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Sadaat

To all Indo-Pak Syeds

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Salaam alaikum,

Thanks for all information given so far.

Does anyone have informations on the holy families Khandaan-e-Ijtehad and Baqir-ul-Uloom families and their routes taken.

I believe Khandaan-e-Ijtehad arrived to Bareilly in a place called Jaees.

Baqir-ul-Uloom family to Kashmir.

I heard Rizvis also arrived to Zaidpur.

Zaidis arrived to Muzaffar Nagar and Muthikpur, Meerut and Bijnor (Uttar Pradesh). I believe (especcially in the case of Muzaffar Nagar) that the ancestor was Syed Abul Farah Zaidi al-Wasti.

Taqvi Syeds arrived to Amroha and Badshah.

Naqvi Syeds arrived to Amroha through general Syed Sharfuddin aka. "Dada" Shah Wilayat who is the ancestor of every Naqvi in Amroha (several hundreds of Naqvis now spanning worldwide).

Also Naqvis in Bareilly.

Anybody care to add to this?

WS.

As Salaam Alaykum

I am no expert on this.

Talking to people including ulema over the years and reading books I can add some info for you here:.

1. You are correct a group of Rizvi syeds did go to Zaidpur (I think in 16th century). From there a migration occurred to Karari, and from there onto the neighbouring town of Manjhunpur in 19th century (recently capital of Koshambi District, now back in Allahabad district). In fact there is an urdu book on this group of syeds. Those latter are currently both towns in Allahabad district (eastern UP) and have shia communities and big imambaras. Some prominent Syed Maulanas who recite majlis and are well-known could fill you in like Uruj Ul-Hasan Meesum as he comes from Karari and mentioned it.

2. Rizvi Syeds - there is a lineage descended from the family of that famous extremist shia called Agha Mir Mutaumud Dawla, prime minister of awadh in the 19th century. The area of Lucknow called Agha Mir Dheori is named after him. Anyhow, he migrated to India in approx. the 1820s and became the PM of Awadh in the time of Ghazi ud Din Hyder. Agha Mir was the grandson of the famous Persian sufi pir Syed Shams of Multan who migrated to Sindh and has a massive mazhar in Sindh with alams to this day (not to be confused with the other famous sufi Syed Shams who was many centuries before and was Rumi's companion). Anyhow Agha Mir instituted tabarra in Lucknow and the sunnis did not like him one bit. He got exiled to Kanpur and lost his prime ministership, and there's mention of him in that Mirza Ghalib series with Nasir ud Din Shah and so on. Anyhow, his family split into 2 settlements in Kanpur one in Gwaltoli and the other in Patkapur. There are 2 huge imambaras associated with both these sites, both built by Agha Mir and he's buried inside one of them. There is also a photo of him in (I think) Husainabad in Lucknow and elsewhere. Anyway, a lot of syeds in the city of Kanpur descend from his family. There are also saiyids from Sindh descended from Syed Shams without the direct link to Agha Mir. If you do a search on the latter all sorts of infromation will come up.

3. Some info . on Zaidi syeds - the settlement you speak of at "Muthikpur" (on the map its called Motikpur) and several surrounding villages constitute a large syedwara and they all descend about 150 to 200 years ago from a neighbouring town called Belaon where there is a big syed graveyard there and the main grave has religious events associated with it as it is meant to be a spiritual place. Anyhow, these all descend from Syed Alim ud Din and his brother. The migration of his ancestor occurred from Terbez in Transoxiana (near the River Oxus, just north of Khurasan) in 1192 to Delhi. A descendant married the daughter of the Syed king Shah Ibrahim Sharqi (Sharqi Dynasty of Jaunpur) but because of this marriage when the Lodhis of delhi fought the Shaqi kings the Lodhis attacked the king's son-in-law (these Syeds' ancestors) and killed them all except the women and children. The lineage continues from those children whose lives were spared on account of a relationship to the Lodhi king's mother. There are 2 printed books on this group of syeds but they're in urdu. Again ulema have come from this syedwara and you could ask them (I think Safi Haidar Sahib may be from the syedwara).

