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In the Name of God بسم الله

Cool

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  1. I am talking about infallibility of Imams and demonstrating you the same by means of the verses of Quran and the ahadith of Prophet (صلى الله عليه وآله وسلم) which you accept (i.e., hadith e safinah, hadith e hablillah etc) It is still intact Alhamdulillah. That is what I was trying to tell you. That your Imams are mujtahids which are fallible but not those who are the مثل of Ark of Noah, the Imams of guidance, the guided ones, the 12 Imams. We only follow Quran & Sunnah. Who told you that we "follow" someone else? Don't complaint about differences while you believe that اختلاف امتي رحمة I don't want to ignite you again so just avoiding to quote more from your books. In other words, I am avoiding to show you the mirror. My sole objective at the moment is to discuss the hadith of safinah & hadith of habilillah which your fallible Imams quote in almost every khutbah. And these two ahadith specifically pointing towards infallible Imams.
  2. This means we are in this limited worldly life which is said to be لعب and لهوا and at the same time we are in the دار الأخرة which is said to be الحيوان. We are here and there simultaneously at the same time? What is اجل (appointed term) then? Will we escape from time when we are in heaven or in hell? Will there be no concept of day & night?
  3. The hadith of safinah is with you. And you know that this safinah is not just merely an ark. It is the سفينة النجاة If those, who are the likes of "Ark of Noah" commit errors, mistakes, they would fear for the نجاة of themselves in the very first place. Therefore, if you truly believe Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام) are the سفينة النجاة، you have to accept them as ones who are free from errors & mistakes, and that is not on their own, but by the grace of Almighty Lord. ما ضل صاحبكم و ما غوا If you believe that Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام) are the guided ones, the ones whom Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) has guided, and they are the "mukhlaseen", you have no way left but to accept them as "infallibles". من يهد الله فما له من مضل Furthermore, the Ark of Noah is not perished with the martyrdom of Imam Hussain (عليه السلام), the Imams after him are the Ark of Noah and that includes Imam Sajjad (عليه السلام) to Imam Mehdi (عليه السلام), all of them are infallibles. Furthermore, you accept Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام) as حبل الله المتين. And you have been assured that this rope will never break and would cause you to drop from the heights. This again points towards infallibility. So it is better to review what you currently assume about the infallibility of Imams. Your choosen & authorized fallible Imams cannot be like the ones whom God has choosen and granted them the authority. Wassalam!!
  4. Salam Brother! That makes this world hell for believers & heaven for unbelievers. But I am talking in context with the referred verses specifically the phrase: وَإِنَّ جَهَنَّمَ لَمُحيطَةٌ بِالكافِرينَ I think it is better if @313_Waiter share the lecture or its link so that we can understand what Br. Khalil wanted to say.
  5. Just to add here that there are some exceptions here too, which is mentioned in the verses of chapter 21: إِنَّ الَّذِينَ سَبَقَتْ لَهُمْ مِنَّا الْحُسْنَىٰ أُولَٰئِكَ عَنْهَا مُبْعَدُونَ {101} [Shakir 21:101] Surely (as for) those for whom the good has already gone forth from Us, they shall be kept far off from it; لَا يَسْمَعُونَ حَسِيسَهَا ۖ وَهُمْ فِي مَا اشْتَهَتْ أَنْفُسُهُمْ خَالِدُونَ {102} [Shakir 21:102] They will not hear its faintest sound, and they shall abide in that which their souls long for.
