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In the Name of God بسم الله

Ya Allah Madad Or Ya Ali Madad


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^^^

bismillahir rahman ar rahim

first lt me say welcome to shia chat. I myself am new to this site, but so far it is very nice.

However I beg to differ, seeking wasilah is not a fine line betwen eman and shirk. allow me to assure you, saying Ya Ali Madad is only a form of seeking wasilah, as we know Ali (as) can do nothing without the power of Allah.

elhumdolilahe rabbiul alameen.

Ya Ali Adriknee

I agree , Ya Ali madad is no Shirk.

Allah has delegated many of His powers to various people.

Like He gave his power to make clay-bird alive to Hz. Isa. Had it been shirk to give life ,Hz. Isa would not have given life .

wassalam

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In one of his majlises, molana Aqeel ul gharavi talks about wasila in these beautifull phrases, (its my translation so pls bare with it) he says,

it is a must to ask from Mustfa(pbuh) and Murtaza(as). it is not shirk. If God had not granted the power of fulfilling duas to them, then we wouldn't be asked them. and now that God has given them this power, it will be kofraAn-e-naimat(thanklessness to Allah's blessings) not to ask them.

he adds,that God is your RAB and he wants a pure sajda from you and not the one that you perform with your selfish desires.he has given this power to Mohammad(pbuh) and Aly Mohammad(as), now he wants to see if you still bow to him or not!

if this was not true then some one would not have said "LO LAA ALI" also!

many of my ehlay sunnat friends believe very strongly in BIBI FATIM'S story and also offer 22nd rajab ki mannat and nayaz and i gladly recite the mujzaat to them all the time.

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Assalam O Alaikum All Brothers and Sisters,

First of all i would like to start by saying BISMILLAH HIRAHMAN NIRAHIM. Secondly i would like to say how deeply hurt i am after reading your posts and replies .

I was feeling low and just typed in YA Allah MADAD in google search and Unfortunetly this post came up first in the search result.

After reading some but not all of your replies i could not resist but to give my humble view. May Allah (JSH) guide me in choosing the right words.

I saw that many of my brothers and sisters gave their views and also quoted the GLORIOUS QURAN. I request everyone not to quote the GLORIOUS QURAN without having proper knowledge of it and please do not try to use it to make a point becasue i have this feeling and to an extent know for sure (may Allah forgive me if i am wrong) that not one of you has any idea what you are talking about.

You do not realize what repercussions it might have when you QUOTE THE QURAN OUT OF CONTEXT just to make your view acceptable.

Now to get to the main discussion. I see that some brother posted this QUESTION and many people replied with what ever small knowledge they have.

One brother said that we ask Allah'S help via Hazrat-e-ALI (KAW) and AAL-E-MOHAMMAD (Peace be upon them). another sister quoted the QURAN, questioning if (Toba naozubillah) Allah him self is asking us to commiting shirk (ASTAGHFIRULLAH).

So i will say something which all of you i hope will agree with. "NO WHERE IN THE QURAN DOES Allah SAY THAT I WILL NOT ANSWER YOUR PRAYERS IF YOU COME WITHOUT A REFERENCE OR IF YOU ASK ME WITHOUT COMMING THRU SOMEONE ELSE".

So my brothers and sisters if this is true then it means Allah has provided us with an easier and true path, then why are we trying to put our small brains to work and risking our lives by walking on the border of commiting the unforgivable sin such as SHIRK. Do you even realize what the consequences are? If Allah forbit you did cross that thin line between EMAAN AND KUFR do you realize what you are putting yourself against and for what?

So my brothers and sisters please i appeal to you Just follow the middle path and ask Allah and no one else. I mean face it, i bet more then half of you dont even pray yet you are here to give FITWAHS about ISLAM and by doing so you do not realize how you are portraying islam to the rest of the world by arguing amongst each other and giving the non-believers a chance to laugh at us. Is this how you repay the efforts of OUR PROPHET (S.A.A.S)? So please have mercy on your souls and do not mislead people with your senseless talk.

Remembering you all in my prayers and hoping you do the same!!!

Al Salamu 3alaykom,

I have a question for you brother, when you ask your mother for forgiveness are you doing shirk? When you ask your mother to be acceptable of you and pray for you so Allah (swt) can help you, are you doing shirk? Now lets put forth the argument of, show me where we are asking the Imams (alayhum alsalam) for forgiveness from them, not from Allah (swt). Secondly, where do you get your supplication from? Do you remeber Noah (a.s) when he asked forgiveness for his son? Remember when, I believe it was Abu Hurriera (r.a) asked the prophet (saaws) for help with his mother as she is not converting to Islam, what did the Prophet (saaws) do?

