Maulana Aqeel Ul Garavi

[Chronic]

(salam)

Having never lived in Pakistan, and more than half my life in the West, I never really got the chance to take an Urdu course at school or study the language to its depth (Something I very much regret). I guess I can consider myself in the same boat as many other born or raised Paki-Westerners who lack adequate urdu vocab. But now as I reach my mid-20's, I feel that this lack of vocabulary is a barrier between me and alot of good urdu books and speeches.

Having said that, Maulana Aqeel Ul Garavi is one of those Alim's that I love to listen to with all my dedication, but many of the words used by him fly over the top of my head and I end up using the following 2 websites to find out their English meanings:

http://www.ebazm.com

http://www.urduword.com/

Although the above websites are good, they are NOT great and certainly don't contain ALL the words of the urdu language I may be looking for. This is the reason why I'm posting here. I would like for anyone to recommend a better website, and if possible, help me translate some of the words I need help with.

I would really appreciate any assistance provided, and would surely keep you in my Duas.

Wasalam

[Rawshni]

^

His Urdu isn't saqeel at all.

Its just that you are at sea in Urdu

[Chronic]

Its just that you are at sea in Urdu

Exactly! Reason why his urdu is Sakheel to ME :(.

Wasalam

PS- Can someone please tell me the english equivalents of the urdu words 'tahreer' and 'sayhr' please.

Edited January 29, 2007 by Chronic

[Rawshni]

^

Try developing an understanding of the language. It is easy. We can help.

Tehreer = writing,

AS in

Kitaboun mein tehreer hai = It is written in books

tehreer = liberation

As in

Hizb al tehreer, one of the despicable fascist organizations

Sayhr, should be spelt seher = magic, enchantment, spell [as the witches cast]

Differentiate it from

Sahar which means dawn, daybreak

[Chronic]

Thanks alot sis.

I have some more words:

tamheed

tardeedh

taqdeeb

mushtuba

Edited January 29, 2007 by Chronic

[Rawshni]

^

Tamheed = preface, prefatory remarks, intro, introductory remarks

tardeed = denial, refutation, refute from radd, to deny, refute, reject

takdheeb = chicanery, lieing, tell a lie [on somebody or about something] from kizb = lie, falsehood

mushtabeh = doubtful, suspiciious, not authentic its from shubeh = doubt, suspicion

Hope this helps

Edited January 29, 2007 by Rawshni

[Chronic]

^

Tamheed = preface, prefatory remarks, intro, introductory remarks

tardeed = denial, refutation, refute from radd, to deny, refute, reject

takdheeb = chicanery, lieing, tell a lie [on somebody or about something] from kizb = lie, falsehood

mushtabeh = doubtful, suspiciious, not authentic its from shubeh = doubt, suspicion

Hope this helps

Thanks once again sis. It does help alot. I was just wondering though, is the word mushtabAh or mushtabeh? Because the way i heard it, it was pronounced with an 'A' I believe.

[Rawshni]

Thanks once again sis. It does help alot. I was just wondering though, is the word mushtabAh or mushtabeh? Because the way i heard it, it was pronounced with an 'A' I believe.

Hmmm

Iranians usually spell words ending with À with an "eh" as in Maasoomeh, Farzaaneh.

I am ethnically Irani, and old habits die hard . . .

[Marbles]

Maulana Aqeel al-Gharavi kee Urdu iss qadar saqeel nahin hai laikin iss wajah se lagtee hai kyun ke aap zyada tar baatain falsafiyana pairaye main bayaan farmatay hain.

Unka iss baar ka ashra saara sunaa. . ."Husn-e-Ikhtiyar" per buhat khubsoorat behes kee hai. baray arsay baad kisi Urdu walay se iss qadar shusta aur shai'sta Urdu sun'nay ka mauqa mila. barray napay tulay andaaz main khitaab kartay hain. basa auqaat chotay chotay jumlon aur aam alfaaz kee madad se aisee khubsoorat aur baa ma'ani baatain keh jatay hain ke insaan 'ash 'ash karta reh jata hai. wo jaisay hamari zabaan main kehtay hain na ke "chass" hee aa gayee ab ke inhen sun kar.

Iss saal kee pehlee majlis main hazrat ne Taqlid ke mauzoo' per barree salees aur 'umda guftugu kee hai, sun'nay ke laiq hai.

