali has denied this marriage ever took place. Furthermore descendants dont come from daughters but from sons. I am interested to know why you believe otherwise.

[Paul Elliot 1]

Never mind this imposter knights templar. His facts are as ludicrous as the claim that knight templars are muslims. As a matter of fact, if you tell a muslim that knight templars or freemasons were muslims, he might even try to kill you because of the offense it may have caused his soul.

[zainab_ 2]

look at Fatima, (as) did not the bloodline run through her for the first time? or the second?

I was told by my great grandmother that through my blood we can disprove the stance of the catholic church, and all they stood on, and lied to the people about, which is why they tried to kill us all. but that this proof lies within my blood.

Edited November 22, 2008 by zainab_

[knightstemplar 3]

look at Fatima, (as) did not the bloodline run through her for the first time? or the second?

I was told by my great grandmother that through my blood we can disprove the stance of the catholic church, and all they stood on, and lied to the people about, which is why they tried to kill us all. but that this proof lies within my blood.

No, the bloodline is not of Fatima but of Abdul Mutallib who is a common grandfather to both Muhammad and Ali. Thus the Y chromosome of Imam Hassan and Imam Hussein is the Y Chromosome of Abdul Mutallib. It was therefore imperative that Bibi Fatima gets married within the Bani Hashem household.

Never mind this imposter knights templar. His facts are as ludicrous as the claim that knight templars are muslims. As a matter of fact, if you tell a muslim that knight templars or freemasons were muslims, he might even try to kill you because of the offense it may have caused his soul.

Oh how empirical of you. I believe you have been told categorically that you are not very witty at all. If you want to earn (not demand) respect, learn to deliver facts. Never mind who chooses to kill me or not.

[zainab_ 2]

anyway, thought you might want to know the story as you are so fascinated with it. This is what I was told.

Edited November 22, 2008 by zainab_

[knightstemplar 3]

anyway, thought you might want to know the story as you are so fascinated with it. This is what I was told.

I know you mean well Sis. I neither wish to be disrespectful to your family story. Its just that ancestry is primarily determined by the Y Chromosome. If you look at the Quran in 33.5 where it states:

And call them by the name of their fathers.

This is a statement involving genealogies and biology of the Y Chromosome. If you google "Y chromosome and ancestry", you will be availed a plethora of results which will tell you what I am telling you.

Your grandmother is also right in the sense that Templars were opposed to Catholic Church but not thru the line of Nabi Isa. Its also very clear to me that the Portuguese town of Fatima was named by the Templars as proof that that opposition to the Catholic Church wasnt from the Line of Nabi Isa.

[Paul Elliot 1]

Oh how empirical of you. I believe you have been told categorically that you are not very witty at all. If you want to earn (not demand) respect, learn to deliver facts. Never mind who chooses to kill me or not.

I don't want respect from impostors.

For those interested in knowing genuine orthodox stories of the knights templars and their history,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knights_Templar

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Knights_Templar

http://www.templarhistory.com/

The Poor Fellow-Soldiers of Christ and of the Temple of Solomon (Latin: Pauperes commilitones Christi Templique Solomonici), commonly known as the Knights Templar or the Order of the Temple (French: Ordre du Temple or Templiers), were among the most famous of the Western Christian military orders.[3] The organization existed for approximately two centuries in the Middle Ages, founded in the aftermath of the First Crusade of 1096, with its original purpose to ensure the safety of the many Christians who made the pilgrimage to Jerusalem after its conquest.

Officially endorsed by the Roman Catholic Church around 1129, the Order became a favored charity throughout Christendom, and grew rapidly in membership and power. Templar knights, in their distinctive white mantles with red cross, were among the most skilled fighting units of the Crusades.[4] Non-combatant members of the Order managed a large economic infrastructure throughout Christendom, innovating financial techniques that were an early form of banking,[5][6] and building many fortifications across Europe and the Holy Land.

