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Sheikh Abdul Qadir Jilani was not SYED


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#1 The Venerator of Ali

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Posted 10 June 2004 - 05:38 AM

www.sunnirazvi.org/forum/read.php?f=15&t=8&a=2 - 77k

It is quite ironic that there is no GENEOLOGICAL shajra of Sheikh Abdul Qadir Jilani

on this website. It would be a challenge! Reason: He was not a descendant of the

prophet as beleived by the people who run this website. I would like the

webmasters to post an ACCURATE FAMILY TREE of sheikh abdul qadir jilani that links

him to Imam Al Husayn and Imam Al Hassan [as claimed] both from father and mothers's

side. Readers: You will never see such shajras on websites normally nor in many

books on sheikh abdul qadir jilani because firstly there exists no such shajra and

secondly a few disputed ones that occur in books written in parts of pakistan and

india are so much full of errors that anyone who has studied the basic histories of

the imams [like imam ali reza a.s of mashhad, imam musa al kazhem a.s etc] and their

imamzadas, will immediatly find that they are false and totally oppose the facts

laid out in the greatest ahl ul sunna books. These shajras mention daughters and

sons of the first 12 imams THAT NEVER existed nor were born! [according to the

consensus of ulemas]. No wonder that no early imams of shajra ansaabs recorded or

accepted that sheikh abdul qadir jilani was a syed. Similarly no wonder that the

pious sheikh himself never claimed any such thing!

I have nothing personal against Sheikh Abdul Qadir Jilani or any member of any sect,

school of thought or cult. However i wish to bring to light, with credible and

authentic references some information which reinforces the fact well known to

learned scholars of all schools of thought that Sheikh Abdul Qadir Jilani, a pious

scholar, was a scholar but DEFINITELY not a Syed or physical descendant of prophet

Mohammad .

Instead of making lies, abuse or any unhealthy talk, i would rather talk with

references from the books of the well known scholars of Ahl Ul Sunnah wal Jamaah.

It is an indisputable fact that although Sheikh Abdul Qadir Jilani was a god fearing

pious man, he was NEVER a physical descendant of the Prophet of Islam through

neither Imam Hassan a.s nor Imam Hussain a.s

I notice that some emotionally charged brothers and sisters resort to abuse and

slander when presented with any information that is only intended to be shared on a

scholasitc level. Such individuals should learn to tolerate, coexist and have a

heart to listen to others as well. The knowledge of Ocean is not restricted to

anyone individual.

References from the most reputed Sunni Books that outrightly reject the widespread

subcontinent-india-pakistan rumor that sheikh abdul qadir jilani was a hassani and

hussaini syed, are below:

1) Imam Al ansab Ahmed Bin Ali Bin Al Hussain bin Ali Mahanna writes in his book

'Umdat al Talib' [page 112, delhi print] that:

'Himself Sheikh Abdul Qadir never claimed that he was a SYED/Descendant of prophet

of mohammad through Al Hassan or Hussain NOR did his sons make this claim. However,

this invention was made by his grandson Qazi Abu Salih Nasar Bin Abi Bakar bin Abdul

Qadir. However, during his period he remained unable to prove his claim to any

expert of shajra ansaab of sa'daats of his time and thus his claim was rejected by

the ulema. This was the sole reason why ahl us sunnah and other scholars rejected

this claim without any doubt.


2) Allama Dorran Syed Ahmed bin Mohammad Al Husseini writes in the family tree book

'Shajrat ul Awlia' that:

"All ulama-e-ansaab have clearly and openly rejected the Syedship of Sheikh Abdul

Qadir Jilani, i.e, he was not a hassani or hussaini syed as claimed by some people.

Also, no ulema of ansaab of his time or his sons time have recorded him as SYED or

descendant of prophet and nor did he claim this himself. Nobody in his life time

called or thought of him as a SYED either [i.e no ulema]. they only referred to him

as sheikh or respectable guide but not descendant of prophet . The first such

false claim [ana awwal min azhar haazahi id da'waa al baatila hooa nasar ibn abi

bakar bin sheikh abdul qadir] was made by his grandson nasar bin abi bakar bin

sheikh abdul qadir. He failed to prove this claim to any ulema of ansab.

