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In the Name of God بسم الله

Age of Ayesha

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What a load of bull. A baligh girl CANNOT be married without her consent. The ignorance. Sheesh!

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And after the children have become baligh or the insane has become sane, he can endorse or abrogate it......... a Talaq or a renewed Nikah, whatever the case may be, must be recited

this then is not a real marriage when the nikkah has to be pronounced again once the girl is of age and has given her actual consent

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Girl does not have give consent.

Her father can do so on her behalf. He has this right.

Here we can see culture.

according to islam the girl has to give consent, this is someting islam came to change from the times of ignorance

And here, we can see religion.

The sooner we differentiate between the two sources of knowledge, the better.

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The point is not whether it's acceptable to marry a 9 year old

that's not the point at all

the point is that things dont add up and it's obvious ayesha lied as usual

read post number one and reflect please and if you want do your own research and u'll see that i'm right

wassalam

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(salam)

But you have not proven that she was not a virgin when married to rasool Allah Mohammad (pbuh) and she was at least 25 years when she married Mohammad (pbuh)!

What you have done is cut and paste from Sunni sites and taken the credit for it! ;)

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The point is not whether it's acceptable to marry a 9 year old

that's not the point at all

the point is that things dont add up and it's obvious ayesha lied as usual

read post number one and reflect pleas

e and if you want do your own research and u'll see that i'm right

wassalam

Salam

1. Kalam of masoom is called Hadith and the rest is not hujja on us. Some human saying something can be classified as historical evidence etc.

2. It is well known among Shias that abubakar and umar married their daughters to rasoolallah to gain political mileage in the name of being father inlaws.

3. There is also evidence other than yours that Ayesha was 19 when the marriage with rasoolallah was consumated.

4. I have heard an alim saying that khatijatal kubra s.a sent the proposal of marriage to rasoolallah when one of the then Jewish scholar foretold her that it is written in their books that a rich Arab woman will marry the prophet whose name will be ahmad.

5. Ayesha's marriage plot was to kill rasoolallah.

6. Ayesha is not worth a discussion and her name best suits on the door of one of my rooms.

7. As far as I know about her, she was childish till her death. She used to play with toys all her life especially a horse that she had. Whatever her age was at the time if marriage she was a 10 year old from inside and was shaytaan ok qaala( maternal aunt of iblees) from outside because she poisoned our beloved rasool. In sahib buqari, there is a poem which speaks volumes about what her character was like and how she behaved after the death of rasoolallah.

Sorry to hurt anyone, the problem is that I dont love our step mom.

Ya Ali madad

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marriage in Islam is totally dependent on consent from the girl if not the relationship becomes harasm therby enemies of imam Ali are born.

Every woman thinks twice before telling her right age. Ayesha is a liar and she is considered majhool in rijaal. She was a ghali but in the hatred of imam Ali.

Before siffin imam Ali wanted to talk to her so as to avoid fighting but she said if you yani Imam Ali comes forward she would show her hair to him and then said rasoolallah said whoever sees the hair if Ayesha will go to hell. To this imam Ali replied, if you do this I will cut your head because rasool Allah also said that whoever dies at the hand of Ali goes to hell. He then left her to her fate.

Ya Ali madad

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Hmm...

So, I just read this discussion.

My concern is about her age not her virginity.

It seems when we look at the numbers, the age appears to differ from the scholars' perspective.

Why is that?

We know what sunnis base their claims on but what do shia scholars base their claims on? Sunni hadiths?

I understand that we must always respect the scholars' opinions, however, what about when it seems to differ with logic/mathematics?

And follow not that of which you have not the knowledge; surely the hearing and the sight and the heart, all of these, shall be questioned about that. (17:36)

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We know what sunnis base their claims on but what do shia scholars base their claims on? Sunni hadiths?

History.

If I'm not mistaken, the Shi'i scholars are unanimous that she was 9-10 when she married/her marriage was consummated.

I understand that we must always respect the scholars' opinions, however, what about when it seems to differ with logic/mathematics?

Elaborate, please?

From the link I posted in your thread, it says:

A'isha was born in 614 A.D., Although the marriage was performed earlier, it was not consummated until 623 or 624 A.D.

So, the fact that she was 9-10 when her marriage was consummated is in tune with mathematics.

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Wow so ayesha is truthfull according to u

as far as i'm concerned she's the biggest liar in history of mankind

see my thread (i will open now about her age )

i agree with u brother...

i wish there was no one with this name "ayesha" in the history of ISLAM :cry:

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Salaam,

I found some information I cut and pasted into a word doc. on this a while ago. I think it deals with the issue of Ayesha's age really well. Sorry for the length, but I think it is definitely worth reading (refs. included). Insha'Allah this article will make things clearer for others as it has for me.

Fatimeh

by T.O. Shanavas

A Christian friend asked me once, “Will you marry your seven year old daughter to a fifty year old man?” I kept my silence. He continued, “If you would not, how can you approve the marriage of an innocent seven year old, Ayesha, with your Prophet?” I told him, “I don’t have an answer to your question at this time.” My friend smiled and left me with a thorn in the heart of my faith. Most Muslims answer that such marriages were accepted in those days. Otherwise, people would have objected to Prophet’s marriage with Ayesha.

However, such an explanation would be gullible only for those who are naive enough to believe it. But unfortunately, I was not satisfied with the answer.

The Prophet was an exemplary man. All his actions were most virtuous so that we, Muslims, can emulate them. However, most people in our Islamic Center of Toledo, including me, would not think of betrothing our seven years daughter to a fifty-two year-old man. If a parent agrees to such a wedding, most people, if not all, would look down upon the father and the old husband.

In 1923, registrars of marriage in Egypt were instructed not to register and issue official certificates of marriage for brides less than sixteen and grooms less than eighteen years of age. Eight years later, the Law of the Organization and Procedure of Sheriah courts of 1931 consolidated the above provision by not hearing the marriage disputes involving brides less than sixteen and grooms less than eighteen years old. (Women in Muslim Family Law, John Esposito, 1982). It shows that even in the Muslim majority country of Egypt the child marriages are unacceptable.

So, I believed, without solid evidence other than my reverence to my Prophet, that the stories of the marriage of seven-year-old Ayesha to 50-year-old Prophet are only myths. However, my long pursuit in search of the truth on this matter proved my intuition correct. My Prophet was a gentleman. And he did not marry an innocent seven or nine year old girl. The age of Ayesha has been erroneously reported in the hadith literature. Furthermore, I think that the narratives reporting this event are highly unreliable. Some of the hadith (traditions of the Prophet) regarding Ayesha’s age at the time of her wedding with prophet are problematic. I present the following evidences against the acceptance of the fictitious story by Hisham ibn ‘Urwah and to clear the name of my Prophet as an irresponsible old man preying on an innocent little girl.

