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In the Name of God بسم الله


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Everything posted by fallah

  1. Who was the Imam between Jesus and Muhammad? You're the one exagerating the word "Imam". Like I said, everytime this word was used in a positive light, it refered to a prophet. It never refered to an "infallible man". http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=2&tid=3373 Read. I didn't even look at this before writing my reply. Seems me and ibn Kathir saw the same thing. Truely, you're exagerating. Read. (Say (O Muhammad ): "Truly, my Lord has guided me to a straight path, a right religion, the religion of Ibrahim, Hanifan, and Ibrahim (to worship none but Allah, alone) and he was not of Al-Mushrikin.'') (6:161) Thus, Abraham was made leader in terms of piousness and a figure to emulate for the people to come. In that sense, Abraham is said to be leader of men. Fact is, give the quran to anyone, let him read it, and he'll never see this imamat concept. And even if he does see Allah appoints some leaders, he will not find that Allah appointed leaders after Muhammad. Have fun.
  2. Nobody said it is not permissible to ask someone to pray for you or to pray for someone.You cannot ask someone who is not in this world, because by definition it is not asking, you're invoking them. If you do, then you've given divinity to thoses saints. Really, it's simple. In Islam there is no detour, Allah is always listening to our duas. If you need something, invoke Him, there's really nothing difficult to understand. But ofc, people will still deny and reduce Allah to a wordly king who refuses to listen to his servants.
  3. To me it sounds like hiding the name of Allah.
  4. I'm pretty sure I made my point. I said both sects are confusing and illogical at different points. Ali didn't refuse their rule. If they were disbelievers or w/e, I don't think "safeguarding the ummah" is a valid reason because there was no ummah left, as you guys put it. If he didn't refuse their rule, why do you? He would have made war. He would have declared their illegitimacy, he wouldn't participate in their government. People quote "If it wasn't for Ali, x would be lost". Logical deduction, Ali participated in their governments. Did Ali participate with disbelievers?
  5. I just saw it right here in this subforum. I also heard it on the radio.
  6. (bismillah) (salam) I will try to expose my current thoughts about this whole sunni/shia issue, and what seems to make sense and what does not. Please understand that this whole subject has become confusing to my mind, and the current political atmosphere is making things worse. First, I would like to expose my thoughts on this whole subject about succession and the companions, perhaps binding in my thoughts about the hadiths at the same time. Looking at the stories of the Prophets throughout the Quran, we understand that history repeats itself. There's this general idea that the Prophets of all times have been treated harshly and have suffered greatly, even though they deserve the best of treatments. What we also see is that most people reject the message. We see that Noah preached for 950 years and less than 10 embarked on the ark. We also see that the children of Israel began to worship the calf after 40 days of absence from Moses. Attitudes of family members of prophets are not the same throughout history, meaning not all of them were good, and of course alot of them were pious. There were wicked women who were destroyed by Allah, and good women who were saved and promised marvelous rewards. It is the same when it comes to men. Being the son, uncle or father of a prophet did not ensure good behavior. Now, we come to our Prophet's time. What I find is that the personalities that the shia reject are often tainted in ungodly behavior in the sunni sahih hadith. Personally, I fail to see how sunnis don't see this in their books. It is as if some behaviors are accepted and not questioned just because they were among the prophet's presence. We can recall different situations, such as the event of the pen and paper, or when the Prophet told them to follow Usama. Theses 2 events happened at the end of the prophet's time, yet people fail to see how this is an important detail. If the sahaba were still disobeying the Prophet during his last days, when would the sahaba understand who this Muhammad was? This seems to confuse me. Then comes the events of the burial of the Prophet. It is said his body remained unburied for 3 days. It is also said while Ali and his family were busy with his body, some