3)Risala e Sufi which is published from 'Basar Parasti Khwaja Hassan Nizami Mandi

Bahawuddin, Zila Gujrat' writes in its ISSUE no 3. and page no 6:

"Sayyom Peer e Tareeqat is Hadrat Khwaja Mohiyuddin Abdul Qadir Jilani. His Silsila

e Nasab [family tree] is from the second caliph OMAR ibn Al Khattab al Farooq and

thus he is a descendant of Hadrat Omar Farooq"

4) Dr. Seyyed Tijjani Samouwi, a once devout follower of sheikh abdul qader jilani,

writes in his book 'Summa Ihtidiyat' [Then i was guided] after years of research

that:

"from most reliable sources of ansaab and history, it is evident that sheikh abdul

qadir jilani was not a Descendant of the Prophet of Islam through any chain or any

of his grandsons and he never claimed any such link and only unfortunatley people

from Pakistan and India fabricated such claims and published such erroneous and

highly controversial shajra nasabs attributing him as hassani and hussaini syed. The

qadri silsila is also attributed to him although it never existed during the

lifetime of this saint"


I hope this information, taken from the most reliable books, journals and names of

history of islam will suffice to say that i have tried to make a genuine

contribution to seekers of truth. Note: Respect for all faiths, all ulemas and all

people is wajib as an article of faith in every school of thought. This article is

only meant to serve as a step forward into research of history and nothing

derogratory towards any sect, cult or personality. It is hoped that this shall be

taken in good faith by those who genuinely seek to research on matters of such great

importance.


May Allah protect us from attributing false hadiths, false shajras/family links or

false connections of ourselves or anyone else to the Final Prophet, the Habib

Allah, Abu Qasim Mohammad . May Allah also guide all those who are in darkness

into the realm of light and truth and save us from following falsehood in pride,

arrogance or blind inherited belief.

#2 Balaji

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Posted 14 July 2004 - 08:08 AM

Are you a syed?

Syeds are those who deserve to be as such.

I am a hindu syed. :)

#3 Baatil Ka Kaatil

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Posted 14 July 2004 - 08:09 AM

Are you a syed?

Syeds are those who deserve to be as such.

I am a hindu syed. :)

:squeez: :unsure:

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Posted 14 July 2004 - 08:51 AM

he's just somebody itching to get banned

#5 AL JAWAB

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Posted 15 July 2004 - 02:47 AM

Sallam
Although i think he said right that he is hindu syed as syed is title of a nobal family and hindu (its actual meaning) are those who used to live in India.
Since he is hindu but he will not be Virantist

Sallam

#6 Balaji

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Posted 15 July 2004 - 03:20 AM

he's just somebody itching to get banned


You talking abt me ? :huh:

#7 Taair-al-Quds

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Posted 27 July 2004 - 11:54 PM

The Venerator of Ali,

That post on Sunni Razvi website was posted by me. They had no legitimate answer to it. I discussed this issue in great deal with a Qadri sunni on our site http://groups.msn.com/shiaofahlulbayt as well and as usual instead of facing the truth he started calling bad things to shia and their ulama. This is the typical behavior you get in return. The sunnirazvi website had no answer to my challenge either. I posted this message on other sunni sites as well. They all remained silent! Silence speaks for itself!

#8 View-Point

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Posted 28 July 2004 - 12:02 AM

Salaam

So it's your site? :) I am member of it. As you can see, The Venerator of Ali, has been banned :rolleyes:

And yeah, Abdul Qadir sahab was not a sayyid.