4. Kazmi / Musawi Syeds. I have a book in english which has some details. It is a book written by a maulana called Syed Zafar Mehdi Sahib Qibla, and one of his sons became a mujtahid. He was born about 1800 and lived into his 90s. Its got his ancestry and a family tree in it. The book, "Tahzib ul Khasail" is interesting. Anyhow, a group of Musawi Syeds migrated during the Mongol invasions of Iran and the leader was called Syed Abu Talib Ashraf. Some of his descendants settled in Jarwal, which is in UP. Again there are ulema from this family so you could ask them for details. They also particpated in the Indian Mutiny against the British when Maulana Zafar Mehdi was imprisoned by the British and had a lot of his estate apparently confiscated.

If you really need more information I can get some from the above books which I have not read for a long time and none cover to cover. Some of the books are very long and I'll have to get someone to translate the urdu ones. So serious requests only please.

Wa Salaam

Edited by husainshahid

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My parents are both Jafri from Imam Jafar as Sadiq (as) .

And I think my grandmother was settled in Jodhpur, India

And my grandfather in Agra

:D

I hope it was helpful

I also have the Jafri family tree tracing the tree back to my dad from Imam Ali (as).

I can post it here if you want but it will take me a couple of weeks.

Though there are no females in the tree, unluckily :(

(wasalam) and take care,

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My parents are both Jafri from Imam Jafar as Sadiq (as) .

And I think my grandmother was settled in Jodhpur, India

And my grandfather in Agra

:D

I hope it was helpful

I also have the Jafri family tree tracing the tree back to my dad from Imam Ali (as).

I can post it here if you want but it will take me a couple of weeks.

Though there are no females in the tree, unluckily :(

(wasalam) and take care,

Sorry for bumping an old topic..

Could you post that family tree? I'm a Jafri with my grandmother from Agra and grandfather from Peharsar.

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Sorry for bumping an old topic..

Could you post that family tree? I'm a Jafri with my grandmother from Agra and grandfather from Peharsar.

We're then definitely related, in some way! :D

Yeah, I'll try to give you that tree, sometime. It's with my uncle, on his computer. I had it in my old one, but now i don't have it. :( I'll have to get it from him again. I'll give it to you right away when I get it, again, Inshallah.

(wasalam)

Basim Ali Jafri

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1. You are correct a group of Rizvi syeds did go to Zaidpur (I think in 16th century). From there a migration occurred to Karari, and from there onto the neighbouring town of Manjhunpur in 19th century (recently capital of Koshambi District, now back in Allahabad district). In fact there is an urdu book on this group of syeds. Those latter are currently both towns in Allahabad district (eastern UP) and have shia communities and big imambaras. Some prominent Syed Maulanas who recite majlis and are well-known could fill you in like Uruj Ul-Hasan Meesum as he comes from Karari and mentioned it.

Just came across this topic while researching about my own ancestors. I am very interested in this Urdu book you talk about, can you pl provide more details?

For my info, my dad's side is a Rizvi from the said Karari area of UP. My mom's side is Zaidi, and I have her full shajra in an old booklet. The last place in India for her family was in Rampur where my nana taught at a school. Both their families immigrated to Pakistan, and ended up in Khairpur Mirs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khairpur_District) in Sindh, which had a heavy influx of shias from India because of support from the Talpurs (ruling family). I am now in Toronto.

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All Jafri's are definitely related in a way <img src="http://www.shiachat.com/forum/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tongue.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":P" border="0" alt="tongue.gif" />

Thanks bro.

Well, I meant really really closely related, like distant cousins or something. Maybe, just maybe, my dad will turn out to know your dad. :D

(wasalam)

Basim Ali Jafri

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Well, I meant really really closely related, like distant cousins or something. Maybe, just maybe, my dad will turn out to know your dad. :D

(wasalam)

Basim Ali Jafri

Yah, or maybe our great grandparents are like cousins or something eh.

vere is that shajrah boy?

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Zaidi

There are two distinct Zaidi surnames. Zaidies living in Yemen and North Africa are mostly descendent of Zaid bin Thabit. However, Zaidi living in pre Partition of India are the descendent of abul Farah Wasti.

