Sirius_Bright

stop making up hadiths to suit your agenda, abu hurraira. it doesnt impress me.
Maula Ali (as) did not kill umar because at that moment the muslim ummah was fractured, confused, and attacked from all sides both within and without (eg attackers from byzantine were marching as it occured, a fake prophet called mohalamine was claiming prophethood) and fitnah was at an all time high. if Imam ali (as) had killed umar, it would have meant civil war and the destruction of the muslim ummah and the end to the prophets mission.
the father ali's actions at the burning house saved islam
the son hussains actions at the burning desert of kerbala saved islam.

why? because he killed an undoubted zaalim? he did the entire world a favour. muslims everywhere owe him a debt of gratitude.

^^ innit :D
abu lulu (ra) was and is a complete legend. dont care what faith he might or might not have been, he did humanity a favour. May he earn bibi paaks (sa) duas.

It seems you did not pay attention to my post. <_<

Shams al Hind Allamah Shibli Numani al Hanafi praised Ebne Qutaibah in al Faruq Volume 1 pag 7 as follows:

"...The fame and authority of this writer are unchallenged. Even the traditionalists are unanimous as to his integrity and trustworthiness."

Sunni scholars are saying the hadiths I have brought u are as authentic as ever, you are saying they are not. Jallal Khaaliq.


<_<

OK. let me rephrase that, so that you wont be able to play with words again:

"Maybe Ali knew that if he tried to do Qisaas while people like Omar and Abubakr are running the wole Ummah (the military, appointing governors, etc) and have absolute power to do Zhulm and jinaayat, they would start killing Ali's followers (hence thousands of innocent people) if he attempted a Qisaas on Omar's life.

Better?


Thats like saying "why would mohammad do muhaajerat and order his followers to go to Madinah (when Quraish was killing all of them)"? or..."Why did he keep Islam secret for 3 years before going public about Islam?" Why would he have to worry that his followers would be killed?

Just because he was Allah's appointed Imam doesnt mean that Allah will protect every single one of his followers from Omar's sword of injustice. Just because he was Allah's appointed Imam doesnt mean he did not have any responsibilities.

To me, it is insignificant whether or not Abu Lu Lu was a shia or not.

I consider Omar a "Al-Haakem o Zhaalem" (evil ruler). Therefore it does not matter to me who killed him, and therefore your question is irrelevant.

Omar was killed? One "sharr" less for the world. Alhamdolellah. :angel:

That is my honest opinion.

If I had a time machine, Id go back and kill him myself for murdering Fatimah and insulting Ali.

salam,

1. All sources that I cited in my last post are Sunni. The 20 sources I cited above are all that I have at this moment. I do not know of any "more" sources.

2. About the janeen of Hadhrat Fatimah, in the first batch of links, I am pretty sure that sources 4,5,6, and 7 clearly mention her pregnancy. About the beating, I translated it directly.

3. The reason al-islam.org does not have these things as you claim can have two reasons:

a. I took the information posted in my last post directly out of a book at my disposal which I picked up during my last trip to Mash-had. I translated the passages myself. The book was written by Mughaatel ebne Atiyah during the 11th century (in Arabic) and is about a Sunni-Shia debate that took place in the court of the Seljuqian Sultan Malekshah. Al-Islam.org is not the ultimate source of info. One must look further.

b. Many Shias are reluctant to mention these things, even though they know it. Why withhold? Because to them Islamic unity is far more important than speaking out the ugly truth. Even Khomeini said "yaa ayyohal moslemoon...ettahedoo ettahedoo". However, once they discover and experience the ugly side of their sunni "brothers", like me, they suddenly come to their senses.

Dear all,

Personally, I feel happy that Omar was assasinated. It doesnt really matter who this abu lulu guy was.

