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in south asia there are many sufi orders

4 of them are the biggest one

Naqshbandiyya

Qadiriyya

Chistiyya

Suhrawardiyya

all theyr heads are sunni , thereby sunni orders

are there any similiar shia orders in sufism?? :)

i heard the first sasanid shah were from a shia sufi order

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in south asia there are many sufi orders

4 of them are the biggest one

Naqshbandiyya

Qadiriyya

Chistiyya

Suhrawardiyya

all theyr heads are sunni , thereby sunni orders

are there any similiar shia orders in sufism?? :)

i heard the first sasanid shah were from a shia sufi order

Shias dont believe in Sufism

Sufism is more dangerous than Wahabism

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Shias dont believe in Sufism

Sufism is more dangerous than Wahabism

[edited] Oh well.....

A quick search on google reveals that there is a sufi order called Bektashiyya;

The Bektashiyya is a Shia Sufi order founded in the 13th century by Haji Bektash Veli, a dervish who escaped Central Asia and found refuge with the Seljuks in Anatolia at the time of the Mongol invasions (1219-23). This order gained a great following in rural areas and it later developed in two branches: the Celebi clan, who claimed to be physical descendants of Haci Bektas Veli, were called Bel Evladlari (children of the loins), and became the hereditary spiritual leaders of the rural Alevis; and the Babagan, those faithful to the path (yol evladlari - children of the way) who dominated the official Bektashi Sufi order with its elected leadership.

Go search the net, your bound to find something.

There is evidence that Rumi was actually shia. See this qasida that is atributted to Mawlana Rumi.

[Mods note : WARNING for swearing]

Edited by Abdulhujjah

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(bismillah)

Unfortunately some shias do follow sufism although the Imams had this to say about it.

Courtesy of a friend:

Sufism is a damned way, cursed on the tongue of every Imam. It evolved, as a result of being damned by the Imams into what has become known as Irfan.

The Imams called the Sufis, “The most wretched of Allah’s creations”, and warned people to be cautious of their exterior façade of supposed asceticism and humbleness.

The question is ‘do we need Sufism’? Do we need their ways to help us achieve or attain a greater level of spirituality?

If you answered YES to the above then you have failed the two things, which we were commanded to follow, The Quran and the Etrat, the AHLUL BAYT. Is not the legacy of their teachings enough that we need to turn to IBN ARABI, and IBN SINA, which have become the focal point of discussion when ‘searching’ for Allah (swt)?. And of all people, Ibn Arabi, who had the most extreme and most twisted version of Sufism, pantheism.

No doubt that we are in need of a guide to lead us onto the road of spirituality, and Allah (swt) has not failed us there, for he gave us the best of Guides, Prophet Mohammad and His Holy Progeny.

Imam Ali has said:

"Allah ! I do not worship You because I am afraid of Your Hell or because I hope for Your Paradise. I worship You because I have found You worthy of being worshipped."

The Imam (as) whom they attributed their ‘ways’ to, is free of their misguidance, for in the above example used in that link the Imam in no place suggests, as they do, that the veil HAD been removed from before the Almighty and its Just HIM (swt) and HIM (as), in every sense of the word. The Imam (as) in fact makes this clear in another hadeeth where he says,

“Even IF the veil is removed, it would not increase me in certitude”.

And to attain that certitude, you first need to look at the Unity of Allah, ONENESS, free of all, as the hadith says, “Allah (swt) is free (khulw) of His creations, and His creations are free (khulw) of him”, not swim in murky waters trying to achieve UNITY, and fuse with the Almighty, which is the ultimate goal of the sufis.

AHLUL BAYT AND THEIR STANCE ON SUFISM

Prophet Mohammad (sawa) in his long list of recommendations to Abu Dhar al-Ghafari said:

“O Abu Dhar, there will come a time, when a group of people will wear wool during their summer and their winter, believing that this gives them superiority over others. The Angels of the Heavens and the Earth curse them. (al-Qummi, Safinat al-Bihar Vol2 Page58)

NB: wearing of wool is synonymous with Sufism, as Suf in Arabic means wool and Sufis were known for their wearing of wool as a form of asceticism.