sahaba heard about some meeting taking place between different people concerning the caliphate. Ok now things get confusing. While it is understandable that the succession is an important matter, it cannot be more important than the Prophet's funeral. Another problem is that, if we were to believe that the Prophet did not designate or see the need to designate his successor, we cannot really say that the sahaba knew more about the need of this ummah than he did, so to say it was an emergency and they had to leave doesn't sound like a legitimate excuse. Also, to say that indeed the Prophet did designate Abu Bakr as his successor by telling him to lead the prayer at some previous time, then there was obviously no need for a shura, and Ali wouldn't complain about his non-participation of the process as it is related in the sahih. The idea that the Prophet did designate a successor is an attractive thought. As the shias would say, Ali was designated successor of the Prophet at Ghadir, and their tafsir of "mawla" being "master" in the speech of the Prophet seems more convincing than the sunni version. More questions arise. The concept of Immamat the shias propose is not rigid, lacks consistency, and is not available in the Quran explicitly. The verses used to support this concept are often extracted without looking at the context, and exaggeration is used. While they have a list of 12 successors and their version of Ahlul-Bayt seem to correspond to the sunni sahih muslim hadiths, the concept of infallibility and overexageration of their characteristics does not go hand in hand with history. Ali did not protest the caliphates, although it could be said he did for 6 months during the first, even according to the sunni sahihs. The sunni version that Ali gave his alliance twice is weak. While we could show that the Prophet nominated Ali, we cannot show that Hassan was next, and that the 6th would be al-Sadiq. The Prophet did not seem to give out the names before his death, and there was confusion about the imam of the time as I have understood. The occultation of the 12th Imam isn't shocking, for Jesus was in occultation according most muslims. While the shia version of Imam Mahdi goes hand in hand with the hadith about being of the descendant of fatima, it leaves questions in my mind, since the purpose of immamat was to guide, and not hide. This is quite funny, for there are theses isolated sects where they are at their 49th? imam and seem to serve the concept better, but we know he's making haram halal. Also, the concept of being secret imams is repulsive, a divine guide does not fulfil his role by hiding from the public eye and using taqiyya. This whole secretive aura the shias have given to the lives of the imams seem very contrary to the spirit of Islam. To me, this abundance of farfetched ideas have been integrated in the shia ahadith over time. Theses 12 men could indeed be the 12 leaders, but not the way the shia have protrayed them. We can find many hadith where the imams are turned into demi-gods, controlling the universe and bestowed exagerated amounts of hidden knoweldge. Today, this exaggeration can be seen through the way some venerate them in their shrines. Indeed, this is sad. There is also this thing where Umar, at first sight, seems to change the sunna of the Prophet during his rule. We can see that in the sunni ahadith concerning mutaa for example. While mutaa was revealed in the Quran in verse 4:24 as shown in tafser ibn kathir, there is in fact no verse abrogating it. And the conflicting accounts in sunni hadith when it was abrogated seem to confuse the reader, and the scholars of sunnis even declared that the Prophet permitted mutaa twice and banned it twice. Although this seems to support the shia view, the conditions to practice mutaa seem to have nothing to do with how it was practiced back in the times. Fatima is at the center of this conflict. While we can understand that Abu Bakr had good intentions, the mystery behind Fatima's death and her illustrated anger cannot be a subject of little importance. I am against exagerating the events, such as saying that she was kicked in the stomach, because it comes as a direct insult to Ali, since there is no reports that he took action to defend her. Obviously something did happen, and it should not be tossed on the side. One question that comes into mind is, "is there shia hadith about this?" Are there shia hadiths about Fadak, the burning of her house, the hadith of pen and paper, the hadith of the cloak? I see them being quoted from sunni hadith but I have not really encountered them in shia hadith. Ah, while