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In the Name of God بسم الله

Intercession In Islam

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On that occasion, was the request asked that Ali AS was going to ask Allah? or was it perhaps just asking for help in the battle?

What I am asking is , for example could one say Ya Ali ask Allah to help me with such and such,

Maidah 55 is a very interesting verse with relevance to your questions.

If you subscribe to the Shia definition of Wali al Amr, and are aware of the different connotations of Wali, the verse answers your question fully.

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YAALIMADAD....

FOR ONE AND FOR ALL (SHIA) WHO WILL BE THE INTERECESSOR.

I AM NEW TO THIS FORUM AND HAVE READ SOME TOPICS LAID DOWN IN THIS FORM AND CAME TO THIS CONCLUSION THAT THERE R STILL SOME DOUBTS IN OUR FAITH (AQEEDA). NOW, THIS QUESTION IS PARTICULARLY FOR THOSE FRNDS WHO QUOTE BY SAYING "YA ALI MADAD OR YA Allah MADAD".

YAALIMADAD....

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(salam)

Brothers/sisters I have a question regarding a surah I was reading today, Surah al-Sajda, when I came upon ayah no.4

"God (it is) Who created the heavens and the earth and what is between them in six days (stages) and got firm on His Throne (of authority), for you there is none besides Him of a guardian, nor any intercessor; What! will ye not then reflect?"

I haven't spoken to an alim yet, so I just wanted to post here to see any good answers first :)

Please help me in understanding how we can do tawassul through our anbiya' and Imams when it is said in the ayah we only have Allah as our intercessor. Jazakallah khayr

(wasalam)

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Salaam.

That ayah is speaking of the false intercession. Read these Ayat:

ãóäú ÐóÇ ÇáøóÐöí íóÔúÝóÚõ ÚöäúÏóåõ ÅöáøóÇ ÈöÅöÐúäö

"Who is he whom can intercede with Him except after his permission?" (2:255)

ãóÇ ãöäú ÔóÝöíÚò ÅöáøóÇ ãöäú ÈóÚúÏö ÅöÐúäöåö

"There is no intercessor except after His permission." (10:3)

etc.,etc.

- Mansab

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AssalaamuaAlaykum,

Brother Mansab has Ayat's that should clear up doubts of the OP.

I also had a question regarding intercession after i read Ayat's like the one by brother Mansab:

Who will Allah give this permission to? I know ofcourse the Prophet (SAW) but to whom else exactly? We read in dua -e Tawasul that the 12 Imams (PBUT) them will and also Bibi Fatima tuz Zahra (peace and blessings of Allah be on her) but is there anyone else?

Salaam

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Ah, jazakallah khayr guys. Brother Mansab, could you perhaps help me to understand why is there a need then for the ayah that I provided when the ayahs you provided not contradict it, but...basically elaborate on it. Even more puzzling, one is before Suraht al Sajda, and the other is after. Do you perhaps know the reasoning why Allah (swt) mentions it more than once, when one time can clear it up?

And he first says that we can seek intercession by others through his permission only, but then says only through him, then again says with others through his permission only?

And what exactly is the 'false' intercession? Like through idols or such?

Shukran bro.

Edited by jund_el_mahdi
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Al hamdullilah I have this surah memorized and read it every day. The verse you asked is a verse that muslim bashers like to quote and they say that the Quran is contradictory because here the verse says they will have no protector or intercessor yet if you look at ayatul kursi for example it states "man dhal ladhi yashfau indahu illa bi indhni" - none will be able to intercede on their behalf except by his leave. To the ignorant person these verses are seemingly contradictory but to the learned individual they are far from it. First off, let me just say that intercession (tawasul) in Islam is definetly legitimate and there is no problem with using it. In Surah Sajdah Allah (swt) is speaking about the kafireen and mushrikeen in that FOR THEM there is no intercessor or protector meaning their idols will not benefit them in the least. But in Ayatul kursi it is clear that intercession is definetly an option for the people whom Allah ALLOWS the power of intercession such as Rasoolulah (sawa). There is a hadith which Iam not sure if the shia consider it sahih but it even states that the person who memorizes the Quran will be able to intercede on behalf of 10 people of his family who were destined for hell.

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ws

God (it is) Who created the heavens and the earth and what is between them in six days (stages) and got firm on His Throne (of authority), for you there is none besides Him of a guardian (Wali), nor any intercessor; What! will ye not then reflec

The verse is talking about 'guardians' (Wali) and intercessors independent from Allah swt.

The proof for that is we do have 'guardians' other than Allah swt according to the Quran, eg, 5:55

'Your WALI is only Allah, His Prophet and those who believe and give zakaat in Ruku...'

There is also another verse thats alreafy been quoted, that starts off just like the one you quoted (see purple), by taling about creation in 6 days, the throne, and then mentioning intercession. We have to take them together and not just look at one ignoring the other:

10:3] Lo! your Lord is Allah Who created the heavens and the earth in six Days, then He established Himself upon the Throne, directing all things. There is no intercessor (with Him) save after His permission. That is Allah, your Lord, so worship Him. Oh, will ye not remind?