The Templars' success was tied closely to the Crusades; when the Holy Land was lost, support for the Order faded. Rumors about the Templars' secret initiation ceremony created mistrust, and King Philip IV of France, deeply in debt to the Order, took advantage of the situation. In 1307, many of the Order's members in France were arrested, tortured into giving false confessions, and then burned at the stake.[7] Under pressure from King Philip, Pope Clement V disbanded the Order in 1312. The abrupt disappearance of a major part of the European infrastructure gave rise to speculation and legends, which have kept the "Templar" name alive into the modern day.

This group - often said to be nine in number - had the mandate of protecting Christian pilgrims who were en route to the Holy Land to visit the shrines sacred to their faith.

[knightstemplar 3]

I don't want respect from impostors.

time will tell. Now to show what kind of an amateur you truly are, the Solomonic Temple that you speak of is replicated at Rosslyn.

http://www.fiu.edu/~mizrachs/poseur3.html

Rosslyn Chapel: As with many other aspects of this mystery, the importance of Rosslyn Chapel is unclear and seems to have been obfuscated, unfortunately. Its owners, the Sinclairs, claim to be the hereditary patrons of Scottish Freemasonry, to have explored the New World (particularly Nova Scotia and Oak Island) a century before Colombus, and to be connected to the Templars through marriage and descent. Some of this appears to be in doubt, because it's based on the work of Jacobite historian Father Hay, who used documents that were lost in a fire... in any case, we do know William Sinclair did build Rosslyn in the 1400s, it does contain very unusual carvings (particularly people who look like Templars engaging in things that seem like Masonic rituals), and it does incorporate unusual geometry. (SOME say that this geometry replicates the Temple of Solomon.) Pierre Plantard seems to have changed his name to "de St-Clair" in order to claim affiliation with the Sinclairs of Scotland.

Infact Rosslyn isnt very Christian at all in its design and aesthetics. You can download this PDF file.

http://ca.geocities.com/fidelity231@rogers...ell/Rosslyn.pdf

[Paul Elliot 1]

Knights templars aka freemasons don't want a worthless good for nothing replica of the real temple, they want the TEMPLE to be rebuilt, at the location of the moslem mosque known as Aqsa Quds.

[knightstemplar 3]

Knights templars aka freemasons don't want a worthless good for nothing replica of the real temple, they want the TEMPLE to be rebuilt, at the location of the moslem mosque known as Aqsa Quds.

If they wanted to rebuild the Temple at Al Aqsa they could have done it a long time ago. On the contrary if you do your research on a Templar site in Portugal called the Convent of Christ at Tomar, you will find that the Covent is modeled on Al Aqsa/Dome of the Rock. Now why would they want to model the Convent on an Islamic design huh?

Go on little boy, google away.

[zuhair_naqvi 4]

W/Salaam

Yes the Knights Templar are Shia Twelvers. 99.9% of the Western Scholars deem them as Christian Crusaders but that is wholly untrue.

1 - The Knights Templar were tried as heretics thru a Vatican sponsored Inquisition and convicted. The heresies they were charged of were Islamic in nature.

2 - The Knights Templar were Guardians of the Holy Grail. The Holy Grail comes from the word Sang Real. Sang Real means Holy Bloodline. Although the Da Vinci Code believes that this Holy Bloodline was the extension of Nabi Isa's bloodline thru an alleged marriage between him and Mary Magdalene which produced a daughter called Sarah. And thru Sarah was Nabi Isa descendants spawned called teh Priory of Sion. But that Islamically is untrue cos you can only have dscendants thru sons and not daughters. Furthermore, Imam Ali's sermon rules out this alleged marriage when it states:

Sermon 159 - He had no wife to allure him, nor any son to give grief, nor wealth to deviate (his attention), nor greed to disgrace him.

Thus the Da Vinci Code is a hoax but that does not mean that the Knights Templar were the guardian of the Holy Grail (Holy Bloodline) is also a hoax. It is potentially true.

3 - The Only Islamic sect that glorifies a Holy bloodline is the shia sect. Some are twelvers and some are seveners. Others like Aga Khan Ismailis and Bohras go beyond those numbers where their imamate extends to current leaders.

But the Shia Twelvers glorify the Bloodline of 14 Masoomeen which includes the Prophet, his daughter Fatima and the 12 Imams. This makes a total of 14 and they are signified as Pillars of the Shia Faith.