I have not spoke of everything, I want to say something on the tragedy of Karbala. To my understanding, the sunnis say the 10th of Muharram is a jolly day because of certain events concerning the prophets. While this is a coincidence, one might be forced to believe it is an intentional one. Please understand something conerning the visiting of the graves. Imagine the graves to be the persons in them. Would any of you put his hands all over the Prophet? Or would you stand at a proper distance and say salam to him and pray that Allah bless him? Other than that, we muslims have nothing else to do in front of tombs. You visit them out of respect, give salam, pray that Allah bless them, and go. It is ignorance to jump on stone and start touching it everywhere like people without reason. While I respect shias for their visiting of the graves, I do not show an respect when they exagerate and act like drunk pagans. I also want to say I like how the salafis are hard against shirk and bidda, but do not appreciate their takfir and destroying the graves of people. Yes they should not become idols as they already have become, but it does not permit someone to disrespect the deceased person, especially that they are pious. Aisha. Shias do not like her. Sunnis consider her to be the favorite wife of the Prophet. While this could be the case, we cannot close our eyes on the sahih hadith. Aisha narrates lots of them. While I do not believe in inflicting harm on the persons character, she was known to be jealous. And in fact, didn't she narrate about how the Prophet used to talk of Khadija? I mean to me a Prophet wouldn't have a "favorite" wife, for he was a Prophet and was beyond favoritism. Where are his other wives? Why are they not as present in the hadith? I understand that sunnis do say she was wrong when she got on the Camel against Ali, they don't go as far as accusing her for the deaths during the battle. They say the army began to fight without her orders. And Ali did not seem to disrespect her after the battle. Did he show hostility? Doesn't seem like it. So while she was wrong, shias can be more forgiving, since they themselves have done things that are not worthy of praise. Ali did seem to forgive her, so you can too, unless you are not of his shia. There are still alot of things to be discussed. ---- Leave your comments. (salam)
  7. Who changed (bismillah) to "In His name" or "Bi issmihi t3ala"? I've heard and see it a couple of times, it sounds deceiving. In who's name are you talking about?
  8. Funny thing is, can you say otherwise about your imams? Weren't they born leaders, yet most of them never became? And also, you say he did the test while he was old. How is that not hitting yourself in the foot, since this imam clearly doesn't mean leadership in the sense you understand it? Point is, I don't see that test as a step to gain something. Abraham was already "friend of Allah", a prophet, infallible. There's nothing he could gain through that test except additional reward for his actions. And that sentence that comes after it can be understood in multiple ways and are much more consistent with the facts than what you are proposing. When Allah says "I will make you a leader of men", it could mean that Allah is telling him that he regards him as among the most pious of men, it could also mean that he is the father of many prophets and generations to come, hence he is their leader as a father, as the original Hanif which the subsequent prophets emulate in terms of faith and piousness. And when he asks Allah to make imams from his progeny, we most likely think of Isaac and Ishmael, way before thinking of the 5th and 6th imam, don't you think? Why exaggerate? And btw, every nation has a guide, but you're just being oblivious here. Our Prophet was sent to all of mankind, he's therefore our guide today. When Allah says there's a guide for every nation, it reflects the same meaning as this verse, 16:36 And certainly We raised in every nation a messenger saying: Serve Allah and shun the Shaitan. So there were some of them whom Allah guided and there were others against whom error was due; therefore travel in the land, then see what was the end of the rejecters. No need to exaggerate anything, the book of Allah is clear.