My reasons:

"After Abu Bakr obtained Bay'at from the people (by sword and force), he sent Omar, Khaled ebne Waleed, Abu Obaydeh Jarraah, and a bunch of the other monaafgheen to Ali and Fatimah's house to get their Bay'at for Abu Bakr. Omar put firewood around the house. This is the same house that the Prophet pbuh had stood on its doorway and said: Assalamu alaikum yaa ahla baytel nubuwwah! (Salam to you oh household of Nabuwwah) and never entered the house without permission of Ali/Fatemah.

Omar set the house on fire. Pregnant Fatemah rushed to the door to block Omar and his gang. But Omar hit and pressed Fatimah so hard against the door that Fatimah's son became seqt (died in her) and the door's nail penetrated inside Fatemah's chest.

Fatemah cried: Oh Father! yaa rasulullah! See what misery (Museebat) the son of Khataab and the son of Abi Ghahaafah (Abu Bakr) have inflicted unto us- your progeny! :cry:

Omar ordered his men to beat Fatimah and thus she became majrooh."

Sunni references that narrate similar versions of the above account:

1. Masnad of Ahmad Hanbal vol3/259
2. Ensaab ul Ashraaf of Balaazheri 586/1
3. al'aqd ul fareed 13/5
4. Melal wa Nahl of Shahrestaani 57/1
5. Ethbaat ul Wathiyaah of Al Mas'udi 123/
6. Alwaafi belwafeeyaat 347/5
7. lesaan ul mizaan 268/1 (mentions that Omar kicked Fatimah so hard that baby Muhsen was killed inside her womb)
8. Al Imaamat wal Siyaasat Ebne Qutaybeh 19-20/1

Fatimah shortly after died while she was severely bitter and angry (Ghadhab) with Omar and Abu Bakr.

Sunni references mentioning this:

1. Sharh of Ebne Abi al Hadeed 50/6
2. Saheeh Al bukhaari 5th book /2
3. Masnad of Ahmad Hanbal 6/1
4. Sunan of Bayhaqi 300/6
5. Tabaqaat of Ebne Sa'd 18/8
6. Saheeh of Termedhi vol1 baab of maa jaa'a fee tarkate rasoolullah.

And finally consider the Hadith that says:

"Allah will be happy (yardhaa) when Fatimah is happy and will be bitter and angry (yagh-dhebo) when Fatimah is bitter."

Sunni ref:

1. Mustadrak Haakem 153/3
2. Asad ul Ghaabah of Ebne Atheer 522/5
3. Esaabah of Ebne Hajar 159/8
4. tahzeeb al tahzheeb 441/12
5. Kenz ul Emaal of Muttaqi 111/7
6. Dhahabi in mizaan ul e'tedaal 72/2

:cry: :cry: :cry:

I hope I didnt make any mistakes in copying down the numbers.

Read 'Then I was guided' by Tejani as-samavi. The author was previously of Maliki sect of Ahle tasannuh. And as you said he was constantly brainwashed about shias. However as he visited places with sane mind, met shia scholars, and enquired about various issues, he suspected that somethings not right. He has urge to find the truth and to be guided and hence Allah (swt) helped him in his endeavor. He became follower of shia religion and made others shia too. 
The thing to notice is that God is not unfair, but people are unfair to themselves. 
This is just one example and you will find many as you go through the pages of history and present situation also. 
 

It was Holy Prophet's  (sawa) wasiyat to Imam Ali (a.s.) that if you don't get 40 helpers then restrain from fighting. Imam Ali (a.s.) had only 4 at that time. 
 
... Then the Holy Prophet looked at Hadhrat Ali (AS) and said: “Oh Ali, no doubt, after me you will face a lot of harshness from Quraysh, in such a manner that they will overpower you and harass you. If you find helpers to fight then with those who obey you , fight with those who oppose you. If you cannot find helpers, then have patience and restrain your hands and do not let yourself be destroyed. Because, surely, your status to me is like the status that Haroon had with Musa and for you, the footsteps of Haroon are present. He (Haroon) had told his brother: “Surely the people reckoned me weak and had well nigh slained me” (Surah Araf: 150)
(Kitab sulaym bin Qais, Hadith no. 1)

I didn't read the whole thread the title annoyed me also