The Knights Templar symbolised this Holy Bloodline of 14 Pillars at Rosslyn Chapel whose notable feature are 14 pillars of which 2 are unique (Muhammad and Fatima) and 12 are similar (12 Imams)

4 - The Knights Templar also revered the sacred feminine as part of the Holy Grail/Holy Bloodline doctrine.

In 1158, a small town in Portugal was named as Fatima. Although the naming of this town is based on legend, its interesting to note that by 1130, the Templars were not only well entrenched in Portugal but in 1160, established a base in Tomar which is a 30 minute ride from Fatima.

Its thus very plausible that its the Knights Templar who named the town as Fatima since no Crusader would name any town with Islamic/Shia value.

It is therefore with little wonder when i read statements like:

1 - The roots of Templarism itself, and thus of Freemasonry, are actually deeply linked not so much to Christianity, but rather to Islam and particularly to Muhammadism.

2 - The De Payen family's Islamic background (founder of Knights Templar) was Shi'ite and drawn from Sufism, a mystic belief in which Muslims seek to find divine love and knowledge through direct personal experience of God, the very thing the Roman Catholic Church had declared a no go area.

3 - The Templar order's "Muslim" Philosophy which sprang from a Sufi trend of Islamism, was then Shi'ite in concept.

Ref:

1 - The Knights Templar of the Middle East - HRH Prince Michael of Albany and Walid Amine Sahab (Book Link)

Pg XI

2 - Ibid pg 68

3 - Ibid pg 75

Although the authors of this book are attempting to paint the Templars as Sufis/Ismailis, but the reality from the symbolism of the Templars is that they were Twelver Athna Asheri Shia. There is no doubt about that.

Salaams

Wow, this is amazing. Does this group still exist? if yes then where, I never thought shia secret societies existed.

[Paul Elliot 1]

If they wanted to rebuild the Temple at Al Aqsa they could have done it a long time ago. On the contrary if you do your research on a Templar site in Portugal called the Convent of Christ at Tomar, you will find that the Covent is modeled on Al Aqsa/Dome of the Rock. Now why would they want to model the Convent on an Islamic design huh?

Go on little boy, google away.

They cannot build the temple there because of muslims and their "right" to have a mosque built there. Freemasons want the temple to be built at that site and that is the sole purpose of their existence till Christ returns and rules us from the temple. Moslems also build replicas of Mecca and Medina as memorabilias, collectors' items, and other emotional attachments.

God willing eventually this will happen, and all your childish insecurities of being born a muslim may go away :)

[knightstemplar 3]

Wow, this is amazing. Does this group still exist? if yes then where, I never thought shia secret societies existed.

Not that know of Bro. I just stumbled onto some early facts so then I became a Knights Templar aficionado, so to speak and went on a large research. I have a dozen books on these guys and have reserved another dozen on Amazon wish list. They are such an enigma mashallah.

Incidentally i forgot to mention to the OP that another parallel of Shi'ism and legend of King Arthur is the messianic nature of the King Arthur Legend. You can read more about it here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_Arthur%2...essianic_return

[knightstemplar 3]

They cannot build the temple there because of muslims and their "right" to have a mosque built there.

Past tense dude, past tense. Jerusalem was taken over by the Crusaders in 1099. By the time the Second Crusades began was 1147 and by the time Salauddin re-took Jerusalem was 1187. Granted that the commencement of the Second Crusade may have caused an impediment to rebuild the Temple, but atleast there were 50 years between taking the Holy Land and the Second Crusades. So what were the Christians doing at the time assuming that the Templars were Christian (which they were not)

This is why most scholars believe that Templars were not Crusading Christians and spent most of their time i the Holy Land excavating beneath the Al Aqsa. They were looking for treasures etc so the scholar says. But in reality they were looking for clues to their ancestry to Muhammad.

Freemasons want the temple to be built at that site and that is the sole purpose of their existence till Christ returns and rules us from the temple. Moslems also build replicas of Mecca and Medina as memorabilias, collectors' items, and other emotional attachments.God willing eventually this will happen, and all your childish insecurities of being born a muslim may go away :)

I cant wait for this to happen cos only then will the Christians know they screwed with and why it was wrong. And ofcourse, it will be the time when everyone will know that Templars were not Christian nor were they Crusaders and nor were they Freemasons.

