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Benazir Bhutto Assassinated

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(Undercover Brother) "Whether she is a shia or not it doesn't matter because Shia Islam has a firm stance on what or who can be a leader and clearly it is against women rulers."

Why so?

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U.S. Brokered Bhutto's Return to Pakistan

For Benazir Bhutto, the decision to return to Pakistan was sealed during a telephone call from Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice just a week before Bhutto flew home in October. The call culminated more than a year of secret diplomacy -- and came only when it became clear that the heir to Pakistan's most powerful political dynasty was the only one who could bail out Washington's key ally in the battle against terrorism.

When Bhutto returned to the United States in September, Khalilzad asked for a lift on her plane from New York to Aspen, Colo., where both were giving speeches. They spent much of the five-hour plane ride strategizing, said sources familiar with the diplomacy.

Friends say Bhutto asked for U.S. help. "She pitched the idea to the Bush administration," said Peter W. Galbraith, a former U.S. ambassador and friend of Bhutto from their days at Harvard

The turning point to get Musharraf on board was a September trip by Deputy Secretary of State John D. Negroponte to Islamabad. "He basically delivered a message to Musharraf that we would stand by him, but he needed a democratic facade on the government, and we thought Benazir was the right choice for that face," said Bruce Riedel, a former CIA officer and National Security Council staff member now at the Brookings Institution's Saban Center for Middle East Policy.

"Musharraf still detested her, and he came around reluctantly as he began to recognize this fall that his position was untenable," Riedel said. The Pakistani leader had two choices: Bhutto or former prime minister Nawaz Sharif, whom Musharraf had overthrown in a 1999 military coup. "Musharraf took what he thought was the lesser of two evils," Riedel

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...7122701481.html

No autopsy done on the body. And I also saw that the place of the attack was immediately washed thoroughly with high pressure water cannons. That will be a great help for the forensics.

Only in Pakistan can minutes after an assasination the evidence be washed away and destroyed with no one really caring, it seems as soon as it happend everyones mind was made up as to who did it and why which is always a dangerous situation to be in. Thats why anything 'official' coming out of Paksitan should always be frowned upon and looked at again with greater detail.

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so was she shia???

im not asking if she was a practicing shia. Just if she was a shia.

Like her father and like Musharraf to the Sunni's she is Sunni and to the Shia she is Shia, it seems as though on purpose these politicions spread rumours about their allegeince to different sects in order to gain a bigger support base from different groups. Note how Musharraf had 'official' government scholars that where WAHABI and in his autobiography it says he is SUNNI whilst rumours persiste that he is a SYED and a SHIA, it seems as though Musharraf is 10 different people !. Same thing with Bhuto now only Allah knows best and we can't specualte e.t.c on her being shia or whatever because in Pakistan even some Brailvi's act exactly like shia saying Ya Ali Madat (as) and having Alams e.t.c so it is hard to tell but if she was then definately she was a cultural shia and not an ideological one.

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I think she was a Shia as well as i have seen a black flag on top of her mansion AKA "Bilawal House" at all times. The other family i knew that had the same flag at all times were another hardcore Shia.

Even if she was not a Shia then she had lived her life under Shiaism shadow and due to her the people of Pakistan knew that Shias have some kind of voice. I have heard this from people's mouth themselves. I dont see what difference it makes regardless as she is with her maker now.

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I think she was a Shia as well as i have seen a black flag on top of her mansion AKA "Bilawal House" at all times. The other family i knew that had the same flag at all times were another hardcore Shia.

Even the Brailvi Shayk ul Islam Dr. Tahir ul Qadri gives long lectures on the permissability and rewards of having an alam on your house, it doesn't mean she was 100% shia because many Sunni's like I said have similair cultural practices as the shiia.

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Even the Brailvi Shayk ul Islam Dr. Tahir ul Qadri gives long lectures on the permissability and rewards of having an alam on your house, it doesn't mean she was 100% shia because many Sunni's like I said have similair cultural practices as the shiia.