IMAM AS-SADIQ (as)

Sufism really began to develop during the Imamat of asSadiq (as), so much so that it was developing into a social status, in fact a ‘philosophical school of thought’ in its own right, hence the strong stance taken by Imam asSadiq against these innovators.

It is narrated that Imam asSadiq (as) when asked about a people who appeared in his time, called Sufis. He said:

“They are our ENEMIES, whomever inclines towards them is of them and he will be gathered with them (on the Day of Judgment). And there will be a people who will claim that they love us, yet they incline towards them (the Sufis), and they imitate them and entitle themselves with their (the Sufis) titles and declarations.

Verily! Whoever inclines towards them is not of us (Ahlul Bayt) and I am free (baree’e) from him, and whoever treats them with contempt and rebuts them, is like one who made jihad against the infidels with the Messenger of Allah (pbuh). (ibid)

And when the Imam (as) was asked about one of the prevalent Imams of Sufism, the Imam characterized his madhab as CORRUPTED.

Narrated Imam Al-Askari (as) who said:

“Imam as-Sadiq (as) was asked about the position of (Abu Hisham al-Kufi). The Imam (as) said: Indeed his doctrine is corrupted, and he is the innovator of a school of thought called Sufism, and rendered it the ‘headquarters’ for his EVIL doctrine, and in it increased in apostasy and (became) a protection for their false doctrines. (ibid)

NB:

Clear disapproval by Imam asSadiq (as) for the Sufi way, because it was clear to the Imam that the Sufis would make an attempt at justifying their corrupted beliefs using the Imams as the authorive source of these beliefs. Therefore we see the Imam clearly stating that he is ‘FREE OF THEM’. Which negates the corrupted beliefs of all who try to form or claim that the Imams (as) had a connection with Sufism

IMAM AL-REDHA (as)

Imam al-Redha (as) said:

“There is not one who professes Sufism but only for reason of deception, misguidance and foolishness” (ibid)

It is narrated that a group of Sufis came to Khorasan to Imam al-Redha (as) and said to him: ‘The Prince of the Faithful thought about Allah’s guardianship to him in all affairs, and he found you the most worthy of being Imams over the people. He then looked at You (Ahlul Bayt) and found you the most worthy of the people for the people, and deemed that this affair should return to you, and the Imamat requires one who eats ‘wood’ (dry and hard substances), and wears coarse garments, and rides a donkey and visits the sick.

Imam al-Redha answered them:

“Yousef (as) was a prophet who wore silk garments and (as) sat on the cushions of Pharoah and ruled. What is needed from an Imam is his equivalence and Justice, and if he speaks, he tells the truth; and if he rules he is equitable; and if he pledges, he fulfills. Allah (swt) does not forbid attire or (any) nourishment. The Imam then recited the following verse, “Say: Who has prohibited the embellishment of Allah which He has brought forth for His servants and the good provisions?” (ibid)

IMAM AL-HADI (as)

It is narrated that Imam al-Hadi(as) was in the Prophet’s Mosque, whereupon a group of his companions came to him, followed after by a group of Sufis, who came and sat in a circle in a corner of the Mosque and then began to glorify (hail).

The Imam said to them, ‘Do no turn and look at those deceivers for they are SATANS, who have destroyed the fundamentals of the religion. They practice asceticism to comfort their bodies and they keep religious vigil to ‘catch the sheep’ (make a show and gain supporters). They forever go hungry to loosen (………..). They do not praise (hail) except in vanity, and they do not limit their sustenance except to prevent (…..) and to ‘peculate’ the heart of the ignorant. They talk in their speeches of love and with their proofs they hurl them into the pits. Their ‘watering place’ is dance and confrontation, and their praises are chanting and singing. None but the FOOLISH follow them, and none but the IGNORANT believes in them. And whomever goes to visit any of them ALIVE or DEAL, it is as if he has aided YAZID, MUWAIWIYAH and ABU SUFYAN.