EVIDENCE #1: Reliability of Source

Most of the narratives printed in the books of hadith are reported only by Hisham ibn `Urwah, who was reporting on the authority of his father. First of all, more people than just one, two or three should logically have reported. It is strange that no one from Medina, where Hisham ibn `Urwah lived the first 71 years of his life narrated the event, despite the fact that his Medinan pupils included the well-respected Malik ibn Anas. The origins of the report of the narratives of this event are people from Iraq, where Hisham is reported to have shifted after living in Medina for most of his life.

Tehzibu’l-Tehzib, one of the most well known books on the life and reliability of the narrators of the traditions of the Prophet, reports that according to Yaqub ibn Shaibah: “He [Hisham] is highly reliable, his narratives are acceptable, except what he narrated after moving over to Iraq” (Tehzi’bu’l-tehzi’b, Ibn Hajar Al-`asqala’ni, Dar Ihya al-turath al-Islami, 15th century. Vol 11, p. 50).

It further states that Malik ibn Anas objected on those narratives of Hisham which were reported through people in Iraq: “I have been told that Malik objected on those narratives of Hisham which were reported through people of Iraq” (Tehzi’b u’l-tehzi’b, Ibn Hajar Al-`asqala’ni, Dar Ihya al-turath al-Islami, Vol.11, p. 50).

Mizanu’l-ai`tidal, another book on the life sketches of the narrators of the traditions of the Prophet reports: “When he was old, Hisham’s memory suffered quite badly” (Mizanu’l-ai`tidal, Al-Zahbi, Al-Maktabatu’l-athriyyah, Sheikhupura, Pakistan, Vol. 4, p. 301).

CONCLUSION: Based on these references, Hisham’s memory was failing and his narratives while in Iraq were unreliable. So, his narrative of Ayesha’s marriage and age are unreliable.

CHRONOLOGY: It is vital also to keep in mind some of the pertinent dates in the history of Islam:

pre-610 CE: Jahiliya (pre-Islamic age) before revelation

610 CE: First revelation

610 CE: AbuBakr accepts Islam

613 CE: Prophet Muhammad begins preaching publicly.

615 CE: Emigration to Abyssinia

616 CE: Umar bin al Khattab accepts Islam

620 CE: Generally accepted betrothal of Ayesha to the Prophet

622 CE: Hijrah (emigation to Yathrib, later renamed Medina)

623/624 CE: Generally accepted year of Ayesha living with the Prophet

EVIDENCE #2: The Betrothal

According to Tabari (also according to Hisham ibn ‘Urwah, Ibn Hunbal and Ibn Sad), Ayesha was betrothed at seven years of age and began to cohabit with the Prophet at the age of nine years.

However, in another work, Al-Tabari says: “All four of his [Abu Bakr’s] children were born of his two wives during the pre-Islamic period” (Tarikhu’l-umam wa’l-mamlu’k, Al-Tabari (died 922), Vol. 4, p. 50, Arabic, Dara’l-fikr, Beirut, 1979).

If Ayesha was betrothed in 620 CE (at the age of seven) and started to live with the Prophet in 624 CE (at the age of nine), that would indicate that she was born in 613 CE and was nine when she began living with the Prophet. Therefore, based on one account of Al-Tabari, the numbers show that Ayesha must have born in 613 CE, three years after the beginning of revelation (610 CE). Tabari also states that Ayesha was born in the pre-Islamic era (in Jahiliya). If she was born before 610 CE, she would have been at least 14 years old when she began living with the Prophet. Essentially, Tabari contradicts himself.

CONCLUSION: Al-Tabari is unreliable in the matter of determining Ayesha’s age.

EVIDENCE # 3: The Age of Ayesha in Relation to the Age of Fatima

According to Ibn Hajar, “Fatima was born at the time the Ka`bah was rebuilt, when the Prophet was 35 years old... she was five years older that Ayesha” (Al-isabah fi tamyizi’l-sahabah, Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani, Vol. 4, p. 377, Maktabatu’l-Riyadh al-haditha, al-Riyadh, 1978).

If Ibn Hajar’s statement is factual, Ayesha was born when the Prophet was 40 years old. If Ayesha was married to the Prophet when he was 52 years old, Ayesha’s age at marriage would be 12 years.

CONCLUSION: Ibn Hajar, Tabari an Ibn Hisham and Ibn Humbal contradict each other. So, the marriage of Ayesha at seven years of age is a myth.

EVIDENCE #4: Ayesha’s Age in relation to Asma’s Age

According to Abda’l-Rahman ibn abi zanna’d: “Asma was 10 years older than Ayesha (Siyar A`la’ma’l-nubala’, Al-Zahabi, Vol. 2, p. 289, Arabic, Mu’assasatu’l-risalah, Beirut, 1992).

According to Ibn Kathir: “She [Asma] was elder to her sister [Ayesha] by 10 years” (Al-Bidayah wa’l-nihayah, Ibn Kathir, Vol. 8, p. 371, Dar al-fikr al-`arabi, Al-jizah, 1933).

According to Ibn Kathir: “She [Asma] saw the killing of her son during that year [73 AH], as we have already mentioned, and five days later she herself died. According to other narratives, she died not after five days but 10 or 20, or a few days over 20, or 100 days later. The most well known narrative is that of 100 days later. At the time of her death, she was 100 years old.” (Al-Bidayah wa’l-nihayah, Ibn Kathir, Vol. 8, p. 372, Dar al-fikr al-`arabi, Al-jizah, 1933)

According to Ibn Hajar Al-Asqalani: “She [Asma] lived a hundred years and died in 73 or 74 AH.” (Taqribu’l-tehzib, Ibn Hajar Al-Asqalani, p. 654, Arabic, Bab fi’l-nisa’, al-harfu’l-alif, Lucknow).

According to almost all the historians, Asma, the elder sister of Ayesha was 10 years older than Ayesha. If Asma was 100 years old in 73 AH, she should have been 27 or 28 years old at the time of the hijrah.

If Asma was 27 or 28 years old at the time of hijrah, Ayesha should have been 17 or 18 years old. Thus, Ayesha, being 17 or 18 years of at the time of Hijra, she started to cohabit with the Prophet between at either 19 to 20 years of age.

Based on Hajar, Ibn Katir, and Abda’l-Rahman ibn abi zanna’d, Ayesha’s age at the time she began living with the Prophet would be 19 or 20. In Evidence # 3, Ibn Hajar suggests that Ayesha was 12 years old and in Evidence #4 he contradicts himself with a 17 or 18-year-old Ayesha. What is the correct age, twelve or eighteen?

CONCLUSION: Ibn Hajar is an unreliable source for Ayesha’s age.

