Jump to content
Guest Account Ali

Are there any Mutah networks?

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

Salaam,

So recently I have been seing some posts about muslims struggling with their desires. And of course the sunnah advises us to reccomend temporary marriage. And many members here then rightfully advise mutah. However, I think one of the biggest hurdles to doing Mutah is finding and then convincing a woman to do Mutah with. However, I was curious to know if there was either an online or offline "Mutah network" that function similarly to marriage networks and take the guessing game  out of temporary marriage. Perhaps we should pin this discussion so we can redirect others who struggle with their desires to proper resources. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Guest Account Ali said:

However, I think one of the biggest hurdles to doing Mutah is finding and then convincing a woman to do Mutah with. However, I was curious to know if there was either an online or offline "Mutah network" that function similarly to marriage networks and take the guessing game  out of temporary marriage. Perhaps we should pin this discussion so we can redirect others who struggle with their desires to proper resources. 

Nikah, whether temporary or permanent, is not just a mean of rightfully fulfilling the sexual requirements & urges. The important point in them is that the male partner have to bear the responsibility & has to do the justice. For instance, the responsibility of sustenance/food, clothing etc. The responsibility of becoming biological father and then the responsibility of the offspring etc. 

Its not just sex. Its responsibility everywhere.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think men should enter a mutah agreement with an intention of marrying. Yeah, fulfilling sexual desires is fine but there should also be at least some sort of vision, as in where they wanna to go from here.

Also we should enter a mutah agreement if we truly love our partner, well at least if we see some sort of compatability. I don't agree with this idea that we should just do mutah with anyone just for the sake of having sex - this is pretty sad imo. Also, I feel having sexual relations with someone you truly love is much more meaningful and better than with someone who hasn't even formed an emotional bond with you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

Nikah, whether temporary or permanent, is not just a mean of rightfully fulfilling the sexual requirements & urges. The important point in them is that the male partner have to bear the responsibility & has to do the justice. For instance, the responsibility of sustenance/food, clothing etc. The responsibility of becoming biological father and then the responsibility of the offspring etc. 

Its not just sex. Its responsibility everywhere.  

A woman in mut'ah is not entitled to subsistence according to Sayyed Al-Sistani.

Issue 2433: A woman with whom temporary marriage is contracted, is not entitled to subsistence even if she becomes pregnant.

https://www.al-islam.org/islamic-laws-ayatullah-ali-al-husayni-al-sistani/marriage-part-ii-ii#mutah-temporary-marriage

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/20/2018 at 7:34 AM, ali_fatheroforphans said:

I think men should enter a mutah agreement with an intention of marrying. Yeah, fulfilling sexual desires is fine but there should also be at least some sort of vision, as in where they wanna to go from here.

Also we should enter a mutah agreement if we truly love our partner, well at least if we see some sort of compatability. I don't agree with this idea that we should just do mutah with anyone just for the sake of having sex - this is pretty sad imo. Also, I feel having sexual relations with someone you truly love is much more meaningful and better than with someone who hasn't even formed an emotional bond with you.

Not all men have it the same way. Sometimes it is wajib on a man to get married just so he can stop committing haram, not because he wants to love someone, and in that case it is different.

In fact, this may be the case with most males in the West as far as I can tell.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/20/2018 at 7:59 AM, Sumerian said:

A woman in mut'ah is not entitled to subsistence according to Sayyed Al-Sistani.

Issue 2433: A woman with whom temporary marriage is contracted, is not entitled to subsistence even if she becomes pregnant.

https://www.al-islam.org/islamic-laws-ayatullah-ali-al-husayni-al-sistani/marriage-part-ii-ii#mutah-temporary-marriage

I know of this ruling, but it bothers me. The child has a right to be supported by its father, even before he or she is born, and the only way to ensure the health and safety of the child in the womb is to provide for at least the basic needs of the mother. 

But a man with integrity will care for his child regardless of the law, and a man without integrity will not, regardless of the law. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, notme said:

I know of this ruling, but it bothers me. The child has a right to be supported by its father, even before he or she is born, and the only way to ensure the health and safety of the child in the womb is to provide for at least the basic needs of the mother. 

But a man with integrity will care for his child regardless of the law, and a man without integrity will not, regardless of the law. 

