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In the Name of God بسم الله

The Hypocrisy Of Dr. James White

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Nope. Clearly you just want to argue, and haven't bothered reading what the blogger actually wrote. Your loss. This post was for Marantha anyway.

FYI the blogger himself happens to be one of James White's followers who later on reverted to islam, after the arguments from our side swayed him to the path of the Ahlul-Bayt :D

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Nope. Clearly you just want to argue, and haven't bothered reading what the blogger actually wrote. Your loss. This post was for Marantha anyway.

FYI the blogger himself happens to be one of James White's followers who later on reverted to islam, after the arguments from our side swayed him to the path of the Ahlul-Bayt :D

Whatever. The basic argument against James White by Muslims is all the hand-waving about Torah prophecies that don't exist and never existed.

Quick -- find me the verses in the Torah that prophesiuzes what Ezra's name and appearance is going to be like? Isaiah? Jeremiah? Solomon? David? ANY Jewish prophet? For that matter, what is the Messiah name going to be?

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Whatever. The basic argument against James White by Muslims is all the hand-waving about Torah prophecies that don't exist and never existed.

Quick -- find me the verses in the Torah that prophesiuzes what Ezra's name and appearance is going to be like? Isaiah? Jeremiah? Solomon? David? ANY Jewish prophet? For that matter, what is the Messiah name going to be?

Why don't you at least read what the brother wrote about James White, because your argument is sooooooo off key and has absolutely NOTHING to do with what the brother was talking about.

Edited by Path2Felicity
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Why don't you at least read what the brother wrote about James White, because your argument is sooooooo off key and has absolutely NOTHING to do with what the brother was talking about.

The brother was making the same bogus argument in support of Islam and the Qur'an that is made here all the time. Just so I'm clear, because some people have expressed their offense at what I've written, I'm saying the ARGUMENTS are bogus.

The Torah NEVER, not once, mentions anything about Muhammed. Period.

I'm sorry that your religion has taught you a lie, and I'm sorry if that's some portion of the basis of you being a Muslim. Het-Mem-Dalet (חמד) is not a secret magical reference to Muhammed wherever one can find that triliteral root. If your religion teaches you that, most likely you got that sort belief from the Christians who like to find secret magical references to Jesus all over the place.

This doesn't mean Dr. White is correct or anything, it just means that if the brother is constructing an argument in favor of Islam on that basis, he's wrong.

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^^WRONG. And it goes to show you didn't read the brother's arguments

The brother was pointing out the hypocrisy in source materials that James White uses, while accusing muslims of doing the same.

I'll get you a cookie tomorrow princess!

Edited by YaZahraa`
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My response on the blog. (I also responded on his new blog)

Note that Dr. James White levels the accusation that Muslim Apologists are inconsistent in their usage of materials whilst attacking Christianity (claiming we use what is termed as Secular or Liberal Scholarship) yet we would never tolerate Christians using the same Scholarship on us or would never accept such works being used by Christian Apologists.

Its very true, in my encounters with Muslims they seem ill aware of the philosophical presuppositions that liberal, secular scholars bring to Christian texts when they are interpreting or attempting to verify history. Its simple, White is only pointing out that one *must* have a philosophy of history that is consistent with his supernatural view of the scriptures (Quran, Psalms et al) Shabir Ally is guilty of this as all types of apologetics I've seen myself.

For example Bart Erhman is nearly universally cited by Muslims in support of their position. But he offers not assistance to Islam because given his standard (recently in a debate with Dan Wallace he said knowing history with any certainty is impossible) it invalidates Islam as well and Muslims who cite or use him then demonstrate an inconsistent apologetic.

Dr White claims that all Muslim Apologists that he has encountered are guilty of such, note I can name him ones which he has mentioned on his show the dividing line that are not guilty of such tactics, such as Hamza Yusuf Hanson, Shabir Ally (despite James commonly accusing him of such) and Abu Ammar Yasir Qadhi.

I keep up with the Dividing Line and I've heard of two of those men. Shabir Ally is guilty of it, and even argued against this type of argument when he debated Robert Morey, so yes he has used it (at his convenience). Also, note that White is speaking of all the apologists he has encountered, not all Islamic apologists.

Speaking of Abu Ammar Yassir Qadhi, it's worth noting that Dr. White once falsely cited this text whilst using such highly acclaimed Scholarship as Answering-Islam to cite a fabricated Hadith about Ibn Masoud.

Which Dr. White admitted he utilized wrong I believe in his most recent Dividing Line. People ye even Apologists make mistakes.