A man from his companions then said, ‘Even though he acknowledge your (Ahlul Bayt’s) Rights?”

The Imam looked at him in a somewhat angry manner and said:

“Enough of that! For whoever acknowledges our rights, does not consort to disobedience of us. Do you not know that they are the most ignoble of the sects of this Ummah? They are ones that strive to extinguish the Light of Allah, and Allah will not consent save to perfect His light, though the unbelievers are averse.”

IMAM AL-ASKARI

It is narrated that Imam al-Askari said to Abu Hisham al-Ju’fi:

“O Abu Hisham! There will come a time where people’s faces are laughing and joyous, their hearts dark and indeterminate. The Sunnah amongst them is innovation and the innovation Sunnah. The believer amongst them is demeaned and the evil one venerated. Their rules are oppressive and their scholars through the doors of darkness proceed. Their wealthy pillage the provision of their poor. Their young precede their old, and every ignorant to them is an authority, and every assignee (I think trustees of treasury) to them is poor. They do not differentiate between the sincere and the doubtful, nor do they know the sheep from wolves. Their scholars are THE MOST EVIL OF GOD’S CREATION ON THE FACE OF EARTH, because they INCLINE TOWARDS PHILOSOPHY AND SUFISM.

By Allah! They are of the ENEMIES and people of DISTORTION. They exaggerate in their love for our opponents and they misguide our Shia and Followers.” (ibid)

THE FAITHFUL SCHOLARS AND SUFISM

And on the same path of the Imams from Ahlul bait, the faithful scholars preceded in destroying any status or threshold of Sufism. Amongst our greatest scholars being Al-Hur al-Ameli and Al-Ardabeeli and Al-Majlisi.

Al-Hur al-Ameli was amongst the first of those whom set about proving that there is no connection in Shia Ithna Asheri School of thought with Sufism. In his book, “Al-Ithna Ahariya fi al-radd ala alsufiya” (Ithna-Aheris rebuttal of Sufism), he narrates close to 1000 hadeeths rebutting and exposing the contradictions in their beliefs from that of the Shia Ithna-Asheris.

Then there was the likes of Al-Allamah al-Majlisi Mohammad Baqir bin Taqi who continued his work and in his path. Al-Majlisi refused to meet with ‘Sayf alHukm’ who was from the Sufis.

He, al-Majlisi was then summoned by Shah Hussain, who wished for him to assume that post, as a favour to him. Al-Shah Hussain asked al-Majlisi what do you want in return for this favour. Al-Majlisi requested that there be no alcohol or fighting or playing around in the bathes.

Shah then ordered that the requests of Al-Majlisi be met, and also as per the request of Al-Majlisi ALL SUFIS WERE BANISHED FROM ISFAHAN and any dhikr sessions exclusive to the Sufis was prohibited, and in fact anything that had any connection with Sufism.

And from there Al-Sheikh Al-Majlisi embarked on the strong stance against the Sufis, practically and intellectually, and issued his fatwas declaring Sufis apostates and authored his book “Ayn al-Hayat”, in which he declared his position on Sufism and its adherents and the reasons for his stance against them.

And then there was al-Muqad’dis al-Ardabeeli who authored the book “hadeeqat al-Shia fe al-radd ala al-Sufiyah”, in which he categorized their madhab into three, Hululiyah (pantheism), ihaad’iy’a (Unity), Ushaaqiy’a (Adorement), and then proceeded in giving the stance of Ahlul Bayt (as) and the righteous scholars from Sufism.

Of the scholars of The City of Qum to oppose Sufism was Ayatollah Al-Sayed Shihaab al-Deen al-Najafi Al-Mar-ashi, who authored his book ‘ihqaaq al-haqq” (Enforcement of Truth). He regards the scourge of Sufism as of the GREATEST ADVERSITIES WHICH HAS BEEN THE CAUSE IN THE RUINATION OF THE PILLARS OF ISLAM.