  9. If they are not dead then why are they in their graves and you mourn their martyrdom every year? Comprehension problems is all I see. Do what you want to do, you've been warned against it: 2:165 2:186 4:116 4:117 6:14 6:19 6:40 6:41 6:56 6:63 6:64 6:71 7:28 7:29 7:37 7:55 7:191 7:192 7:194 7:196 7:197 10:18 10:66 10:104 10:106 11:101 13:14 13:16 15:96 16:20 16:27 16:53 16:86 17:22 17:39 17:42 17:67 18:14 18:15 18:52 19:48 22:12 22:13 22:62 22:71 22:73 23:117 26:213 27:62 28:62 28:64 28:74 28:88 29:65 30:13 30:35 30:52 31:32 32:4 34:22 35:14 35:40 39:3 39:8 39:38 39:43 39:49 40:12 40:14 40:20 40:60 40:66 40:74 41:47 41:48 43:86 46:4 46:5 50:26 72:18 72:20 72:22 74:48 And if this is not enough for you, here are duas found in the Book of Allah. What did Allah teach us? Who do believers invoke? 1. Our Lord! Accept (this service) from us: For Thou art the All-Hearing, the All-knowing [2:127] 2. Our Lord! Make of us Muslims, bowing to Thy (Will), and of our progeny a people Muslim, bowing to Thy (will); and show us our place for the celebration of (due) rites; and turn unto us (in Mercy); for Thou art the Oft-Returning, Most Merciful [2:128] 3. Our Lord! Grant us good in this world and good in the hereafter, and save us from the chastisement of the fire [2:201] 4. Our Lord! Bestow on us endurance, make our foothold sure, and give us help against the disbelieving folk [2:250] 5. Our Lord! Condemn us not if we forget or fall into error [2:286] 6. Our Lord! Lay not on us a burden Like that which Thou didst lay on those before us [2:286] 7. Our Lord! Lay not on us a burden greater than we have strength to bear. Blot out our sins, and grant us forgiveness. Have mercy on us. Thou art our Protector; Help us against those who stand against faith [2:286] 8. Our Lord! (they say), Let not our hearts deviate now after Thou hast guided us, but grant us mercy from Thine own Presence; for Thou art the Grantor of bounties without measure [3:8] 9. Our Lord! Thou art He that will gather mankind Together against a day about which there is no doubt; for Allah never fails in His promise. [3:9] 10. Our Lord! We have indeed believed: forgive us, then, our sins, and save us from the agony of the Fire [3:16] 11. Our Lord! We believe in what Thou hast revealed, and we follow the Messenger. Then write us down among those who bear witness [3:53] 12. Our Lord! Forgive us our sins and anything We may have done that transgressed our duty: Establish our feet firmly, and help us against those that resist Faith [3:147] 13.Our Lord! Not for naught Hast Thou created (all) this! Glory to Thee! Give us salvation from the penalty of the Fire [3:191] 14. Our Lord! Any whom Thou dost admit to the Fire, Truly Thou coverest with shame, and never will wrong-doers Find any helpers! [3:192] 15. Our Lord! We have heard the call of one calling (Us) to Faith, 'Believe ye in the Lord,' and we have believed. [3:193] 16. Our Lord! Forgive us our sins, blot out from us our iniquities, and take to Thyself our souls in the company of the righteous [3:193] 17. Our Lord! Grant us what Thou didst promise unto us through Thine apostles, and save us from shame on the Day of Judgment: For Thou never breakest Thy promise [3:194] 18. Our Lord! We believe; write us down among the witnesses. [5:83] 19. O Allah our Lord! Send us from heaven a table set (with viands), that there may be for us - for the first and the last of us - a solemn festival and a sign from thee; and provide for our sustenance, for thou art the best Sustainer (of our needs) [5:114] 20. Our Lord! We have wronged our own souls: If thou forgive us not and bestow not upon us Thy Mercy, we shall certainly be lost. [7:23] 21. Our Lord! Send us not to the company of the wrong-doers [7:47] 22. Our Lord! Decide Thou between us and our people in truth, for Thou art the best to decide. [7:89] 23.Our Lord! Pour out on us patience and constancy, and take our souls unto thee as Muslims (who bow to thy will)! [7:126] 24. Our Lord! Make us not a trial for those who practise oppression; And deliver us by Thy Mercy from those who reject (Thee) [10:85-86] 25. O our Lord! Truly Thou dost know what we conceal and what we reveal: for nothing whatever is hidden from Allah, whether on earth or in heaven [14:38] 26. O our Lord! And accept my Prayer. [14:40] 27. O our Lord! Cover (us) with Thy Forgiveness - me, my parents, and (all) Believers, on the Day that the Reckoning will be established! [14:41] 28. Our Lord! Bestow on us Mercy from Thyself, and dispose of our affair for us in the right way! [18:10] 29. Our Lord! We fear lest he hasten with insolence against us, or lest he transgress all bounds [20: 45] 30. Our Lord! We believe; then do Thou forgive us, and have mercy upon us: For Thou art the Best of those who show mercy [23: 109] 31. Our Lord! Avert from us the Wrath of Hell, for its Wrath is indeed an affliction grievous,- Evil indeed is it as an abode, and as a place to rest in. [25: 65-66] 32. O my Lord! Grant unto us wives and offspring who