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In the Name of God بسم الله


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  1. Good question. I am Shia but not 12er. However I do accept the Ismah of Imam Hassan (as) and not the khilafa of muawiyah. The reason is that it is my belief that Imam Hassan (as) did this to prevent further bloodshed within the Ummah not as an endorsement of his leadership. Muawiyah was determined to be king. He fought Imam Ali (as) for it and most certainly was going to fight Imam Hassan (as). The fitnah it caused was terrible. By allowing him to hold power he exposed the man's greed and luster to rule. It was demonstrated for all to see that proper leadership only comes from the Ahl Al Bayt. But besides that he simply did not have the military wherewithal to hold power. Also from a ZAYDI SHIA perspective Isma does not mean that one does not make mistakes. It means that one does not commit sins or act contrary to Islam. 12er Shia have a very different view of this. I am not in either madhab but I lean more towards the Zaydi view regarding Ismah. And Allah knows best
  2. The answer is that Muhammad (saws) was both the Prophet and the head of state. So it became necessary after he died to have someone who could explai Qur'an, be an example.of how to live it, issue rulings on aqidah and fiqh, negotiate treaties, deal with infrastructure, decide on war and peace, appoint regional government , collect taxes and be a moral leader. As far as I know I will there have only been two Imams(as) from the 12er line who have actually done all of these things and those are Ali (as) and Hassan (as).
  3. Oh come on. The Imamate should be a pretty basic concept. There is no reason for me to get contradictory answers. The duties and rights of an Imam do not change.
  4. Please provide a full and comprehensive list, according to your madhab, of the following: 1. The reasons for the existence of an Imamate 2. The rights and duties of an Imam. 3. How the Imams were chosen and by whom I am asking for a full and comprehensive list because I keep getting different answers depending upon what conversation I am having. This is not acceptable. ......
  5. Zaydiyah are NOT "fivers". Calling them such is misleading, inaccurate and distorts any chance at proper understanding of the Zaydi madhab. The Zaydiyah do NOT stop at 5 Imams. The most recent Zaydi Imam died in 2007. The thing is that Zaydiyah are called such because they recognize Zayd (as) as the Imam of the Age while other Shia recognize Baqir (as) and Sadiq (as) for this time period. Zaydiyah also recognize Imams Baqir (as) and Sadiq (as) as Imams of Knowledge and they FREQUENTLY refer to them and their works and narrations from them as a source of Zaydi aqidah and fiqh. So it is not even accurate to say that Zaydiyah "reject" them but more accurate to say that they disagree about the level of the Imamates of these men. This is in part because Zaydiyah do not agree with 12ers about what an Imamates actually IS in the first place. But there is no such thing as a "Fiver". That is a derogatory term which a Zaydi would not accept. It also makes it seem like the Zaydiyah believe in 5 Imams in the sense that 12ers believe in 12 and that is not even close to be the case. Also Zaydiyah hold only THREE Imams (as) to be masom. That is the first three based on their status as Ahl Al Kisa. So since the rest of their Imams are NOT considered masom right up to the present day it makes no sense to call them "Fivers" since there is no list of 5 anything which they adhere to. They do not even say there are 5 pillars of Islam as Sunni do because Zaydiyah hold that there is a sixth pillar which is the Imamate. I hope I cleared this up for you. May Allah guide us all Of course not. Zaydiyah are Muslims and all Muslims consider themselves to follow the Sunnah. Now there are those who disagree with the aqidah and fiqh of the Zaydi school but accusing a madhab of turning it's back on the Sunnah is basically equivalent to takfir. One can certainly disagree with the Zaydiyah on many points. I disagree with them on some things myself. I would not accuse them of intentionally abandoning the Sunnah though. And that is a general charge. Tell whoever said that to be specific so that a response can be given point by point. Otherwise they are just hurling insults
  6. As salaamu alaikum brother. I am studying the Zaydi madhab. I really AM a Zaydi but I have not been one for long and was not raised in it etc. So I don't know EVERYTHING. However I CAN help you out. I can tell you what our basic beliefs are and I can tell you where to go for more in depth answers to some of your questions if I cannot answer them to your satisfaction. For instance I never paid attention to the Zaydi stance on him. I know it is not like the Sunnis though. That guy is inb like HALF of their hadith. Ha ha ha ! In any case we have PLENTY of major differences with the Sunnis. It's just that we do NOT do this thing I keep catching Ithna Ashari brothers doing. I keep seeing them judge how much of a Shia a person is based on how much they distance themselves from the Sunnis. This is not correct thought. What is correct is to go by the Qur'an, the Sunnah and the consensus of the Ahl Al Bayt. Anyway you kind of caught me at a bad time because I am on my way to go to sleep. But message my inbox OR I will just meet you back here later in the aftenoon. By the way Facebook has a page by Zaydis and it is all about answering questions about our madhab. It is called The Zaidi School of Thought,. There is also a website called salvationark.com. And scribd.com has MANY works by zaydiyah regarding our aqidah and fiqh. It is there under the heading Imam Rassi Society. As salaamu alaikum and may Allah guide us all
  7. Thank you for your answer. Zaydis were no small sect though. They were thre biggest branch until the rise of the Safavid empire. But look here's what I don't understand. How, according to 12ers does one become the Imam ? I have heard that they are appointed by Allah and I have heard that the current Imam picks his successor. I am speaking about the past of course as the 12th and final Imam is in ghayba. But which is it ? Allah appoints or Imam appoints ?
  8. OK I guess you missed the point and maybe that is because I was not clear. I don't mean how do we know he was lying about being the Imam so much as how do we know he was lying that Askari (as) never had a son. Also I am asking how he could claim Imamate if it was already known who the Imam was. 12er of ten cite hadith stating that the names of the Imams were known before they were even born. I think those hadith are fabricated/a load of malarkey because if that were the case the many disputes over who the Imam of the time was would never have occurred. Zaydiyyah and Ismaili yah would not even exist if there was an accepted list of 12 names. This brings me to the next part of my response. People DID proclaim Imamate publicly. I have no idea why you say otherwise. Imam Hussein (as) did so, Imam Zayd (as) did so as did a number of other Zaydi and Ismaili Imams (as). I love and embrace all the Imams (as) from the Zaydi AND the 12ver lines as Blessed members of the Ahl Al Bayt and regard some of them as Imams of knowledge even if they were not Imams of the age. As far as the claims of the 7ers I have not researched them. I should make it a point to do that. In any case I find the 12vers claims that being an Imam was dangerous to on the one hand be very TRUE UT also very confusing since Zaydi Imams somehow managed to rule their own states in Tatarstan , southern Spain and eventually in Yemen. Why was one group of Imams able to thrive while the other had to hide? I gotta look into that........
  9. How do we know he was lying? How did he claim Imamate if the Imam was known? Can 12ers explain the events following the death of Imam Askari(as)? No rants please. This is a fair question.
  10. The answer is probably not. I have yet to see a response to this just attacks. I am Shia but not 12er and this is one of the reasons why
  11. Sigh...... Jesus (as) did NOT govern . Not once not ever. The reasons are irrelevant. He did not. I am not putting him down for not governing. That was not his mission. Allah has sent different people with different missions. Jesus (as) accomplished his mission perfectly but that mission did NOT include governing. He did not have to levy taxes or negotiate trade deals or treaties. He made pronouncements when he saw fit. Nothing wrong with that. But his life was NOTHING like that of King David (as) or Muhammad (saws) or even Moses (as). He led only a small band of followers. Sure other people listened to him but they were not under his rule. Jesus (as) never had an army or the type of widespread support necessary to claim a kingdom as such and I doubt he would have wanted to. His situation was therefore different and my point stands
  12. @Spicen that IS editing. That is the very DEFINITION of editing. Arranging orders and adding titles. The Harakat were even added later. Early written Qur'an do not have them. That is adding punctuation. Go to any modern publishing house or newspaper they do the same thing. That does not mean it is not accurate But people view editing differently than I do. One need not change the content in order to upgrade the presentation.
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