#9 AL JAWAB

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Posted 28 July 2004 - 05:27 AM

Sallam
You people are much more educated than me, and your knowledge is quite vast.
All I can say that it could be one of the controversial historical matters in which shia scholars have different point of view.
I read book of Ayatullah Mutahari in which respected teacher wrote that Abdul Qadir Jillani was a controversial personality and descendent of Imam Hassan (without giving Ref. So no one knows that did he quoted sunni sources or not).
Where as in book “ Chouda Sittarey (14 Stars) “ by Allama Najmul Hassan Kararvi, it is written that Sheikh Abdul Qadir Jillani was not Syed, and he never claimed it, where as his nephew or some one from his family did claim it without any authentic evidence that is why his claim was rejected.

@)

#10 GHULAAM E ABBAS

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Posted 29 July 2004 - 05:27 PM

this is a very intresting topic.......

i had asked many sunnies to provide a shajra of abdul qadir but never got one.
now what i figure out with my research that he was not a syed
he was a iranian person from town of jilan. in order to be a syed u have to have arabic.
but when we talk about jilani syeds, there are some naqvi saddat who migrate to jilan are called them selves jilani too

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Posted 30 July 2004 - 07:12 AM

this is a very intresting topic.......

i had asked many sunnies to provide a shajra of abdul qadir but never got one.
now what i figure out with my research that he was not a syed
he was a iranian person from town of jilan. in order to be a syed u have to have arabic.
but when we talk about jilani syeds, there are some naqvi saddat who migrate to jilan are called them selves jilani too

I never knew that. Its funny Shia's main country is in Iran. I guess most of u guys are not syeds. And i suppose the Wahabis are the true arabs of this century :!!!: . THe name Jillani was given to his because he was from Jillan. Just like Hazrat Juniad Baghdadi. He was given that name b/c he was born there.

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Posted 30 July 2004 - 07:14 AM

this is a very intresting topic.......

i had asked many sunnies to provide a shajra of abdul qadir but never got one.
now what i figure out with my research that he was not a syed
he was a iranian person from town of jilan. in order to be a syed u have to have arabic.
but when we talk about jilani syeds, there are some naqvi saddat who migrate to jilan are called them selves jilani too

That's b/c u just like to ignore it.
SAIYED-US-SADAT QUTUB-UL-WUJOOD, RAIS-UL-MAHBOOBEEN, QUTB-UL-AQTAB, GHAUS-US-AZAM AL-SAIYED AL-SHEIKH, ABDUL QADIR GILLANI,

Son of Al Saiyed Abu Saleh Musa Jangi Dos,

Son of Al Saiyed Abdullah Al-Jiyeli,

Son of Al Saiyed Yahya Al-Zahid,

Son of Al Saiyed Muhammad,

Son of Al Saiyed Dawood,

Son of Al Saiyed Musa,

Son of Al Saiyed Abdullah,

Son of Al Saiyed Mussa-Ul-Jown,

Son of Al Saiyed Abdullah Al-Hehadh,

Son of Al Saiyed Hassan Massna.

Son of Al Saiyed Amir-al-Momeneen Asad—Ullah—Hill-Ghalib Hazrat Imran Ali

Son of Abi Talib Son of Abdul Mutalib,

Son of Hashim Son of Abdul Munaf

Son of Qassa Son of Kulab

Son of Marrah Son of Kaab,

Son of Lavee Son of Ghalib,

Son of Father Son of Malik

Son of Nazdar Son of Kanana,

Son of Khazima Son of Madrake,

Son of Aliyas Son of Muzdar,

Son of Nazaar Son of Maad,

Son of Adenan Son of Owo,

Son of Own Son of Hameesaa,

Son of Jumal Son of Nibt,

Son of Kezar Son of Ismail Zahib Ulla,

Son of HAZRAT IBRAHIM KHALIL ULLAH

Son of Torah Son of Qasir,

Son of Sharigh Son of Arghoot,

Son of Faligh Son of Shalikh,

Son of Keenan Son of Arfakhshad,

Son of Samm Son of Hazrat Huh Alehis Salam,

Son of Yardd Son of Idris,

Son of Mehmaial Son of Keenan,

Son of Anosh Son of Sheeth,

Abu-l Bashir (Father of Mankind) Hazrat Adam Safi-Allah, who was created from Dust, dust from Earth; Earth from Foam, foam from Waves, Omnipotence, which from WILL, and WILL from the Infinite Knowledge of Allah.