If we were doing shirk do you think we are going to hide it? Or maybe you think we don't know? You know the meaning of Ahlul bait? Do you know who they (a.s) were? Do you know what Bait we are talking about? Do you know that all of our Imams (a.s) who have been martyred in the name of Allah (swt)? Do you believe that Al Nabi Muhammad (saaws) would say things like Imam Hassan and Hussien (a.s) are leaders of youth of heaven if Allah (swt) was not happy with them? Do you think that Al Nabi Muhammad (saaws) would say I am the city of Knowledge and Ali (a.s) is the entrance? Now you explain to me what knowledge is Al Nabi Muhammad (saaws) talking about? Where did Rasulol Allah (saaws) get this knowledge from? Now tell me oh you people who say that all the prophets of Allah (swt) have committed sins(at least some of you), and who follow the Calipha's who corrupted Islam, and assaulted Ahlulbait (a.s), you who claim we are doing shirk, put forth anything that proves we are doing tawasul to other than Allah (swt) through his Hujja in this world. Let me ask you another question I don't know if you are part of the people who deny this or not, but tell me why did the Mala2ika "Angels" sajadu (bowed down) li (to) Adam (a.s)? And the (shaitan) (La3anahu Allah) devil didn't? Ahlulbait (a.s) were preserving the true meaning of Islam after the Prophet Muhammad (saaws), who were (a.s) the safe guardians after the prophet Muhammad (saaws) of Islam. And do you think that Allah (swt) would allow anyone who is corrupt to safeguard the religion of Islam? Li Deeni Wa lakum Deenakom, I have my religion and you have yours, where do you get your religion from after the Quran? Hadith? Put forth who narrates most of your Hadith. Also please provide how long has this person (r.a) been in contact with Rasulul Allah. You who complain between your madhabs can we read the Quran when we are Najis.

I told this to many people, and hopefully you may understand rather than act like you know everything, Allah (swt) knows your "Niyyat" intentions, this is what you don't want understand, or (astaghfirulah) you don't believe that Allah (swt) knows that? Lots of people judge us on behalf of some people on the streets saying Please give us money from the mercy of Ali (a.s) these people are ignorant and don't know what they are talking about. We are not suppose to give anyone money unless he specifically says "Min Mala Allah" meaning from the Money of Allah (swt). I always have people coming and saying you do this and you do that and I say put forth your proof, (SHOW ME), (NOTHING).

Wasalamu 3alaykom.

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Al Salamu 3alaykom,

I have a question for you brother, when you ask your mother for forgiveness are you doing shirk? When you ask your mother to be acceptable of you and pray for you so Allah (swt) can help you, are you doing shirk? Now lets put forth the argument of, show me where we are asking the Imams (alayhum alsalam) for forgiveness from them, not from Allah (swt). Secondly, where do you get your supplication from? Do you remeber Noah (a.s) when he asked forgiveness for his son? Remember when, I believe it was Abu Hurriera (r.a) asked the prophet (saaws) for help with his mother as she is not converting to Islam, what did the Prophet (saaws) do?

If we were doing shirk do you think we are going to hide it? Or maybe you think we don't know? You know the meaning of Ahlul bait? Do you know who they (a.s) were? Do you know what Bait we are talking about? Do you know that all of our Imams (a.s) who have been martyred in the name of Allah (swt)? Do you believe that Al Nabi Muhammad (saaws) would say things like Imam Hassan and Hussien (a.s) are leaders of youth of heaven if Allah (swt) was not happy with them? Do you think that Al Nabi Muhammad (saaws) would say I am the city of Knowledge and Ali (a.s) is the entrance? Now you explain to me what knowledge is Al Nabi Muhammad (saaws) talking about? Where did Rasulol Allah (saaws) get this knowledge from? Now tell me oh you people who say that all the prophets of Allah (swt) have committed sins(at least some of you), and who follow the Calipha's who corrupted Islam, and assaulted Ahlulbait (a.s), you who claim we are doing shirk, put forth anything that proves we are doing tawasul to other than Allah (swt) through his Hujja in this world. Let me ask you another question I don't know if you are part of the people who deny this or not, but tell me why did the Mala2ika "Angels" sajadu (bowed down) li (to) Adam (a.s)? And the (shaitan) (La3anahu Allah) devil didn't? Ahlulbait (a.s) were preserving the true meaning of Islam after the Prophet Muhammad (saaws), who were (a.s) the safe guardians after the prophet Muhammad (saaws) of Islam. And do you think that Allah (swt) would allow anyone who is corrupt to safeguard the religion of Islam? Li Deeni Wa lakum Deenakom, I have my religion and you have yours, where do you get your religion from after the Quran? Hadith? Put forth who narrates most of your Hadith. Also please provide how long has this person (r.a) been in contact with Rasulul Allah. You who complain between your madhabs can we read the Quran when we are Najis.

