أبو فاطمة المحمدي

A mumin never supports any unjust person. Doing so leads straight to Hellfire, according to the Qur'an. None of the US presidential candidates is just, except maybe Sanders.

Quote whatever you wish to share here. I generally do not waste my time on Nasibi websites. Besides, what is your comment on the hadith in the OP?

There are two issues here: 1. What does Shi'ism itself teach? 2. What did some Shi'is do? As every reasonable human being knows, we do not judge a religion/sect through the behaviours of some of its followers. It is perfectly possible to find some Shi'is in the past who believed in tajsim. However, did they get it from Shi'ism? The answer is obvious: "no." Therefore, mentioning that some Shi'is once believed in tajsim or tashbih is completely illogical and irrelevant, in this discussion. By contrast, it is impossible to be a Sunni without being a mujassim. This is because tajsim itself is rooted in the foundations of Sunnism. This is why every Sunni believes that they will see Allah with their eyes - which indicates that He is a jism (a corporeal being). Our eyes can only see ajsam (i.e. corporeal beings). Apparently, Sunnis believe that Abu Bakr, 'Umar and 'Uthman held this 'aqidah too. This then means that those three were the first mujassimah in this Ummah. Whoever believed in tajsim or tashbih later only got it from them. Al-Jahiz must have been smoking something when he wrote the above. We all know he is lying here. For instance, did he know all the Shi'ah all over the world? Of course, he did not. It was impossible for him to know all Shi'ah all over the world. But, here, he is claiming to have known all of them - which shows that he was a careless liar. Secondly, the records that have come to us from the early Shi'i actually rejects tajsim and tashbih. These records further expose the lie of al-Jahiz. If anything, there may have been a few Shi'is who believed in tajsim or tashbih, apparently influenced by the tajsim and tashbih of Sunni Islam. After all, many of them were converts from Sunnism, and it is often difficult to shed all the bad influences of Sunnism within a short period of time.

Salafis are more straightforward in their heresy. The other Sunnis only run away from their own shadows.