#13 GHULAAM E ABBAS

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Posted 30 July 2004 - 08:29 AM

you got a athenticated refrence??


i know iran is a shia country but beging syed has nothing to do iran as shia country.

#14 Guest_Sufi_*

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Posted 30 July 2004 - 09:35 AM

you got a athenticated refrence??


i know iran is a shia country but beging syed has nothing to do iran as shia country.

of course its authentic. This is accepted by all the Sufi/Sunni.
Look at the contradiction here!

he was a iranian person from town of jilan. in order to be a syed u have to have arabic.


Edited by Sufi, 30 July 2004 - 09:36 AM.


#15 vsg

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Posted 30 July 2004 - 10:00 AM

who is true syed and who is not is always going to be a question mark these days (for obvious reasons) how many syeds on this fourm can provide their own "100% authentic shajra" of being syed ????????
My point is that if a big number of sunnis and sufis see him as Syed, we should respect their believe, as only God knows the truth and its upto him to deciede not us

#16 GHULAAM E ABBAS

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Posted 30 July 2004 - 12:50 PM

you got a athenticated refrence??


i know iran is a shia country but beging syed has nothing to do iran as shia country.

of course its authentic. This is accepted by all the Sufi/Sunni.
Look at the contradiction here!

he was a iranian person from town of jilan. in order to be a syed u have to have arabic.

what you are trying to quote my sentence
my stand will remain same.

and a think accepted by all sunni and sufi do not make is trustable.

#17 Guest_Sufi_*

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Posted 30 July 2004 - 02:50 PM

you got a athenticated refrence??


i know iran is a shia country but beging syed has nothing to do iran as shia country.

of course its authentic. This is accepted by all the Sufi/Sunni.
Look at the contradiction here!

he was a iranian person from town of jilan. in order to be a syed u have to have arabic.

what you are trying to quote my sentence
my stand will remain same.

and a think accepted by all sunni and sufi do not make is trustable.

Indeed ur stand will remain into a contradiction. So u have to worry about what is reliable or what is not.

#18 inuit

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Posted 30 July 2004 - 04:09 PM

you got a athenticated refrence??


i know iran is a shia country but beging syed has nothing to do iran as shia country.

of course its authentic. This is accepted by all the Sufi/Sunni.
Look at the contradiction here!

he was a iranian person from town of jilan. in order to be a syed u have to have arabic.

what you are trying to quote my sentence
my stand will remain same.

and a think accepted by all sunni and sufi do not make is trustable.

Indeed ur stand will remain into a contradiction. So u have to worry about what is reliable or what is not.

Sheikh bhi aur Syed bhi
have you seen Syed bhi and Khan bhi like Sir Syed Ahmad Khan

#19 Guest_Sufi_*

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Posted 30 July 2004 - 04:26 PM

you got a athenticated refrence??


i know iran is a shia country but beging syed has nothing to do iran as shia country.

of course its authentic. This is accepted by all the Sufi/Sunni.
Look at the contradiction here!

he was a iranian person from town of jilan. in order to be a syed u have to have arabic.

what you are trying to quote my sentence
my stand will remain same.

and a think accepted by all sunni and sufi do not make is trustable.

Indeed ur stand will remain into a contradiction. So u have to worry about what is reliable or what is not.

Sheikh bhi aur Syed bhi
have you seen Syed bhi and Khan bhi like Sir Syed Ahmad Khan

Bhai shiekh is not a last name. Sheikh means scholar.

#20 inuit

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Posted 30 July 2004 - 05:25 PM

Bhai shiekh is not a last name. Sheikh means scholar.