will be the comfort of our eyes, and give us (the grace) to lead the righteous [25:74] 33. Our Lord is indeed Oft-Forgiving Ready to appreciate (service) [35: 34] 34. Our Lord! Thy Reach is over all things, in Mercy and Knowledge. Forgive, then, those who turn in Repentance, and follow Thy Path; and preserve them from the Penalty of the Blazing Fire! [40:7] 35. And grant, our Lord! that they enter the Gardens of Eternity, which Thou hast promised to them, and to the righteous among their fathers, their wives, and their posterity! For Thou art (He), the Exalted in Might, Full of Wisdom. And preserve them from (all) ills; and any whom Thou dost preserve from ills that Day,- on them wilt Thou have bestowed Mercy indeed: and that will be truly (for them) the highest Achievement. [40:8-9] 36. Our Lord! Forgive us, and our brethren who came before us into the Faith, and leave not, in our hearts, rancour (or sense of injury) against those who have believed. [59:10] 37. Our Lord! Thou art indeed Full of Kindness, Most Merciful. [59:10] 38. Our Lord! In Thee do we trust, and to Thee do we turn in repentance: to Thee is (our) Final Goal [60:4] 39. Our Lord! Make us not a (test and) trial for the Unbelievers, but forgive us, our Lord! for Thou art the Exalted in Might, the Wise. [60:5] 40. Our Lord! Perfect our Light for us, and grant us Forgiveness: for Thou hast power over all things. [66:8] ------ Enough said. Is Rasul Allah not enough as an example for you? Who did he invoke? Which prophet before him invoked other than Allah? Truly people do not know what makes Islam different from the rest.
  10. did shaytan use a wasilah? Bro, you have to put your limits somewhere. Otherwise, one might say "I use idols as a wasila to pray Allah". Look, it is simple. There are a defined set of actions that are considered worship. Invocations and prayer has always been known to be the essence of worship. So please understand that when you pray or invoke other than Allah, you've given Allah a partner. THERE'S NO WAY OUT OF THIS. look up the verse where Allah says "Ask Me, I will answer you, and those who don't like my service will go to hellfire." Do we have an excuse not to ask Allah?
  11. Imams were dispatched to go and preach to different generations themselves by Allah (SWT) Most of your imams had nothing to do with political leadership. All prophets were for religious guidance. All imams we for religious guidance. Ah, so women can see angels but imams can't. Good to know, makes perfect sense. The word "Imam" was always used for a prophet (if used in a positive way). Revelations are not what defines prophethood, so your point is moot. bleh Meaning, he was born a leader, but his mission as a leader did begin after that test. He was not told to physically lead but after that test, although he was already a leader by being a prophet. It's a consequence of prophethood to be a leader. I mean at the very least he is preaching, thus leading to the truth. I cannot understand how one can believe that prophethood does not entail the responsibility of leadership. Some prophets were leaders at a young age, while others were older. Some prophets were physical leaders as well, while others were not. Most of your imams were not physical leaders, so all that is left to defend that theory is religious leadership, something all prophets inherently possesed.
  12. Lol, Talut is always used as an example of a non-prophetic imam. Was he not an imam restricted to a few people? And read the verse again, it isn't a divine status, he was already a leader, but Allah would support him now to make this leadership apparent. All that it is saying. And even if it is as you say it is, the fact that Allah appointed a prophet to lead his nation does in no way mean Allah has made leaders after our Prophet. And his offsrpings can very well mean the known prophets that came after him, and not your 12 imams. When the word imam was used in the quran, has it ever been used in a positive light to someone other than a prophet?
  13. Shirk disguised behind intercession. Yes it is wrong, and you will see this practice in regions where polytheistic religions exist. Meaning, in some part of the worlds, both shias and sunnis do this, while in other parts, both don't. Clearly, this is shirk, disgusting lack of faith in Allah. fact is, shaytan asked Allah for something and Allah granted it, there is no excuse. ya Allah madad oh and they will say it isn't shirk, like the christians that say that they are not polytheists when they bow down to statues and call on mary or jesus. Replace statues by graves/shrines, and replace mary/jesus by ali.