The history of the Zaidi family is filled with apprehension, misgiving, misunderstanding, strife and sorrow. To know and understand Zaidi family one has to know the history of the Arabs and Islam. The cleft, according to the friends of Ali ‘Shiaan-e-Ali’ started, just after the death of the Prophet. The ‘Shias’ claimed the application of inheritance. Since The Prophet had neither a brother nor a son as a direct descendant, so the mantle should have fallen to Fatima, his daughter from his first wife Khudaija who was his paternal aunt, once removed, also. Marriage to siblings was a taboo but not to cousins. Arab law of inheritance is not so cut and dry. Women, if they were capable, did inherit the ‘leadership’ of the tribe,. Capability law applied to both genders. If there was no heir apparent or not suitable than the mantle fell on the brother, whether younger or older, then to the father or paternal uncle, then to the eldest male cousin and so on. The successor’s ‘capability’ was of prime importance and acceptability by the elders, was secondary but important. Survival of a tribe depended on the ability of its leader. Therefore, capability always took precedence. ‘Shura’ the council of elders was called to deliberate. Its decision was final yet challengeable. So you see, inheritance, among the Arabs, is complex. However, once a person had been chosen or elected, the rest of the tribe members, including the elders and contestants, had to swear allegiance (bayaa), meaning that they empowered the ‘leader’ over their life and limb, including death. So, after the death of the Prophet, the council selected and appointed Prophet’s best friend, a cousin and father-in-law, abu Bakr as the ‘Successor’. Ali, the cousin and son-in-law, yielded and swore allegiance.

Whatever the reality of the claim by the Shias, historically, Ali swore his allegiance to all the three preceding ‘Khalifas’ and then He became the fourth. By that time, Muslims had been divided into several factions. The majority adhering the ‘status quo’ and the minorities had their own ideas. After Ali, Hassan, whatever the reasons behind, accepted Muawiya. Muawiya invoked the Tribal law of direct descent and appointed his son, Yazeed. That made a big bang and ‘Karbala’ took place, an outright fight between Him and Hussain, son of Ali. Hussain lost and was killed in the battle along with his brothers, sons, cousins, nephews and friends. The sole male survivor was his son ‘Ali’ who was ill and could not fight. He survived and became known as ‘Zainul-Aabedeen’ the pious one. ZA had eleven sons from many wives. From his wife Fatima, his cousin, the daughter of his paternal uncle Hassan, was born Mohammed ‘Baquer’ who was chosen to be the leader or Imam, among the Shias. ZA’s mother was the princess of Persia.

YezdGuerd was the last of the Persian kings. Salaqa, the daughter, nicknamed Shaherbanu, after the fall of Persia, during the second Caliphate, was captured and brought to Mecca. Salman, the Persian, requested Caliph Omar, that she, a princess, ought to be treated with Royal protocols. She was granted asylum with equal rights. She accepted Islam voluntarity. Salman, again, became instrumental of her marriage to an equal. Muslims did not have a Royalty. The nearest they could get was a grandson of the Prophet. She married Hussain and gave birth to ZA. When Sind (Hind - India) was captured another princess, Hooria (pretty) came around and likewise married the son of Salaqa & Hussain: ZA. She, unlike Salaqa, was not granted royal courtesies and was sold as a slave. As a captured person, she was given the choice to proselytize or sold as a slave. She was a feisty wench, refused and preferred to be sold. Mukhtar-bin-abu-Obieda Taquefee bought her for 30,000 dirhams, an unprecedented sum, when a yearly salary for a court functionary was twelve hundred dirhams a year. He gave her her freedom. As a free woman, she converted and married ZA and gave birth to ZAID, head of Zaidi clan. Zaid, after ‘Baquer’, among the sons of ZA, was the most eligible for leadership.

