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    • Nobody is stopping anyone reaching whatever theological conclusions they like, and nobody is dictating anything to anyone. The issue is what is allow to be said in the public sphere, and the manner in which it is said. If someone wants to become a Christian, or an atheist, then can. They don't need to tell the whole world about it, and try to proselytise their new-found beliefs. How do you know he would have been executed? You are assuming that had he lived under some idealised Islamic state that he would have reached those same conclusions that made him briefly convert to Christianity, and that even if he had converted, that he would have made it public enough to draw the attention of the state (which in practice would have meant he was trying to convert others). Further, you would need to assume that when questioned, you would openly admit to having left the faith, and not taken any opportunities to recant. Now, I admit all of this is possible, but it seems fairly unlikely. Leaving Islam isn't a death penalty. People are free to believe whatever they want, and if they really feel the need to tell the world about their conversion, then they are perfectly welcome to leave, as the Qur'an advises Muslims themselves: Surely (as for) those whom the angels cause to die while they are unjust to their souls, they shall say: In what state were you? They shall say: We were weak in the earth. They shall say: Was not Allah's earth spacious, so that you should have migrated therein? So these it is whose abode is hell, and it is an evil resort [Qur'an 4:97, Shakir] No Muslim advocates doing anything like what China is doing. Muslims in China want to right to simply go about their lives peacefully and practice their religion. China on the other hand wants to forcibly make them leave their religion. I think there is a bit of a misunderstanding here. Muslims don't believe in setting up some kind of inquisition and interrogating people on what they believe, whether they are fasting during the month of Ramadan, or whether they pray five times a day. Everyone is free to believe whatever they like, and will be left alone, as long as they aren't seeking to recruit others to their cause. And ultimately, if the rulers of the state believe that there are better ways of dealing with the issue, giving the current circumstances, and changes in society etc, then they aren't forced to carry out the harshest penalties.
    • When a minority/oppressred group undertake it, it's a form of affirmative action.   This is incorrect. There have been periods of European history when they have been oppressed and there have been periods when they have flourished economically and culturally. There have been no periods of American history when blacks have flourished.
    • In islam we are also encouraged to get rid of the nafs because none of this worldly life belongs to us and when we die, it will be an easy transition as we dont see things as belonging to us, this heavely goes against the individualist beleifs as they tell you that this thing or even your body is YOURS and you can do whatever you want as long as you dont hurt others with it, for example, but we know full well that these things are all given by Allah(stw). In islam we also have Allah(stw) as you mentionned that tell the individual that they can change their destiny they have control of their actions, which also goes against some aspects of collectivsm.
    • @iCenozoic I think examples from The Islamic Republic of Iran would prove to be more formidable. Arabi is an atheist, activist and blogger. He's in an Iranian prison, in bad shape both emotionally and physically. His crime? Blasphemy: writing insulting Facebook posts about the prophet Muhammad, the Supreme Leader of Iran Ali Khamenei and other Iranian officials. Arabi was arrested in December 2013 and sentenced to death for blasphemy. In July 2015, upon appeal, his death sentence was reduced to seven and a half years in prison and two years of religious studies to cure him of his atheism. In addition to physical problems caused by various hunger strikes, Arabi has been tortured, resulting in blunt trauma to his testicles and a broken nose, amongst other injuries. Refusing to be silenced, he was later sentenced to an additional three years in prison, exile and a fine on charges of “propaganda against the state” and “insulting the sacred and the supreme leader” because of his open letters highlighting inhumane prison conditions of political prisoners in Iran. As if to rub the mullahs’ noses in it, he signs letters as Soheil Arabi, Atheist. Source: https://newhumanist.org.uk/articles/5606/thousands-were-released-in-iran-but-not-atheist-prisoner-soheil-arabi @Ashvazdanghe Brother what can you tell us about the case of Soheil Arabi, and do you think forcing him to undergo religious studies as well as torturing him, which I don't see how such two polars could really help in anything, other then establish greater disillusion. Was this all necessary do you support these measures and if so why? I tagged you because I know you are an avid supporter and defender of Ayatollah Khamenai and the Islamic Republic, which I respect and admire, but at times stand and question.
    • I use Saudi Arabia because almost everyone here, recognizes that the countries government is unjust with respect to how it treats other religions. I could point to other countries, but I'm just trying to find common ground that others here would agree with. https://www.hrw.org/news/2014/03/20/saudi-arabia-new-terrorism-regulations-assault-rights
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In the Name of God بسم الله

Atheism/Other Religions

Discuss atheism, non-Abrahamic faiths (Buddhism, Hinduism, etc), and other religious/spiritual philosophies. 

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