I told this to many people, and hopefully you may understand rather than act like you know everything, Allah (swt) knows your "Niyyat" intentions, this is what you don't want understand, or (astaghfirulah) you don't believe that Allah (swt) knows that? Lots of people judge us on behalf of some people on the streets saying Please give us money from the mercy of Ali (a.s) these people are ignorant and don't know what they are talking about. We are not suppose to give anyone money unless he specifically says "Min Mala Allah" meaning from the Money of Allah (swt). I always have people coming and saying you do this and you do that and I say put forth your proof, (SHOW ME), (NOTHING).

Wasalamu 3alaykom.

Assalam O Alikum Brother,

Bismilah Hirahman Nirahim. I am sorry if my message appeared to you in the way which i did not intend it to (May Allah (JSH) forgive me).

i am quoting from your answer where you said "Lots of people judge us<----" This is exactly what i was talking about. Why does it have to be US and THEM. I do not recall saying in my reply once that i know everything infact my answer emphases that i DO NOT know anything. Nither did i once treat the matter in a manner which separated MUSLIIMS between US and YOU. I just said Allah(JSH) forbid IF IF and only IF what we are doing is shirk then we have no way out on the day of judgement. I know what Aal-e-bait means. I only said lets just follow a path which we all agree upon and not enter into waters where we do not know the depth properly. I did not want to get into an argument nor do I (ASTAGFIRULLAH) look at myself as being capable of entering into such argument, maybe you do !! So rather then going on with you and giving the shaitaan a chance to suceeed in his mission by making the exact mistake which i beg people not to make. I will end my reply by praying to Allah(JSH) that may HE guide US to the right path and keep us from harmsway. AAAMEEEEN.

Waslam

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Assalam O Alikum Brother,

Bismilah Hirahman Nirahim. I am sorry if my message appeared to you in the way which i did not intend it to (May Allah (JSH) forgive me).

i am quoting from your answer where you said "Lots of people judge us<----" This is exactly what i was talking about. Why does it have to be US and THEM. I do not recall saying in my reply once that i know everything infact my answer emphases that i DO NOT know anything. Nither did i once treat the matter in a manner which separated MUSLIIMS between US and YOU. I just said Allah(JSH) forbid IF IF and only IF what we are doing is shirk then we have no way out on the day of judgement. I know what Aal-e-bait means. I only said lets just follow a path which we all agree upon and not enter into waters where we do not know the depth properly. I did not want to get into an argument nor do I (ASTAGFIRULLAH) look at myself as being capable of entering into such argument, maybe you do !! So rather then going on with you and giving the shaitaan a chance to suceeed in his mission by making the exact mistake which i beg people not to make. I will end my reply by praying to Allah(JSH) that may HE guide US to the right path and keep us from harmsway. AAAMEEEEN.

Waslam

SOLITARY

Wa Salamu 3ala man 2itaba3a Al Huda.

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Asslam-o-Alaikum;

Iss site par yey aik bhut purana topic hay,magar main nay abhi tak iss topic main khuch nahi likha hay. Abb main bhi khuch likhna chata hoon.Yey topic Ya Ali Madad say start hua tha aor Aima ( as) aor Anbia (as) ko Wasela bnanay tak phunch gaya hay.Sub Say phelay tu main yey kahna chata hoon kay Wasila Mazhab-e- Ahlaibait main Mustahib hay Wajib nahi hay.Iss ki sub say bari daleel yey hay kay Allah Tallah ( J.J) har shaks ki hajatoon ko pura karta hay chahay woh Waseela say mangain ya bagher Wasila kay.Muslman tu kiya woh tu unn ki Hajatoon ko bhi pora kar raha hay jo uss ki Khudai par Eeman nahi Rakhtay.Agar Wasila Wajib huta tu Bagher Waseela Hajjtain pora huna mahal tha.

Drasal Wasila ko hum nay theek trah say samjha nahi hay.Drasal Wasila Dunya kay liyay Mustahib aor Aakhirat kay liyay Wajib hay.Jaisa kay bhut say Ullama Sora Hamd ki inn Ayat ko Wasila ki Daleel bnatay hain kay jiss main Allah Farmata hay kay Unn Logoon Ka Rasta Ikhtyar karu kay jinn par Khuda nay apni Naimatain Nazil ki hain.Yahan par bhi woh Rasta hi Waseela ban raha hay .Yani Nabi (S.a.w.w) aor Ahaibait ki Taalemat hi Waseela hain.kay jinn kay Zareay Hum Nijjat pa saktay hain.

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Salam...