EVIDENCE #5: The Battles of Badr and Uhud

A narrative regarding Ayesha’s participation in Badr is given in the hadith of Muslim, (Kitabu’l-jihad wa’l-siyar, Bab karahiyati’l-isti`anah fi’l-ghazwi bikafir). Ayesha, while narrating the journey to Badr and one of the important events that took place in that journey, says: “when we reached Shajarah”. Obviously, Ayesha was with the group travelling towards Badr. A narrative regarding Ayesha’s participation in the Battle of Uhud is given in Bukhari (Kitabu’l-jihad wa’l-siyar, Bab Ghazwi’l-nisa’ wa qitalihinna ma`a’lrijal): “Anas reports that on the day of Uhud, people could not stand their ground around the Prophet. [On that day,] I saw Ayesha and Umm-i-Sulaim, they had pulled their dress up from their feet [to avoid any hindrance in their movement].” Again, this indicates that Ayesha was present in the Battles of Uhud and Badr.

It is narrated in Bukhari (Kitabu’l-maghazi, Bab Ghazwati’l-khandaq wa hiya’l-ahza’: “Ibn `Umar states that the Prophet did not permit me to participate in Uhud, as at that time, I was 14 years old. But on the day of Khandaq, when I was 15 years old, the Prophet permitted my participation.”

Based on the above narratives, (a) the children below 15 years were sent back and were not allowed to participate in the Battle of Uhud, and ( Ayesha participated in the Battles of Badr and Uhud

CONCLUSION: Ayesha’s participation in the Battles of Badr and Uhud clearly indicates that she was not nine years old but at least 15 years old. After all, women used to accompany men to the battlefields to help them, not to be a burden on them. This account is another contradiction regarding Ayesha’s age.

EVIDENCE #6: Surat al-Qamar (The Moon)

According to the generally accepted tradition, Ayesha was born about eight years before hijrah. But according to another narrative in Bukhari, Ayesha is reported to have said: “I was a young girl (jariyah in Arabic)” when Surah Al-Qamar was revealed (Sahih Bukhari, kitabu’l-tafsir, Bab Qaulihi Bal al-sa`atu Maw`iduhum wa’l-sa`atu adha’ wa amarr).

Chapter 54 of the Quran was revealed eight years before hijrah (The Bounteous Koran, M.M. Khatib, 1985), indicating that it was revealed in 614 CE. If Ayesha started living with the Prophet at the age of nine in 623 CE or 624 CE, she was a newborn infant (sibyah in Arabic) at the time that Surah Al-Qamar (The Moon) was revealed. According to the above tradition, Ayesha was actually a young girl, not an infant in the year of revelation of Al-Qamar. Jariyah means young playful girl (Lane’s Arabic English Lexicon). So, Ayesha, being a jariyah not a sibyah (infant), must be somewhere between 6-13 years old at the time of revelation of Al-Qamar, and therefore must have been 14-21 years at the time she married the Prophet.

CONCLUSION: This tradition also contradicts the marriage of Ayesha at the age of nine.

EVIDENCE #7: Arabic Terminology

According to a narrative reported by Ahmad ibn Hanbal, after the death of the Prophet’s first wife Khadijah, when Khaulah came to the Prophet advising him to marry again, the Prophet asked her regarding the choices she had in mind. Khaulah said: “You can marry a virgin (bikr) or a woman who has already been married (thayyib)”. When the Prophet asked the identity of the bikr (virgin), Khaulah mentioned Ayesha’s name.

All those who know the Arabic language are aware that the word bikr in the Arabic language is not used for an immature nine-year-old girl. The correct word for a young playful girl, as stated earlier, is jariyah. Bikr on the other hand, is used for an unmarried lady without conjugal experience prior to marriage, as we understand the word “virgin” in English. Therefore, obviously a nine-year-old girl is not a “lady” (bikr) (Musnad Ahmad ibn Hanbal, Vol. 6, p. .210, Arabic, Dar Ihya al-turath al-`arabi, Beirut).

CONCLUSION: The literal meaning of the word, bikr (virgin), in the above hadith is “adult woman with no sexual experience prior to marriage.” Therefore, Ayesha was an adult woman at the time of her marriage.

EVIDENCE #8. The Qur’anic Text

All Muslims agree that the Quran is the book of guidance. So, we need to seek the guidance from the Quran to clear the smoke and confusion created by the eminent men of the classical period of Islam in the matter of Ayesha’s age at her marriage. Does the Quran allow or disallow marriage of an immature child of seven years of age?

There are no verses that explicitly allow such marriage. There is a verse, however, that guides Muslims in their duty to raise an orphaned child. The Quran’s guidance on the topic of raising orphans is also valid in the case of our own children. The verse states: “And make not over your property (property of the orphan), which Allah had made a (means of) support for you, to the weak of understanding, and maintain them out of it, clothe them and give them good education. And test them until they reach the age of marriage. Then if you find them maturity of intellect, make over them their property...” (Quran, 4:5-6).

In the matter of children who have lost a parent, a Muslim is ordered to (a) feed them, ( clothe them, © educate them, and (d) test them for maturity “until the age of marriage” before entrusting them with management of finances.

Here the Quranic verse demands meticulous proof of their intellectual and physical maturity by objective test results before the age of marriage in order to entrust their property to them.

In light of the above verses, no responsible Muslim would hand over financial management to a seven- or nine-year-old immature girl. If we cannot trust a seven-year-old to manage financial matters, she cannot be intellectually or physically fit for marriage. Ibn Hambal (Musnad Ahmad ibn Hambal, vol.6, p. 33 and 99) claims that nine-year-old Ayesha was rather more interested in playing with toy-horses than taking up the responsible task of a wife. It is difficult to believe, therefore, that AbuBakr, a great believer among Muslims, would betroth his immature seven-year-old daughter to the 50-year-old Prophet. Equally difficult to imagine is that the Prophet would marry an immature seven-year-old girl.

Another important duty demanded from the guardian of a child is to educate them. Let us ask the question, “How many of us believe that we can educate our children satisfactorily before they reach the age of seven or nine years?” The answer is none. Logically, it is an impossible task to educate a child satisfactorily before the child attains the age of seven. Then, how can we believe that Ayesha was educated satisfactorily at the claimed age of seven at the time of her marriage?

AbuBakr was a more judicious man than all of us. So, he definitely would have judged that Ayesha was a child at heart and was not satisfactorily educated as demanded by the Quran. He would not have married her to anyone. If a proposal of marrying the immature and yet to be educated seven-year-old Ayesha came to the Prophet, he would have rejected it outright because neither the Prophet nor AbuBakr would violate any clause in the Quran.