As-Salam 'Alaikum, There is an interesting Sunni hadith, which is attributed to the Messenger of Allah, peace be upon him and his family: رأيت ربي في صورة شاب أمرد جعد عليه حلة خضراء I saw my Lord in the form of a curly-haired, beardless young man, wearing a green robe. The well-known Salafi website, Dorar, has published a research on this hadith. In that research, they have stated about this report above: وهذا الحديث من هذا الطريق صححه جمعٌ من أهل العلم، منهم: الإمام أحمد المنتخب من علل الخلال: ص282، وإبطال التأويلات لأبي يعلى 1/139 وأبو زرعة الرازي إبطال التأويلات لأبي يعلى 1/144 والطبراني إبطال التأويلات لأبي يعلى 1/143 وأبو الحسن بن بشار إبطال التأويلات 1/ 142، 143، 222 وأبو يعلى في إبطال التأويلات 1/ 141، 142، 143 وابن صدقة إبطال التأويلات 1/144 تلبيس الجهمية 7 /225 وابن تيمية في بيان تلبيس الجهمية 7/290، 356 طبعة مجمع الملك فهد لطباعة المصحف الشريف- 1426هـ This hadith through this chain has been declared sahih by a group of scholars, including: Imam Ahmad (al-Muntakhab min 'Ilal al-Khalal, p. 282; and Ibtal al-Tawilat of Abu Ya'la 1/139) Abu Zur'ah al-Razi (Ibtal al-Tawilat of Abu Ya'la 1/144) Al-Tabarani (Ibtal al-Tawilat of Abu Ya'la 1/143) Abu al-Hasan b. Bashar (Ibtal al-Tawilat 1/142, 143, 222) Ibn Sadaqah (Ibtal al-Tawilat 1/144) (Talbis al-Jahmiyyah 7/225) Ibn Taymiyyah in Bayan Talbis al-Jahmiyyah 7/290, 356 - printed by King Fahd Complex for the Publication of the Noble Mushaf, 1426 H) At this point, we should present this hadith from Kitab al-Kafi, and it has a sahih chain: أحمد بن إدريس، عن محمد بن عبد الجبار، عن صفوان بن يحيى قال: سألني أبو قرة المحدث أن ادخله على أبي الحسن الرضا عليه السلام فاستأذنته في ذلك فأذن لي فدخل عليه فسأله عن الحلال والحرام والأحكام حتى بلغ سؤاله إلى التوحيد فقال أبو قرة: إنا روينا أن الله قسم الرؤية والكلام بين نبيين فقسم الكلام لموسى ولمحمد الرؤية، فقال أبو الحسن عليه السلام: فمن المبلغ عن الله إلى الثقلين من الجن والإنس لا تدركه الابصار و لا يحيطون به علما و ليس كمثله شئ أليس محمد؟ قال: بلى قال :كيف يجيئ رجل إلى الخلق جميعا فيخبرهم أنه جاء من عند الله وأنه يدعوهم إلى الله بأمر الله فيقول: لا تدركه الابصار و لا يحيطون به علما و ليس كمثله شئ ثم يقول أنا رأيته بعيني وأحطت به علما وهو على صورة البشر؟! أما تستحون؟! ما قدرت الزنادقة أن ترميه بهذا أن يكون يأتي من عند الله بشئ، ثم يأتي بخلافه من وجه آخر؟! قال أبو قرة: فإنه يقول: ولقد رآه نزلة أخرى فقال أبو الحسن عليه السلام: إن بعد هذه الآية ما يدل على ما رأى. حيث قال: ما كذب الفؤاد ما رأى يقول: ما كذب فؤاد محمد ما رأت عيناه، ثم أخبر بما رأى فقال لقد رأى من آيات ربه الكبرى فآيات الله غير الله وقد قال الله: ولا يحيطون به علما فإذا رأته الابصار فقد أحاطت به العلم ووقعت المعرفة، فقال أبو قرة: فتكذب بالروايات؟ فقال أبو الحسن عليه السلام: إذا كانت الروايات مخالفة للقرآن كذبتها. وما أجمع المسلمون عليه أنه لا يحاط به علما ولا تدركه الابصار وليس كمثله شئ. Ahmad b. Idris – Muhammad b. ‘Abd al-Jabbar – Safwan b. Yahya: Abu Qurrah, the hadith narrator, asked me to take him to Abu al-Hasan al-Rida, peace be upon him. So, I asked his (i.e. the Imam’s) permission concerning that, and he permitted me. Thus, he (Abu Qurrah) went to him and asked him about the halal, the haram and the ahkam, until his questions got to tawhid. Abu Qurrah said, “We narrate that Allah divided the ocular vision of Himself and His speech between two prophets. He gave His Speech to Musa, and to Muhammad He awarded the ocular vision of Him.” Upon that, Abu al-Hasan, peace be upon him, said: “Who conveyed from Allah to the two weighty things, the jinns and the humans, that {Visions cannot reach Him} [6:103] and {They cannot comprehend Him in knowledge} [20:110] and {There is nothing whatsoever like Him} [42:11]? Was it not Muhammad?” He (Abu Qurrah) said, “Yes, it was him.” He (al-Rida) said: “How then can a man come to the entire creation, informing them that he has come from Allah, and that he calls them to Allah with the Command of Allah, and he says {Visions cannot reach Him} and {They cannot comprehend Him in knowledge} and {There is nothing whatsoever like Him} and then he says ‘I saw Him with my eyes and I have comprehended Him in knowledge, and He has the image of a man?!’ Are you not ashamed? Even the atheist is incapable of accusing him of that, of bringing one thing from Allah and then contradicting it from another angle?!” Abu Qurrah said, “But, He says {He saw him again another time} [53:13].” Abu al-Hasan, peace be upon him, said, “Verily, there is after this verse that which explains what he saw, when He says {His heart did not belie what he saw} [53:11]. He says: The heart of Muhammad did not belie what his eyes saw. Then, He informs about what he saw, and says: {He saw some of the greatest signs of his Lord} [53:18]. The signs of Allah are not Allah. Allah has also said {They cannot comprehend Him in knowledge}. If the visions see Him, then they will have comprehended Him in knowledge, and recognition (of Him) will have occurred.” Then, Abu Qurrah said, “So, are you calling the reports lies?” Upon that, Abu al-Hasan, peace be upon him, said, “If the reports contradict the Qur’an, I call them lies. Besides, all Muslims unanimously agree that He cannot be comprehended in knowledge, and that visions cannot reach Him, and that there is nothing whatsoever like Him.”

Haaa! Okay, I get it. You think your eyes should be able to see a being with no image, with no figure, with no form, with no body?! Wow! I think, at this point, I am withdrawing from the discussion.