  6. How can we be in heaven & hell without being going through the hour (الساعة) or qiyamah? I would rather say that we are witnessing the qiyamah at this very moment. Our every action is producing its effects. So I think احاطه here in this verse refers to the "surrounding in sins", those who are surrounded by their sins, are the people of fire according to 2:81 بَلَىٰ مَنْ كَسَبَ سَيِّئَةً وَأَحَاطَتْ بِهِ خَطِيئَتُهُ فَأُولَٰئِكَ أَصْحَابُ النَّارِ ۖ هُمْ فِيهَا خَالِدُونَ 2:81) Nay, those who seek gain in evil, and are girt round by their sins,- they are companions of the Fire: Therein shall they abide (For ever). There is no linguistic weight in this idea that we are either living in hell or heaven. There is a verse of Quran which categorically says this: فَوَرَبِّكَ لَنَحْشُرَنَّهُمْ وَالشَّيَاطِينَ ثُمَّ لَنُحْضِرَنَّهُمْ حَوْلَ جَهَنَّمَ جِثِيًّا {68} [Shakir 19:68] So by your Lord! We will most certainly gather them together and the Shaitans, then shall We certainly cause them to be present round hell on their knees. And everyone of us has to go through it, according to this verse: وَإِنْ مِنْكُمْ إِلَّا وَارِدُهَا ۚ كَانَ عَلَىٰ رَبِّكَ حَتْمًا مَقْضِيًّا {71} [Shakir 19:71] And there is not one of you but shall come to it; this is an unavoidable decree of your Lord.
  7. Lets see when Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) created the angels according to Ahlul Bayt (عليه السلام): وبإسناده إلى جابر الجعفي، عن أبي جعفر عليه السلام قال: قال: يا جابر كان الله ولا شئ غيره (و) لا معلوم ولا مجهول، فأول ما ابتدأ من خلق خلقه أن خلق محمدا صلى الله عليه وآله وخلقنا أهل البيت معه من نور عظمته فأوقفنا أظلة خضراء بين يديه حيث لا سماء ولا أرض ولا مكان ولا ليل ولا نهار ولا شمس ولا قمر يفصل نورنا من نور ربنا كشعاع الشمس من الشمس نسبح الله ونقدسه ونحمده ونعبده حق عبادته، ثم بدا لله أن يخلق المكان فخلقه (1) وكتب على المكان (لا إله إلا الله محمد رسول الله عي أمير المؤمنين ووصيه به أيدته ونصرته) ثم خلق الله العرش فكتب على سرادقات العرش مثل ذلك، ثم خلق الله السماوات فكتب على أطرافها مثل ذلك، ثم خلق الجنة والنار فكتب عليهما مثل ذلك، ثم خلق الملائكة فأسكنهم (2) السماء، ثم خلق الهواء فكتب عليه مثل ذلك، ثم خلق الجن فأسكنهم الهواء، ثم خلق الأرض فكتب على أطرافها مثل ذلك، فبذلك يا جابر قامت السماوات بغير عمد، وثبتت الأرض، ثم خلق الله آدم من أديم الأرض ثم ساق الحديث الطويل إلى قوله فنحن أول خلق الله. وأول خلق عبد الله وسبحه، ونحن سب الخلق وسبب تسبيحهم وعبادتهم من الملائكة والآدميين (تمام الخبر). http://shiaonlinelibrary.com/الكتب/1485_بحار-الأنوار-العلامة-المجلسي-ج-٥٤/الصفحة_171#top And the ahadith explaining the above quoted verse are here: كرامة بني آدم الكتاب * (ولقد كرمنا بني آدم وحملناهم في البر والبحر ورزقناهم من الطيبات وفضلناهم على كثير ممن خلقنا تفضيلا) * [1]. - رسول الله (صلى الله عليه وآله): ما شئ أكرم على الله من ابن آدم، قيل: يا رسول الله ! ولا الملائكة ؟ ! قال: الملائكة مجبورون، بمنزلة الشمس والقمر الإمام الصادق (عليه السلام): لما اسري برسول الله (صلى الله عليه وآله) حضرت الصلاة، فأذن وأقام جبرئيل، فقال: يا محمد تقدم، فقال رسول الله: تقدم يا جبرئيل: فقال له: إنا لا نتقدم الآدميين منذ امرنا بالسجود لآدم (عليه السلام) ما يوجب تفضيل الإنسان على الملائكة - الإمام الصادق (عليه السلام) - وقد سأله عبد الله بن سنان: الملائكة أفضل أم بنو آدم ؟ -: قال أمير المؤمنين علي بن أبي طالب (عليه السلام): إن الله عزوجل ركب في الملائكة عقلا بلا شهوة، وركب في البهائم شهوة بلا عقل، وركب في بني آدم كلتيهما، فمن غلب عقله شهوته فهو خير من الملائكة، ومن غلبت شهوته عقله فهو شرمن البهائم http://ar.lib.eshia.ir/11023/1/223 I think these ahadith resolve the issue. By this one should not undermine the great station of angels as our Imam al-Sajjad (عليه السلام) praised the angels like this: اللهم وحملة عرشك الذين لايفترون من تسبيحك ... ، ورسلك من الملائكة إلى أهل الأرض بمكروه ، ما ينزل من البلاء ومحبوب الرخاء ، والسفرة الكرام البررة ، والحفظة الكرام الكاتبين ، وملك الموت وأعوانه ، ومنكر ونكير ، ورومان فتّان القبور ، والطائفين بالبيت المعمور ، ومالك والخزنة ، ورضوان وسدنة الجنان ، والذين لا يعصون الله ما أمرهم ، ويفعلون ما يؤمرون ، والذين يقولون : سلام عليكم بما صبرتم فنعم عقبى الدار ، والزبانية الذين إذا قيل لهم : (( خذوه فغلوه ثم الجحيم صلوه )) ابتدروه سراعاً ولم ينظروه ، ومن أوهمنا ذكره ، ولم نعلم مكانه منك ، وبأي أمر وكّلته ، وسكّان الهواء والأرض والماء ... ) (الصحيفة السجادية / الدعاء 3 )
  8. I remember one source which everyone would hate , i.e., قول أبي بكر في السقيفة : نحن عترة رسول اللّه ص Someone asked this question from Ibn Arabi, whether this statement of Abu Bakr correct? The reply given by Ibn Arabi is very interesting and it has reminded me the argument of Hisham bin al-Hakam: قال : أراد بلدته وبيضته. وعترة محمد ص لا محالة ولد فاطمة 3، والدليل على ذلك ردّ أبي بكر وإنفاذ علي ع بسورة براءة ، وقوله ص: « أُمرت أن لا يبلّغها عني إلاّ أنا أو رجل منّي » ... فلو كان أبو بكر من العترة نسباً لكان محالاً أخذ سورة براءة منه ودفعها إلى علي ع He said: He wanted his town and his egg. And the progeny of Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace, was inevitably the son of Fatima, and the evidence for that is the reply of Abu Bakr and the enforcement of Ali, peace be upon him, by Surat Bara’ah, and his saying, may God bless him and grant him peace, “I have been commanded that only I or a man from me” communicate it… If Abu Bakr was a descendant of lineage, it would have been impossible to take a Surah acquitted of him and given it to Ali (عليه السلام) The same was the argument of Hisham: Hisham used to say, "I wonder why the opponents of the Shi'a chose the man as caliph whose dismissal came from heaven and dismiss the man whose appointment came from heaven; and quoted the story of the verse Bara'at for justification." (Fehrist Ibn Nadim)
  9. Obviously there should be one Imam/Caliph at a time. But we see in history that there were three Imams of Zaidi's appeared simultaneously at the same time and same place. إنه ظهر ثلاثة ائمة في وقت واحد في بلد واحد وهم المهدي والمنصور علي بن صلاح والهادي علي المؤيد (المصدر السابق) I don't currently know how they have settled the issue! Which two of them from al-Mehdi, al-Mansoor Ali bin Salah and al-Hadi Ali surrendered their claims to which one. As I am digging deeper into their history and books I am getting familiar with many contradictions within zaidiyyah. For instance, their definition of Imamate: قال الإمام الهادي يحيى بن الحسين (لا تثبت الامامة لأحد إلاّ بدليل شرعي اجماعاً، وذلك لما كانت الامامة تابعة للنبوة، لان ثمرتها هي حفظ الشريعة وتقويمها... لم تكن إلاّ لمن اختاره الله واصطفاه وعلم طهارته وقيامه..) عدة الاكياس في شرح معاني الاساس: 2 / 136 So here he mentions Imamate as: a) تابعة للنبوة (follower of Prophecy) b) لم تكن إلاّ لمن اختاره الله (Chosen by God c) علم طهارته (and He knows his purity means Ismah perhaps) Now another Imam gave this definition: وقال الإمام أحمد بن سليمان في كتاب (حقائق المعرفة) (فقال أبو الجارود ومن قال بقوله من الزيدية علي وصي رسول الله(صلى الله عليه وآله) والامام بعده وان الامة كفرت وظلت في تركها بيعته ثم بعده الحسنان بالنص ثم هي بينهم شورى فمن خرج من أولادهما جامع الشروط للإمامة فهو امام...) Adding conditions after Imam Hussain (عليه السلام), as Allah (سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى) has changed His sunnah (na'udobillah). We see in Quran: سُنَّةَ اللَّهِ فِي الَّذِينَ خَلَوْا مِن قَبْلُ وَلَن تَجِدَ لِسُنَّةِ اللَّهِ تَبْدِيلًا 33:62) (Such has been) the course of Allah with respect to those who have gone before; and you shall not find any change in the course of Allah. فَهَلْ يَنظُرُونَ إِلَّا سُنَّتَ الْأَوَّلِينَ فَلَن تَجِدَ لِسُنَّتِ اللَّهِ تَبْدِيلًا وَلَن تَجِدَ لِسُنَّتِ اللَّهِ تَحْوِيلًا 35:43) Then should they wait for aught except the way of the former people? For you shall not find any alteration in the course of Allah; and you shall not find any change in the course of Allah سُنَّةَ اللَّهِ الَّتِي قَدْ خَلَتْ مِن قَبْلُ وَلَن تَجِدَ لِسُنَّةِ اللَّهِ تَبْدِيلًا 48:23) Such has been the course of Allah that has indeed run before, and you shall not find a change in Allah's course.
  10. Yes it is logical to have one caliph at a time but your history tells something else: إنه ظهر ثلاثة ائمة في وقت واحد في بلد واحد وهم المهدي والمنصور علي بن صلاح والهادي علي المؤيد (المصدر السابق) and you have the history of wars between your Imams, for instance: الحروب بين ائمة الزيدية كالمنصور علي بن صلاح، والداعي، والامام المهدي أحمد بن يحيى المرتضى، وغيرهم وانقسام الناس بينهما والاشعار والسب بين المهدي وابن الوزير ( كتاب ائمة اليمن للعلامة زبارة ) The most devastating statement I came across in your book, is this: في التحف شرح الزلف ص73 (قال زيد بن علي: ما فينا امام مفترض طاعته بعد الحسين...) (We do not have an imam who is supposed to be obeyed after Hussain (عليه السلام)) A clear contradiction to the following: أولهم علي بن الحسين
  11. I think it is your frustration. And I was fearing that your relationship with me would get damaged if I tried to counter you. I already advised you not to indulge in debate with us but you are continuing to create thread after thread and inviting people for debate. Now bear it and don't complaint please. I will quote much more from your books if you asked for it. Why you are asking us after quoting ahadith from our books lol. Come on bro, I think I must stop now. I don't want to debate with you anymore. Enjoy yourself!!
  12. Who is the hujjah of Allah upon creation now? Who is the one due to his existence earth & its ahl are existing? وفي تتمة الاعتصام يذكر حديث اثني عشر خليفة تتمة الاعتصام: 5 / 400 ـ 402 (زيدي). I am now playing in your ground my friend. So you need to defend your creed carefully. Here is another quote: وفي التحف شرح الزلف قال: (ان الذرية يدخلون في لفظ أهل البيت (عليهم السلام) وان ذريتهم باقية إلى يوم القيامة، وانهم الحجة على الأمة بدليل حديث السفينة والأمان و..) So for you every "Syed" is a hujjah of Allah upon ummah? lol are you really serious??? Every "Syed" you see is a saleh (pious) person? Every Syed is mithl of safinah? What a joke this is!!!