In Iran and Iraq Sheikh used with a person who is non-syed

Did Sheikh Abdul Qadir Jilani himself ever claim that he is syed; any of his own book or saying? It was his grandson who for the first time made him Syed. I mean claimed for him that he is Syed.

#21 inuit

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Posted 30 July 2004 - 05:32 PM

Son of Kezar Son of Ismail Zahib Ulla,

Son of HAZRAT IBRAHIM KHALIL ULLAH

Son of Torah Son of Qasir,

Thanks you agree that the Name of father of HAZRAT IBRAHIM KHALIL ULLAH is
Torah Son of Qasir NOT like other Sunnies who say that name of his father was Azar who was KAFAR and they quote a Quranic verse which DOES NOT show that Azar was a biological father of HAZRAT IBRAHIM KHALIL ULLAH. I really appreciate. :P

#22 inuit

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Posted 30 July 2004 - 05:43 PM

Son of HAZRAT IBRAHIM KHALIL ULLAH

Son of Torah Son of Qasir,

Son of Sharigh Son of Arghoot,

Son of Faligh Son of Shalikh,

Son of Keenan Son of Arfakhshad,

Son of Samm Son of Hazrat Huh Alehis Salam,

Son of Yardd Son of Idris,

Son of Mehmaial Son of Keenan,

Son of Anosh Son of Sheeth,

Abu-l Bashir (Father of Mankind) Hazrat Adam Safi-Allah, who was created from Dust, dust from Earth; Earth from Foam, foam from Waves, Omnipotence, which from WILL, and WILL from the Infinite Knowledge of Allah.

But dear Sufi i could not find Prophet Nuh(AS) [Noah] in this shajra of abdul qadir Is'nt it interesting.

It means it can be wrong. am i right?

#23 Guest_Sufi_*

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 12:06 AM

Bhai shiekh is not a last name. Sheikh means scholar.

In Iran and Iraq Sheikh used with a person who is non-syed

Did Sheikh Abdul Qadir Jilani himself ever claim that he is syed; any of his own book or saying? It was his grandson who for the first time made him Syed. I mean claimed for him that he is Syed.

That shia believes dude. Shiekh means scholar. Sheikh Abdul Qadir al Jillani was known for his gold chain. His father was from Imam Hussan(r.a) and his mother was from Imam Hussian(r.a)

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 12:07 AM

Son of Kezar Son of Ismail Zahib Ulla,

Son of HAZRAT IBRAHIM KHALIL ULLAH

Son of Torah Son of Qasir,

Thanks you agree that the Name of father of HAZRAT IBRAHIM KHALIL ULLAH is
Torah Son of Qasir NOT like other Sunnies who say that name of his father was Azar who was KAFAR and they quote a Quranic verse which DOES NOT show that Azar was a biological father of HAZRAT IBRAHIM KHALIL ULLAH. I really appreciate. :P

No problem buddy. I even believe that Hazrat Abu Talib(r.a) accepted Islam.

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Posted 31 July 2004 - 12:21 AM

Son of HAZRAT IBRAHIM KHALIL ULLAH

Son of Torah Son of Qasir,

Son of Sharigh Son of Arghoot,

Son of Faligh Son of Shalikh,

Son of Keenan Son of Arfakhshad,

Son of Samm Son of Hazrat Huh Alehis Salam,

Son of Yardd Son of Idris,

Son of Mehmaial Son of Keenan,

Son of Anosh Son of Sheeth,

Abu-l Bashir (Father of Mankind) Hazrat Adam Safi-Allah, who was created from Dust, dust from Earth; Earth from Foam, foam from Waves, Omnipotence, which from WILL, and WILL from the Infinite Knowledge of Allah.
But dear Sufi i could not find Prophet Nuh(AS) [Noah] in this shajra of abdul qadir Is'nt it interesting.

It means it can be wrong. am i right?

:!!!: There is a typo It suppose to be Hazrat Nuh(a.s). The site belongs to my friend i will tell him to fix it.

Edited by Sufi, 31 July 2004 - 12:23 AM.




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