Aur kisi ne unka latest ashra suna?

[-SeeKeR-]

i agree with chronic...though i just love him but some of the words just fly off my head and i just derive its meaning with ref to the sentence.

[imranali]

Maulana Aqeel Garavi is not very well educated but he has art of making speeches and get attention of the listners. he uses difficult words of URDU in order to show peoples that i am educated person.

he is a molana but he likes to be called as "Aayat ullah" which is word for Marja's only.

[Marbles]

Maulana Aqeel Garavi is not very well educated but he has art of making speeches and get attention of the listners. he uses difficult words of URDU in order to show peoples that i am educated person.

he is a molana but he likes to be called as "Aayat ullah" which is word for Marja's only.

His speeches are manifestations of his knowledge and 'ilm. He is a learned man, no doubt about that. One cannot possibly use difficult language and impress intelligent public that they are learned. Knowledge reveals itself.

The title "Ayatullah" is not used for Maraje' only. Its also used for mujtahids. Moreover, 'Ayatullah' is not a property of those who reach the level of ijtehad.

Edited February 2, 2007 by Jibran Haider

[Abuzar]

Salaam:

^

His Urdu isn't saqeel at all.

Its just that you are at sea in Urdu

Bibi, he does have the tendency of choosing the less easy alternative where vocabulary presents two or more choices.

Maulana Aqeel Garavi is not very well educated but he has art of making speeches and get attention of the listners. he uses difficult words of URDU in order to show peoples that i am educated person.

he is a molana but he likes to be called as "Aayat ullah" which is word for Marja's only.

The observation is not only in very poor taste but also factually incorrect:

• Maulana Aqeel ul Gharawi is one of those scholars who has undergone both temporal and religious education, as is apparent from his grasp of Urdu and English languages as well classic and contemporary literature in both languages.
  
• Without commenting on whether the usage of the term with his name is appropriate or not (for it is not my level to make such comment), let me submit the factual correction that maraji are of the level of Grand Ayatullah not Ayatullah.
  

[kaneez e mehdi]

Maulana Aqeel Garavi is not very well educated but he has art of making speeches and get attention of the listners. he uses difficult words of URDU in order to show peoples that i am educated person.

he is a molana but he likes to be called as "Aayat ullah" which is word for Marja's only.

i m sorry brother but its such a childish post.

i dont have to say much coz two wise brothers above my post have said much and very well. but just tell me who do u consider awell educated person?

[SyedMohsin]

(salam)

By the way he has reached the level of studies to be called an Ayatullah.

[Ishk-e-Zahra]

he uses difficult words of URDU in order to show peoples that i am educated person.

Using difficult terms doesn't give one, the certificate of an educated person

brother, please refrain from using such words for a learned man ..

The majalises recited by him, indeed reveals his knowledge...

[MOHIB E AHLAYBAIT]

Imran maybe by not understanding his language you are proving that you are uneducated, atleast when it comes to urdu.

[Rawshni]

(bismillah)

(salam)

I believe the time to call a spade a spade, has come.

I responded to Brother Chronic the way I did, for the following easy to understand reasons.

1. Aqeel al Gharavi sits on the Minbar-e-Rasool, which is an honour not for everybody. I did not want to say anything that would seem to lessen the honour of the Minbar.

2. Brother Chronic, as he had himself introduced himself, doesn't know much urdu. So he should not have judged Aqeel Gharvi, simply asked for help.

3. Now that it seems Chronic's need for assistance in understanding al Gharvi's diction has ballooned into something else, things should be put into perspective.

Maulana Aqeel al-Gharavi kee Urdu iss qadar saqeel nahin hai laikin iss wajah se lagtee hai kyun ke aap zyada tar baatain falsafiyana pairaye main bayaan farmatay hain.

Unka iss baar ka ashra saara sunaa. . ."Husn-e-Ikhtiyar" per buhat khubsoorat behes kee hai. baray arsay baad kisi Urdu walay se iss qadar shusta aur shai'sta Urdu sun'nay ka mauqa mila. barray napay tulay andaaz main khitaab kartay hain. basa auqaat chotay chotay jumlon aur aam alfaaz kee madad se aisee khubsoorat aur baa ma'ani baatain keh jatay hain ke insaan 'ash 'ash karta reh jata hai. wo jaisay hamari zabaan main kehtay hain na ke "chass" hee aa gayee ab ke inhen sun kar.