[zuhair_naqvi 4]

Not that know of Bro. I just stumbled onto some early facts so then I became a Knights Templar aficionado, so to speak and went on a large research. I have a dozen books on these guys and have reserved another dozen on Amazon wish list. They are such an enigma mashallah.

Incidentally i forgot to mention to the OP that another parallel of Shi'ism and legend of King Arthur is the messianic nature of the King Arthur Legend. You can read more about it here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_Arthur%2...essianic_return

True bro. Inshallah they will re-appear when Imam (ajf) returns with Jesus (as).

[zainab_ 2]

True bro. Inshallah they will re-appear when Imam (ajf) returns with Jesus (as).

Inshallah

[zuhair_naqvi 4]

They cannot build the temple there because of muslims and their "right" to have a mosque built there. Freemasons want the temple to be built at that site and that is the sole purpose of their existence till Christ returns and rules us from the temple. Moslems also build replicas of Mecca and Medina as memorabilias, collectors' items, and other emotional attachments.

God willing eventually this will happen, and all your childish insecurities of being born a muslim may go away :)

We love Jesus (as) more than you do, so much so that we would give our lifes without second thought if he (as) asks us. And you bear love for jews, who slander him (as).

Where did your arrogance lead you other than self-deception?

Edited November 22, 2008 by zuhair_naqvi

[Paul Elliot 1]

Past tense dude, past tense. Jerusalem was taken over by the Crusaders in 1099. By the time the Second Crusades began was 1147 and by the time Salauddin re-took Jerusalem was 1187. Granted that the commencement of the Second Crusade may have caused an impediment to rebuild the Temple, but atleast there were 50 years between taking the Holy Land and the Second Crusades. So what were the Christians doing at the time assuming that the Templars were Christian (which they were not)

If you excavate the site you will find evidences of the foundation of the new temple there and the current moslem mosque is not more than 1000 years old.

This is why most scholars believe that Templars were not Crusading Christians and spent most of their time i the Holy Land excavating beneath the Al Aqsa. They were looking for treasures etc so the scholar says. But in reality they were looking for clues to their ancestry to Muhammad.

Moslem scholars perhaps.

Mohammad didnt live in Jerusalem. Jesus did.

I cant wait for this to happen cos only then will the Christians know they screwed with and why it was wrong. And ofcourse, it will be the time when everyone will know that Templars were not Christian nor were they Crusaders and nor were they Freemasons.

I see that maybe perhaps templars screwed with moslems so much that they bore an off spring resulting in your existence right now. You hold on to them dearly but i am not that worried because we are at least 3 billion in number right now, 9 less won't hurt us as much as it may hurt moslems, or better still, shia moslems.

[knightstemplar 3]

Moslem scholars perhaps.

lol - truly you are an amateur. I can tell when someone is scared and says things like "perhaps". Go and be sure yourself first before you speak.

I see that maybe perhaps templars screwed with moslems so much that they bore an off spring resulting in your existence right now. You hold on to them dearly but i am not that worried because we are at least 3 billion in number right now, 9 less won't hurt us as much as it may hurt moslems, or better still, shia moslems.

maybe.

[knightstemplar 3]

True bro. Inshallah they will re-appear when Imam (ajf) returns with Jesus (as).

Inshallah. But be not in doubt, they are indeed shia and mashallah quite amazing people.

Inshallah

Ameen from me too...lol

[mohalamine 19]

Inshallah. But be not in doubt, they are indeed shia and mashallah quite amazing people.

Ameen from me too...lol

Salaam Bro KT

Excuze me I was Absent for a While due to a travel in our bushes, I will be back to you Insha Allah.

As you mentionned Above, You have a suitable and proovable hypothesis But For me, If you can Read the book Of Sayyed Mojtaba Mussawi Laari intitled " GOD and His Attributes " and you Melt it With Sayyed Muhammad Rizwi in chapters talking about christian morality then i am expecting you to speak about high probability and possibility not Total Confidence about KT being Shias.