You may be right but i have never seen any Sunni house doing this in Karachi, Pakistan. Bilawal house flag is something i have seen with my very own eyes around the year. I know a lot of people that were under the impression of her being Shia as well.

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Why do people even wonder about such a completely corrupt person, and a thief being a Shia or not --- I'd think that her being a Shia would be a major source of embarrassment for Shias...

http://www.samsloan.com/benazir.htm

Bhutto's twin posts, as prime minister and finance minister, gave her virtually free rein. Zardari became her alter ego, riding roughshod over the bureaucracy although he had no formal economic powers until Bhutto appointed him Investment Minister, reporting only to herself, in July 1996. They maintained an imperial lifestyle in the new prime minister's residence in Islamabad, a $50 million mansion set on 110 acres on an Islamabad hilltop.

Within days of moving in, Zardari ordered 11.5 acres of protected woodland on an adjoining hilltop to be bulldozed for a polo field, an exercise track, stabling for 40 polo ponies, quarters for grooms and a parking lot for spectators. When a senior government official, Mohammed Mehdi, objected to paying for the project with $1.3 million diverted from a budget for parks and other public amenities, Zardari "categorically told me that he does not appreciate his orders to be examined and questioned by any authority," according to an affidavit filed with the Pakistani investigators by Mehdi. A few months later, with the work in progress, Zardari had Mehdi dismissed.

The investigators say that Zardari and associates he brought into the government, some of them old school friends, began reviewing state programs for opportunities to make money. It was these broader activities, the investigators assert, more than the relatively small number of foreign deals revealed in the documents taken from the Swiss lawyer, that netted the largest sums for the Bhutto family.

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Show me any photograph of this "FLAG" that you have mentioned which had the Zulfiqar inscribed with 'la fata illah Ali la saif ullah zulfiqar'.

Hassan farhan

this is not a myth. I have personally seen the emblems of the party with the inscription. Of course you are free to believe we are all lying. If you live in Karachi check with an old PPP supporter (go to some old shia locality like Hussainabad Malir/Rizvia society and you'll run into one).

In any case her shia connections are much stronger than those of the dog who calls himself Syed Musharraf.

Edited by ShahLatif

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Why do people even wonder about such a completely corrupt person, and a thief being a Shia or not

Because we as a Pakistani community love being robbed and made fools out of and also we love to have our natural resources raped and being dogs to the US is also a new trend that has picked up popularity in recent years.

I'd think that her being a Shia would be a major source of embarrassment for Shias...

It is, imagine a Shiat Ali (as) calls hudood 'barbaric' and despite a tough stance on women leaders including one explicit hadith from Imam Ali (as) posted in a previous thread which strongly condems the notion of women rulers.

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You may be right but i have never seen any Sunni house doing this in Karachi, Pakistan. Bilawal house flag is something i have seen with my very own eyes around the year. I know a lot of people that were under the impression of her being Shia as well.

BILAWAL HOUSE is not her property but her husband Asif Ali Zardari's.. Put your facts straight before you make such claims brother

Fitting tribute to Bhutto by her supporters:

post-6473-1198925342_thumb.jpg

Yeah right!! 40 Edhi Ambulances have been burnt in Karachi along with 6 of their offices..

Now what did Maulana Adul Sattar Edhi do to face this wrath..

Senseless!! :mad:

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they shouldnt burn edhi ambulances such foolish peoples coz edhi is the one

who helps them in bad times

If only they understood...

Today it is the same poor masses who have no atta or rice to eat because of the disturbance that they have been creating since the 27th...

Atta is being sold at Rs. 45 to a Kg by black marketeers..

Shame on them!

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Citing what it said was an intercepted phone call, the interior ministry said Benazir Bhutto's killing had been ordered by an "al-Qaeda leader", Baitullah Mehsud.

Pakistani intelligence services intercepted a call from him in which he allegedly congratulated another militant after Ms Bhutto's death, interior ministry spokesman Javed Iqbal Cheema told reporters.

But a spokesman for the South Waziristan tribal leader denied he was involved, calling it "government propaganda".

"He had no involvement in this attack," spokesman Maulana Omar said in a telephone call.