"Corporeal" means "having a body." Does Allah have a body? Does He have material body parts? So, you think our corporeal eyes can see non-corporeal beings? Ya'ni, your eyes can see a being which has no image, no form and no body? Are you really sure of that?

Okay, perhaps, I should re-phrase the submission: 1. Do you believe that Allah has a corporeal form? 2. Can our corporeal eye see non-corporeal things? Well, according to your scholars, it is possible to see Allah even with these earthly eyes.

Wa 'alaikum salam, This answer is a bit confusing. Could you please clarify. If someone voluntarily imagines Allah as possessing a certain image or shape (whatever that is), would that really categorize as an "involuntary act"?

Peshawar Nights is a very poor book, by modern academic standards.

Every creature is made up of substances. There is no creature, which is not made up of some sort of substances - even angels, jinns, air and electric currents. However, there is nothing like Allah. Therefore, He is NOT made up of substances of any sort. Meanwhile, our eyes cannot see anything except if it is made up of substances. Thus, if you claim that the eyes can see Allah, then you are claiming that He too is made up of substances. If you are claiming that the human eye is capable of seeing a Being that is not made up of substances of any sort, then I am afraid you've got to provide the proofs for that.

Again, I told you: you are free to follow da'if ahadith in your religion. Just do not bother others with them.

Never mind. Your lie is apparent, and the fact that you shamelessly repeat it shows a lot about you. I only wanted to be very sure, before concluding that you are a dishonest liar. Now, I am certain.

I think I have earned the right to call you a liar.

Only one of the Mothers of the Believers was openly rebellious against Allah and His Messenger, especially after the death of the Prophet. Did you read any history at all? The fact that you are examining the chains of a mutawatir hadith shows how ignorant or dishonest you are. The status of the chains of a mutawatir hadith are IRRELEVANT to its authenticity. This is why they are never checked by the honest people. Refer back to the OP. Hadith al-Thaqalayn is a good shahid for the ahadith in the OP. So, it is perfectly relevant, and it proves the same point as the ahadith in the OP. Not so fast, Sunni! Have you really forgotten your weird claim so fast? Do you now reject this claim? Or do you still insist on it?

The bottom-line is that a hadith with no known chain IS da'if. We cannot accept it. If you wish, you may accept it. It is your Deen, and you can make anything hujjah upon yourself. As for us, we cannot. Besides, three similar ahadith do NOT establish tawattur in anything. Tawattur?! Are you kidding? It does seem that you have very loose definitions of tawattur and sihhah.

So, what is your explanation of this verse (3:77): إِنَّ الَّذِينَ يَشْتَرُونَ بِعَهْدِ اللَّهِ وَأَيْمَانِهِمْ ثَمَنًا قَلِيلًا أُولَٰئِكَ لَا خَلَاقَ لَهُمْ فِي الْآخِرَةِ وَلَا يُكَلِّمُهُمُ اللَّهُ وَلَا يَنظُرُ إِلَيْهِمْ يَوْمَ الْقِيَامَةِ وَلَا يُزَكِّيهِمْ وَلَهُمْ عَذَابٌ أَلِيمٌ Those who sell Allah´s contract and their own oaths for a paltry price, such people will have no portion in the Next World, and on the Day of Rising Allah will not speak to them or look at them or purify them. They will have a painful punishment. Does this mean: Allah will not see them? Also, how would you interpret this (80:24): فَلْيَنظُرِ الْإِنسَانُ إِلَىٰ طَعَامِهِ Man has only to look at his food.

You are correct. I also notice that in Qur'an 21:65, it is used as a reference to idols. Shukran.

So, هَٰؤُلَاءِ is used for animals too? Please, could you provide examples of that?

You are correct in this particular submission. Thanks for that. However, I want to ask further. Can animals be referred to as هَٰؤُلَاءِ ? The hadith is mursal, and therefore da'if. It cannot be used as evidence.