The bit in bold shows that there will be intercessors, but only by His permission (and therefore not independent of Him).

Im sure there are other ways of explaining the verses other than what Ive written so by all means...

Edited by .InshAllah.
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(bismillah) (salam)

Intercession Of Imam Hossein (as)

When Imam Hossein (as) was born, Allah sent down the angel Jibrail (as) to congratulate the family (as)

of Holy Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) .

On the way down from the heavens angel Jibrail (as) passed an island, on which the angel Fitrus was

sent to by Allah because he had been naughty. Fitrus had also had his wings taken away by Allah.

When Fitrus saw Jibrail (as) he asked him where he was going. Jibrail (as) told him that he was going

to congratulate the Holy Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) and his family (as) on the birth of Imam Hossein (as).

Fitrus asked if he could also go with him. Jibrail (as) agreed with the permission of Allah and so carried him

down to earth.

When the angels reached the Holy Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) and congratulated him and his family,

the Holy Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) told Fitrus to go to Imam Hossein (as).

When Fitrus touched Imam Hossein's (as) cradle his wings were given back to him by Allah, who had forgiven him.

http://www.ezsoftech.com/stories/imamhussain2.asp

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When I want something from my dad, I ask my mom to talk to him. He';s more likely to say yes to her than he is to me.

My father used to tell me to ask him myself and not be shy, but i'd still get my mother to ask him for me, he'd call me and tell me why am I still asking my mum when he told me not to, and he'd make me ask him to his face.

Edited by o0o0o
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My father used to tell me to ask him myself and not be shy, but i'd still get my mother to ask him for me, he'd call me and tell me why am I still asking my mum when he told me not to, and he'd make me ask him to his face.

http://hadithproofsfortawassul.blogspot.com/ - by a sunni from sunni sources.

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(bismillah)

(salam)

let me quote from sahih muslim

these few ahadeeth would give you a good idea of the significance of intercession

you can always check them here

http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/crcc/en...im/031.smt.html

Chapter 55: THE MERITS OF UWAIS QARANI (Allah BE PLEASED WITH HIM)

Book 031, Number 6170:

Usair b. Jabir reported that a delegation from Kufa came to 'Umar and there was a person amongst them who jeered at Uwais. Thereupon Umar said: Is there amongst us one from Qaran? That person came and Umar said: Verily Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) has said: There would come to you a person from Yemen who would be called Uwais and he would leave none in Yemen (behind him) except his mother, and he would have the whiteness (due to leprosy) and he supplicated Allah and it was cured except for the size of a dinar or dirham. He who amongst you meets him should ask him to supplicate for forgiveness (from Allah) for you.

Book 031, Number 6171:

'Umar b. Khattab reported: I heard Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: Worthy amongst the successors would be a person who would be called Uwais. He would have his mother (living with him) and he would have (a small) sign of leprosy. Ask him to beg pardon for you (from Allah).

Book 031, Number 6172:

Usair b. Jabir reported that when people from Yemen came to help (the Muslim army at the time of jihad) he asked them: Is there amongst you Uwais b. 'Amir? (He continued finding him out) until he met Uwais. He said: Are you Uwais b., Amir? He said: Yes. He said: Are you from the tribe of Qaran? He said: Yes. He (Hadrat) 'Umar (again) said: Did you suffer from leprosy and then you were cured from it but for the space of a dirham? He said: Yes. He ('Umar) said: Is your mother (living)? He said: Yes. He ('Umar) said: I heard Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) say: There would come to you Uwais b. Amir with the reinforcement from the people of Yemen. (He would be) from Qaran, (the branch) of Murid. He had been suffering from leprosy from which he was cured but for a spot of a dirham. His treatment with his mother would have been excellent. If he were to take an oath in the name of Allah, He would honour that. And if it is possible for you, then do ask him to beg forgiveness for you (from your Lord). So he (Uwais) begged forgiveness for him. Umar said: Where do you intend to go? He said: To Kufa. He ('Umar) said: Let me write a letter for you to its governor, whereupon he (Uwais) said: I love to live amongst the poor people. When it was the next year, a person from among the elite (of Kufa) performed Hajj and he met Umar. He asked him about Uwais. He said: I left him in a state with meagre means of sustenance. (Thereupon) Umar said: I heard Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: There would come to you Uwais b. 'Amir, of Qaran, a branch (of the tribe) of Murid, along with the reinforcement of the people of Yemen. He had been suffering from leprosy which would have been cured but for the space of a dirham. His treatment with his mother would have been very kind. If he would take an oath in the name of Allah (for something) He would honour it. Ask him to beg forgiveness for you (from Allah) in case it is possible for you. So he came to Uwais and said.: Beg forgiveness (from Allah) for me. He (Uwais) said: You have just come from a sacred journey (Hajj) ; you, therefore, ask forgiveness for me. He (the person who had performed Hajj) said: Ask forgiveness for me (from Allah). He (Uwais again) said: You have just come from the sacred journey, so you ask forgiveness for me. (Uwais further) said: Did you meet Umar? He said: Yes. He (Uwais) then begged forgiveness for him (from Allah). So the people came to know about (the status of religious piety) of Uwais. He went away (from that place). Usair said: His clothing consisted of a mantle, and whosoever saw him said: From where did Uwais get this mantle?

i hope this clarifies.