"It is against tribal tradition and custom to attack a woman," he added.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/7163754.stm

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Yeah right!! 40 Edhi Ambulances have been burnt in Karachi along with 6 of their offices..

Now what did Maulana Adul Sattar Edhi do to face this wrath..

Senseless!! :mad:

If this is what her supporters are capable of, what hope for the country if she had been elected?

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Countrywide protests, killings and arson

ISLAMABAD: At least 27 people were killed and many wounded in violence during a nationwide outpouring of grief and a protest strike over Benazir Bhutto’s assassination while army was deployed in 16 districts of Sindh and paramilitary forces elsewhere in the country.

A complete general strike and funeral prayer congregations in all the country’s four provinces, Azad Kashmir and Northern Areas marked the day as the former prime minister, killed in an unidentified assassin’s gun-and-bomb attack in Rawalpindi on Thursday, was buried beside her father Zulfikar Ali Bhutto at their ancestral Garhi Khuda Bux village.

But protests at several places turned violent, with demonstrators attacking and burning both public and private properties, mostly in Sindh where 17 people were reported killed in Karachi and 10 in eight towns in other parts of the province.

An army statement in Rawalpindi said the troops had been deployed in 16 Sindh districts, including Karachi, on the requisition of the provincial government, to assist the local administration restore law and order.

“Army authorities have been asked to coordinate law-enforcement action being conducted by police and (paramilitary) Rangers,” said the statement, quoting a spokesman of the Inter-Services Public Relations Directorate. “In case the situation goes out of hand of these agencies, army units will be employed to restore law and order.”

It said the army had taken over security of “sensitive installations and national” assets in Karachi and other places in Sindh and that troops were patrolling in the troubled localities of Karachi, Larkana, Hyderabad, Sukkur, Thatta and Badin.

SINDH: In Karachi, seven workers were burnt to death after a factory was set on fire. Two policemen were also killed. Hospitals received eight bodies with gunshot wounds. Over 400 vehicles and 18 banks were burnt in the city since Thursday night.

In other parts of Sindh, incidents of violence completely paralysed civic life on second day of mourning with 10 people killed and around two dozens injured.

Two deaths each were reported from Jacobabad and Thatta and one each from Mirpurkhas, Hyderabad, Badin, Matiari, Tando Allahyar and Khairpur.

Government properties, banks, private vehicles, gas and petrol stations, telephone exchanges were prime targets of attackers in every district.

The bungalow of former Sindh chief minister Dr Arbab Ghulam Rahim, who a family member said, had gone to Saudi Arabia for “Umra pilgrimage” on Thursday night, was torched in G.M.B. Colony in Qasimabad.

ISLAMABAD: Protests in Islamabad largely remained peaceful but students of the Quaid-i-Azam University burnt a bus of their own institution.

PUNJAB: In the cities and towns of Punjab, protesters became violent in several towns, burning property and election campaign banners of candidates belonging to the formerly ruling Pakistan Muslim League.

Sargodha witnessed constant clashes between police and protesters for hours, according to the Online news agency.

In Attock district, PPP activists set fire to posters and flags of a PML candidate for the National Assembly, former Punjab chief minister Chaudhry Pervez Elahi.

Jaranwala also witnessed a rowdy day with protests, cases of arson and stoning of a Wapda building and a local school. Six police personnel were reported injured there.

NWFP: In the NWFP, enraged protesters set a police post and railway station on fire at Taru Jabba, near Peshawar, snatched guns from police and also set ablaze two official motorcycles at the police post.

The police post was set on fire after police reportedly fired in the air to disperse the crowd.

The protesters set ablaze at least three vehicles and a motorbike in other areas and an office of the Muttahida Qaumi Movement at Peshawar’s Nishtarabad Chowk and the PML provincial office at Gulbahar locality.

BALOCHISTAN: In Balochistan, a railway station, several banks and other public and private buildings were set on fire as riots erupted in some areas of the province.

At least four policemen were injured in attacks on police posts while Quetta remained cut off by rail as Pakistan Railways cancelled all outgoing trains while passenger trains that had left on Thursday evening for Karachi, Lahore and Rawalpindi were stopped at Sibi railway station and returned to Quetta on Friday morning.