As-Salam 'Alaikum, I think it is safe to assume that everyone on this forum has heard the story of Prophet Adam (peace be upon him) and the angels, how Allah ordered them to prostrate to him, and how Iblis refused. Perhaps, all of us also know that Prophet Adam was asked to tell some names to the angels, to prove his superiority over them. Usually, we are told that Allah taught him the names of all things, all things to exist later in this world. For instance, he was taught the names of airplanes, tall buildings, laptops, elephants, and so on. But, a closer look at one of the verses (2:31) presents some problems: وَعَلَّمَ آدَمَ الْأَسْمَاءَ كُلَّهَا ثُمَّ عَرَضَهُمْ عَلَى الْمَلَائِكَةِ فَقَالَ أَنبِئُونِي بِأَسْمَاءِ هَٰؤُلَاءِ إِن كُنتُمْ صَادِقِينَ And He taught Adam the Names, all of them; then presented them to the angels and said, ‘Tell me the names of these, if you are truthful.’ The parts in red suggest that Prophet Adam was taught the names of some other existing human beings. Those pronouns are used for humans only, or at least intelligent beings, as far as I know. Apparently, Allah taught Prophet Adam all the names of some existing intelligent beings, and then presented these beings to the angels. Let us move forward (2:33): قَالَ يَا آدَمُ أَنبِئْهُم بِأَسْمَائِهِمْ فَلَمَّا أَنبَأَهُم بِأَسْمَائِهِمْ قَالَ أَلَمْ أَقُل لَّكُمْ إِنِّي أَعْلَمُ غَيْبَ السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالْأَرْضِ وَأَعْلَمُ مَا تُبْدُونَ وَمَا كُنتُمْ تَكْتُمُونَ He said, ‘O Adam, inform them of their names,’ and when he had informed them of their names, He said, ‘Did I not tell you that I indeed know the Unseen in the heavens and the earth, and that I know whatever you disclose and whatever you were concealing?’ The same pronouns are used, denoting that those beings were living and intelligent beings. It is interesting that Prophet Adam gained superiority over the angels, and deserved their prostration, by knowing all the names of these beings. But, who were they?

Go ahead. Quote the authentic reports from it.

This is also from Tafsir Ibn Kathir: Allah the Exalted said, (And whatsoever the Messenger gives you, take it; and whatsoever he forbids you, abstain (from it).) meaning, `whatever the Messenger commands you, then do it and whatever he forbids you, then avoid it. Surely, He only commands righteousness and forbids evil.' Imam Ahmad recorded that `Abdullah bin Mas`ud said, "Allah curses women who practice tattooing and those who get themselves tattooed, and the women who remove the hair from their eyebrows and faces and those who make artificial spaces between their teeth in order to look more beautiful, whereby changing Allah's creation.'' His statement reached a woman from Bani Asad called, Umm Ya`qub, who came to `Abdullah and said, "I have come to know that you have cursed such and such'' He replied, "Why should I not curse those whom Allah's Messenger has cursed and who are cursed in Allah's Book!'' Umm Ya`qub said, "I have read the whole Qur'an, but did not find in it what you say.'' He said, "Verily, if you have read the Qur'an, you have found it. Didn't you read, (And whatsoever the Messenger gives you take it and whatsoever he forbids you, you abstain (from it).)'' She replied, "Yes, I did.'' He said, "Verily, Allah's Messenger forbade such things. '' "She said, "But I think that your wife does these things'' He said, "Go and look at her.'' She went and watched her, but could not see anything in support of her claim. She went back to `Abdullah bin Mas`ud and said that she did not notice anything on his wife. On that he said, "If my wife was as you thought, I would not keep her with me.'' The Two Sahihs recorded this from the Hadith of Sufyan Ath-Thawri.

I guess you were referring to those cursed in the hadith - whether they have similarly been cursed in authentic Shi'i hadiths. If that is what you are asking, then honestly, I do not know whether we have similar hadiths or not.