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^ Please note that Uwais was a living person, and that Omar r.a was not asking him at a grave or asking a favour from a dead pious person.

True there's also another hadith Where Umar asks Al Abbas ( a living person ) to ask Allah for something ..intercession and Tawassul from a dead pious person is alien and doesn't exist in Sunni Islam

Edited by Al Risalah
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(bismillah)

(salam)

intercession and Tawassul from a dead pious person is alien and doesn't exist in Sunni Islam

check out this link

http://www.minhajbooks.com/en.php?control=...89&read=txt

read this incident quoted by tahir qadri in his book, at-Tawassul ind-al-A'imma wal-Muhaddithin, page 23,24,25

it is available at this link,

http://www.minhajbooks.com/en.php?control=...84&read=img

post-51753-1245441940_thumb.png

post-51753-1245441967_thumb.png

post-51753-1245441996_thumb.png

Edited by toocoool66
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(bismillah)

(salam)

Why do you need to do this when Allah gave you a heart phone to call him from?

35. íóÇ ÃóíøõåóÇ ÇáøóÐöíäó ÂãóäõæÇ ÇÊøóÞõæÇ Çááøóåó æóÇÈúÊóÛõæÇ Åöáóíúåö ÇáúæóÓöíáóÉó æóÌóÇåöÏõæÇ Ýöí ÓóÈöíáöåö áóÚóáøóßõãú ÊõÝúáöÍõæäó

surat-ul-maidah

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(bismillah)

(salam)

35. íóÇ ÃóíøõåóÇ ÇáøóÐöíäó ÂãóäõæÇ ÇÊøóÞõæÇ Çááøóåó æóÇÈúÊóÛõæÇ Åöáóíúåö ÇáúæóÓöíáóÉó æóÌóÇåöÏõæÇ Ýöí ÓóÈöíáöåö áóÚóáøóßõãú ÊõÝúáöÍõæäó

surat-ul-maidah

Allah said to Moosaa, I am with you.

Allah is with you also sidi.

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(bismillah)

(salam)

35. íóÇ ÃóíøõåóÇ ÇáøóÐöíäó ÂãóäõæÇ ÇÊøóÞõæÇ Çááøóåó æóÇÈúÊóÛõæÇ Åöáóíúåö ÇáúæóÓöíáóÉó æóÌóÇåöÏõæÇ Ýöí ÓóÈöíáöåö áóÚóáøóßõãú ÊõÝúáöÍõæäó

surat-ul-maidah

To the one who posted the scans from tahir qadris book, im sorry i can't read urdu.

And the Sunni Tafsir of this Ayah is that the Waseelah, or the way with which we reach Allah s.w.t, is by our Good deeds and worship.

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(bismillah)

(salam)

To the one who posted the scans from tahir qadris book, im sorry i can't read urdu.

go through the first link

that is in english

And the Sunni Tafsir of this Ayah is that the Waseelah, or the way with which we reach Allah s.w.t, is by our Good deeds and worship.

read maarif-ul-quran, mufti-e-azam shafi usmani, english version, vol 3, page 144.

Now, after this lexical explanation of the word, 'Wasilah,' and the

exegetical notes from the Sahabah and Tabi'in, we do know how everything

which becomes the' means of achieving the pleasure and nearness

of Allah is, for a human being, the 'Wasilah' of becoming close to

Allah. As jncluded in it are faith and good deeds ,

so included therein are the company and the love of prophets

and righteous people as well, for that too is one of the causes of the

pleasure of Allah - and so, praying to Allah Almighty by making them

a Wasilah' should be correct, as was done by Sayyidna 'Umar

when he, at the time of a famine, making Sayyidna 'Abbas a 'Wasiah,'

made a prayer for rains before Almighty Allah. The prayer was answered.

It is reported that the Holy Prophet had himself

taught a blind Sahabi to pray with the words which are as follows : (0 Allah, I seek from You, and I ask for

Your attention with (the Wasilah of) Your Prophet, Muhammad, the

Prophet of Mercy. (Manar)

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I sometimes wonder if this is getting too much... I mean bringing Sunni sources everytime someone asks a question.

Do not get me wrong, this is all well and good when presenting them with a proof and debating them, but the one asking this question is a Shi'ite. And let's be honest, do we take our 'aqidah from others? No, we don't.. So it doesn't really matter in this case whether or not they mention it, we aren't in need of that.

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When I want something from my dad, I ask my mom to talk to him. He';s more likely to say yes to her than he is to me.

No one opposes natural help that one living person would ask from another. What we oppose is supernatural/divine help from those that are not living or can not hear.

Edited by night_stroller
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No one opposes natural help that one living person would ask from another. What we oppose is supernatural/divine help from those that are not living or can not hear.

You may want to read this blog post which is by a sunni: http://hadithproofsfortawassul.blogspot.co...awassul-of.html

http://hadithproofsfortawassul.blogspot.co...-after-his.html

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