Just take the Kheops pyramid with its 13 stages + the triangle, it's much more 12+1+1 since you have 12 stages loking Alike, 1 different fom the 12 and the triangle on the top being different from the 13th stage thus we have 12+1+1 = 14

May we assume Pharoahs are Shia 12ers ? as Of Inquisition and Vatican Accusing the templars of Baphomet Idolators, we all know If one want to kill his Dog he accuses the Dog of being Enraged thus If you look with scrutiny the Time of Crusades, the templars and The Vatican inquisition, one can end up with the conclusion that Vatican Looking for A " REASON" to annihilate the Templars, accused them of BAPHOMETANISM as Zionists are Killing and destroying American and Western world Liberties in the name of "GLOBAL WAR ON ISLAMIC TERROR".

Though my English is Still bad , i assume you Understand what I mean and Only Rosslyn 12+2 pillars and Vatican Accusation is not Sufficent to make the KT SHIA 12ers. and Ihave not any single proof about their lineage with Shia Sayyed, this myth of Sang Real " SAINT GRAAL " and Templars being Its Keepers is something like Sufism melting Chriastianity monachism and mysticism with SHIA Esoteric Beliefs. Constantinople ( Istanbul ) is the area where this melting pot took place out of Jerusalem and DAMAS.

I will elaborate later Insha Allah though i am very busy now that is why i cannot take enough time to present a logical statements with proofs but i know i have many proofs to rebuff your statements on KT's.

Friendly yours. Your brother and friend

Maa Salaam

[The Green Knight 8,264]

Did you know, The Knights Hospitallers were Shias? As proof I give you my crazy theory number 1. blah blah blah. And my crazy theory number 2, 3 and 4. Blah blah. Their uniform was all black and Shias love to wear black (IMPORTANT: The europeans LIE that it had a big white cross right over the chest, just like they lie about templar having a HUGE HOKING red cross over their white tabards!).

Did you know, The Teutonic Knights were Shia? As proof I give you a wall of text. Please imagine my impressive wall of text here. Also because they wore horns on their helmets. Shia love cows and those horns are cow horns, so there. Thats no coincidence!~

Did you know, Ghenghis Khan was Shia? As proof I give you the fact that he loved cake, and all of us Shias love cake too. Now that's no simple coincidence folks.

..............

(Some guy in 2108 A.D. 100 years from now)

Did you know, G. W. Bush was a secret Shia? He waged war against the wahabi zealots. He also killed Saddam Hussain who was a wahabi so HE MUST BE A SHIA. :!!!: It's no simple coincidence folks!~ =D

P.S.: All European and Middle Eastern historians ARE BIG LIARS because teh crusades never took place! :o The knights templar did not join it. All the popular historic figures are either fake or did not belong to the order of the templar. Godfrey de Bouillon DID NOT invade and BATHE JERUSALEM with the blood of 90,000 it's non-christian residents. They did not turn their occupied area into hell for so many years. Saladin never fought Lionheart , never subdued the templars known to us as Guy of Lusignane and slaughtered the murderous black hearted Reginald of Chatillon who wanted to invade Medina because the templar hated Islam. You MUST unlearn those popular lies!!~

The templar were alleged of keeping small statues only known as the "Baphomet" idol and we all know that such pagan ways are perfectly Islamic, innit!??!?!? THATz why they killed the templar! coz they were too ISlamic!

Beware of the lies!~

I'll write more after I consume another bucket-full of buritos.

Edited November 22, 2008 by Ibrahim Nakhaee

[knightstemplar 3]

well cynicism wont get you far. But if you can show me the evidence of the Baphomet statue as the starting point of your argument, i will believe every pile [Edited Out] you deliver. But if you cant, i hope you choke on your buritos.

[angel555 0]

U have a sharp eye, bro....coz my first reaction to Knights Templar was also what?????? As far as I know they ere the BAD guys who massaccred Muslims during the Crusades, their mission was (is?) to find soem Holy Grail, they're like the Illuminati, and their rituals include obscene homosexual acts.....so like you I also first thougt "why does he even have this name????" FINALLY...WE HAVE SOMEONE W/HALF A BRAIN ON SC! Congrats, Bro! You'll find this site is corrupted as hell sometimes.