In 117 AH (735 AD) Zaid, like his grandfather Hussain, challenged the legitimacy of Waleed-bin-Yazeed. Hisham-bin-abd-ul-Malak Marwaan, governor of Basra summoned him and told him that he was unfit to claim leadership because his mother was a slave. He retorted back that the mother of Ismael (father of the Arabs) was also a slave. Hisham ordered Yousef-bin-Omar Thaquefee to subjugate Zaid. The battle raged for three days. A poisoned arrow, fired by Yousef’s slave Rashed, hit Zaid right in between the eyes. He fell and died. He was 43 years old. His head was severed and sent to Hisham and the body was hung on a stake for four years, until Hisham died. Yousef requested Waleed-bin-Yazeed for a pardon, which was granted. He cremated the residue and scattered the ashes into Euphrates. There is a tomb at the site and a small hamlet called Zaid. He left four sons and one daughter. The youngest, Eesa-abu-Yahya, was only one year old. The elder three were imprisoned to be killed. The jailer felt pity and, somehow, managed to let them flee in the darkness of the night. They went into hiding until the end of Beni Omayyah’s rule. His son Yahya-bin Zaid, like his father fought against Waleed-bin-Yazeed and died. No known offspring.

Zaidies are the descendants of the three sons, Eesa, Hussain and Mohammed. Eesa-abu-Yahya’s real name was A’sara. Name change was necessary to survive. His maternal uncle brought him up. He lived in hiding and worked as a water-carrier. He died at the age of 46 in 168 AH/784 AD. He left four sons, Hussain Ghassara, Mohammed, Zaid and Ahmed Mukhtafi. Ghassara is unknown. Zaid stayed in Syria. Ahmed became a scholar, imprisoned by Haroon-ur-Rasheed, freed, wrote lots of books and died in Basra in 240AH/854 AD. No known survivors. Mohammed left many children, spent life in hiding and died in Basra. One of his son Sayyed Ali lived in Medina with fear, left for Iraq and was called Sayyed Ali Iraqi instead of Sayyed Zaid. His son Sayyed Yayha left Iraq and settled in Fidak in Khyber. His son Sayyed Hussain left Khayber for Madina and his son Dawood, also, lived there, but his son Sayyed Abul-Farah (Wasti) was forced to leave Medina and settled in Wasit in Iraq, hence Wasti, became an advisor to the Governors of Koofa and Basra. Political climate changed and he emigrated to Ghazni and became advisor to Sultan Mahmud of Ghazni, accompanied him to India on his expeditions. After one expedition, Ghaznavi appointed Wasti’s three sons as the viceregeants of the Punjab that they ruled for 180 years. The descendents of ZAID are living in all parts of this planet, North, South, East and West. It is the largest single cohesive sub-tribe among the Arabs.

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Salam,

My grandfathers name was Mohammad Saeed Quraishi. He changed his last name to Syed. All of his siblings changed their last name to Syed too. But one of his brother changed to Hashmi. Now my grandfather's name became Mohammad Saeed Syed. I really want to know my shijra (lineage). I know that my family inter married. Oral tradition of our family goes back to Bukhara in Uzbekistan. I believe after Bukhara they traveled to Balkh in Afghanistan and then ended in Amritsar. My great-grand fathers name that people called him was Ghulam Rasool.

From my mother side they call their family Husseini and my grandmother from my mother's side told me that they are descended from Ali ibn Husayn (Zaynul ‘Ābidīn).

I would like to know more about my family tree from my fathers side.

Thank-you,

Ahmed Syed

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Salam,

My grandfathers name was Mohammad Saeed Quraishi. He changed his last name to Syed. All of his siblings changed their last name to Syed too. But one of his brother changed to Hashmi. Now my grandfather's name became Mohammad Saeed Syed. I really want to know my shijra (lineage). I know that my family inter married. Oral tradition of our family goes back to Bukhara in Uzbekistan. I believe after Bukhara they traveled to Balkh in Afghanistan and then ended in Amritsar. My great-grand fathers name that people called him was Ghulam Rasool.

From my mother side they call their family Husseini and my grandmother from my mother's side told me that they are descended from Ali ibn Husayn (Zaynul ‘Ābidīn).

I would like to know more about my family tree from my fathers side.

Thank-you,

Ahmed Syed

Brother, quraishis are not syeds. And like some ppl would really really like it to change but it is a great privilege to b a syed. There r definately ppl who have changed their names to b called syeds but a few questions can generally expose them.