Iss saal kee pehlee majlis main hazrat ne Taqlid ke mauzoo' per barree salees aur 'umda guftugu kee hai, sun'nay ke laiq hai.

Aur kisi ne unka latest ashra suna?

Tumm nay mujhay iss qadar hairaan kiya hai keh bayaan naheen karr sakktee

i agree with chronic...though i just love him but some of the words just fly off my head and i just derive its meaning with ref to the sentence.

Coming from, you, that carries a lot of weight. And you are quite right in agreeing with Chronic.

Maulana Aqeel Garavi is not very well educated but he has art of making speeches and get attention of the listners. he uses difficult words of URDU in order to show peoples that i am educated person.

he is a molana but he likes to be called as "Aayat ullah" which is word for Marja's only.

O bhaee imranali, yehee baat kisee thorray say "saqeel" andaaz mein keh dayatay, tou aisey naa laggtaa keh lathth maara hai

His speeches are manifestations of his knowledge and 'ilm. He is a learned man, no doubt about that. One cannot possibly use difficult language and impress intelligent public that they are learned. Knowledge reveals itself.

The title "Ayatullah" is not used for Maraje' only. Its also used for mujtahids. Moreover, 'Ayatullah' is not a property of those who reach the level of ijtehad.

Ayatullah literally means a sign of Allah. Technically, all of Allah's creations are Ayatullahs.

Salaam:

Bibi, he does have the tendency of choosing the less easy alternative where vocabulary presents two or more choices.

The observation is not only in very poor taste but also factually incorrect:

• Maulana Aqeel ul Gharawi is one of those scholars who has undergone both temporal and religious education, as is apparent from his grasp of Urdu and English languages as well classic and contemporary literature in both languages.
  
• Without commenting on whether the usage of the term with his name is appropriate or not (for it is not my level to make such comment), let me submit the factual correction that maraji are of the level of Grand Ayatullah not Ayatullah.
  

Bhaaee

Aaap nay oopar jo bohat kahee, uss mein dou raye naheen ho sakkteen

Neechay jo likhaa, uss say mujhay ikhtelaaf hai

Using difficult terms doesn't give one, the certificate of an educated person

brother, please refrain from using such words for a learned man ..

The majalises recited by him, indeed reveals his knowledge...

To me it seems Aqeel al Ghjarvi is another Talib Johri in the makin; all style and no substance

Edited February 2, 2007 by Rawshni

[MOHIB E AHLAYBAIT]

(bismillah)

To me it seems Aqeel al Ghjarvi is another Talib Johri in the makin; all style and no substance

Talib Johri - All style no substance.....

Ullama eik aam insaan say kahi ziada ilm rakhtay hai, lekin phir bhee hai sirif insaan he. Allama Talib Johri bhee insaan he hai, ab to (pichlay panch - chay saal say) to woh bus dhoratay hia upna purana jama shuda mawad, lekin ab bhee kabhi josh mei hoon to phir dekhai unhai. Hai to insaan he, but upni poorani majlis ko dhoora kay waqt guzar detay hai, lekin issay unkay ilm kay baray mei kuch nahi kaha ja sakta.

Khair app ka comment sunkay eik dum disagree karnay kay liyay likhnay eth gaya lekin jub upna oper ka paragraph likh kar parha to nazar aya key yeh ab to jo baat app keh rahi hai sahi he hai. Or waisya bhee unkay ilm kay baray mei to baat bhee nahi key thee app nay.

I just confused myself now :)

[Rawshni]

Talib Johri - All style no substance.....

Ullama eik aam insaan say kahi ziada ilm rakhtay hai, lekin phir bhee hai sirif insaan he. Allama Talib Johri bhee insaan he hai, ab to (pichlay panch - chay saal say) to woh bus dhoratay hia upna purana jama shuda mawad, lekin ab bhee kabhi josh mei hoon to phir dekhai unhai. Hai to insaan he, but upni poorani majlis ko dhoora kay waqt guzar detay hai, lekin issay unkay ilm kay baray mei kuch nahi kaha ja sakta.

Khair app ka comment sunkay eik dum disagree karnay kay liyay likhnay eth gaya lekin jub upna oper ka paragraph likh kar parha to nazar aya key yeh ab to jo baat app keh rahi hai sahi he hai. Or waisya bhee unkay ilm kay baray mei to baat bhee nahi key thee app nay.