This is taken from Imam Sajjad's psalms The Sahifah...Duas 2 & 4 :

"He sealed through us all He created,

appointed us witnesses over those who deny.."

In this, Imam Sajjad refers to Nabih Muhammad's Ahlul Bayt as the SEALS of ALL Allah(swt) created. A seal is symbolically the final stage of a process...Not the beginning. And Imam Sajjad includes himself as one of the Ahlul Bayt as well as the future generations of the Ithna Ashari Aimma [imams Baqir; Sadiq; Kazim; etc...].

"O God,

as for the followers of the messengers

and those of the people of the earth

who attested to them unseen

(while the obstinate resisted them through crying lies) -

they yearned for the emissaries through the realities of faith,

in every era and time in which Thou didst send a messenger

and set up for the people a director

from the period of Adam down to Muhammad

(God bless him and his Household).."

Here, Imam Sajjad CLEARLY identifies the chronological ages from Nabih Adam(as) to Ashraf ul-Anbiya Muhammad(saaw)...

-------------------------

Here is a verse from the one-and-only Amir-ul-Muminin's Dua-e-Mashlool :

"O Thou that didst forgive the omission of Adam and lifted up Idris to an exalted station by Thy mercy.."

Nowhere in the invaluable and lengthy supplication of Mashlool, does Imam Ali mention the shafa'at or intercession of Rasul Muhammad's Ahlul Bayt to Allah(swt) for Nabih Adam(as)...

Again, the very own AUTHENTICATED words of the Aal-e-Muhammad Aimma are what we Muslims should go by...Not the scores of hadith attributed to them that may or may not be FACTS.

Instead of being CRAMMED and STUFFED with mostly hadiths compiled by the Bukharis, Suyutis, Majlisis, etc...

It would be far more productive and helpful to all us Muslimin to actually read and recite more often, the AUTHENTIC duas of the Ithna Ashari Aimma to understand the REAL Islam. Not to mention the Holy Qur'an itself.

-------------------------

P.S.--

In these particular verses of Dua 2 from Imam Ali al-Sajjad's Sahifah, it is to be NOTED that what Imam Zayn al-Abidin means by "Nabih's Family" are the Banu Quraysh tribe and NOT the Qurayshi clans of Bani Hashim and Bani Muttalib.

And those "brought near from afar" were the Ansar of the Banu Yathrab, Banu Aws and Banu Khazraj...While those "sent afar" were Rasulallah's native tribe the Quraysh...

And Rasul "cutting ties of the womb" is metaphoric for the city of his birth...Makkah[i.e. Makkah being Rasul's symbolic "womb'].

"..showed open enmity toward his next of kin

by summoning to Thee,

fought against his family

for Thy good pleasure,

cut the ties of the womb

in giving life to Thy religion,

sent far those close

because of their denial,

brought near those far

because of their response to Thee,

showed friendship to the most distant

for Thy sake,

displayed enmity toward the nearest

for Thy sake.."

The very first surah in Quran pak ( surah Fatiah) says " Iyyaka nabudo wa iyyaka nastaeen" - maening- Ae Allah hum teri hi ibadat krtay hain aur sirf tujhi se madad mangtay hain".

Suppose if really have to have a waseela Then why not say " ya Rasool Allah madad? Who else can be closer to Allah than Hazrat Mohammed (peace be upon him)

Sonia

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The very first surah in Quran pak ( surah Fatiah) says " Iyyaka nabudo wa iyyaka nastaeen" - maening- Ae Allah hum teri hi ibadat krtay hain aur sirf tujhi se madad mangtay hain".

Suppose if really have to have a waseela Then why not say " ya Rasool Allah madad? Who else can be closer to Allah than Hazrat Mohammed (peace be upon him)

Sonia

http://www.answering-ansar.org/answers/tawassul/en/chap2.php

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The very first surah in Quran pak ( surah Fatiah) says " Iyyaka nabudo wa iyyaka nastaeen" - maening- Ae Allah hum teri hi ibadat krtay hain aur sirf tujhi se madad mangtay hain".

Suppose if really have to have a waseela Then why not say " ya Rasool Allah madad? Who else can be closer to Allah than Hazrat Mohammed (peace be upon him)

Sonia

Zaat e Elahia aur Sifaat e Elahia .......Agar ap in lafzon ko samajh saken to ap jaan jyen gi ke Ali (a.s) Sifaat e Elahiya ke Mazhar hain ..Asad Ullah , Yureed Ullah , Ain Ullah, Lassaan Ullah aur aise bahut se .Isi Liye Ya Ali Madad hain ..agar ap is ko samajh saken to shayd ap Ya Ali madad ko bhi Samajh jayen ..Sirf itna kahon ga

" Main Tujh se Na Mangoon to na Mangoon ka ksi se ".

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