CONCLUSION: The marriage of Ayesha at the age of seven years would violate the maturity clause or requirement of the Quran. Therefore, the story of the marriage of the seven-year-old immature Ayesha is a myth.

EVIDENCE #9: Consent in Marriage

A women must be consulted and must agree in order to make a marriage valid (Mishakat al Masabiah, translation by James Robson, Vol. I, p. 665). Islamically, credible permission from women is a prerequisite for a marriage to be valid.

By any stretch of the imagination, the permission given by an immature seven-year-old girl cannot be valid authorization for marriage.

It is inconceivable that AbuBakr, an intelligent man, would take seriously the permission of a seven-year-old girl to marry a 50-year-old man.

Similarly, the Prophet would not have accepted the permission given by a girl who, according to the hadith of Muslim, took her toys with her when she went live with Prophet.

CONCLUSION: The Prophet did not marry a seven-year-old Ayesha because it would have violated the requirement of the valid permission clause of the Islamic Marriage Decree. Therefore, the Prophet married an intellectually and physically mature lady Ayesha.

SUMMARY:

It was neither an Arab tradition to give away girls in marriage at an age as young as seven or nine years, nor did the Prophet marry Ayesha at such a young age. The people of Arabia did not object to this marriage because it never happened in the manner it has been narrated.

Obviously, the narrative of the marriage of nine-year-old Ayesha by Hisham ibn `Urwah cannot be held true when it is contradicted by many other reported narratives. Moreover, there is absolutely no reason to accept the narrative of Hisham ibn `Urwah as true when other scholars, including Malik ibn Anas, view his narrative while in Iraq, as unreliable. The quotations from Tabari, Bukhari and Muslim show they contradict each other regarding Ayesha’s age. Furthermore, many of these scholars contradict themselves in their own records. Thus, the narrative of Ayesha’s age at the time of the marriage is not reliable due to the clear contradictions seen in the works of classical scholars of Islam.

Therefore, there is absolutely no reason to believe that the information on Ayesha’s age is accepted as true when there are adequate grounds to reject it as myth. Moreover, the Quran rejects the marriage of immature girls and boys as well as entrusting them with responsibilities.

T.O. Shanavas is a physician based in Michigan. This article first appeared in The Minaret in March 1999.

© 2001 Minaret

Extracted 09/06/02 from The Minaret

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not forgetting that she was supposed to get married to bin mitam 7 years previously. If she was 9 in 622 then that would have made her 2 in 615 which is highly unlikely that she would have married at that age.

The younger one got married as a lady the higher her status, in those days. It may not be a case of Ayesha trying to slander the Prophet (saaw) but more of other trying to raise her status at a later date.

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^Thanks for that article although it is from the Sunni point of view. A lot of things mentioned in it are incorrect from the Shi'ite point of view.

Anyway, does anyone know which Shi'ite scholars reject the fact that Ayesha was married at the age of 9-10 or her marriage was consummated at this age?

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Salams

The 'age of Ayesha at the time of her marriage' is an issue which is screened by Muslims and non-Muslims nowadays through modern day standards. If we look at the global standards at that particular period of time, we will find that women in Europe were also getting married at a very early age (Read through the history of Royal families of Europe to seek reference of the same practise). Societal standards were very different (or should I say, simple) back then. The bf gf relationship like we have today did not exist then, for it was perceived to be a crime (a relationship out of wedlock). Women were not perceived to be career people. They were the admins of Home; their priority role in society was to be a wife and mother. So if they were baligh enough to have a child, their marriages were arranged by their guardians. In conclusion, it was common for them to get married at a very early age.

On the contrary, since we are so 'modern' and 'civilised' nowadays, we are unwilling to accept a practise of that time, which we now see as barbaric. Thanks to the taliban of Afghanistan who helped us perceive this image by misusing historical references of Islam to allow forceful marriage of young sisters in Islam (of today) to old perverts.

Fi-Amanillah

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narrated by the liar Aisha herself! Aisha had a knack for fabricating traditions, especially those that attempted to harm the honor of the Holy Prophet(SAWW); just one example the so-called "black magic" story.

Clearly it was only Aisha who was lying (as usual) against our Holy Prophet(SAWW); in her sick attempt to try an harm the Prophet(SAWW)'s memory. But Allah(SWT) will defeat the liars as they have no power over his supreme greatness(SWT).

Oh " brother " in Islam do please explain why would she (ra) want to harm the Prophet (saw)? But then you believe she (ra) poisoned him (SAW) so i guess if that can be done, just lying isnt that big....but i'd be and im sure others will be aswell, interested in an explanation

5. Ayesha's marriage plot was to kill rasoolallah.

6. Ayesha is not worth a discussion and her name best suits on the door of one of my rooms.

7. As far as I know about her, she was childish till her death. She used to play with toys all her life especially a horse that she had. Whatever her age was at the time if marriage she was a 10 year old from inside and was shaytaan ok qaala( maternal aunt of iblees) from outside because she poisoned our beloved rasool. In sahib buqari, there is a poem which speaks volumes about what her character was like and how she behaved after the death of rasoolallah.

Sorry to hurt anyone, the problem is that I dont love our step mom.

Ya Ali madad

Dont worry you haven't hurt anyone.....only a fellow muslim or someone who i respected/loved would hurt me, something im well loathed to say, you are neither. I hope i haven't hurt you, im sure i haven't, if you curse and do takfir im sure your big enough to take some thats thrown your way.

But i am interested if Ibless has a Maternal aunt, who was his mum? Quite an interesting question... actually wait i can think of quite a few people who fill that position, so theres no need to reply. I quite like my choices

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History.

If I'm not mistaken, the Shi'i scholars are unanimous that she was 9-10 when she married/her marriage was consummated.

If I recollect correctly, brother Hasnain Rajabali in one of his lectures, which was not about Aisha or his age, briefly referred to her and spoke about the age of her marriage in a way that seemed to be less than certain. Since I listen to many lectures, I cannot remember which one it was.

Elaborate, please?

From the link I posted in your thread, it says:

A'isha was born in 614 A.D., Although the marriage was performed earlier, it was not consummated until 623 or 624 A.D.

So, the fact that she was 9-10 when her marriage was consummated is in tune with mathematics.

How about the sunni article that FatimehJ presented?

None of the evidences in that article are considered valid?

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ÇáäøóÈöíøõ Ãóæúáóì ÈöÇáúãõÄúãöäöíäó ãöäú ÃóäÝõÓöåöãú æóÃóÒúæóÇÌõåõ ÃõãøóåóÇÊõåõãú

The Prophet is closer to the Believers than their own selves, and his wives are their mothers

(Surah al ahzab, ch.33, v.6)

Only the worst kind of people talk bad about their mother.