IMAM ALI (as)

Asceticism of Imam Ali (as) was cognizance of Allah (swt) and Thankfulness to HIM, and abstinence from the forbidden and patience in times of adversity and obedience to Allah (swt), not desisting and abstaining from what Allah has deemed permissible of the good things for that would be complete contradiction of the Quran in which Allah (swt) says:

O you who believe! Do not forbid (yourselves) the good things which Allah has made lawful for you and do not exceed the limits; surely Allah does not love those who exceed the limits. [Al-Ma'idah 5:87]

Nahjul Balaghah

Sermon 207 --- On seeing the vastness of the house of Ala bin Zaid Harisi

Ameerul Momineen went to esquire about the health of his companion Ala ibn Ziyad al-Harisi and when he noticed the vastness of his house he said:

What will you do with this vast house in this world, although you need this house more in the next world? If you want to take it to the next world you could entertain in it guests and be regardful of kinship and discharge all (your) obligations according to their accrual. In this way you will be able to take it to the next world.

Then al-Ala said to him: O' Ameerul Momineen, I want to complain to you about my brother `Asim ibn Ziyad. Ameerul Momineen enquired:

What is the matter with him?

al-`Ala' said: He has put on a woolen coat and cut himself away from the world. Ameerul Momineen said:

Present him to me.

When he came Ameerul Momineen said:

O' enemy of yourself. Certainly, the evil (Satan) has misguided you. Do you feel no pity for your wife and your children? Do you believe that if you use those things, which Allah has made lawful for you, He will dislike you? You are too unimportant for Allah to do so.

He said: "O' Ameerul Momineen, I am following your example. Look at your dress, how course, rough and cheap it is even the poorest of us would not care to wear it. Look at your food, it is dry and stale bread." Then Imam Ali (as) replied:

Woe to you, I am not like you. Certainly, Allah, the Sublime, has made it obligatory on true leaders that they should maintain themselves at the level of low people so that the poor do not cry over their poverty.

Saying 431

The whole of asceticism is confined between two expressions of Quran. Allah the Glorified says:

"...lest distress you yourselves for what escapes you, and be overjoyous for what He has granted you.." (Quran, 57:23)

Whoever does not grieve over what he misses and does not revel over what comes to him acquires asceticism from both its sides.

ًWassalaam

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i dont find wahabis dangerous

neither do i find shia dangerous

and why the hell would sufis be dangerous???

THE SAME SUFI ORDERS AND THEYR LEADERS ARE FROM THE AHLE BAIT. and yo uclaim to respect the ahle bait then?

there is sufi orders i know it, and shia follow them

imam bari sarkar in pakistan, mazaar e sharif in afghanistan have sufi shia orders.

the ayatollahs of shias forbade them , couse sufi orders have family traditions of following the prophets message and are from the household, while the ayatollahs have to work theymself up to theyr power, the sufi orders can inherit theyr seat.

it is a political game

just give me a complete list and history of shia sufi orders

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the first shah of iran who made iran a shia state

Ismail the first

from house of Safiuddin, made the empire

he were sayd to be the follower of a shia sufi saint

The one who give priority to Hazrat Ali over other threes is not shia.

The one who say ya Ali madad is not a shia

believing in Ahle Bait(AS) with the believe in other Munafiqeen and Tolaqaa is not shiite.

IF this see them from one side they will look like shia, all of the saints in Pakistan looks like shias but at the same time they believe in the purity of Sahaba also. which conflicts with the concepts of Shias. that is why their is no such kind mix-up in Shiite.

No any Sufi is Shia.

If one is Shia; with all his shia beliefs it means he is not a Sufi. He give priority to Imams of Ahle Bait(AS) rather than some other Sufi order.

Edited by inuit

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Did Hazrat Yusuf (as) really wear silk? Isn't it forbidden for men to wear silk?

Did Prophet Mohammad pbuh actually forbid it, or is that just some Wahhabi nonsense? And what about not wearing red, orange, or yellow? Are those colors haraam?

And why would one of the 12 Imams tell anybody to treat others with contempt? Islam commands us to treat others with kindness regardsless of their faith. Is that a reliable hadith?