Yessss. You said exactly what I always thought. I am sure there is something wrong with this ruling. What if a woman falls pregnant and doesn't have the means to support herself? This ruling gives the man the right to abandon the woman who is carrying his child. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, notme said:

I know of this ruling, but it bothers me. The child has a right to be supported by its father, even before he or she is born, and the only way to ensure the health and safety of the child in the womb is to provide for at least the basic needs of the mother. 

But a man with integrity will care for his child regardless of the law, and a man without integrity will not, regardless of the law. 

I agree 100% . I will also add that it is up to both parties to put terms in the contract that they need. The basic mutah contract is just a template, or a default(in computer science terminology). Either party can add conditions to the contract, and once those conditions are added, it becomes wajib on both parties to fulfill them, just as it is wajib to fulfill the default terms of the contract. For example, a women could put a condition in the contract that if she gets pregnant, the man is obligated to support her financially during her pregnancy and even for x months afterward. If he agrees, then this becomes wajib on him to do, i.e. it is a major sin if he doesn't do this. 

The reason the fatwa is that 'the women is not entitled to financial support' is that if that was part of the default contract, every man who did mutah would be obligated to support his wife financially. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/20/2018 at 9:14 AM, starlight said:

Yessss. You said exactly what I always thought. I am sure there is something wrong with this ruling. What if a woman falls pregnant and doesn't have the means to support herself? This ruling gives the man the right to abandon the woman who is carrying his child. 

The ruling is just a law which is a kind of fence or jail and it is not moral guide or whatsoever... unlike permanent marriage, because of its temporary nature, this kind of contract is more like trading contracts. It should be detail and carefully planned. And this is why the woman should be a rashida.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anyone considering mutah needs to think seriously about the possibility of producing a child, but people tend to think that a short term marriage will only have short term consequences. I guess it's either idealism or cynicism. 

Other than abstinence, no pregnancy preventative is 100% effective. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Abu Hadi said:

women could put a condition in the contract that if she gets pregnant, the man is obligated to support her financially during her pregnancy and even for x months afterward. If he agrees, then this becomes wajib on him to do

How can she demand something when her marja says she's not even entitled to it? Sistani doesn't leave this open ended,he explicitly stated she isn't entitled to it.

There are no witnesses to Shia marriage contract. Suppose she is pregnant and facing financial problems what do you think would be the reply from marja's office if she decides to take this up with him? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/20/2018 at 10:11 AM, starlight said:

How can she demand something when her marja says she's not even entitled to it? Sistani doesn't leave this open ended,he explicitly stated she isn't entitled to it.

There are no witnesses to Shia marriage contract. Suppose she is pregnant and facing financial problems what do you think would be the reply from marja's office if she decides to take this up with him? 

She isn't entitled to it by default, but a woman can add it in the contract. People don't know, but you can add a lot of things in the marriage contract, and therefore be entitled to that which you aren't entitled to in a normal contract.

Unfortunately this part of the risala which mentions adding extra clauses in marital contracts is not available in English.

But for those who know Arabic; 

https://www.sistani.org/arabic/book/16/874/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, starlight said:

How can she demand something when her marja says she's not even entitled to it? Sistani doesn't leave this open ended,he explicitly stated she isn't entitled to it.

There are no witnesses to Shia marriage contract. Suppose she is pregnant and facing financial problems what do you think would be the reply from marja's office if she decides to take this up with him? 

She can demand anything halal in the contract. There are no witnesses in most of trade affairs, yet good and bad things do happen. The parties involved in this affair should do something to prevent bad things happened (like adding legality to the contract to make use of law enforcer powers). I think this ideally can be applied too in temporary marriage contracts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/20/2018 at 10:26 AM, Sumerian said:

Unfortunately this part of the risala which mentions addin extra clauses in marital contracts is not available in English.

Thanks. Its not there in the urdu version either.That's so sad that even the risalas haven't been fully translated. Only yesterday I was fretting over the unavailability of our hadith books in languages other than Arabic  :(

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, starlight said:

Thanks. Its not there in the urdu version either.That's so sad that even the risalas haven't been fully translated. Only yesterday I was fretting over the unavailability of our hadith books in other languages :(

That's because it seems it is only available in Minhaj Al-Saliheen, and I think it is only in Arabic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, starlight said:

Thanks. Its not there in the urdu version either.That's so sad that even the risalas haven't been fully translated. Only yesterday I was fretting over the unavailability of our hadith books in languages other than Arabic  :(

I totally see where you are coming from, i complained about this for years. Then i decided to give up on the system and complacent people in charge of these things, and started to learn Arabic myself.