Edited by Ghulam Nabi
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ÇáäøóÈöíøõ Ãóæúáóì ÈöÇáúãõÄúãöäöíäó ãöäú ÃóäÝõÓöåöãú æóÃóÒúæóÇÌõåõ ÃõãøóåóÇÊõåõãú

The Prophet is closer to the Believers than their own selves, and his wives are their mothers

(Surah al ahzab, ch.33, v.6)

Only the worst kind of people talk bad about their mother.

So how bad must Allah (swt) be because in the same chapter He (swt) threatens the 'mothers' with a double punishment?

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Salams

The 'age of Ayesha at the time of her marriage' is an issue which is screened by Muslims and non-Muslims nowadays through modern day standards. If we look at the global standards at that particular period of time, we will find that women in Europe were also getting married at a very early age (Read through the history of Royal families of Europe to seek reference of the same practise). Societal standards were very different (or should I say, simple) back then. The bf gf relationship like we have today did not exist then, for it was perceived to be a crime (a relationship out of wedlock). Women were not perceived to be career people. They were the admins of Home; their priority role in society was to be a wife and mother. So if they were baligh enough to have a child, their marriages were arranged by their guardians. In conclusion, it was common for them to get married at a very early age.

On the contrary, since we are so 'modern' and 'civilised' nowadays, we are unwilling to accept a practise of that time, which we now see as barbaric. Thanks to the taliban of Afghanistan who helped us perceive this image by misusing historical references of Islam to allow forceful marriage of young sisters in Islam (of today) to old perverts.

Fi-Amanillah

Yup. Marriage requires 3 conditions:

1. Biological maturity

2. Psychological maturity

3. Consent of the bride

It is conceivable a girl could meet condition 1 at 9 or 10.

But as for condition 2, even in the developing world, economic development requires education of all citizens to be prepared for adulthood and contribute. As a result, marriage at 9 or 10 is not appropriate today.

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If I recollect correctly, brother Hasnain Rajabali in one of his lectures, which was not about Aisha or his age, briefly referred to her and spoke about the age of her marriage in a way that seemed to be less than certain. Since I listen to many lectures, I cannot remember which one it was.

From the limited Shi'ite sources which I've gone through, all of them state that she was 9-10 when either married/marriage was consummated.

Marhoom Sayyed Murtadha Askari was a critical historian and he has written a book 'The Role of Aisha in the History of Islam'. He writes:

'A'ishah was the daughter of the first caliph 'Abd
Allah
Abu Bakr, son of Abu Quhafah 'Uthman, and granddaughter of 'Amir ibn Ka'b of the house of Taym (Quraysh).

She was born in the fourth year after the Prophet's ordainment in Mecca and grew up in the same city.

After the death of his first loyal wife, Khadjjah, and two years before his emigration to Medina, the Prophet wedded 'A'ishah, and a year and a half after the emigration, in the lunar month of Shawwal and after the battle of Badr, on the insistence of her father Abu Bakr, took her to his own house.
When the Prophet died, she was only eighteen years old. Thus Umm al-Mu'minin spent only eight years and five months of her life in the Prophet's house.

From this, it can be gauged that she was around 9-10 when she was married.

How about the sunni article that FatimehJ presented?

None of the evidences in that article are considered valid?

I haven't verified each evidence, but some of the points mentioned in there are clearly invalid according to the Ja'fari madhhab.

Salaam,

Sayed Ammar Nakshawani (a respected Shia lecturer) has discussed the age of Ayesha in one of his talks.

If you check the website: http://www.sayedammar.com/ and go to talk 79 The Mother of the Believers - he starts discussing this after about 30 minutes.

(wasalam)

Can you summarise what he says?

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The age of Aisha is irrelevant. Based on Islamic teachings and the example of the Prophet, the only thing that matters is that the marriage was consented on both sides. In addition, there is no evidence in any of the ahadith that Aisha "suffered" from her marriage to the Prophet. But if we were to postulate about her age, more evidence has shown us that she was indeed 9-10 years old when she was consummated. Why are you treating this like a big deal? During those times, women were married and consummated after menstruation. It is the menstrual cycle that separates biologically children from women. Islam is a universal religion meant to be practiced throughout human history; as such, it does not prescribe an age for marriage. It is halal for an individual to marry once they pass into adulthood, and this could happen in women even earlier than 7. Should we have waited for Aisha to finish her undergraduate degree in computer science before she got married? We should not impose current standards universally. If we did, history would not make sense.

Moreover, the Virgin Mary was married off to Joseph at the age of 12 (some say as old as 14). This is from a Catholic source. Marriage shortly after puberty is not terribly uncommon. Also: the age of consent in the United States a few hundred years ago was 10. I found this while reading the "Age of Consent" website, but this page seems to be unavailable now. In many places in Europe (and in some states), the age of consent is 12. These are all artificial and meaningless numbers. What matters is biological maturity and psychological readiness (and consent) in order for one to marry. Whether that is at age 9 or 12 or any other variable, the criteria should not simply be age. Besides, Aisha was the only virgin the Prophet married (if I'm not mistaken). Perhaps you should analyze his marriage to Khadjiah before jumping to conclusions. Unless of course you believe Muhammed's master plan was to wait until he was 25-26 to marry a widower who was 15 years older than him, remain with her exclusively until her death (which lasted approximately 25 years) in order to arrive at a girl who was not ready to marry (na'ozabullah). The marriage was accepted as normal and unproblematic by the Muslims, Christians, Jews and Pagans during the Prophet's time. In addition, the Christians of Europe had access to our religion for centuries, prompting them to depict Muhammed in the hellfire (among other useless blasphemy), but they never criticized the marriage until recently.

Nevertheless, I remain open to differing accounts, even though I think most people are wasting their time trying to be apologetic. Whatever the case may be, evidence has pointed to an earlier age of marriage and consummation.

Edited by asphyxiated
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is there any solid strong hadith that:

(1) ammi jaan aishahs sister was 10 years older than her

(2) her sisters age at hijrat was 20-something

if we can prove these two points, one way or another this discussion is finished.

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so many "proofs" frm everyone supporting their point... i jus cnt decide who to bleev :unsure: sumthin i dunno bout i try lernin n i get confuzzled coz everyone brings proofs n thn u jus dnt kno wich one is true n wich aint... newayz....

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So how bad must Allah (swt) be because in the same chapter He (swt) threatens the 'mothers' with a double punishment?

here is an example of pure ignorance

I swear to Allah these haters of the wives get so excited when they read 33:30 that they don't even bother to read the next verse

[033:030] Oh wives of the prophet! The punishment will be doubled if anyone of you commits a lewd and vile deed. That is really easy for Allah to do.