Jaffarabad district administration called out Frontier Corps personnel to control the law and order situation.

In Turbat, police arrested 15 PPP workers for forcibly closing shops.

But the overall law and order situation in the province remained under control after the government deployed extra personnel of police, the Balochistan Constabulary and Frontier Corps in Quetta and other areas.

However, at least three banks were burnt down in Dera Allahyar, a town neighbouring Sindh, where PPP workers and supporters took over roads at around 9am and blocked the highway between Balochistan and Sindh.

The protesters also attacked and set on fire branches of three banks. According to reports, currency notes worth several millions of rupees and all record were burnt.

Sources said a group of protesters attacked Dera Allahyar railway station and torched it. They also burnt down the office of Nadra, the district office of Excise and Taxation and PML election office and attacked a bank branch, the office of District Police Officer and Civil Hospital but law-enforcement agencies did not allow them to enter these buildings.

Riots were also reported in Dera Murad Jamali where protesters burnt a bank branch and destroyed the official vehicle of a senior police officer.

Protesters also attacked police posts in Dera Allahyar and beat up policemen, four of whom were injured.

http://www.dawn.com/2007/12/29/top2.htm

If this is what her supporters are capable of, what hope for the country if she had been elected?

None..

What did the country get during her first 2 tenures.. :angry:

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oh man, when the cars were burnt in karachi, i was right there. We were stuck in traffic for 5 hours! and absolutely NO gov't control at ALL. It was all general public trying to control the traffic and help people out (i think mqm guys)! its a shame for the gov't.

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oh man, when the cars were burnt in karachi, i was right there. We were stuck in traffic for 5 hours! and absolutely NO gov't control at ALL. It was all general public trying to control the traffic and help people out (i think mqm guys)! its a shame for the gov't.

Karachi is mother of ISLAMabad. There will be crisis in ISLAMabad avenues if Karachi will continue closed for another 2 days.

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Karachi is mother of ISLAMabad. There will be crisis in ISLAMabad avenues if Karachi will continue closed for another 2 days.

Very true.. Karachi alone contributes over 50% of all Government Revenues..

This is detrimental for investors, both foreign and local..

Lets hope that sanity prevails soon

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Just seen a press conference from the Interior minister who again said that Benzir passed away due to a blow to the head and no bullet or bomb. He also said the audio of the conversation between the molvi and supposed brains behind the attack will be available aswell offering to exhume the body of Bhutto to confirm the governments reports.

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Wow

Give me a total number of :

- Suicide attacks at christian places of worship

- Number of Christian luminaries assassinated in targeted killings

- Christians beheaded because they have christian names

- Christian neighborhoods surrounded by armed militias bent on ethnic cleansing.

Just give me the stats and I will stand corrected.

Perhaps if there was a Christian country under occupation instead of engaging in the occupation? Comparisons between the situations in globally southern Islamic states and economically developed 'Christian' states only serve to enforce the self-inferiority complex that alot of Muslims seem to be more and more engaged in as of recently.

Edited by Dr. Strangelove

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I'm trying to work out how much work she had done to her face.

bb.tiff

She definitely had her teeth worked on, a bit like Drycola when younger, but as she grew older her features were more refined, anyone think she had work done on her face? Seems to be more luxuriant hair as well.

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If this is what her supporters are capable of, what hope for the country if she had been elected?

Haji and Hassan Farhan

the biggest gathering of PPP supporters was at her funeral. Tell me how many banks were gutted there?

Secondly, when the dog Mushy feels threatened by 7,8 old men from the SC he locks down the whole damn country using military/paramilitary forces. Where is the military now?

