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In the Name of God بسم الله


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About swede

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  1. I do not doubt that the Sunnah speaks about two different women named Miryam, but this doesnt prove that the Quran does. If I am not wrong, Miryam is the only woman mentioned by name in the Quran, so assuming that the same person is intended seem logical, if the Quran does not contain material to destinguish between them.
  2. So I will repeat my rebuttal: Had a sensation like a virgin birth, or a man that could make living birds from clay been known, it would inevitable have been reported to the Roman ocupators, and be found in the files in Rome, and in contemporary history writings and private letters. Also early christians lika Paul would not have missed a chanse to use the virgin birth as a proof that Jesus was the son of God. But there is nothing such.
  3. .....because the family of Jesus did not know their family line, or they did not internally agree how they were related to king David. How many poor and maybe illiterate carpenters would remember their family tree 1000 years back? Probably the family tree was created like a myth, and this is why there are more than one version
  4. A minority of christians believe that the Bible should be read litterally. As an example; only fundementalists believe God created the world in 7 days 6000 years ago.
  5. But if the sunnah has got its historical information from the Bible (where else?) and the Bible has been corrupted, how do we know that the sunnah does not contain some of this corrupted information?
  6. I am sorry, I am not able to find this in any of your posts. Could you please just once give me the chapters and numbers of the suras you have in mind.
  7. Pleas just give me the suras in the Quran that makes it possible to determine that the 2 Marys are not the same person. Mark and Luke did their best, but how make a correct genetic line from poor peasants in galilea? And why should we believe that Muhammad had knowledge of the correct genetic lines?
  8. If no other information is given, it is impossible to decide if she was the daughter of Aron or not. This was my point. From the Quran only we can not decide if Mary was the sister or not. I didnt say she was. From the Bible we can conclude that she was not, even if the Bible has got errors in the genetical line. the Quran has got no such errors because there is so little information that errors are impossible to determine. Maybe info is available in other islamic sources, but where do they come from and who wrote them? We have got all reasons to be sceptical to stories that are written 700 y
  9. I agree it is difficult to read. This must be the reason why people do not always agree on how to interpret the Quran. I dont consider myself to be an expert. But since experts do not agree, I think people like me should be allowed to put forward ideas as well.
  10. Rubbish. We have got no indication whatsoever that the virgin birth of Jesus was famous. On the contrary; It was totally unknown until the gospel of Matthew and Luke tells us about it, almost a century after it was supposed to have happened. Two entirely different stories. They only agree that Jesus was born by a virgin.
  11. Wether Maryum (mother of Isa) and Maryum (sister of Moses) was the same person or not, is not possible to decide from the Quran only. Nor is it possible to decide when she/they lived, because the Quran has no line of genealogy. (Likely to be the reason why we in the Bible find family trees with errors buty not in the Quran.) Now I have read the Quran only once, so I am open to reconsider this opinion of mine if you can show beyond reasonable doubt, based on the Quran only, that they were two different persons. It was not proved on this page. I have not read the Sunnah, but I doubt it is consi
  12. Corrupted is not an adequate word. Many stories like the virgin birth story that was written almost a century after the birth, are myths. What is historically correct and what is not in the bible ought to be a problem for Muslims too. The quran is very limited on historical details, and from the Quran only we can not decide if virgin Mary was the sister of Mose and Aron, or if she lived millenniums later. Only one example. If we do not know which parts of the Bible that are "corrupted", and here the Quran gives hardly any help, this will affect our understanding of the Quran. Based on the Qura
  13. The romans crucified many, and the crucifixion of Jesus is not found mentioned by contemporary historians or in official documents. But naturally it was a shocking experience to his desciples and family. John the baptist was known from secular records of the time thou, and Muhammad was very famous.
  14. Naturally it it impossible to say when the virgin birth was known. And therefore I am not accusing you for suggesting different periods. You suggest that Mary kept the secret until Jesus was born (for what reason?). We have earlier discussed that when Jesus started his mission (around year 30) his family thought he had gone mad. This made you suggest that Mary had (still) not told anone. 20 years later Paul writes his letters. He travells a lot, meets with the apostles, a brother of Jesus and many other christians are mentioned by name. Detailled letters about his journeys, plans an thoughts.
  15. Before you said that Mary kept the virgin birth secret to the end, now you say it was common knowledge!!! But Jesus was not a famous person in the 1 century. Besides from Josefus, who have written a short, but disputed comment on Jesus, we have nothing on him from other than christian sources. A virgin birth ought to have been a world sensation, at least mentioned by Josefus or Tacitus. Jesus became famous as christian faith grew becoming a rival to other religions. If Mary was spoken bad about, this is more likelty to be the reason, than in which way she was made pregnant. I think you ought
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