[033:031] (Oh wives of the prophet) We will grant the reward twice to any of you who obeys Allah and His messenger, and acts righteously. We will grant her a generous and eminent sustenance.

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here is an example of pure ignorance

I swear to Allah these haters of the wives get so excited when they read 33:30 that they don't even bother to read the next verse

[033:030] Oh wives of the prophet! The punishment will be doubled if anyone of you commits a lewd and vile deed. That is really easy for Allah to do.

[033:031] (Oh wives of the prophet) We will grant the reward twice to any of you who obeys Allah and His messenger, and acts righteously. We will grant her a generous and eminent sustenance.

isnt it amazing at the difference highlighting different parts of the same ayat make?

here is an example of pure ignorance

I swear to Allah these haters of the wives get so excited when they read 33:30 that they don't even bother to read the next verse

[033:030] Oh wives of the prophet! The punishment will be doubled if anyone of you commits a lewd and vile deed. That is really easy for Allah to do.

[033:031] (Oh wives of the prophet) We will grant the reward twice to any of you who obeys Allah and His messenger, and acts righteously. We will grant her a generous and eminent sustenance.

oh you lovers of ammi jaan, answer these questions:

(1) did ammi jaan obey the prophet, by leaving her house (disobeying a direct ayat) and fighting against the rightful caliph of her time maula ali (as) (disobeying the prophets instructions throughout his life)

(2) did ammi jaan obey the prophet, according to those ayats in surah tehreem?

(3) did ammi jaan act "righteously" by unrighteously being responsible for the death of around 100,000 of her "children"..ALL of whose blood is on her hands?

shes gonna burn in hell. inshallah.

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isnt it amazing at the difference highlighting different parts of the same ayat make?

your acting like as if have taken out the middle part from the verse

and I have seen people in here taking a whole sentence out or adding sentences in the Quran

oh you lovers of ammi jaan, answer these questions:

(1) did ammi jaan obey the prophet, by leaving her house (disobeying a direct ayat) and fighting against the rightful caliph of her time maula ali (as) (disobeying the prophets instructions throughout his life)

Aisha(ra) participated in both Battles of Uhud and Badr

So if the Prophet during his life didn't stop his wife from helping the believers in the wars

then who are you to question her :angel:

(2) did ammi jaan obey the prophet, according to those ayats in surah tehreem?

both wives were asked to repent 66:4

if they had not repented then Prophet Muhammad would had divorced them as the next verse says

which did not happen Prophet Muhammad didn't divorce his wives, indicating that they were forgiven

(3) did ammi jaan act "righteously" by unrighteously being responsible for the death of around 100,000 of her "children"..ALL of whose blood is on her hands?

“And the people who provoked the murder of Uthman [the Saba’ites] had the worst sleep ever because they came close to be doomed. They were discussing their plight the whole night until they agreed to ignite a war [between Aisha and Ali] in secret. They took that as a secret so that no one would know what evil they were planning. They woke up at dusk and while their neighbors did not feel them; they (the agitators) sneaked to do the dirty job in the darkness … they laid swords in the believers…” [Al-Tabari, vol.3, p.39, year 36H]

“The Saba’ites…who were fearing of peace…started throwing Aisha with lances while she was on her camel…Aisha said: ‘…remember Allah and Judgment Day.’ But the Saba’ites refused anything but to fight. So the first thing Aisha said when the Saba’ites refused to stop was: ‘O people, curse the killers of Uthman and their friends.’” [Musnaf Ibn Abi Sheibah, vol.8, the Book of the “Camel” in the departure of Aisha, p.718]

shes gonna burn in hell. inshallah.

when the Quran says Prophet wives are mother of believers then they are Quran doesn't say except for aisha(ra)

you dont want to follow the Quran then that is your choice

Quran defended Aisha in chapter 24

may Allah guide you to the right path

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*rolls up his sleeves*

right. lets do this.

your acting like as if have taken out the middle part from the verse

and I have seen people in here taking a whole sentence out or adding sentences in the Quran

that has no relevance to this thread or topic. the fact is YOU are guilty of not reading the whole ayat.

why do you think the lines " to any of you who obeys Allah and His messenger, and acts righteously." are included in the ayat? why ANY of you? surely this means that it was possible for some of the wives to NOT be righteous?

what are your thoughts on this?

Aisha(ra) participated in both Battles of Uhud and Badr

really? how many people did she kill? cos if she killed even one that wud be one more than umar killed LOL

So if the Prophet during his life didn't stop his wife from helping the believers in the wars

then who are you to question her :angel:

bring your BS daleel quickly so i can prove it wrong. in the meantime what do you think the first part of ayat tatheerat which is referring to the wives of the prophet means:

[33.32] O wives of the Prophet! you are not like any other of the women; If you will be on your guard, then be not soft in (your) speech, lest he in whose heart is a disease yearn; and speak a good word.

[33.33] And stay in your houses and do not display your finery like the displaying of the ignorance of yore; and keep up prayer, and pay the poor-rate, and obey Allah and His Apostle. Allah only desires to keep away the uncleanness from you, O people of the House! and to purify you a (thorough) purifying.

and please...do us both a favour and dont even bother saying "ammi jaan aisha is one of the people of the house". run a search before you run your mouth.

both wives were asked to repent 66:4

if they had not repented then Prophet Muhammad would had divorced them as the next verse says

which did not happen Prophet Muhammad didn't divorce his wives, indicating that they were forgiven

it indicates nothing of the sort.

[66.5] Maybe, his Lord, if he divorce you, will give him in your place wives better than you, submissive, faithful, obedient, penitent, adorers, fasters, widows and virgins.

where does it say "if you are guilty then he will divorce you"?

[66.3] And when the prophet secretly communicated a piece of information to one of his wives-- but when she informed (others) of it, and Allah made him to know it, he made known part of it and avoided part; so when he informed her of it, she said: Who informed you of this? He said: The Knowing, the one Aware, informed me.

[66.4] If you both turn to Allah, then indeed your hearts are already inclined (to this); and if you back up each other against him, then surely Allah it is Who is his Guardian, and Jibreel and -the believers that do good, and the angels after that are the aiders.

astagfirullah...Allah hu akbar.

ammi jaan aisha was such a disbeliever, she did not even have imaan, that her husband rasool e paak had ilm e ghayb!!!! who did she THINK informed him of it???

“And the people who provoked the murder of Uthman [the Saba’ites] had the worst sleep ever because they came close to be doomed. They were discussing their plight the whole night until they agreed to ignite a war [between Aisha and Ali] in secret. They took that as a secret so that no one would know what evil they were planning. They woke up at dusk and while their neighbors did not feel them; they (the agitators) sneaked to do the dirty job in the darkness … they laid swords in the believers…” [Al-Tabari, vol.3, p.39, year 36H]

oh, well...if its in tabari it MUST be true. ill just stop arguing now. :dry:

good old answering-ansar zindabaad



Chapter Three: Identifying Uthman’s killers

So far we have proved that the stories relating to Ibn Saba killing Uthman have been fabricated for the purpose of veilng the actual Sahaba that killed Uthman. We shall now proceed to give details of each and every individual who played a lead role in the agitation against Uthman that lead to his murder.