Furthermore :) ,, the whole concept of being a syed not just for fun brothers, there are serious religious connotations, for instance 'zakat' is a basic pillar of the whole scheme of islam but the allmighty Allah has prohibited 'zakat' for syeds and a whole different concept of 'khumus' (, but which we have never seen the face of, coz it goes God knows where!) is introduced into the devine laws.. If it were such an inconsistent & an inconcequent concept then surely the allmighty would not have bothered to introduce a whole different set of laws and made it part of the basic belief. Y define a special system of welfare for the progeny of the prophet (pbuh)?!!

Cant b pointless! Can it?

Even all forms of 'sadqaas' are prohibited for syeds, why, if being a syed is so without meaning or purpose?

We are supposed to do research and reach out to the ppl for spreading the enlightenment, but the present day capitalist system has us so engaged and entangled, in trying to make ends meet, that we have lost the script :(

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Syed [Edited Out] is BS, done us way more harm than good, someone needs to release a fatwa abolishing this bs.

Mind ur language u ignorant bigot. How dare u say such things abouts us Sayyeds?! By the hate instilled within you, u make urself sound like a follower of Yazeed who openly spilled the blood of saadat back in the day.

Back to the topic, I am a Razvi Syyed Alhamdolillah, originating from India. My dad said that we are a descendant of Diyanat Khan who was the chief admin in charge of the mughal king, aurangzeb.

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Hello there,

I was just looking for some info about my ancestors and found this thread to be useful as I am also a rizvi syed. My family came from mushhad to india, I dont know when but they've lived in kapur thalla state etc and most of our ancestors were called, QAZI'S. I am lookin for the names of Hazrat Imam ALI RAZA (as)'s family as in how many sons/daughters he had. does anyone have this info? All I can find online is one of his son i.e. the 9th imam ali naqi (as)

Any info given will be much appreciated:)

Cheers

Muhibban - e Ali (as)

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Dear Brothers AOA!

My name is Syed Naveed Hussain Shah and I need your help regarding my family tree as until my uncles wedding time it was present among my fathers eldest family members which happened roughly 45 years from now but right now no body know whereabouts of my family tree as the person keeping the records had been dead 20 years from now and no one care after that but now I realize that a grave mistake has been done in past and need to rectify it therefore I need someone help in identifying the names I mention in a syed shijra for era between 1800 - 1947 AD. My two ancestors name Syed Faiz Imam and Syed Fazal Imam came to India from Bukhara from one of them my great grand father was son whose name was Syed Fayyaz Hussain Shah and my grand father name was Syed Muhammad Sultan Hussain Qadri as he give baith to qadri order during his time so can anyone please identify this info and if found send me the copy of that shijra as I really need to erect history and continue from there atleast upto my great grandfather name must be present in one of the tree as this would help me a lot to build the rest please as my last sir name is also lost because of that as no one knows who were we from one source i have heard that we were kazmi syeds but i consider it doubtful and want to know the real truth about it whether we really are kazmi or are we belong to zaidi, mosvi, naqvi, jafri or else please need help.

Also, my great grandfather name from my mother side was Syed Mahndi-ul-Hassan Jafri and grandfather was Syed Sharif-ul-Hassan Jafri and that shijra have also been misplased by my uncles so if the grandfather could be indentified in Jafri family shijra I can rebuild taht as well so please need help in both shijras.

Regards,

Naveed

Edited by Syed Naveed Hussain Shah

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Dear Brothers AOA!

My name is Syed Naveed Hussain Shah and I need your help regarding my family tree as until my uncles wedding time it was present among my father’s eldest family members which happened roughly 45 years from now but right now no body know whereabouts of my family tree as the person keeping the records had been dead 20 years from now and no one care after that but now I realize that a grave mistake has been done in past and need to rectify it therefore I need someone help in identifying the names I mention in a syed shijra for era between 1800 - 1947 AD. My two ancestors name Syed Faiz Imam and Syed Fazal Imam came to India from Bukhara from one of them my great grandfather was son whose name was Syed Fayyaz Hussain Shah and my grandfather name was Syed Sultan Hussain Qadri as he give baith to qadri order during his time so can anyone please identify this info and if found send me the copy of that shijra as I really need to erect history and continue from there atleast upto my great grandfather name must be present in one of the tree as this would help me a lot to build the rest please as my last sir name is also lost because of that as no one knows who were we from one source i have heard that we were kazmi syeds but i consider it doubtful and want to know the real truth about it whether we really are kazmi or are we belong to zaidi, mosvi, naqvi, jafri or else please need help.