I just confused myself now :)

(salam)

Bhaee mayray

Pehlee bat tou yeh hai keh Shiah Islam harr shakhs kou 'Aalim daikhna chaahta hai. Iss baat kou abb Shiyoun nay talaaq day chorree hai

Iss kee wajeh say aisey logoun kay liye, jinn kaa 'ilm sathee hai aur andaaz guftugu dramaaee hotaa hai, sunn nay waaloun kou asar andaaz karnaa bohat aasaan ho gyaa hai

Talib Johri kay walid-e-marhoom, Allameh Mustafa Johar aala Allah maqaamahu waqaee 'aalim thay. Mayn nay unn kee taqareer kee recordings sunee hain, nihayat bakamaal aadmee thay

Edited February 2, 2007 by Rawshni

[MOHIB E AHLAYBAIT]

Waqt kay sath sath zamana badalta rehta hai.

Moulana Johar, Hafiz Kifayat Hussain, Bashir Saheb Fateh Taxela (not sure about spelling) unki baat he hor thee, lekin unka andaaz jo tha woh ab kay daur kay lehaz say bohat loggo kay liyay itna karamad bhee nahi hoga.

Pehlay bhee tabaraee majalis hotiee thee lekin unka andaz alag hota tha, ab bhee htoiee hai lekin alag tareeqay say. Ab kuch or daur hai, jiss tarha eik daur tha kay doosro kay eitrazaat per aksar yeh kaha jata tha kay khamoosh raho sabr karo, ab woh daur chala gaya, ab eint ka jawab pather say denay ka waqt hai issi liyay ullama ka andaaz bhee badal gaya hai. Bulkay sirif ullama ka nahi bulkay zakireen ka bhee.

Mei Ali Mohammad Rizvi (Sachey marhoon) noha khawan ko zati taru pay jatna tha woh kehtay thay kay jub tak woh karachi mei rahey unki shaeri ka andaaz kuch or tha or Canada akay unka andaaz badal gaya (mahool ka asar) I think yehee masla humarya zakireen ulama kay saath hai.

Doosray internet or doosray media nay ab loggo ka standard change kar diya hai. Pehaly alim nay mehnat karkay eik ashra taiyar kar liya or wohee majalis poori duniay mei parhtay rehtay thay, lekin technology nay woh sub change kar diya ab duniya kay kissi konay mei eik baat karei here jaga phonch jati hai, is liyay ab loggo ko lagta hai kay repeat kar rahey hai kuch parhany ko nahi hai.

Waisay app nay kabhi Hafiz Kifayat Hussian Marhoom key majalis sunni hai??

[Rawshni]

Waqt kay sath sath zamana badalta rehta hai.

Moulana Johar, Hafiz Kifayat Hussain, Bashir Saheb Fateh Taxela (not sure about spelling) unki baat he hor thee, lekin unka andaaz jo tha woh ab kay daur kay lehaz say bohat loggo kay liyay itna karamad bhee nahi hoga.

Pehlay bhee tabaraee majalis hotiee thee lekin unka andaz alag hota tha, ab bhee htoiee hai lekin alag tareeqay say. Ab kuch or daur hai, jiss tarha eik daur tha kay doosro kay eitrazaat per aksar yeh kaha jata tha kay khamoosh raho sabr karo, ab woh daur chala gaya, ab eint ka jawab pather say denay ka waqt hai issi liyay ullama ka andaaz bhee badal gaya hai. Bulkay sirif ullama ka nahi bulkay zakireen ka bhee.

Mei Ali Mohammad Rizvi (Sachey marhoon) noha khawan ko zati taru pay jatna tha woh kehtay thay kay jub tak woh karachi mei rahey unki shaeri ka andaaz kuch or tha or Canada akay unka andaaz badal gaya (mahool ka asar) I think yehee masla humarya zakireen ulama kay saath hai.

Doosray internet or doosray media nay ab loggo ka standard change kar diya hai. Pehaly alim nay mehnat karkay eik ashra taiyar kar liya or wohee majalis poori duniay mei parhtay rehtay thay, lekin technology nay woh sub change kar diya ab duniya kay kissi konay mei eik baat karei here jaga phonch jati hai, is liyay ab loggo ko lagta hai kay repeat kar rahey hai kuch parhany ko nahi hai.