Abu Sulaiman’s denial about Sahaba’s role in agitation and the murder of Uthman

It is indeed amusing that Abu Sulaiman had claimed in his opening defence of Uthman:

Ansar.Org stated:

Every sane man would have no doubts that the killers of Uthman were not the Companions. The Companions, may Allah be pleased at them, did not participate in this murder, nor did they approve of it. On the contrary, the Companions defended him and stood by Uthman’s side.

Reply One

If this was indeed true then it would mean that ALL the Sahaba stood shoulder to shoulder protecting Uthman from the ‘Sabaies’ and Egyptians. This would pinpoint the presence of hundreds of thousands of Sahaba protecting Uthman. This being the case how is it that a group of rebels were able to penetrate through these minions of loyal defenders and kill the Khalifa? If we are to accept the traditions that Abu Sulaiman had cited not more than 5 individuals are mentioned, clearly this does not constitute all the Sahaba so where were they? Why were they not defending Uthman as Abu Sulaiman claims? The answer is that companions were themselves involved in the agitation and murder of Uthman whether that involved participating with Egyptian forces or in local groups.

Reply Two

Imam Ayji testifies in his famed work Al-Mawaqif, Volume 3 page 642 that the murder of Uthman involved the companions and this fact is Mutawatir (with successive chains of narrations):

æÃãÇ ÇáÝÊä æÇáÍÑæÈ ÇáæÇÞÚÉ Èíä ÇáÕÍÇÈÉ ÝÇáåÔÇãíÉ ÃäßÑæÇ æÞæÚåÇ æáÇ Ôß Ãäå ãßÇÈÑÉ ááÊæÇÊÑ Ýí ÞÊá ÚËãÇä ææÞÚÉ ÇáÌãá æÕÝíä

“About the sedition (fitna) and wars which took place among the companions, the Hyshamya (sect) deny it, and no doubt that they (the deniers) do prevaricate, because about the murder of Uthman, the battles of Jamal and Sefeen, it is Mutawatir”

And what more relevant testimony can there be other than of the victim himself? The ‘companions of Prophet ’ who the Nasibi author claims were then the ‘companions of Uthman’ were in his opinion his enemies. Ibn Katheer records the following incident in Al Bidayah Wal Nihayah (Urdu), Vol 7 page 353 (published by Nafees Academy, Karachi):

“Imam Ahmed stated: Ishaq bin Sulaiman told us that he heard Muawiyah bin Aslam that Salmah narrated from Mutraf from Nafi’e from Ibn Umair that Uthman during his siege looked at his companions and said: ‘Why do you people want to kill me? I have heard Holy Prophet that the blood of a person becomes Halal only in three conditions i.e. if he committed adultery after marriage, such a man should be stoned to death, or someone deliberately killed another person, his punishment is death or if someone becomes apostate, his punishment is death as well. By Allah! I neither committed adultery during the days of ignorance nor during the days of Islam, nor have I killed someone that I may give Qasas via my life, also I didn’t become apostate after becoming Muslim. I testify that there is no God except Allah and Muhammad is His prophet and Messenger’. Nasai has narrated it Ahmed bin Al-Azahar from Ishaq bin Sulaiman.”

Al Bidayah Wal Nihayah (Arabic), Vol 7 page 202

This tradition is recoreded in Musnad Ahmad bin Hanbal, Volume 1 page 63 while the margin writers of the book such as Shaykh Shu'aib al-Arnaout declared it ‘Hasan’ and Shaykh Ahmad Shakir declared it ‘Sahih’ (Musnad Ahmad, v2 p358).

On the next page we find a similar tradition recorded by Ibn Katheer which begins in this manner:

“Imam Ahmed stated: ‘Qatan told us Yunus (Ibn Abi Ishaq) narrated from his father that he heard Abu Salmah bin Abdulrehman that Uthman during his siege looked outside his palace and stated: ‘In the name of Allah I make an appeal to the person who saw the Holy Prophet on the day of Hira, when mountain shook, He struck his foot on it…’”

This tradition is recoreded in Musnad Ahmad bin Hanbal, Volume 1 page 59 while both Shaykh Shu'aib al-Arnaout and Shaykh Ahmad Shakir declared it ‘Sahih’ (Musnad Ahmad, v2 p343).

The statement of Uthman makes it clear that the people who had beseiged him and wanted to murder him were companions of the Holy Prophet , which is why he appealed directly to those individuals and reminded them to testify that they had seen the incident of Hira at the time of Holy Prophet . That is why Imam Ibn Hajar Asqalani in Uthman’s biography testified:

æÌÇÁ ãä ØÑÞ ßËíÑÉ ÔåíÑÉ ÕÍíÍÉ Úä ÚËãÇä áãÇ Ãä ÃÍÕÑæå ÃäÊÔÏ ÇáÕÍÇÈÉ Ýí ÃÔíÇÁ

“It has been narrated with different renowned and Sahih chains that when they besieged Uthman, he beseeched the Sahabah for various things”

Isaba, Volume 4 page 378 Translation No. 5452

When one wishes to resolve hostilities with an opponent, he will beseech that person, so that the matter can be amicably resolved. You beseech with those that you are in dispute. Uthman was likewise pleading with the Sahaba that he was in direct conflict with, Sahaba that would ultimately shed his blood.

We read in Kanz al Ummal, Volume 13 page 82:

“When the Egyptian forces landed at Jahafa and began to talk ill of Uthman, he got to know about it and climbed on the pulpit and said, “O Sahaba of Prophet Muhammad (s), May Allah curse you for bad mouthing me. You advertised my shortcomings and concealed my virtues. You have also provoked people against me.

Kanz al Ummal, Volume 13 page 82 Tradition 36293

Reply Three

At this point we have cited light proofs for the involvement of the Sahabah in the agitation and murder of Uthman. We shall now cite an array of evidences about each and every Sahabi involved in the agitation and murder of Uthman. Once we have submitted such evidence, readers shall have no doubt about the role of the Sahabah in the murder of 3rd caliph of Ahle Sunnah.