  14. So was Mariam mother of Isa as a Prophet? perhaps higher in position than the Imams? And if no angel accessed them, how then could they appoint their successor? I'm pretty sure most of your scholars believe angels follow them. Uh, ask your fellow brothers, and see what the majority of them believe. You can also see the first post. I'm not playing games, rather I see a distinct seperation between the world of prophethood and ordinary man, while I see no division between Prophethood and Imamat. List the caracteristics of Prophets. compare them to imam. The words are interchangeable, since there's no definite barrier between both. There's nothing that was given to him additional to what he already had. I mean, you're the one trying to put meaning into something that is self-evident. He was already infallible, he had angels following him, he was already a prophet. How do all theses caracteristics not include the responsibility of leadership? Do an infallible man need to pass a test in order to be granted something he already had?
  15. Was he not already a leader amongst his community? Tell me, have you ever heard of a Prophet who keeps his mouth shut? If "Imam" is physical leadership, then we can argue that most of your imams never held physical leadership. If you say it is religious, then all prophets were imams. Let's not exaggerate, if here "Imam" meant a certain divine position, then you should see the same word being used elsewhere for the exact same reason.
  16. Uh, some prophets came with no new idea nor new revelation, they were just reaffirming the previous message. Hence, the akward similiture between an Imam and a Prophet. To me it seems as if you claim something while it is not actually the reality of your claim. You can very well say they are not prophets, yet they have been ascribed the caracteristics of Prophets, and according to most they are even higher. You can call them imams, but you believe them as prophets, even if you claim you don't. Fact is, can you prove my claim wrong? What is so different between them and another prophet of god? Nothing.
  17. Is there an action that is considered to be shirk, no matter your intention? Simple question.
  18. Explain how you could distinguish an Imam from a Prophet. A Prophet doesn't come with a new law, yet he is sent by God to reaffirm the previous law. Muhammad pbuh is the seal of the Prophets, but at the same time you believe people of higher status than prophets come after the Messenger pbuh. If to believe that a prophet comes after Mohammad pbuh is kufr, then how is believing someone higher than Prophet comes after the messenger not kufr?? The argument about seeing and hearing angels doesn't make sense, because Mariam mother of Isa as heard angels too.
  19. So now stones affect you? Sounds exactly like the pagans believed with charms/amulets.
  20. How so? They swear by Allah that they did not speak, and certainly they did speak, the word of unbelief, and disbelieved after their Islam, and they had determined upon what they have not been able to effect, and they did not find fault except because Allah and His Messenger enriched them out of His grace; therefore if they repent, it will be good for them; and if they turn back, Allah will chastise them with a painful chastisement in this world and the hereafter, and they shall not have in the land any guardian or a helper.And there are those of them who made a covenant with Allah: If He give us out of His grace, we will certainly give alms and we will certainly be of the good. But when He gave them out of His grace, they became niggardly of it and they turned back and they withdrew. So He made hypocrisy to follow as a consequence into their hearts till the day when they shall meet Him because they failed to perform towards Allah what they had promised with Him and because they told lies. 9:75-77 The basic goal of Islam is exactly the same basic goal of all the other Prophets, to spread the message of monotheism so that man may achieve his destined place. Islam will dominate the world as a consequence of it's magnificence, not because people wage war. If our Prophet was harsh with people, as people are right now with fellow muslims, then the Prophet would have not succeded, as Allah has already said it in the Quran. As for entrusting the publication of His Quran, each sect has it's version of events. I personally do not understand how one can think that Prophet saw no need to compile the quran in written form, but the companions did. Not to mention the many hadith about the additions and lost verses of the Quran are present in the sahih books that make a whole mess out of this subject. The murder of Uthman ripped them apart..? Were they not ripped apart when the Prophet commanded Usama to lead the army and the companions objected. If they did not obey the Prophet at his last days, when would they learn? Sahih Bukhari Volume 5, Book 59, Number 552: Narrated Ibn Umar: Allah's Apostle appointed Usama bin Zaid as the commander of some people. Those people criticized his leadership. The Prophet said, "If you speak ill of his leadership, you have already spoken ill of his father's leadership before. By Allah, he deserved to be a Commander, and he was one of the most beloved persons to me and now this (i.e. Usama) is one of the most beloved persons to me after him. Do we need to mention the incident of the pen and paper? They did know the sacredness of a Muslim's blood, so they went and killed each other. Next time you want to show respect and love for someone, go kill them. I'm sorry, but in Islamic terms Allah says strive to make peace with Muslims, but if one part is being unjust, then you have no choice but to fight them. So indeed, there's a group who was right, and the other was wrong. To say both is right is to silence Allah's justice in order to hide the wrongs of certain groups. Tell me, would you ever think to act the same when it concerns Islamic conflicts of today?