As-Salam 'Alaikum, When it comes to Hadith al-Thaqalayn, our Sunni brothers are of two kinds: (i) the sincere ones and (ii) the insincere ones. The sincere ones generally accept the hadith once a reliable chain of it has been shown to them. Even if they are not going to become Shi'ah, they still agree that the Prophet (peace be upon him and his family) had truly commanded his Ummah to follow the Qur'an and his Ahl al-Bayt (peace be upon them) after him. The insincere ones either adamantly maintain that the hadith is not authentic, even after seeing its sahih chains. Some of them are less mischievous: they agree that the hadith is indeed sahih, but they will not follow it because they cannot find it in the Qur'an! You might wonder: why do such Sunnis not call themselves Qur'anists instead? Well, of course, they accept ahadith, except those that favour the Ahl al-Bayt. This then may be a good sign of nasb in their hearts. In any case, I have found Hadith al-Thaqalayn in the Qur'an !!! So, such Sunnis have no more excuse. Here it is, in this hadith from Sahih Muslim: حَدَّثَنَا إِسْحَاقُ بْنُ إِبْرَاهِيمَ، وَعُثْمَانُ بْنُ أَبِي شَيْبَةَ، - وَاللَّفْظُ لإِسْحَاقَ - أَخْبَرَنَا جَرِيرٌ، عَنْ مَنْصُورٍ، عَنْ إِبْرَاهِيمَ، عَنْ عَلْقَمَةَ، عَنْ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ، قَالَ لَعَنَ اللَّهُ الْوَاشِمَاتِ وَالْمُسْتَوْشِمَاتِ وَالنَّامِصَاتِ وَالْمُتَنَمِّصَاتِ وَالْمُتَفَلِّجَاتِ لِلْحُسْنِ الْمُغَيِّرَاتِ خَلْقَ اللَّهِ ‏.‏ قَالَ فَبَلَغَ ذَلِكَ امْرَأَةً مِنْ بَنِي أَسَدٍ يُقَالُ لَهَا أُمُّ يَعْقُوبَ وَكَانَتْ تَقْرَأُ الْقُرْآنَ فَأَتَتْهُ فَقَالَتْ مَا حَدِيثٌ بَلَغَنِي عَنْكَ أَنَّكَ لَعَنْتَ الْوَاشِمَاتِ وَالْمُسْتَوْشِمَاتِ وَالْمُتَنَمِّصَاتِ وَالْمُتَفَلِّجَاتِ لِلْحُسْنِ الْمُغَيِّرَاتِ خَلْقَ اللَّهِ فَقَالَ عَبْدُ اللَّهِ وَمَا لِيَ لاَ أَلْعَنُ مَنْ لَعَنَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم وَهُوَ فِي كِتَابِ اللَّهِ فَقَالَتِ الْمَرْأَةُ لَقَدْ قَرَأْتُ مَا بَيْنَ لَوْحَىِ الْمُصْحَفِ فَمَا وَجَدْتُهُ ‏.‏ فَقَالَ لَئِنْ كُنْتِ قَرَأْتِيهِ لَقَدْ وَجَدْتِيهِ قَالَ اللَّهُ عَزَّ وَجَلَّ ‏{‏ وَمَا آتَاكُمُ الرَّسُولُ فَخُذُوهُ وَمَا نَهَاكُمْ عَنْهُ فَانْتَهُوا‏}‏ فَقَالَتِ الْمَرْأَةُ فَإِنِّي أَرَى شَيْئًا مِنْ هَذَا عَلَى امْرَأَتِكَ الآنَ ‏.‏ قَالَ اذْهَبِي فَانْظُرِي ‏.‏ قَالَ فَدَخَلَتْ عَلَى امْرَأَةِ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ فَلَمْ تَرَ شَيْئًا فَجَاءَتْ إِلَيْهِ فَقَالَتْ مَا رَأَيْتُ شَيْئًا ‏.‏ فَقَالَ أَمَا لَوْ كَانَ ذَلِكِ لَمْ نُجَامِعْهَا ‏.‏ 'Abdullah reported that Allah had cursed those women who tattooed and who have themselves tattooed, those who pluck hair from their faces and those who make spaces between their teeth for beautification changing what God has created. This news reached a woman of the tribe of Asad who was called Umm Ya'qub and she used to recite the Holy Qur'an. She came to him and said: What is this news that has reached me from you that you curse those women who tattooed and those women who have themselves tattooed, the women who pluck hair from their faces and who make spaces between their teeth for beautification changing what God has created? Thereupon 'Abdullah said: Should I not curse one upon whom Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) has invoked curse and that is in the Book also. Thereupon that woman said: I read the Qur'an from cover to cover, but I did not find that in it. whereupon he said: If you had read (thoroughly) you would have definitely found this in that (as) Allah, the Exalted and Glorious, has said:" What Allah's Messenger brings for you accept that and what he has forbidden you, refrain from that." That woman said: I find this thing in your wife even now. Thereupon he said: Go and see her. She reported: I went to the wife of 'Abdullah but found nothing of this sort in her. She came back to him and said: I have not seen anything. whereupon he said: Had there been anything like it in her, I would have never slept with her in the bed. Let's see how they respond this time.