Will You Marry Him?

[Rawshni]

(bismillah)

(salam)

Your family proposes marriage for you with a man who is one of the most attractive, pious, well mannered, well-educated, and blessed with a really good income..

They come back that with the message that he is prepared to marry you provided:

You agree to adopt one baby for each child you two have.

Will you marry him?

If yes, why? If no, why?

Detailed answers please. Thank you.

[I Believe]

I probably would marry him.... I'm adopted so I'd love to adopt also.

[lalala123]

Definitely, it would probably make me want to marry him more. It shows he has a social conscience if he wants adopt, I would be very impressed indeed!!

[Rawshni]

Lovely answer from both the sisters.

Let us see what others have to say.

[Armans Wife]

But isn't the ruling about adoption rather complicated in islam? Will the adopted children be mahram to the parents??

I would mind about adoption, but you can also support less fortunate children by being foster parents.

[Rawshni]

I am not sure, but if a woman breast feeds a girl wityh the milk of her husband [milk resulting from lactating after having borne the husband's child] that girl becomes a mahram to the husband.The feeding should be according to the conditions laid down. Once again, this is not a ruling,from a marj'a just a possibility I am putting down. I may be wrong.

So far as baby boy is concerned, once a woman breastfeeds him, he does become her mahram.

Edited August 7, 2008 by Rawshni

[Armans Wife]

I am not sure, but if a woman breast feeds a girl wityh the milk of her husband [milk resulting from lactating after having borne the husband's child] that girl becomes a mahram to the husband.The feeding should be according to the conditions laid down. Once again, this is not a ruling,from a marj'a just a possibility I am putting down. I may be wrong.

So far as baby boy is concerned, once a woman breastfeeds him, he does become her mahram.

I am aware of that, what do you call it... hmm.. siblings by breastfeed.. lol I forget the term. But many people adopt because they cannot have children on their own, what will be the ruling of this as the woman will not be able to lactate.

Lets take a scenario, a girl was adopted and later in her life she decided to become a practicing muslim. Her adopted mother never nursed her and that would made the father namahram to her while he's the only father she knows. Wouldn't it be akkward if you can't hug or kiss your own 'father' because of this ruling :o

I really want to know the rulings but I don't feel like writing my marja in proper English... @)

[Rawshni]

I really want to know the rulings but I don't feel like writing my marja in proper English... @)

That is one of the most fantastic reasons I have ever hear hear .

The girl, even if she does not become a muslim, remains a naamahram tp the man who is the only father she has known.

[Armans Wife]

^ yes I know but wouldn't that be sad for the family :(

[Rawshni]

Very.

[*Slave of Zahra*]

lol ^ that cracked me up haha

anyway...hmm

i think the guy in this situation is living in an angelina jolie fantasy and he needs to wake up

jk

seriously i dont think i would because its so demanding on his behalf...what kind of condition is that...think about it....if i wanna have four biological kids that means i have to accept eight kids in total? thats not funny. :o

[Rawshni]

^

Give him a wake up call

[Zuljenah]

(bismillah)

(salam)

Your family proposes marriage for you with a man who is one of the most attractive, pious, well mannered, well-educated, and blessed with a really good income..

They come back that with the message that he is prepared to marry you provided:

You agree to adopt one baby for each child you two have.

Will you marry him?

If yes, why? If no, why?

Detailed answers please. Thank you.

YES! He sounds PERFECT :wub: Find me such a man, I'll marry him! :D I plan on adopting InshAllah. It's such a wonderful thing to do! why would anyone object?

[Zuljenah]

I am aware of that, what do you call it... hmm.. siblings by breastfeed.. lol I forget the term. But many people adopt because they cannot have children on their own, what will be the ruling of this as the woman will not be able to lactate.

Lets take a scenario, a girl was adopted and later in her life she decided to become a practicing muslim. Her adopted mother never nursed her and that would made the father namahram to her while he's the only father she knows. Wouldn't it be akkward if you can't hug or kiss your own 'father' because of this ruling :o

I really want to know the rulings but I don't feel like writing my marja in proper English... @)

I'll probably get attacked for saying this, but whatever. I think that's silly. If he raised the child from when she was just a baby, even if she is TECHNICALLY na-mahram to her, I see no reason why he can't hug his own daughter when she is older. I think that's absurd. To him, she is his daughter. If he's a DECENT man, he will NEVER think of her as anything BUT his daughter. So this whole issue of mahram-ness shouldn't even be an issue in my opinion. And I know that goes against what Islam says, blah blah, but whatever. I think any decent male will not have any sexual feelings for a girl he raised from babyhood to adulthood. That's just insane.