Waisay app nay kabhi Hafiz Kifayat Hussian Marhoom key majalis sunni hai??

(salam)

Bhaee

Ahqaaq-e-Haq aur ibtaal-e-baatil tou hameisha say Shiah Majalis kaa asl rahaa hai.

Tabarra pehlay qaedey say hotaa thaa, abb jaisey filmi loug kehtay hain "mota action" hotaa hai - jo keh koyee achchee baat naheen hai.

Allameh Hafiz Kiayat Hussain Sahab, Allameh Mohammad Basheer Ansari Sahab, Allameh Sayyed Azhar Hasan Zaidi Saheb, Mallameh Zafar Hasan Amrovi Sahab, Allameh Agha Zameer ul Hasan Najafi Sahab, aur Allameh Rasheed Trurabi Sahab apnay apnay andaaz mein harr eik durr-e-yateem thaa, bolkul yaganeh roozgaar.

Sachchee baat poocho tou Shiah peh guzeshteh sadee bohat bhaaree guzree hai, qaht al rijaal kee sadee. Jo babay kaam kay thay woh eik eik karr kay apnay Rabb say jaa milay, naye aanay waalay kisee jogay naheen hain . . .

Yeh baat sirf Pakistan parr sadiq naheen aatee, dunya bharr mein Shiah kay liye hai, aur sakht lamh-e-fikriyeh hai

[MOHIB E AHLAYBAIT]

Waisay ab "mota action" key he zaroorat hai, ab tak humnay kiya hasil kar liya. Shia 1400 saal say kattay he a rahay hai. Eik qom say kub tak yeh expect kiya ja sakta hai kay khamoosh rahey.

Yeh naqsh-e-ghum-e-sarwar hai zaki, mitnay ka nahi yeh duniya say

utna he ubharta rehta hai, jitna kay dabaya jata hai.

Or mei koie alim nahi lekin meri upni observation hai kay loggo kay standard bohat change hogayee hai, ajj kay daur mei her bacha bukhari, muslim parh sakta hai (net pay) Kafi, man la yazuur ul faqih, istabsar sub kuch thora thora dekh chooka hai. Is liyay ab loggo ko ullama ka ehsaas hota hai kay woh nahi rahey.

Waisay sirif pichlee sadi nahi ussay pehlay bhee baray baray ullama guzar gaye jinsay lagta tha kay ab unka badal nahi ayega, lekin a he gaya. Or issi tarha ab hai, agar dekha jayee to Talib Johri kuch phir bhee app ko doosro say behtar laggay gay, inkay baad kiya hoga? Inkay baad bhee koie na koie a he jayega.

Edited February 2, 2007 by MOHIB E AHLAYBAIT

[Rawshni]

Waisay ab "mota action" key he zaroorat hai, ab tak humnay kiya hasil kar liya. Shia 1400 saal say kattay he a rahay hai. Eik qom say kub tak yeh expect kiya ja sakta hai kay khamoosh rahey.

Yeh naqsh-e-ghum-e-sarwar hai zaki, mitnay ka nahi yeh duniya say

utna he ubharta rehta hai, jitna kay dabaya jata hai.

Or mei koie alim nahi lekin meri upni observation hai kay loggo kay standard bohat change hogayee hai, ajj kay daur mei her bacha bukhari, muslim parh sakta hai (net pay) Kafi, man la yazuur ul faqih, istabsar sub kuch thora thora dekh chooka hai. Is liyay ab loggo ko ullama ka ehsaas hota hai kay woh nahi rahey.

Waisay sirif pichlee sadi nahi ussay pehlay bhee baray baray ullama guzar gaye jinsay lagta tha kay ab unka badal nahi ayega, lekin a he gaya. Or issi tarha ab hai, agar dekha jayee to Talib Johri kuch phir bhee app ko doosro say behtar laggay gay, inkay baad kiya hoga? Inkay baad bhee koie na koie a he jayega.

(salam)

Nah

Motay action kee naa kall zururat thee, naa aaj hai.

Daikho, Shi'ism kee hifazat kaa zimmeh oopar waalay nay khud liya hai. Yoon bhee hamm aap kee awqaat hee kyaa hai.

'Ilm kaa m'eyaar girr gya hai, saheeh hai yeh baat.