There was another totally BOGUS argument made that the military allowed PPP loyalists to vent their anger. For many reasons :

a - Their absence is unprecedented. Paki military has been fond of invading their own cities ever since our country was created. At-least their track record in post-MQM karachi testifies to that. Unless we want to admit that the Army is too timid to go on the streets!

b - PPP never organized any such organized looting. Thus if any goons were to be killed during rioting, why would PPP own up to them? Plus, it would tell us that indeed PPP elements sere destroying the property and in the process were dealt justice.

c - The events that PPP DID organize (like 'ghaibana' funeral prayers around the country) were PEACEFUL. This point is connected to ( b ). Had PPP ever asked for violent demonstrations you could blame them.

d - PPP was not in power in any of the 4 provinces. Unlike MQM on the 12th may, who let goons rule the city for a day, you can't blame them for NOT bringing into the streets enough law-enforcement personnel.

Edited by ShahLatif

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I'm trying to work out how much work she had done to her face.

bb.tiff

She definitely had her teeth worked on, a bit like Drycola when younger, but as she grew older her features were more refined, anyone think she had work done on her face? Seems to be more luxuriant hair as well.

she looks drugged up in that pic....you cant have gone to harvard and oxford and not get high....

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Haji and Hassan Farhan

the biggest gathering of PPP supporters was at her funeral. Tell me how many banks were gutted there?

Secondly, when the dog Mushy feels threatened by 7,8 old men from the SC he locks down the whole damn country using military/paramilitary forces. Where is the military now?

There was another totally BOGUS argument made that the military allowed PPP loyalists to vent their anger. For many reasons :

a - Their absence is unprecedented. Paki military has been fond of invading their own cities ever since our country was created. At-least their track record in post-MQM karachi testifies to that. Unless we want to admit that the Army is too timid to go on the streets!

b - PPP never organized any such organized looting. Thus if any goons were to be killed during rioting, why would PPP own up to them? Plus, it would tell us that indeed PPP elements sere destroying the property and in the process were dealt justice.

c - The events that PPP DID organize (like 'ghaibana' funeral prayers around the country) were PEACEFUL. This point is connected to ( b ). Had PPP ever asked for violent demonstrations you could blame them.

d - PPP was not in power in any of the 4 provinces. Unlike MQM on the 12th may, who let goons rule the city for a day, you can't blame them for NOT bringing into the streets enough law-enforcement personnel.

Shah Latif

First of all, lets decide one thing.. Is PPP a party which is confined only to Larkana? Just answer in YES or NO.. No smart talk.

This is what The Dawn had to say about the reaction in Larkana

=================================================================

LARKANA, Dec 27: A pall of gloom descended over the Bhutto hometown as the news of Benazir Bhutto’s assassination reached here on Thursday evening. With people in a state of shock, there were scenes of rioting all around.

Small traders and kiosk owners shut their shops as people came out into the streets, shouting slogans against President Pervez Musharraf, burning tyres and attacking vehicles. Policemen were nowhere to be seen.

Naudero town was completely shut with protestors raising slogans against the government and damaging everything that came in their path.

The protesters set on fire bank branches in various localities of the city, besides torching the District Council Hall in the Jinnahbagh area.

An employee of the Askari Bank told this correspondent on phone that some bank workers were still inside the branch. The main building of the State Life Insurance was damaged and eyewitnesses said that it had been set on fire.

A bakery was also set ablaze. Some protesters in Naudero set on fire the Khushhal Khan Khatak Express at the Shahnawaz Bhutto railway station, reports reaching here said.

A large number of PPP supporters reached Ms Bhutto’s Naudero house to mourn the death of their leader.

Reports reaching here from Shahdadkot indicated that the town was quite tense. Protesters had set ablaze a bank branch, burnt tyres and push-carts right from the ‘Koto Moto’ chowk to the Station Road.

In Qambar, PPP supporters pulled down posters and banners of rival parties and removed flags hoisted over party offices.

Protesters attacked a police station in Badah and burnt a car inside the station. Police personnel ran away from the station while the wireless operator took refuge in a nearby mosque.

In Larkana, a mob tried to break into the Market police station but protesters were dispersed after police lobbed tear-gas shells, sources said.

Rangers and police personnel started patrolling the city at 10.30pm.

The district police officer and the district nazim had called for army’s support to control the situation but troops were not seen anwhere till the filing of this report.