And in the event he DOES end up having those feelings for her when she is a woman, then he isn't worth hugging anyway, cause he's obviously not decent then, so screw him.

Just my two cents.

[Silent Prayer]

(salam)

yes of course! ^_^ i would love to adopt.

[postmaster1923]

If he is able to support me and all those children, yes, but only if he wants to adopt orphans, not babies whose mothers want money for giving them up for adoption.

[Rawshni]

I'll probably get attacked for saying this, but whatever. I think that's silly. If he raised the child from when she was just a baby, even if she is TECHNICALLY na-mahram to her, I see no reason why he can't hug his own daughter when she is older. I think that's absurd. To him, she is his daughter. If he's a DECENT man, he will NEVER think of her as anything BUT his daughter. So this whole issue of mahram-ness shouldn't even be an issue in my opinion. And I know that goes against what Islam says, blah blah, but whatever. I think any decent male will not have any sexual feelings for a girl he raised from babyhood to adulthood. That's just insane.

And in the event he DOES end up having those feelings for her when she is a woman, then he isn't worth hugging anyway, cause he's obviously not decent then, so screw him.

Just my two cents.

You don't know what all can happen with the PC Islamic guys

[Caelum]

I'll probably get attacked for saying this, but whatever. I think that's silly. If he raised the child from when she was just a baby, even if she is TECHNICALLY na-mahram to her, I see no reason why he can't hug his own daughter when she is older. I think that's absurd. To him, she is his daughter. If he's a DECENT man, he will NEVER think of her as anything BUT his daughter. So this whole issue of mahram-ness shouldn't even be an issue in my opinion. And I know that goes against what Islam says, blah blah, but whatever. I think any decent male will not have any sexual feelings for a girl he raised from babyhood to adulthood. That's just insane.

And in the event he DOES end up having those feelings for her when she is a woman, then he isn't worth hugging anyway, cause he's obviously not decent then, so screw him.

Just my two cents.

thats if you lived in the ideal world. Reality is totally different and it has nothing to do with a decent man but with shaytan and the weakness of mankind.

[miss shah]

raising kids is hard, not as easy as men think. i would like to adopt but only if i can give him everythink i could. i would want mu husband to understand its not all about money. its a strange request but i dont think i could handle having sooo many children.

its stupid to say a father cant hug his adopted daughter, thats really stupid. he is a father and will (should) only see his daughter as his daughter.

[Caelum]

raising kids is hard, not as easy as men think. i would like to adopt but only if i can give him everythink i could. i would want mu husband to understand its not all about money. its a strange request but i dont think i could handle having sooo many children.

its stupid to say a father cant hug his adopted daughter, thats really stupid. he is a father and will (should) only see his daughter as his daughter.

so youre basically saying that the islamic ruling is stupid :huh:

[Hopeful]

If I can breastfeed the child, maybe, I would accept the condition. It also depends on the way he communicates it to me, and states his reason as to why he wants so.

I would explain to him though, that as as parents, there will always be fear that we might commit some injustice towards the orphan or our own kid in an attempt to balance between the both, I dread being put in such a situation. And I would also put a condition, that we will have one biological kid and one adopted, because I can't take care of more than two. I would like to give my kids a good life and upbringing, rather than having a lot of kids.

[miss shah]

well if mu husband wouldnt be allowd to hug his own daughter even tho he raised her then yea in this cause its stupid

[Hopeful]

^

This is my personal experience and need not apply to all. No offense to anybody.

As I have grown up in life, many rulings which seemed stupid to me earlier, started making sense. So, today, when I find a ruling; I feel is stupid, I just give it the benefit of doubt. :)

Edited August 8, 2008 by Hopeful

[Caelum]

^

This is my personal experience and need not apply to all. No offense to anybody.

As I have grown up in life, many rulings which seemed stupid to me earlier, started making sense. So, today, when I find a ruling; I feel is stupid, I just give it the benefit of doubt. :)

Ahsanti! theres no such thing as a stupid ruling, just our own ignorance.