Aisha’s lead role in killing Uthman

Many of the books of Ahle Sunnah record that Aisha had declared Uthman a Nathal that should be killed. Amongst those texts are the following:

1. Al Nahaya, Volume 5 page 80

2. Qamus, page 500 "lughut Nathal" by Firozabadi

3. Lisan al Arab, Volume 11 Chapter "Lughuth Nathal" page 670

4. Sharh Nahjul Balagha Ibn al Hadeed Volume 2 page 122

5. Sheikh al-Mudhira, by Mahmoud Abu Raya, p170 (foot note)

6. Al-Imama wa al-Siyasa, Volume 1 page 52

7. Tarikh Mukhtasar al-Duwal, by Ibn Al-Ebrei, v1 p55

8. Al-Mahsol, by al-Razi, v4 p343

Ibn Qutayba in his book Al-Imama wa al-Siyasa records:

Abdullah bin Muslim (ibn Qutayba) from Ibn Abi Maryam and Ibn Ufair – from Ibn Uon – from Mukhol bin Ibrahim and Abu Hamza al-Thumali – from Ali bin al-Hussain who said: ‘… then Ubaid said to her: ‘The first one to incite the people against him was you, and you used to say, ‘kill this Nathal because he has become dissolute.’’’

AND

Aysha was inciting people against Uthman, when she was informed about his murder while she was in Makka, she spoke in the Shrine (Makka) and said: ‘I believe that Uthman shall bring ill luck on his people (Ummayads) just as Abu Sufyan brought ill luck on his people (disbelievers) on the Day of Badr’.

Ansab al Ashraf, Volume 6 page 212

Aisha’s actions against Uthman were as follows:

1. She incited people by declaring Uthman to be a kaafir who should be killed.

2. When the rebels closed in on Uthman, she left for the Hajj and refused to intervene and save Uthman’s life.

3. She encouraged Ibn Abbas to move against Uthman , and made it clear that Talha would be a worthy successor when Uthman dies.

4. When Uthman died Aisha said Uthman brought bad luck to the Banu Ummayya.

Whilst Uthman was alive, Aisha was his bitter opponent; she wanted people to overthrow him and indicated to Ibn Abbas that Talha was the man who could lead the people after Uthman. The indication that Ali bin Abi Talib [as] would succeed had clearly angered Aisha who brought the conversation to an abrupt end.

what do you think about this?

saba'ites....what is it with you sunnis loving the fictional ibn saba??? your stance is so typically sunni i dont even need to think up a response...answering-ansar wrote an article specificallty for small minded people like you incapable of original and logical thought.

chew on this.

Sayf Ibn Umar – The fabricator of the story

If one analyses the chains of narrations of all these fairy tales, you will notice that one name Sayf Ibn Umar is at the centre of such stories, whilst there are some narrations in this regard that don't even have any chains of narration. There are also some narrations about Abdullah Ibn Saba which are not transmitted through Sayf Ibn Umar, but these narrations do not mention the involvement of ‘Sabaies’ in the murder of Uthman rather they are only cite the existence of one such person and this is totally different from the fairy tale painted by Sayf Ibn Umar.

There is an ijma (unanimous opinion) amongst the Ahle-Sunnah that the narrator Sayf Ibn Umar was a cursed person who narrated all types of lies. They have written all types of negative remarks about him that include Zandiq, Kadhab (liar) and untrustworthy and his traditions have no value and they all are weak. For example Imam of Salafies Al-Albaani declared him a liar (Silsila Sahiha, v3 p184) so did Mahmood Abu Raya (Adhwa ala alsunnah, p139). Imam Ibn Abi Hatim (Al-Jarh wa al-Tadil, v4 p278), Imam al-Haythami (Majm'a al-Zawaed, v8, p98) and Shaykh Shu'aib al-Arnaout (Margin of Siar alam alnubala, v3 p27) declared him Matruk while Yahya Mukhtar al-Ghazawi said: ‘There is an agreement on him being Matruk’ (Foot note of Abdullah bin Uday’s book al-Kamil, v3 p435). Those who declared him weak are Imam Ibn Hajar (Taqrib al-Tahdib, v1 p408), Imam Yahya ibn Mueen (Tarikh Ibn Mueen, v1 p336), Imam Al-Nesai (Al-Du'afa, p187) and Al-Aqili (Al-Du'afa by Aqili, v2 p175) while he has been decalred as ‘Very weak’ by Al-Salehi al-Shami (Subul al-Huda wa al-Rashad, v11 p143). Imam Ibn Haban said: ‘He narrates fabricated traditions’ (Al-Majrohin, v1 p345). Allamah Abu Naeem al-Asbahani said: ‘He is nothing’ (Al-Du'afa, by Abu Naeem, p91) and so did Imam Abu Daud (Sualat al-ajeri, v1 p214). Imam Ibn al-Jawzi said: ‘He is accused of fabricating hadith’ (Al-Mudu'at, by ibn al-Jawzi, v1 p222). Allamah Sibt Ibn al-Ejmi said: ‘He used to fabricate hadith’ (Al-Kashf al-Hathith, p131). Abdullah bin Uday said: ‘His narration is munkar’ (Mezan al-Etidal, v2 p255). Al-Hakim said: ‘Sayf is accused of being a heretic. His narrations are abandoned.’ (Tarikh al-islam, v11 p161). Hassan bin Farhan al-Maliki said: ‘Fabricator’ (Naho Enqad al-Tarikh, p34). Al-Dhahabi says about him: "Sayf Ibn Umar wrote two books, which have been unanimously rejected by scholars”. (Al-Mughani fil Dhufa, page 292).

It is interesting that although the Ulema of Ahle Sunnah rejected this narrator and his two books that contained all sorts of stories regarding the role of Sabiees (or Shias) in the agitation and murder of Uthman, the Ulema of Ahle Sunnah have taken some stories from it and have included it in their books with then intention that they may act as a veil over the roles of certain prominent Sahabah that acted in the murder of Uthman.

when the Quran says Prophet wives are mother of believers then they are Quran doesn't say except for aisha(ra)

you dont want to follow the Quran then that is your choice

LOL WTF?!?!?!

shes not ummul momineen...shes ummul mushrikeen. only mushrikeen see her as their mother.

the prophets wives were of two types. the good and the hellbound. ammi jaan aisha definately belongs to the hellbound one. their being "mothers" does not make them immune to judgement no matter what their sin.

can we see our mothers hair? YES

can we hug our mothers? YES

if we go on a journey, can we sleep in the same room as our mothers? YES

can we see the wives of the prophets hair? NO

can we hug wives of the prophet? NO

if we go on a journey, can we sleep in the same room as wives of the prophet? NO.

so how are they like our biological mothers???

they are like our mothers, and this ayat was revealed, because some randy sahabas (talha) wanted to marry ammi jaan aisha after the prophet died and he was told not to because they are like our mothers in the sense we cannot marry them.

this does NOT make them somehow able to do whatever they feel like and not worry about the consequences.

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