(bismillah)

(salam)

I found this posted on the Profile page of one of Shia Chat's member:

So who are they and how are they related to Shias?

(wasalam)

[mohalamine 19]

Did you know, The Knights Hospitallers were Shias? As proof I give you my crazy theory number 1. blah blah blah. And my crazy theory number 2, 3 and 4. Blah blah. Their uniform was all black and Shias love to wear black (IMPORTANT: The europeans LIE that it had a big white cross right over the chest, just like they lie about templar having a HUGE HOKING red cross over their white tabards!).

Did you know, The Teutonic Knights were Shia? As proof I give you a wall of text. Please imagine my impressive wall of text here. Also because they wore horns on their helmets. Shia love cows and those horns are cow horns, so there. Thats no coincidence!~

Did you know, Ghenghis Khan was Shia? As proof I give you the fact that he loved cake, and all of us Shias love cake too. Now that's no simple coincidence folks.

..............

(Some guy in 2108 A.D. 100 years from now)

Did you know, G. W. Bush was a secret Shia? He waged war against the wahabi zealots. He also killed Saddam Hussain who was a wahabi so HE MUST BE A SHIA. :!!!: It's no simple coincidence folks!~ =D

P.S.: All European and Middle Eastern historians ARE BIG LIARS because teh crusades never took place! :o The knights templar did not join it. All the popular historic figures are either fake or did not belong to the order of the templar. Godfrey de Bouillon DID NOT invade and BATHE JERUSALEM with the blood of 90,000 it's non-christian residents. They did not turn their occupied area into hell for so many years. Saladin never fought Lionheart , never subdued the templars known to us as Guy of Lusignane and slaughtered the murderous black hearted Reginald of Chatillon who wanted to invade Medina because the templar hated Islam. You MUST unlearn those popular lies!!~

The templar were alleged of keeping small statues only known as the "Baphomet" idol and we all know that such pagan ways are perfectly Islamic, innit!??!?!? THATz why they killed the templar! coz they were too ISlamic!

Beware of the lies!~

I'll write more after I consume another bucket-full of buritos.

Bro Nakhaee I would like you to visit Amazonia forest Tribes or Ambazonia ( African Rain Forest and Saheli areas) and please try to speak about Shia 12ers here you will get the answers by yourself. ( apart if you are despising these Black indegenous Wild Animals of ours).

Does this history mystification and falsification means the Shia twelvers Is just a myth ? using the same logic which leads me to Shia twelverism is the way i will follow if i don't want to be unjust and fanatic. So said, Why not Knight Templars Being Shias, What we are looking for is Islamic Proofs, Tangible and irrefutable Proofs.

Rejection or negation without clear proofs is neither scientifically correct nor islamically acceptable.

I emphasises that I have no probing clues evidencing templars being Shia's yet if we discover more details, i am about to change my view but till the contrary i stand with my opinion that KT are neither Shia nor Sayyid founded order.

I think only Archeological Team could do this job in Future, in today's World mentalities are so violently reluctant enough to chenge their common views that it is not easily feasable. first it needs Know how, and financial Means, Second It Needs Changing Mentalities Of Western christian World Fake Theories like Darwinist Evolution, Catholich church Dogmatic views on Crusaders and knight templars. and MORE shia historian views and works by that time.

IBLISS AND HIS SHAYTANS ARE WORKING HARD TO HIDE FACTS , SO WE BETTER BE KEEP VIGIL.

Allah HAFEZ 2 ALL

Edited November 23, 2008 by mohalamine

[Kaka 1]

Didnt the templars fight on the side of the crusaders? So is that why you hate Salahuddin (ra)? Wasnt Richard the Lion heart one? So was he Shia?

Also weren't they Gnostic or shall i say have Gnostic beliefs. And didnt a large number of them migrate to France, and mix with the Cathars there? And then were massacred by was it King Phillip?