Baat 'ilm takk rasaaee kee naheen hai, baat talab-e-ilm kee hai. Jis mein hai woh aaj bhee sarfraaz hai, jahaan naheen hai, wahaan naheen hai . . .

Mayn nay kahaa thaa, pichlee sadi Shia mein qaht al rijaal kee sadi thee, Shia mein barray aadmee bohat kamm saamnay aaye

Edited February 2, 2007 by Rawshni

[MOHIB E AHLAYBAIT]

Kabhi waqt hota hai sullah ka (Imam Hassan) kabhi waqt hota hai jung ka (Imam Hussain).

Ab jiss tarha kay aitrazaat hotay hai shio pay kiya pehlay bhee aisay hota tha? Ab jiss tarha jaga jaga Shia kafir likha hota hai kiya phelay bhee aisa hota tha? Ab waqt badal gaya hai. I mean I m not promoting violence but there is a limit to everything.

Ilm to hai he humari merras, or shio mei abhi bhee mojood hai baat hotie hai tallash karnay key.

Waisay jaha tak Talib Johri ka talloq hai, app unkay ammal ko nahi dekhai agar ilm ko dekhai to waqaee alim shakz hai woh. Waisay unki majalis mei nahi lekin unkay sath beth kar baat karey to ziada ehsaas hota hai kay kiya cheez hai woh.

Jaha tak shio mei baray addmi agay annay ka talooq hai, shio mei sabhi baray hotay hai, ab shia sunni forum he dekh kar andaza hojayega kay kis qoom kay pass kitnay ilm hai or kitnay barya hai.

Edited February 2, 2007 by MOHIB E AHLAYBAIT

[Rawshni]

Kabhi waqt hota hai sullah ka (Imam Hassan) kabhi waqt hota hai jung ka (Imam Hussain).

Ab jiss tarha kay aitrazaat hotay hai shio pay kiya pehlay bhee aisay hota tha? Ab jiss tarha jaga jaga Shia kafir likha hota hai kiya phelay bhee aisa hota tha? Ab waqt badal gaya hai. I mean I m not promoting violence but there is a limit to everything.

Ilm to hai he humari merras, or shio mei abhi bhee mojood hai baat hotie hai tallash karnay key.

Waisay jaha tak Talib Johri ka talloq hai, app unkay ammal ko nahi dekhai agar ilm ko dekhai to waqaee alim shakz hai woh. Waisay unki majalis mei nahi lekin unkay sath beth kar baat karey to ziada ehsaas hota hai kay kiya cheez hai woh.

Jaha tak shio mei baray addmi agay annay ka talooq hai, shio mei sabhi baray hotay hai, ab shia sunni forum he dekh kar andaza hojayega kay kis qoom kay pass kitnay ilm hai or kitnay barya hai.

(salam)

Yeh falsfaeh hee ghalat hai keh Imam Hussain kaa Yazeed kee b'eyat say inkaar koyee jang thee.

Siyasi maulvyoun nay Karbala kou apnee dukaandaaryaan chamkaanaay kay yeh estemaal kiya hai, magar kisee soorat yeh naheen bataatee kee keh Karbala jang thee: taareekh yeh bataatee hai hai keh entehaayee barbariyyat say, sochay samjhay mansoobeh kay mutabiq, Imam Hussain aur unn kay saathyoun kou qatl kiya gyaa -- seedha seedha massacre.

Jang karrnay jo nikaltay hain, woh ghar say apnay 'alam peh ÅöäøóÇ áöáøåö æóÅöäøóÜÇ Åöáóíúåö ÑóÇÌöÚæä likhwaa kay naheen nikaltay, kuchch dinn kay dhoodh peetay bachchay saath lay kay naheen nikaltay.

Talib Johri kou chorro. Unn kaa zikr zimnan aa gyaa thaa. Mujhay 'aamal say gharaz naheen. Haan yeh hai, keh mayray yahaan 'aalim kee definition aur hai, aur maujoodeh daur kee Shia akthariyyat kay yahaan 'aalim kee definition aur hai.

Mayn Shia Sunni dialog mein jaatee hee naheen

[MOHIB E AHLAYBAIT]

(salam)

Yeh falsfaeh hee ghalat hai keh Imam Hussain kaa Yazeed kee b'eyat say inkaar koyee jang thee.

