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Allama Irfan Haider Abidi (marhoom)


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#1 vsg

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 10:14 AM

Salaam all;
I dont know if this topic has been done before, I did do a serach on it but did not find anything so i just though of starting it here.
Anyways, I am sure everyone here who comes from Pakistan, knows about the great Allama Irfan Haider Abidi and how he died in a car accident.

However, at many places I have seen the term "shaheed" put next to his name, and I have heard people say that he was actually murdered.

So, does anyone knows any details of what actually happend?
Also, did his entire family die in the event or did he leave back any children ?

ws
ali

#2 SoldierOfMahdi

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 10:41 AM

(salam)

Does this allam have any books i can read? Thank you in advance

(salam)

#3 Hasnain

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 11:36 AM

Salam,

As far as I know he died in a car accident. Dad told me he was quite young too.. :?

#4 vsg

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 12:50 PM

SoldierOfMahdi, I do not know of his books as such, however his majaalis are avalible on some websites (if u understand urdu that is)

Yes, what I know is that he died in a car accident, coming back to karachi from Hyderabad, he was killed along with his wife and daughter, but as I said, I have also heard people say that accident was a "cover up" and that he was indeed murdered, but i dont know the details about that, so I was hoping someone here, woud know.
Yes, I guess it is safe to say that he was quiet young, maybe in his last 40s (i guess) when he died

#5 inuit

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 01:03 PM

(salam)

Does this allam have any books i can read?  Thank you in advance

(salam)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>



One of his book is "Kafar Koun?" --> Who is Kafar?
I think this book is banned by Govt.

however i have its one copy.

#6 chingari

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 01:05 PM

he was not an allama.

wasalam.

#7 Sadaat

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 01:07 PM

I don't know about "Allama" - I don't think he had qualifications from Hawzah. He was a zakir.

#8 vsg

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 01:10 PM

^hmmm i respect your opinions (WELL NOT REALLY) but that does not have anything to do with the topic does it ?/

do me a favour, open up a dictionary and see waht the word "Allama" means, and start another thread about that, this thread has nothing to do with it

Edited by vsg, 05 February 2005 - 01:11 PM.


#9 Sadaat

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 01:11 PM

I don't want to speak ill of the dead, but I heard some bad things about his character also.

#10 ailia

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 01:26 PM

(bismillah)

(salam)

very painful to read some comments from some members about great scholar of his time.
HE is now in the blessing of allmighty Allah & MNASOOMEEN (as),so we should not say anything foolish for HIM.

& yes dear bro vsq tis was a planned car crash at all,every one know about it.
a heavy truck hit his car & allama along wit his wife blessed to martyrdom by "sipah-e-yazid.
his books are;
1]kafir koun,
2] shariet aur shieyet,
3]sirat-e-mustaqeem,

ur bro

ailia

#11 Sadaat

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 01:39 PM

Scholar or zakir?

#12 ailia

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 01:43 PM

I don't want to speak ill of the dead, but I heard some bad things about his character also.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

(bismillah)

(salam)

^^bro i m admirer of ur posts at tis fourm,but tis is is not just wat u r trying to say :blush: :blush: :blush: .

ailia

#13 Socrates

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 01:44 PM

vsg,

I also have heard that the "accident" was planned and afterwards I heard that SSP had some involvement with it. No arrests however were made as is in line with the government's policy :dry:

#14 Friend of All

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 01:46 PM

Yes, it was a car accident..Must've been planned..

#15 ailia

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 01:47 PM

^^he was a scholar by his special work.
scholars are not only those,whom came from "hoza".

ailia

#16 ailia

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 01:51 PM

^^yes tis rit.
tat was a planned car crash.

ailia

#17 chingari

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 02:08 PM

here is some statistics about car crashes in Pakistan.

The total number of registered vehicles increased 17 times between 1956 and 1996 (table 1). At the same time, there was a fivefold increase in vehicles on the road, indicative of vehicle density, and a 237% increase in the number of people/km2 (population density). During this 40 year period there was a 14-fold increase in the total number of motor vehicle crashes, while the number of deaths due to road traffic crashes increased 16 times

If he was killed by being shot or bomb blasted then we could definitely say that he was murdered. According to the statistics and knowing what kind of a zakir he was i doubt it. He was no threat to any one.

one thing can be for certain Allama Arif Hussain Hussaini was murdered. If somebody wanted to murder Irfan haider then they would not have let him survive that long.


wasalam.

#18 Sadaat

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 06:42 PM

Was he really "Allama" i.e. Aalim though?

I can understand "Allama Talib Jauhari" as he has studied in Najaf in the past.

#19 vsg

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Posted 05 February 2005 - 07:32 PM

Aalim is not an e doctrate or even a digree, so there is no such requirment .....

and to everyone else who contributed, thank a lot for the input.....

Edited by vsg, 05 February 2005 - 07:34 PM.