So they were all Shias? So am i correct in thinking after helping the Catholic church, in attacking the Holy Land, Massacring Muslims or more correct shall i say Sunni Muslims and Jews and Christians of the Eastern Orthodox and Coptic persuasion, holding on to the Holy Land, until the were defeated by the Sunni Muslims then they migrated to Western Europe where the Pope and some of the Royalty worried about their power and heretical beliefs massacred them. Im guessing then some of them survived and migrated to Iraq, Iran and Lebanon, where they wait until they can recapture the Holy Land, build Sulaiman (as) temple again. Wait for the Messiah, in this case your Imam Mehdi, who will give all human beings including Sunni Muslims the choice of becoming Shias or face complete annihilation.

I read a few books a whileback when i was going through my conspiracy theory phase. And even worse i didnt have smoking marijuana as an excuse in my case...lol. I remember reading a book by those guys that sued Dan Brown is it? The author of the Da vici code.

Edited November 23, 2008 by Kaka

[mohalamine 19]

Didnt the templars fight on the side of the crusaders? So is that why you hate Salahuddin (ra)? Wasnt Richard the Lion heart one? So was he Shia?

Also weren't they Gnostic or shall i say have Gnostic beliefs. And didnt a large number of them migrate to France, and mix with the Cathars there? And then were massacred by was it King Phillip?

So they were all Shias? So am i correct in thinking after helping the Catholic church, in attacking the Holy Land, Massacring Muslims or more correct shall i say Sunni Muslims and Jews and Christians of the Eastern Orthodox and Coptic persuasion, holding on to the Holy Land, until the were defeated by the Sunni Muslims then they migrated to Western Europe where the Pope and some of the Royalty worried about their power and heretical beliefs massacred them. Im guessing then some of them survived and migrated to Iraq, Iran and Lebanon, where they wait until they can recapture the Holy Land, build Sulaiman (as) temple again. Wait for the Messiah, in this case your Imam Mehdi, who will give all human beings including Sunni Muslims the choice of becoming Shias or face complete annihilation.

I read a few books a whileback when i was going through my conspiracy theory phase. And even worse i didnt have smoking marijuana as an excuse in my case...lol. I remember reading a book by those guys that sued Dan Brown is it? The author of the Da vici code.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR CONTRIBUTION bro !

Please allow me adding more Fuel on the fire ; This Link : http://www.AFRICAMAAT.COM/ reflects the thoughts of Most African Youths and intellectuals, mostly the non House Negro. ( Presidents and ministers in their lofty palaces and luxurious offices as well as high ranking officials ).

The Africans with the view of rejecting western and foreign domination are rejecting all . thus a certain kemi seba Adhered to these afrocentrism ideology, (un)Fortunately he was jailed by the sarkozy police administration for Black African rights miltantism and he converted to Sunni -islam later and rejected theories of this afro-centrist web site ( though full of hiden truths of course, but they exaggerated some facts like Scientists rejecting Roman catholic Church and Creating Evolution theory to deny any GOD Existence due to VATICAN Bad Practices and Behaviour in the name of GOD. wikipedia or google pope john XXIII please.

What was so good is that he visited a SHIA center in france and praised HEZBOLLAH and Hassan nasrallah, more he Said He is looking for truth.

I want to point that we better keep searching, not staying on what general public and opinion says. however we are not to give credit to any sort of theory as well.

Check the bible from Muslims surveys and lectures about Knight Templars and SAINT GRAAL ; may be we can find more clues ( from Authentic Islamic Shia twelver Sources is more reliable) and if we can substantite it with Hadeeths. otherwise its not worthy keeping harsh words on what we all don't really know.

Maa Salaam

[The Green Knight 8,264]

Read Kaka's post KT, and accept a BiG heartfelt CONGRATZ on your desired outcome of choice with your theory. :D

Yes! I intend to hide the truth about the templar order, because they're still alive and practising the Shia faith inside KT's mind, and not accepting that reality shall be a dark act of lunacy in broad daylight (also but in KT's mind alone fortunately)!~

Yes, even the cunning Hashishin and their Sheikh ul-Jabal simpleton leader guy could not realize that the templar were actually Shias, like themselves, and so they never allied with them, and instead they murdered their popular knights and strove to drive them into the sea.

If only those poor ancient brainless chaps had bro KT around to reveal the truth. :(

BTW I am so evil, so desperate to hack away at your solid facts about the templar with such futility. :(

Baphomet :( So many big liars :(