[Hopeful]

^

Bro, as I said, I feel is stupid, I meant, that I don't understand and agree, but, then I tell myself that I do not know and will learn the reason with time :)

[Caelum]

^

Bro, as I said, I feel is stupid, I meant, that I [/b]don't understand and agree, but, then I tell myself that I do not know and will learn the reason with time :)

thats why i said its because of our own ignorance that some may feel its stupid, but if we knew its reason we would think otherwise. theres no ruling that has no logic explanation, some we might understand later in this life, some we will not understand at all in this life.

btw Im a sis

[Hopeful]

thats why i said its because of our own ignorance that some may feel its stupid, but if we knew its reason we would think otherwise. theres no ruling that has no logic explanation, some we might understand later in this life, some we will not understand at all in this life.

^

True :)

btw Im a sis

Oops, Sorry Sis.

I have a serious question, why are certaing rulings of marja opposite to each other, kindly join this thread and explain, if you can :)

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/index.php?sh...p;#entry1726431

[Rawshni]

well if mu husband wouldnt be allowd to hug his own daughter even tho he raised her then yea in this cause its stupid

(salam)

Rulings come down to us as one-liners and two liners.

In actuality, each question is discussed threadbare by a panel of learned ulema led by a mujtahed,[ all of them can be muktaeheds in some cases] and then a conclusion arrived at.

Best thing to do is ask for the "dalael" reasons when asking for ruling.

Be prepared to wait long, not because they will take long to get those reasons, but because they usually do not have full time, professional english typists.

And be prepared read lots and lots of pages, could be even three hundred in response to a single question.

[Path2Felicity]

I don't think it has to do with whether the man has sexual feelings for the girl he raises. I think that, in Islam, we can't take someone away from their own family lineage and attach them to our own family lineage. What do they say here... blood is thicker than water? (or something?).

If I adopt a son, I would not be so arrogant as to presume that he is now part of my blood. Things just don't happen that way. I believe that is the main reasoning behind the rulings.

Wasalaam

[Hopeful]

^

Good justification, sounds reasonable. :)

[Rawshni]

The ethics of marrying a girl one has raised as a daughter are, however, very dubious

[Nabeeha]

Salaam,

I would if i loved him. My mother is adopted and i would like to and if he is such a good man that wants to love and provide for a child not his blodd then he is a good man.

Maa salaam

[Cary Grant]

well rawsh if the couple goes along with the guys/gal's stipulation, and adopt a <2yo baby with each child that they have of their own, the practicality of that is that if the wife has sufficient breast milk (and no other complicating factors), then she can in terms of fiqh, make each adopted child mahram. is this why you thought up this scenario? most people with twins will tell you that its not easy. heck just having one child is not easy. but if you want to raise a child as your own, and want to follow the fiqh out there, this really would be one of the most practical ways of doing it.

However this scenario cannot be guaranteed, so in effect, the stipulation would have to make allowance for that. As much as I hate to admit it, I think I'll side a little with the egotistical, non charitable, vulgar males on this .. at least slightly. Making a demand in regards to something like this just suggests a bit of naivity. I mean she/he has good intentions perhaps, but no practical sense of the possibilities that lie ahead. Lets presume they follow present day main stream shia fiqh or at least intend to, what if there is no one to breastfeed the child to make him/her mahram, what then? What if their financial situation struggles to support only one child at the time? What if her health does not allow her to care for one child, let alone two? lots of what ifs.

Furthermore this in effect discriminates against older children. What will be done in their regard? And really what the word adoption constitutes in this stipulation needs to be defined. Is it raising a child as your own, or more like being a benefactor to a child? Its all well and good to say hey i want to adopt a child for each child we have of our own, I feel strongly enough about this to make it a stipulation in my marriage contract, but I would be more concerned to see if they had put real thought into something they claim to feel so strongly about. Rather than awwwww :wub:, id be interrogating them for answers to these questions and more i.e. if they have caught my fancy to begin with.

The rough idea we get from your mirrored threads seems to be that guys dont like being told what to do, and really are not so hot about the idea of adopting as the gals are. really no surprises there.

[Abbas.]

and really are not so hot about the idea of adopting as the gals are. really no surprises there.

In reality, men are more likely to adopt children than women. They adopt at twice the rate women do.

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http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20080807/APA/808071014

http://www.redorbit.com/news/health/151568...ends/index.html

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?.../a101612D83.DTL

http://www.healthcentral.com/newsdetail/408/618262.html

http://www.chattershmatter.com/2008/08/08/...ate-than-women/

[Rawshni]

^

Somebody true said that old foxes are always more with it than young cubs