Also, my great grandfather name from my mother side was Syed Mahndi-ul-Hassan Jafri and grandfather was Syed Sharif-ul-Hassan Jafri and that shijra have also been misplased by my uncles so if the grandfather could be indentified in Jafri family shijra I can rebuild taht as well so please need help in both shijras.

Regards,

Naveed

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Dear Brothers AOA!

My name is Syed Naveed Hussain Shah and I need your help regarding my family tree as until my uncles wedding time it was present among my fathers eldest family members which happened roughly 45 years from now but right now no body know whereabouts of my family tree as the person keeping the records had been dead 20 years from now and no one care after that but now I realize that a grave mistake has been done in past and need to rectify it therefore I need someone help in identifying the names I mention in a syed shijra for era between 1800 - 1947 AD. My two ancestors name Syed Faiz Imam and Syed Fazal Imam came to India from Bukhara from one of them my great grand father was son whose name was Syed Fayyaz Hussain Shah and my grand father name was Syed Muhammad Sultan Hussain Qadri as he give baith to qadri order during his time so can anyone please identify this info and if found send me the copy of that shijra as I really need to erect history and continue from there atleast upto my great grandfather name must be present in one of the tree as this would help me a lot to build the rest please as my last sir name is also lost because of that as no one knows who were we from one source i have heard that we were kazmi syeds but i consider it doubtful and want to know the real truth about it whether we really are kazmi or are we belong to zaidi, mosvi, naqvi, jafri or else please need help.

Also, my great grandfather name from my mother side was Syed Mahndi-ul-Hassan Jafri and grandfather was Syed Sharif-ul-Hassan Jafri and that shijra have also been misplased by my uncles so if the grandfather could be indentified in Jafri family shijra I can rebuild taht as well so please need help in both shijras.

Regards,

Naveed

My name is Obaid Hasan Jafri. It appears as if we have the same relatives. Syed Mahndi ul Hasan Jafri was my great grandfather and my grandfather was Syed Aziz ul Hasan Jafri who had a Brother Syed Shareef ul Hasan Jafri I would love to link up and figure out the family tree

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Naveed

Are you related to Usman Siddiqui. My name is Obaid Jafri. I have a great grandfather who was Mehndi ul Hasan Jafri and my grandfather, Aziz ul Hasan Jafri, had a brother named Shareef ul Hasan Jafri. We should link up because I also am told that our ancestors came from Bhukara

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it is the sunna of yazeed the cursed to disrespect syeds, it is his ways and traditions that his non-syeds followed on to persecute syeds, yazeeds non-syed followers even of today strive to remove all syeds off this earth, whether through the sword or through mockery of words. that is why you complaining non syed brothers are seeing syeds in india pakistan as they were forced to migrate only to save themselves and the religion,traditions of their forefathers, it is maulas (saw) mirracle that there are sooo many syeds today ( yet many non syeds find this hard to believe).

hashmi is a tribe not syed,

a syed holds his family tree, not to prove to jokers who he is, but for real islamic requirements

Edited by alialiali

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AOA

I'm a jaffery from Imam Jafar al-Sadiq (as) - also gardezis. I believe my ancestors came from Afghanistan. Later, they moved to Multan and then to Azad Kashmir. Oh and syed aswell. Although I don't make that public. Hate it when people call me Shah jee or some title like that. There is only one Shah. Shah Ast Hussain.

WS

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Assalamo aliakum freinds my name is syed tauzi ali jafery iam from pilibhit western u.p india through my parents many times we heard that we are jafery sayeds but due to the lack of our shajrah nasab it is very difficult to prove in public because it was burnt during the hindu muslim riots in pilibhit but my grand father told me that our ancestors came from bukhara ( uzbekiston) if you guys send me the shijra till (syed faiz ali) then my shijra will be complete..........my grandfather told me that two brother came from bukra to india one was syed Faiz ali and I think second was syed fazal ali..but I dont know in which period they came to india....it is my humble request to all my brother and sisters that if you are having shajra till syed Faiz ali then please send it to me...

.

.

.

ali.tauzi786@gmail.com

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