According to eyewitnesses, mobs broke into two arms’ shop near Pakistan Chowk and looted arms and ammunition. Police confirmed that one arms shop had been looted.

Offices of the Education Department near the Govt Girls’ Colleges and Wapda’s office near the Al Murtaza House were also attacked.

http://www.dawn.com/2007/12/28/top8.htm

=================================================================

Why did the violence erupt only after Benazir's death?? Why didn't such violence erupt after the 18th October bombing in Karachi??

What you have called Musharraf is against the norms of this forum.. I would like to ask the Moderators to edit this word from your text and issue you a warning.. This is Shia Chat not some group made for or against Benazir.. There must be many Anti - Mushi groups on the internet. Go and use such language there.

a - Who launched the operation in Karachi against the MQM? Who was heading the country when police killed 100s of MQM Activists in Extra Judicial killings? I am not defending the Pakistan Army but it is because of them that many thankless people can sleep in peace at night.. In their own independant country.

b - Another report from The Dawn

Angry PPP activists go on the rampage

By A Reporter

PESHAWAR, Dec 27: Pakistan People’s Party (PPP) supporters went on the rampage here on Thursday evening following Benazir Bhutto’s assassination minutes after she addressed a rally in Rawalpindi.

At least five supporters were injured when police resorted to shelling at a protest procession of the PPP in the Gulbahar area.

The emotionally charged activists had taken out the procession and blocked the main Grand Trunk road at Gulbahar for about half an hour and pelted the passing vehicles with stones.

The protesters set ablaze a car near Haji Camp, while windscreens of dozens of other vehicles were smashed. The angry protesters tore off banners and posters of the Pakistan Muslim League-Q candidates and ransacked the Hashtnagri police station. However, the officials denied the incident.

The procession was taken out from the election office of the PPP candidates. The protesters raised slogans against the government after blocking the road.

Later, police opened the road after dispersing the protesters.

The election offices of PML-Q were also reportedly attacked in different parts of the city.

Reports about aerial firing in the areas of Nauthia, Gulbahar and Charsadda road were also received.

According to our Mansehra correspondent, some protesters blocked the Shahrah-i-Resham by setting ablaze tyres and erecting hurdles on the road.

The PPP workers chanted slogans against Gen Musharraf and asked the rulers to admit their failure in protecting the lives of people and step down immediately.

http://www.dawn.com/2007/12/28/nat4.htm

=================================================================

c - No political party ever calls for VIOLENT demonstrations.. Give me an example where MQM, PML or any other party called for VIOLENT demonstrations

d - You have mentioned 12th May and MQM's role here.. Let me remind you of a bigger carnage.. The Carnage in Hyderabad in 1989... Pukka Qila and Kutcha Qila.. PPP was in Power both at the Federal level and the provincial level as well.

You justify that carnage and I'll justify 12th May..

It is easy to sit in our homes and write.. Ground realities and realities on the streets are very different!!

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Shah Latif

First of all, lets decide one thing.. Is PPP a party which is confined only to Larkana? Just answer in YES or NO.. No smart talk.

This is what The Dawn had to say about the reaction in Larkana

=================================================================

LARKANA, Dec 27: A pall of gloom descended over the Bhutto hometown as the news of Benazir Bhutto�s assassination reached here on Thursday evening. With people in a state of shock, there were scenes of rioting all around.

Small traders and kiosk owners shut their shops as people came out into the streets, shouting slogans against President Pervez Musharraf, burning tyres and attacking vehicles. Policemen were nowhere to be seen.

Naudero town was completely shut with protestors raising slogans against the government and damaging everything that came in their path.

The protesters set on fire bank branches in various localities of the city, besides torching the District Council Hall in the Jinnahbagh area.

An employee of the Askari Bank told this correspondent on phone that some bank workers were still inside the branch. The main building of the State Life Insurance was damaged and eyewitnesses said that it had been set on fire.

A bakery was also set ablaze. Some protesters in Naudero set on fire the Khushhal Khan Khatak Express at the Shahnawaz Bhutto railway station, reports reaching here said.

A large number of PPP supporters reached Ms Bhutto�s Naudero house to mourn the death of their leader.