  13. lol, So 12 Imams from the "Progeny" of Imam Hassan (عليه السلام) & Imam Hussain (عليه السلام) (6 from each) & then where the first, second & third Imam went? It turned out to be 15 instead of twelve . Anyway , the hadith mentions that the progeny of Imam Hassan & Imam Hussain "spread" from which sons. And that's it. But in the mean time the hadith referred carries some important points which need to be addressed: 1: ، وهم بمنزلة اسباط بني اسرائيل حجة الله على خلقه 2. وأمان أهل الأرض من استيصال عذابه I guess none of your Imam (mijtahid) holds the title "hujjatullahe ala khalqeh" and none of them is the mitl of "amaana ahl al-ard". And what about the hadith of 12 caliphs? lol, let me clear it to you once again: أولهم علي بن الحسين This is Imam Sajjad (عليه السلام) You don't consider him as your Imam or do you believe in his Imamate. وآخرهم المهدي ثم الائمة فيما بينهما So we do believe and accept that Zayd Shaheed was a faqih & mujtahid of his time. But he was not the bearer of divine covenant. Which passed on to Imam Baqir (عليه السلام) from Imam Sajjad (عليه السلام) and then to from Imam Baqir (عليه السلام) to Imam Ja'far al-Sadiq (عليه السلام). Checkmate Bro!!!
  14. Brother according to Sheikh Al-Mufeed: The Imamis are unanimously agreed that the prophets of God Almighty and His Messengers from among humans are better than the angels أوائل المقالات - الشيخ المفيد ص 49، 50: 17- القول في المفاضلة بين الأنبياء والملائكة عليهم السلام واتفقت الإمامية على أن أنبياء الله تعالى عز وجل ورسله من البشر أفضل من الملائكة And I remember there is a hadith in Meezan Al-Hikmah: عن الإمام الباقر (ع): "ما خلق اللَّه عزّ وجل خلقاً أكرم على اللَّه عزّ وجلّ من المؤمن لأن الملائكة خدّام المؤمنين" Quran al-Hakim mentions this: وَلَقَدْ كَرَّمْنَا بَنِي آدَمَ وَحَمَلْنَاهُمْ فِي الْبَرِّ وَالْبَحْرِ وَرَزَقْنَاهُم مِّنَ الطَّيِّبَاتِ وَفَضَّلْنَاهُمْ عَلَى كَثِيرٍ مِّمَّنْ خَلَقْنَا تَفْضِيلاً 17:70
  15. Brother according to Sheikh Al-Mufeed: The Imamis are unanimously agreed that the prophets of God Almighty and His Messengers from among humans are better than the angels أوائل المقالات - الشيخ المفيد ص 49، 50: 17- القول في المفاضلة بين الأنبياء والملائكة عليهم السلام واتفقت الإمامية على أن أنبياء الله تعالى عز وجل ورسله من البشر أفضل من الملائكة And I remember there is a hadith in Meezan Al-Hikmah: عن الإمام الباقر (ع): "ما خلق اللَّه عزّ وجل خلقاً أكرم على اللَّه عزّ وجلّ من المؤمن لأن الملائكة خدّام المؤمنين" Quran al-Hakim mentions this: وَلَقَدْ كَرَّمْنَا بَنِي آدَمَ وَحَمَلْنَاهُمْ فِي الْبَرِّ وَالْبَحْرِ وَرَزَقْنَاهُم مِّنَ الطَّيِّبَاتِ وَفَضَّلْنَاهُمْ عَلَى كَثِيرٍ مِّمَّنْ خَلَقْنَا تَفْضِيلاً 17:70
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