Secondly, it's worth listing the most famous Christian Apologists against Islam and analysing the consistency of their arguments:

1) Jay Smith: Cites only Orientalist Works, and reads his own twisted understanding into the Koranic Text.

2) Sam Shamoun again guilty of the above.

3) Anis Shorrosh- uses any text left, right and centre and out of context to attempt to prove his crazy theories.

4) Andy Bannister- Guilty of the same as Jay Smith.

5) Keith Small- Guilty of the same as Jay Smith.

By citing these men do you then admit that the men that White has encountered are inconsistent? It means nothing to cite Christian apologists who are similar in their apologetic to Muslims, it implicilty means you are excusing these men because Christians do. I hardly believe this is consistent on your part. Perhaps you should demand consistency by Christians as Christians (like James White) do of Muslims. Also, I haven't heard these men so Im' not sure. I'm only demonstrating what are the logical conclusions of defending Muslim apologists on the basis of Christian 'error'

FYI the blogger himself happens to be one of James White's followers who later on reverted to islam, after the arguments from our side swayed him to the path of the Ahlul-Bayt

Oh really? So the man was a Reformed Christian? How sure are you of this?

If that is the case, he's an apostate. His condemnation is just.

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Oh really? So the man was a Reformed Christian? How sure are you of this?

Because he said so.

Btw I don't believe I buy you condemnation of Shabir Ally. He's not my favourite person in garbs but from one I have seen, he is consistent in his apologetics like the blogger said.

but regardless James White is as hypocritical as any muslim apologist he debates with. Most of the debates he engages in are with wahabi-ish scholars. I have yet to see debate with a scholar of as reputation as say Moderassi from us. The fact that he is busy debating the uneducated shows he's looking for an easy victory and that is just not cool.

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^^WRONG. And it goes to show you didn't read the brother's arguments

The brother was pointing out the hypocrisy in source materials that James White uses, while accusing muslims of doing the same.

I'll get you a cookie tomorrow princess!

Look, whatever.

Yes, I didn't read it through and through because the video was of some Christian idiot, and the bloggers profile is about being a born again at some point in time.

My point still stands -- Muslim apologists rely on the same faulty interpretations and understandings of Jewish scriptures that Christians use to justify Christianity. And that includes the best of the best -- folks like Ahmed Deedat.

Six die in Lebanon fighting

BEIRUT, Lebanon (CNN) -- Six people have been killed and 52 wounded since Thursday night in battles between pro- and anti-government forces in the northern Lebanese city of Tripoli, security forces told CNN.

Four people died Friday. After Lebanese soldiers arrived, the city quieted down, the sources said.

The fighting was prompted by animosities between Sunni supporters of the Western-backed majority in Parliament and members of the Alawite sect loyal to the Hezbollah-led opposition.

Earlier this month, the Lebanese government announced it had agreed on a unity Cabinet, a step aimed at stabilizing the country, which has been torn by internal strife.

In keeping with a deal sponsored by the Arab League, the new Cabinet gives 11 seats to Hezbollah and its allies that oppose the government, 16 to the government, and three to Lebanese President Michel Sleiman to fill by appointment. It gives Hezbollah veto power.

Edited by YaZahraa`
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Because he said so.

Btw I don't believe I buy you condemnation of Shabir Ally. He's not my favourite person in garbs but from one I have seen, he is consistent in his apologetics like the blogger said.

but regardless James White is as hypocritical as any muslim apologist he debates with. Most of the debates he engages in are with wahabi-ish scholars. I have yet to see debate with a scholar of as reputation as say Moderassi from us. The fact that he is busy debating the uneducated shows he's looking for an easy victory and that is just not cool.

As Salam Alaykum:

Brother you must admit it is funny to see evangelists and wahhabis debate. It is like watching two drunkards curse at eachother.

ws

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As Salam Alaykum:

Brother you must admit it is funny to see evangelists and wahhabis debate. It is like watching two drunkards curse at eachother.

ws

If the evagelists had any guts then they would debate REAL experts on Islam like Modaressi and not second rate scholars that aren't even grade school educated. Its obvious why they go after the wahabi types, because they want to insinuate that this is the best muslims have to offer. Let see them debate one of our ulema if they dare.

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If the evagelists had any guts then they would debate REAL experts on Islam like Modaressi and not second rate scholars that aren't even grade school educated. Its obvious why they go after the wahabi types, because they want to insinuate that this is the best muslims have to offer. Let see them debate one of our ulema if they dare.

Insinuation is a technique of dissemblance that they use. Do you expect weeds to produce fruit? What fun would it be to see Rajabali crush him?

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