Reports reaching here from Shahdadkot indicated that the town was quite tense. Protesters had set ablaze a bank branch, burnt tyres and push-carts right from the �Koto Moto� chowk to the Station Road.

In Qambar, PPP supporters pulled down posters and banners of rival parties and removed flags hoisted over party offices.

Protesters attacked a police station in Badah and burnt a car inside the station. Police personnel ran away from the station while the wireless operator took refuge in a nearby mosque.

In Larkana, a mob tried to break into the Market police station but protesters were dispersed after police lobbed tear-gas shells, sources said.

Rangers and police personnel started patrolling the city at 10.30pm.

The district police officer and the district nazim had called for army�s support to control the situation but troops were not seen anwhere till the filing of this report.

According to eyewitnesses, mobs broke into two arms� shop near Pakistan Chowk and looted arms and ammunition. Police confirmed that one arms shop had been looted.

Offices of the Education Department near the Govt Girls� Colleges and Wapda�s office near the Al Murtaza House were also attacked.

http://www.dawn.com/2007/12/28/top8.htm

=================================================================

Why did the violence erupt only after Benazir's death?? Why didn't such violence erupt after the 18th October bombing in Karachi??

What you have called Musharraf is against the norms of this forum.. I would like to ask the Moderators to edit this word from your text and issue you a warning.. This is Shia Chat not some group made for or against Benazir.. There must be many Anti - Mushi groups on the internet. Go and use such language there.

a - Who launched the operation in Karachi against the MQM? Who was heading the country when police killed 100s of MQM Activists in Extra Judicial killings? I am not defending the Pakistan Army but it is because of them that many thankless people can sleep in peace at night.. In their own independant country.

b - Another report from The Dawn

Angry PPP activists go on the rampage

By A Reporter

PESHAWAR, Dec 27: Pakistan People�s Party (PPP) supporters went on the rampage here on Thursday evening following Benazir Bhutto�s assassination minutes after she addressed a rally in Rawalpindi.

At least five supporters were injured when police resorted to shelling at a protest procession of the PPP in the Gulbahar area.

The emotionally charged activists had taken out the procession and blocked the main Grand Trunk road at Gulbahar for about half an hour and pelted the passing vehicles with stones.

The protesters set ablaze a car near Haji Camp, while windscreens of dozens of other vehicles were smashed. The angry protesters tore off banners and posters of the Pakistan Muslim League-Q candidates and ransacked the Hashtnagri police station. However, the officials denied the incident.

The procession was taken out from the election office of the PPP candidates. The protesters raised slogans against the government after blocking the road.

Later, police opened the road after dispersing the protesters.

The election offices of PML-Q were also reportedly attacked in different parts of the city.

Reports about aerial firing in the areas of Nauthia, Gulbahar and Charsadda road were also received.

According to our Mansehra correspondent, some protesters blocked the Shahrah-i-Resham by setting ablaze tyres and erecting hurdles on the road.

The PPP workers chanted slogans against Gen Musharraf and asked the rulers to admit their failure in protecting the lives of people and step down immediately.

http://www.dawn.com/2007/12/28/nat4.htm

=================================================================

c - No political party ever calls for VIOLENT demonstrations.. Give me an example where MQM, PML or any other party called for VIOLENT demonstrations

d - You have mentioned 12th May and MQM's role here.. Let me remind you of a bigger carnage.. The Carnage in Hyderabad in 1989... Pukka Qila and Kutcha Qila.. PPP was in Power both at the Federal level and the provincial level as well.

You justify that carnage and I'll justify 12th May..

It is easy to sit in our homes and write.. Ground realities and realities on the streets are very different!!

All PPP workers, like the workers of all other political parties anywhere, are not law-abiding citizens.

That is one thing we should always keep in mind.

It is extremely difficult for the saner elements in the party leaderships to keep a grip on the emotional charged workers in such an eventuality.

That is another thing we should always keep in mind.

Criminal and anti-social, anti-people elements always take advantage take of such situations whenever they happen.

That is yet another thing we should always keep in mind.