Siyasi maulvyoun nay Karbala kou apnee dukaandaaryaan chamkaanaay kay yeh estemaal kiya hai, magar kisee soorat yeh naheen bataatee kee keh Karbala jang thee: taareekh yeh bataatee hai hai keh entehaayee barbariyyat say, sochay samjhay mansoobeh kay mutabiq, Imam Hussain aur unn kay saathyoun kou qatl kiya gyaa -- seedha seedha massacre.

Yeh ab app alfaz say khel rahi hia. You know what I meant when I said Imam Hussain nay jung key. Ofcourse woh jung kay liyay nahi niklay thay but you know kay mera point kiya tha.

[MOHIB E AHLAYBAIT]

Hum alimo per to aitraaz karnay kay liyay taiyar hai lekin upnay app ko nahi dekhtay. Alim bhee insaan hota hai, ussay bhee pait bharna hota hai, jub doosray khayal nahi kareingay to woh khod kuch na kuch karayga. Jahan woh thora sa tera houa ilm rukhsat.

Khair shia alim ho, aam insaan ho, koie ho, I don't go against them. I beleive kumsay kum itne aqal, tameez to thee kay haq to agaya.

[Rawshni]

Yeh ab app alfaz say khel rahi hia. You know what I meant when I said Imam Hussain nay jung key. Ofcourse woh jung kay liyay nahi niklay thay but you know kay mera point kiya tha.

Yeh muaameleh itnaa sanjeedeh hai keh iss mein alfaaz say khailnay kee koyee gunjaaesh naheen nikalti

Guzeshteh 30 saaloun mein kitaaboun kaa eik toomaar shaay'a kiya giya hai yeh saabit karrnay kay liye keh Imam jang hee kay liye niklay thay

Hum alimo per to aitraaz karnay kay liyay taiyar hai lekin upnay app ko nahi dekhtay. Alim bhee insaan hota hai, ussay bhee pait bharna hota hai, jub doosray khayal nahi kareingay to woh khod kuch na kuch karayga. Jahan woh thora sa tera houa ilm rukhsat.

Khair shia alim ho, aam insaan ho, koie ho, I don't go against them. I beleive kumsay kum itne aqal, tameez to thee kay haq to agaya.

Pata naheen kyaa baat karr rahay ho bhaee. Jin baatoun kaa zikr yahaan oopar hai, mayn nay kahee hee naheen

Edited February 3, 2007 by Rawshni

[MOHIB E AHLAYBAIT]

Yeh muaameleh itnaa sanjeedeh hai keh iss mein alfaaz say khailnay kee koyee gunjaaesh naheen nikalti

Guzeshteh 30 saaloun mein kitaaboun kaa eik toomaar shaay'a kiya giya hai yeh saabit karrnay kay liye keh Imam jang hee kay liye niklay thay

Yeah app sahi keh rahi hai, but shia honay key waja say yeh sooch he nahi hai is liyay shayad jaldi mei keh gaya.

Khair jaha tak shio kay ilm key baat hai to bus ab yeh nahi dekhna chiaya kay alim kon hai ilm hai ya nahi. Jo ajj kal shio ka hasher hogaya hai, her cheez mei aitraaz, bus yeh dekhai kay aqeeda sahi hai to bus bohat acha hai warna koie bhee ho bhekar hai.

[Marbles]

Tumm nay mujhay iss qadar hairaan kiya hai keh bayaan naheen karr sakktee

Main ne Aqeel al-Gharavi ko zyada suna hai na un ke baray main qata'ee raaye rakhta hoon. magar unka 'umoomee tarz-e-takkallum aisa hai ke wo khalis falsafiyana nukton ko aksar zer-e-behes latay hain. kam az kam pichlay do 'ashroN main aisa hota rahaa hai.

Doosra ye ke iss baar kee pehlee taqreer main unhon ne simple analogy se Taqlid ke mut'aliq jo kahaa hai, hamarya 'ulema kehtay rehtay hain. ye analogy buree nahin. Ghaibat-e-Imam-e-Zamana [ajtf] main Shion ko Taqlid, zuroorat-e-taqlid aur sharait-e-taqlid se aagaah hona chahiye. hamaray haan aksar loug iss baat se kulliyatan naa-waaqif hain. baaz ko yahan tak nahin pata ke taqlid na karnay kee soorat main mutabaadal kyaa hain. pooree daastaan-e-gham hai choriye.