#20 ailia

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Posted 06 February 2005 - 03:01 AM

dr iqbal was also called an "ALLAMA."
wopuld anyone explain from which "hoza" he got tis qualication........?
& i can easly say tat shaheed irfan aabdi was an allama in history at least,& one should not compare HIM & ALLAMA HUSSAINI SHAHEED,as both were genious by their own work.

#21 akhbari

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Posted 06 February 2005 - 06:18 AM

lol @ No arrests however were made as is in line with the government's policy - gr8 one youth.

The maehoom's aqeeda was exemplified by a small fact that he never read masaib of sani e zehra sitting on the mimber.

A man of gr8 knowledge and impecceble manners.

As for the word allama - there was and only will be one allama - Hilli. Refer to the books and you will find that the word mulla has been used even for baquer manjlisi. It is rather unfortunate that when such greats like behrul uloom and sh. mufeed never refered to themselves with this word and people today are getting it by the dozens. Pity.

#22 Ali_Hashmi

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Posted 06 February 2005 - 07:49 AM

(bismillah)
(salam)

He most definitely was not a scholar. He was a zakir and one who spoke in a manner to hype up crowds. An Alim is one who consits of a rather high status of knowledge and who has studied sufficiently either at an institute or under a scholar who is well passed qualification. As for those who think that Islamic jurispudence is not a form of a degree or doctrine; they should be informed it was Imam Jaffar Sadiq (as) who had started these very institutes in which he trained and started jurispudence as a whole. Through such very institutes came scholars. Unfortunately, the barrier of knowledge has come so low that anybody who has a few points comprehended has been labeled a scholars. Pitiful is the case.

InshaAllah Khayr

Wasalaam wr

#23 ailia

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Posted 06 February 2005 - 01:40 PM

IQBAL........was allama,because he had the phD degree..................?

IRFAN shaheed was allama,because he had the L.L.B & M A[eng] degrees............?

ailia

#24 chingari

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Posted 06 February 2005 - 05:16 PM

dr iqbal was also called an "ALLAMA."
wopuld anyone explain from which "hoza" he got tis qualication........?
& i can easly say tat shaheed irfan aabdi was an allama in history at least,& one should not compare HIM & ALLAMA HUSSAINI SHAHEED,as both were genious by their own work.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Go read my post again and read it slowly this time around . If you still dont see what i am saying then read it again!!!! I hope you see what point i am making in regards to the TOPIC at hand.

Note about the word ALLAMA:

Although this has nothing to do with the topic at hand. But nevertheless i will post my thoughts on this.

The word Allama is used in a different context in URDU. In arabic it has a different meaning. I dont know what exactly it means in urdu but i am aware of what it means in arabic. so i will post it.

Allama in arabic:

If i recall correctly Allama is a title given to a person who is considered to be knowledgeable in all areas. It is considered a status higher than Ayatullah. If you look at the scholars who studied in qum or najaf very few have gained that status. Although u can find a lot of ayatullahs.

Here is a list of Allama's

Allama Tabatabai ( author of mizan)
Allama Hilli
Allamah al-Ameeni
Allamah Muhammad Taqi Ja’fari
Allamah Ayatullah al-'Uzma Sayyid Mahdi ibn Sayyid Murtada al‑Tabataba'i al-Najafi
Allamah Sayyid Muhammad Husayn Tehrani

so from what i remember correct me if i am wrong , i conclude, all allamah's are ayatullahs but not all ayatullahs are allamah.

But in urdu its more like a respect that you give out to someone. The original meaning is different then what most people think.

So technically speaking , Irfan haider was a zakir with probably exceptional public speaking skills. Irfan haider was probably not even close to any one of the above mentioned Allama's in any category of subject. Irfan haider was Not an allamah technically. Some give him respect and attach allama not knowing wat exactly it means.


Wasalam.

#25 ghulamhusain

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Posted 06 February 2005 - 05:47 PM

(salam)

theres no hard and fast rule, and the title allama is relative
in howza allama is normally used for those ulama who have a rank above the rest, and unique quality, greater ilm and hikmah. doesnt necessarily has to be a mujtahid
sometimes the a person's name becomes fixed to a title, it becomes part of his personality and his recognition, so the title sticks, such as Allama Hilli, or Sheikh Mufeed, or Mulla Mohammad Baqir Majlisi, or Shaheed-e-Thani, Shareef Murtadha etc
Sheikh Mufeed was called Al-Sheikh, it doesn't mean an alim needs to reach his status to be called Sheikh

its only in the past few centuries these titles seems to have been given arbitrary ranks

so anyway, to be an allama you gotta be an alim first ;) and be recognised to be more knowledgable than most of the ulama-e-deen

somehow i dont think the many zakir "allamas" fit this bill :)

think we sort of got carried away with the title thing, so back to the topic...
i heard from a friend close to him that he died in an accident, there was no conspiracy in this, hundreds of people die in accidents - allahu aalam

may Allah raise his darajat in the hereafter for his role in azadari and zikr-e-aale-mohammad (as)

Edited by ghulamhusain, 06 February 2005 - 05:51 PM.




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