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Guest Toreador

(salam)

here's a book i found in our library.

something to consider for those who claim shias think sufism is evil.

Kernel of the kernel : concerning the wayfaring and spiritual journey of the people of intellect : a Sh'̄ ̄approach to Sufism : (Risāla-yi Lubb al-lubāb dar sayr wa sulūk-i ulu'l-albāB) / from the teachings of Sayyid Muhammad Husayn Tabātabāʾī ; compiled, edited and expanded by Sayyid Muhammad Husayn Husaynī Tihrānī ; translated by Mohammad H. Faghfoory ; foreword by Seyyed Hossein Nasr.

wasalam

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The Shia were starting to spread Shiaism around the world. However they were overpowered by the Sufis.

During the 10th and 11th centuries, Shia Islam had a large following throughout the Middle East, but the spread of the popular mystical movement known as Sufism seems to have greatly diminished its strength. Today Shiites are in the majority in Iran, and large numbers are found in Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, India, Pakistan, and parts of Central Asia.

http://mb-soft.com/believe/txo/shiites.htm

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(salam)

here's a book i found in our library.

something to consider for those who claim shias think sufism is evil.

Kernel of the kernel : concerning the wayfaring and spiritual journey of the people of intellect : a Sh'̄ ̄approach to Sufism : (Risāla-yi Lubb al-lubāb dar sayr wa sulūk-i ulu'l-albāB) / from the teachings of Sayyid Muhammad Husayn Tabātabāʾī ; compiled, edited and expanded by Sayyid Muhammad Husayn Husaynī Tihrānī ; translated by Mohammad H. Faghfoory ; foreword by Seyyed Hossein Nasr.

wasalam

(bismillah)

This book you have suggested is written by a mystic to justify mysticism, I might as well read a book by Donald Rumsfeld to justify the attacks on Iraq.

Wassalaam

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Bektashi is a shia version of sufism in Turkey.

Nimatullahi is a shia version of sufism in Iran.

Also many shia scholars who are not neccesarily associated with any sufi order encourage Irfan, eg Syed Khomeni who was a great Areef.

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the first shah of iran who made iran a shia state

Ismail the first

from house of Safiuddin, made the empire

he were sayd to be the follower of a shia sufi saint

The one who give priority to Hazrat Ali over other threes is not shia.

The one who say ya Ali madad is not a shia

believing in Ahle Bait(AS) with the believe in other Munafiqeen and Tolaqaa is not shiite.

IF this see them from one side they will look like shia, all of the saints in Pakistan looks like shias but at the same time they believe in the purity of Sahaba also. which conflicts with the concepts of Shias. that is why their is no such kind mix-up in Shiite.

No any Sufi is Shia.

If one is Shia; with all his shia beliefs it means he is not a Sufi. He give priority to Imams of Ahle Bait(AS) rather than some other Sufi order.

You are a joke.

You cant even be the dust on Shah Ismail Safavis shoes.

It was him who started the publicy Tabarra after Juma prayers on the 3 "caliphs" , so NO HE DOES NOT BELIVE IN THE PURITY OF "SAHABA."

But some Sahaba are pure, like Salman al-farisi, who was given the title of Pak!

Be shia sufis namely Bektashi and Nimatullahi belive in Usool Deen and Furo Deen.

Edited by MTV

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werent the imams talking about the sunni sufis, not the shia-ish ones? i dont find sufis a threat at all, i know plenty. what do they do that is such a threat to shiaism?

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bro i dont have a clue what they are. i dont even think they know what they are. when i ask them they say "ali ko mannan walay" and leave it at that.

they spend all day doing tasbeeh of "ya huwwa" or surah al hamd or surah yaseen. a few play the sitar as well for some reason, something to do with the sound it makes. it was them that taught me the lines "damma dum mast qalandar, sakhi shahbaz qalandar, ali dha pehla nambar, bakee teeno kanjar" so im sure theyre not naqshabandi etc. i cant say more than that, other than all this rubbish that they are such a major threat to shiaism by members here is nonsense. i cant remember any sufi related massacres of shias through history, maybe a member can post a few links?

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