786:)

Sadly he does. Already went down this path with him and was shocked. I would advise you to get some popcorn because you are in for some entertainment.

Of all my time with this topic, I have yet to see someone bring an authentic narration or verse which explicitly says “call upon other than Allah” rather there are endless verses and authentic narrations which state to call upon Allah alone—not to forget endless narrations and verses which CONDEMNS those who call upon other Allah. I can understand this being a debate in a village, but this has no belonging in the academic world. The evidence is clear as day for calling upon Allah alone—I don’t care how Salafi or Wahhabi that phrase sounds. Haq is haq.

So obeying Allah can be done without obeying the Prophet? Isn’t obeying Allah the ultimate goal? Please think before you regurgitate something you heard from the mimbar. You’ll save yourself some embarrassment. Anyways, whatever “Abu Bakr and Co.” did in Islamic history does not validate Ya Ali Madad. The principles of Islam remain constant with or without the personalities and the history of Islam.

This topic has been going on SC for ages now. Here’s the thing—those who call upon other than Allah do not care about proofs from the Thaqlayn. To them this is simply what they found their forefathers doing so they will defend it to the grave even if they have to do all sorts of mental gymnastics. Another dynamic is that the idea of calling Allah alone has been auctioned off to the Salafis/Wahhabis. Whereas slogans such as Ya Ali Madad are promoted by Shia speakers using Rasoolallah calling Imam Ali in battle as the proof. So the issue goes down sectarian lines. And we all know how blindi

I know twelvershia is run by Salafis and they openly acknowledge this. However, I am not sure how you arrived at the conclusion that real tashayyu is ran by anti shia.

Haha you act like you have a phone relationship Sistani. I have actually met my “internet marjah”. But I would argue that not having any respect for the shahada being a bigger issue. That’s just me though. However it doesn’t surprise me coming from you. Same guy who defends babies heads being cut open. I don’t expect you to have any reverence for the shahada. It’s probably just some arbitrary phrase someone made up along the way right? Ya Ali Madad is what you probably would defend.

I think this is a great initiative, but how are you going to push and promote “real Tashayyu” by refuting the lies ascribed to it from the outside when you promote the lies ascribed to it from the inside? For example in your intro you gave Eid e Zahra. Most intellectuals know this eid is fabricated and not from the teachings of Ahl Muhammad. I am not trying to derail the topic, but what is your guidelines for “real Tashayyu”?

Nope, equating the shahada to Muawiya praise was just disturbing to me. And thanks for admitting you are a better troll than me.

Which one is it? Let me know when you make up your mind.

Im not a fan of Pakistan’s laws so you don’t have to tell me about them. I just thought your point about the shahada was silly. “Shahada without Aliyun Waliullah”—NEWSFLASH: thats the real shahada. Want proof? Look at your shahada in salah. End of discussion.

I really don’t get it. How is the shahada against the man’s belief if he indeed is a Shia? If he was making him say something against his beliefs I would get it—like the Muawiya praise. However, the shahada is the same for all Muslims.

^Makes zero sense. You act like saying the original shahadah is some grave sin as a Shia. You say it in salah 9x a day so let’s not make silly contradictions. I had no problem with your Muawiya point hence why I left it out. So you can keep your ad hominem deflections to yourself.

How evil of them to make someone recite the authentic shahadah. Do consider it “force” in tashahud when you have to stop yourself after two testimonies?

Or she was just an open book and those husband-wife relationships she describes in her accounts did indeed happen. Crazy theory right?

My post was not meant to dilute the position or character of the Prophet. All I am saying is that when one asks for accounts about an individual from the individual's friends vs their family, it is likely the family's account will be much more filtered. For example, get some of your friends to describe you and share some stories about you. Then ask your kids to do the same. There will certainly be some contrast in the two.