Baqee jahaan tak ta'aluq hai style hee style aur no substance. . .to mere khayaal main is ka zyada ta'aluq iss baat se bhi hai ke sun'nay wala mukarrar se kiss darjay aur haesiyat kee baat sun'na chahta hai. minbar per jalwa afroz hazraat ka fann-e-khatabat bhi ehem hota hai. aur phir hum Shia majlison main 70% unhee masa'il per baat kartay hain jo kisi na kisi tarah Sunni-Shia farq ko highlight karen aur hamaray un se farq awaam ko samjhayen. dars kee baatain kam hotee hain.

Talib Johri kee jahaan tak baat hai tou ye sacch hai ke pichlay 3/4 saal se un kee taqreeren mehez repetition hain. lambi chorree tamheed ke baad jab daleel kee baat kartay hain tou pani per bulbulah sabit hota hai. kahaa ja sakta hai ke aaj kall wo form mai nahin hain. halaanka sann do hazaar aur us ke aagay peechay kee un kee taqaareer main substance qadray accha tha.

Ye bhi ehem hai ke minbar per jalwa afroz shaks ko sirf minbar ke ai'nay main hee na dekha jaaye. Talib Johri na ghaliban Ahsan-ul-Hadith kee do jilden murattab kee hain. aap ne yaqeenan dekhee hongee. Banda itnaa maarraa nahin hai waisay.

Baqee Allah sab ko un kee niyyaton ka phall day. aur jholee bhar ke de.

Wasslam

[Rawshni]

Main ne Aqeel al-Gharavi ko zyada suna hai na un ke baray main qata'ee raaye rakhta hoon. magar unka 'umoomee tarz-e-takkallum aisa hai ke wo khalis falsafiyana nukton ko aksar zer-e-behes latay hain. kam az kam pichlay do 'ashroN main aisa hota rahaa hai.

Doosra ye ke iss baar kee pehlee taqreer main unhon ne simple analogy se Taqlid ke mut'aliq jo kahaa hai, hamarya 'ulema kehtay rehtay hain. ye analogy buree nahin. Ghaibat-e-Imam-e-Zamana [ajtf] main Shion ko Taqlid, zuroorat-e-taqlid aur sharait-e-taqlid se aagaah hona chahiye. hamaray haan aksar loug iss baat se kulliyatan naa-waaqif hain. baaz ko yahan tak nahin pata ke taqlid na karnay kee soorat main mutabaadal kyaa hain. pooree daastaan-e-gham hai choriye.

Baqee jahaan tak ta'aluq hai style hee style aur no substance. . .to mere khayaal main is ka zyada ta'aluq iss baat se bhi hai ke sun'nay wala mukarrar se kiss darjay aur haesiyat kee baat sun'na chahta hai. minbar per jalwa afroz hazraat ka fann-e-khatabat bhi ehem hota hai. aur phir hum Shia majlison main 70% unhee masa'il per baat kartay hain jo kisi na kisi tarah Sunni-Shia farq ko highlight karen aur hamaray un se farq awaam ko samjhayen. dars kee baatain kam hotee hain.

Talib Johri kee jahaan tak baat hai tou ye sacch hai ke pichlay 3/4 saal se un kee taqreeren mehez repetition hain. lambi chorree tamheed ke baad jab daleel kee baat kartay hain tou pani per bulbulah sabit hota hai. kahaa ja sakta hai ke aaj kall wo form mai nahin hain. halaanka sann do hazaar aur us ke aagay peechay kee un kee taqaareer main substance qadray accha tha.

Ye bhi ehem hai ke minbar per jalwa afroz shaks ko sirf minbar ke ai'nay main hee na dekha jaaye. Talib Johri na ghaliban Ahsan-ul-Hadith kee do jilden murattab kee hain. aap ne yaqeenan dekhee hongee. Banda itnaa maarraa nahin hai waisay.

Baqee Allah sab ko un kee niyyaton ka phall day. aur jholee bhar ke de.

Wasslam

Theek hai bhaee, hamm hee ghalat . . .

[Marbles]

sis main naraz ho jaonga main keh raha hoon :angry:

main ne kab kaha you are wrong. hmm?

[Rawshni]

sis main naraz ho jaonga main keh raha hoon :angry:

Ho saktay ho?

[Marbles]

^ Ho sakta hoon?