786:)

I do find it funny how some Shias celebrated with fireworks over MAL’s bukhari gate series and now hate him for this lol. I appreciate him for his objective lens of putting aside his sectarian narrative to seek the truth. I would hope all of us do the same iA.

The classical Shia opinion is that Prophets are greater than Imams. Read Nahjul Balagha, Imam Ali says he hopes to be in the company of the Prophets (plural) in paradise. This is a clear indication that believed himself to be below Prophets in status. This is no knock on Imam Ali as some Shia take it because Allah says in the Quran the prophets were the best of his creation. This notion of Imams being greater than Prophets comes from ghuluw influence and of course is now the dominant belief in mainstream Tashayyu unfortunately.

@Muslim2010 please tell me what you disagree with? Pray behind a Sunni (if your ego allows) and pray behind a Shia—the Sunni Imam’s Tajweed will blow away the Shia Imam’s tajweed.

I don’t think it is a secret that Ahluh Sunnah are superior to Shia when it comes to the Quran—including recitation. The average Sunni lay person will have better tajweed than a high ranking Shia scholar. I am not sure why that is, but generally Sunnis have more emphasis on the Quran than Shias so this may be why, but Allah knows best.

Sure but Shias have this tendency of being more history focused as if we will be asked about what happened 1400 years ago. Do you think Allah expects us to know everything that happened 1400 years ago to the T when hadith literature is such a mess from both sides? We don’t know the truths of yesterday, but our creator expects us to know the truths of 7th century Arabia?

I think you missed the point about the verse. Anyways, I think you are asking the wrong person. I don’t think Shias or Sunnis have a 100% monopoly on truth. Even if the Prophet raised Umar’s hand it would have no impact on Islam nor will Allah ask us about it on Qiyamah because we will be judged on the Quran and our goodness as Humans. It will not be Islamic History version of ‘Who Wants to be a Millionaire’.

Serious question, if Imam Ali was the “sahib” in the cave, would we Shias perform so many gymnastics to prove this nothing special? Or would we run with it like Ghadeer? Ask yourself this. It truly makes no difference to me if this is a fadhail of Abu Bakr or not. I don’t think Abu Bakr was Iblis 2.0 as mainstream Shias paint him or Gibrail 2.0 as mainstream Sunnis paint him. I just find the inconsistencies when it comes to cherry-picking verses to be a shame.

Please tell me what Shia dawah would entail. There is a reason Shias leave dawah to the Sunnis. It’s hard to preach imamah to a non Muslim because it comes off as nepotism.

I am pleasantly surprised to see you speak up against this. We may not agree on everything but kudos to you for going against the tide.

Sadly he does. Already went down this path with him and was shocked. I would advise you to get some popcorn because you are in for some entertainment.

Of all my time with this topic, I have yet to see someone bring an authentic narration or verse which explicitly says “call upon other than Allah” rather there are endless verses and authentic narrations which state to call upon Allah alone—not to forget endless narrations and verses which CONDEMNS those who call upon other Allah. I can understand this being a debate in a village, but this has no belonging in the academic world. The evidence is clear as day for calling upon Allah alone—I don’t care how Salafi or Wahhabi that phrase sounds. Haq is haq.

So obeying Allah can be done without obeying the Prophet? Isn’t obeying Allah the ultimate goal? Please think before you regurgitate something you heard from the mimbar. You’ll save yourself some embarrassment. Anyways, whatever “Abu Bakr and Co.” did in Islamic history does not validate Ya Ali Madad. The principles of Islam remain constant with or without the personalities and the history of Islam.

This topic has been going on SC for ages now. Here’s the thing—those who call upon other than Allah do not care about proofs from the Thaqlayn. To them this is simply what they found their forefathers doing so they will defend it to the grave even if they have to do all sorts of mental gymnastics. Another dynamic is that the idea of calling Allah alone has been auctioned off to the Salafis/Wahhabis. Whereas slogans such as Ya Ali Madad are promoted by Shia speakers using Rasoolallah calling Imam Ali in battle as the proof. So the issue goes down sectarian lines. And we all know how blindi

I know twelvershia is run by Salafis and they openly acknowledge this. However, I am not sure how you arrived at the conclusion that real tashayyu is ran by anti shia.

Haha you act like you have a phone relationship Sistani. I have actually met my “internet marjah”. But I would argue that not having any respect for the shahada being a bigger issue. That’s just me though. However it doesn’t surprise me coming from you. Same guy who defends babies heads being cut open. I don’t expect you to have any reverence for the shahada. It’s probably just some arbitrary phrase someone made up along the way right? Ya Ali Madad is what you probably would defend.