Two points are worth remembering.

Criminal elements often take advantage of such situations and indulge in activities as described above.

Pakistani journalists and Pakistani journalism are not the most ethical in the world. Dawn has had an axe to grind against the Bhutto name a family since the early seventies. News items creeded without credit [eg. BY a Reporter, By Our News Desk, etc,] are usually manufactured within the four walls of the papers office.

These are another few things that we should keep in in mind.

Now,

It is quite true that whereas all the above factors have contributed to the lawlessness that we have witnessed since Thursday evening, it is also true that had the government not been paralysed at both the Federal and Provincial levels, when this gruesome tragedy happened, things could have been much better than they are.

Pakistanis should also thank Allah that things are not any worse than they are. There have been instance in history where there have literally been bloodbaths at such assassinations.

Archduke Franz Ferdinand's assassination sparked World War 1. The guy was an insignificant wimp.

Closer to home, the murder of Indira Gandhi in the eighties led to a carnage of massive proportions.

Edited by Pest

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(salam

It is really needless debate if she was Shia or Sunni. What is more important to discuss is what she delivered during her two stints as Prime Minister and what her previous polices were and what policies she was going to pursue after taking over the reins of the Government for the third time.

It is very clear that she failed to deliver despite being elected twice. Her affinity towards Shias was very evident from the fact that she allowed PPP backed Watto's Government to make Sheikh Hakim, a SSP member, a minister in Punjab Government. The SSP terrorists took advantage of this ministry and martyred a large number of Shias and her Government remained a mere spectator.

She also failed at foreign policy level as her foreign polices were more western than Pro-Pakistan.

Having said that I would say the act of killing her is highly deplorable and condemnable. The perpetrators of this crime must be brought to justice. The Busharrf regime must not be allowed to hush up the matter.

Shah Latif

You justify that carnage and I'll justify 12th May..

Carnage is carnage; it is highly condemnable irrespective of the nationality of the criminals involved. No one claim to be even a human after justifying it, not to speak of being a Shia.

Edited by Sayyid

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(salam

It is really needless debate if she was Shia or Sunni. What is more important to discuss is what she delivered during her two stints as Prime Minister and what her previous polices were and what policies she was going to pursue after taking over the reins of the Government for the third time.

It is very clear that she failed to deliver despite being elected twice. Her affinity towards Shias was very evident from the fact that she allowed PPP backed Watto's Government to make Sheikh Hakim, a SSP member, a minister in Punjab Government. The SSP terrorists took advantage of this ministry and martyred a large number of Shias and her Government remained a mere spectator.

She also failed at foreign policy level as her foreign polices were more western than Pro-Pakistan.

Having said that I would say the act of killing her is highly deplorable and condemnable. The perpetrators of this crime must be brought to justice. The Busharrf regime must not be allowed to hush up the matter.

Lets see what Shah Latif comes up with in defense of whatever you have written here..

In personality worshipping, we tend to just turn a blind eye to facts.. Not good when educated people do so.

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Lets see what Shah Latif comes up with in defense of whatever you have written here..

In personality worshipping, we tend to just turn a blind eye to facts.. Not good when educated people do so.

And also if we claim to be Shia Muslim and human being we must condemn strongly even if a single innocent person is killed, irrespective if the criminal belong to MQM, Punjab or Sind.

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And also if we claim to be Shia Muslim and human being we must condemn strongly even if a single innocent person is killed, irrespective if the criminal belong to MQM, Punjab or Sind.

Agreed..

And not just if we are Shia.. Humanity itself is most important..

In one of my earlier posts yesterday I had mentioned that while everyone was mentioning Benazir, 20 plus other people had also dies with her.. Alas no one talks about them or what their families will have to face now

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^ adding to that, Bhutto's house in karachi is the single politicians house that has an alam. Along with that she was always seen with an imamzamin, and along with that you would often hear 'nare haidery'during her speeches. that's enough facts for us to condemn her death and the 30 others that died in the attack. After all she was a human, however good or bad of a politician she was, killing is not the resort. Humanity should after all force us to condemn suchacts.

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