  21. In any case, a single dispute between the 2 can cause a big issue and complicate things, since there is no proof when the marriage began and when it ended. 1. Let's say the woman complains that the man did not give her the mahr, what can the judge do? The man says he did, the woman says he didn't. No witness. 2. Let's say the man complain that he gave her the mahr and said the contract, but the woman "steals" the money and refuses to sleep with him. what can the judge do? No witness of muta contract and what the mahr sum was. 3. Let's say a man rapes a woman and the woman complains, the man says he entered mutaa and she's lying. What can the judge do? No witness, no proof, no nothing. 4. Let's say a man is married and enters mutaa with a woman with a sexual disease. He didn't know, no test was done, nothing was recorded. He goes to his other wife, transmits the disease. Can the woman complain that her man committed adultery? There's no proof of mutaa contract. If you say there's no proof of adultery neither, then please understand that in such a case the woman has a proof that something happened outside of marriage. The man has no proof of his other marriage. I cannot imagine all the additional fitna and difficulties that rise from this. Please explain. Having 2 witnesses is not a difficulty, and I can't buy that it makes marriage easier, since obviously everyone knows at least one person in his life.
  22. But it is necessary to have witnesses for divorce? I don't get it. And we all know that people's testimonies are not to be taken for fact, since when it involves children and money, people lie and invent stories. When 2 persons are in conflict, how do you make judgement when there is no proof of what each person is saying? Let's say a woman get's pregnant through fornication, and then invents a story about how her previous mutaa husband is responsible for the child. There's no proof that she was fornicating, no proof that he was her husband, no proof when the mutaa began and ended. Where is the wisdom in such system?
  23. Question then, how then can you verify if someone is actually married to another person? How can you under law be held innocent in case of accusation of fornication or adultery? If there is no witness, then there is no proof of the marriage, then people have the right to ask for witnesses or papers if they see a man and a woman together they didn't see before. I mean in an islamic system, how can marriage and inheritance be regulated when women get pregnant and we have no proof that they were married?? I was engaged permanently with a girl, by a shia sheikh. 2 witnesses were needed, and a paper was signed by us and the present witnesses and the verbal pronunciation was also needed. Not only that, the mahr was registered, and the alliance was made public (meaning relatives were invited to know about it). I don't understand how witnesses are not needed and how it can be secret. Under Islamic government, this concept would result in chaos.
  24. I'll not take part of any side. I just want answers. Sunnis say shias believe in a conspiracy against Islam. At the same time, sunnis believe shia islam is a Persian conspiracy against Islam. So really, it's not an argument. My concern is this, Noah (as) preached for 950 years, less than 10 accepted the message. Moses (as) left for 40 days, his people ended up worshiping the golden calf. Allah (swt) repeats the stories of the Prophets over and over again. Have you seen the similarities? Most people are rejectors. What I find weird is that things would change with our Prophet (pbuh) for some unknown reason. If the majority of the companions were righteous, if the the majority feared Allah (swt), then please explain why in around 50 years all this fitna happened: Uthman is assassinated in 656 Battle of the Camel in 656 Battle of Siffin in 657 Ali is assassinated in 661 Hassan is assassinated in 672 Battle of Karbala in 680 Secondly, we find in your books of hadith, Let's not go further in history, let's not put other things in this. How exactly did the Muslims of that time follow the Prophet (pbuh)? How can the best of the best of our ummah kill each other? Surely they learned to be patient? Surely they knew how sacred Muslim blood is? And if they, the best of all muslims, couldn't resist but to kill each other, then is it really surprising that today we're killing each other and making takfir before we even pray our fajr on time? This needs an answer, because obviously something went horribly wrong.
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