Edited by Intellectual Resistance

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, Guest Account Ali said:

Oh my god guys, just answer my question. I asked about Mutah networks vis a via marriage networks. All I want to know is do they exist in the same official capacity (online or offline) as marriage networks do?

No. They don't. 

[Edit] once we SCers start discussing something we do it in complete depth.:grin:

Edited by starlight

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, Guest Account Ali said:

Oh my god guys, just answer my question. I asked about Mutah networks vis a via marriage networks. All I want to know is do they exist in the same official capacity (online or offline) as marriage networks do?

Try shiamatch, just make it clear what you are looking for. There is a site called mutah.com that has profiles for matchmaking, but I don't know if it is reputable or active. It exists, that's all I can tell you. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, starlight said:

No. They don't. 

[Edit] once we SCers start discussing something we do it in complete depth.:grin:

Well I am one to talk online the same way I talk in real life. And I at least appreciate people staying on topic versus going on tangents and making everyone forget what the initial post was all about. Heck, had this discussion went on to become two pages then I guarantee you and most members here would have forgotten entirely what the initial post was all about. And that ain't good. 

Edited by Guest Account Ali

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
48 minutes ago, notme said:

Try shiamatch, just make it clear what you are looking for. There is a site called mutah.com that has profiles for matchmaking, but I don't know if it is reputable or active. It exists, that's all I can tell you. 

Aight. Appreciate it my G. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/20/2018 at 12:20 PM, Guest Account Ali said:

Oh my god guys, just answer my question. I asked about Mutah networks vis a via marriage networks. All I want to know is do they exist in the same official capacity (online or offline) as marriage networks do?

Dear brother- you may need to approach it differently.

Rather than looking for a mutah network (or marriage network), or for that part a job network, you (everybody) should look for places where like minded people gather, of both genders.

People flock to marriage sites and so on, nothing wrong with it; but had they flock to masajid, centers, and volunteer events etc. for the sake of doing the right thing and then let things flow from there as a side benefit of finding a suitable partner, their chances of success would be much higher.

If you really want to be successful in forming any companionship - find ways to meet good people regardless. Meeting people first and then vetting them to be suitable for marriage, career, profession, friendships, activity partners; is a much sure shot way to go about than the other way around.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/20/2018 at 2:05 PM, Irfani313 said:

Dear brother- you may need to approach it differently.

Rather than looking for a mutah network (or marriage network), or for that part a job network, you (everybody) should look for places where like minded people gather, of both genders.

People flock to marriage sites and so on, nothing wrong with it; but had they flock to masajid, centers, and volunteer events etc. for the sake of doing the right thing and then let things flow from there as a side benefit of finding a suitable partner, their chances of success would be much higher.

If you really want to be successful in forming any companionship - find ways to meet good people regardless. Meeting people first and then vetting them to be suitable for marriage, career, profession, friendships, activity partners; is a much sure shot way to go about than the other way around.     

MashaAllah <3 Good Advice <3 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/20/2018 at 2:05 PM, Irfani313 said:

Dear brother- you may need to approach it differently.

Rather than looking for a mutah network (or marriage network), or for that part a job network, you (everybody) should look for places where like minded people gather, of both genders.

People flock to marriage sites and so on, nothing wrong with it; but had they flock to masajid, centers, and volunteer events etc. for the sake of doing the right thing and then let things flow from there as a side benefit of finding a suitable partner, their chances of success would be much higher.

If you really want to be successful in forming any companionship - find ways to meet good people regardless. Meeting people first and then vetting them to be suitable for marriage, career, profession, friendships, activity partners; is a much sure shot way to go about than the other way around.     

Gucci advice. 

But also I am not asking for myself. I am asking because when people here confess their desires and we tell them "do mutah" with the expectation that they just walk into a masjid and figure things out is easier said than done. Marriage is one thing but Mutah is another. Since there is a huge cultural stigma against Mutah, there is an extremely low chance you will find a woman in the masjid who wants to do Mutah, mainly due to cultural bias. My mother has narrated to me too many stories of men who do what you say only to turn up empty because many women have a stigma against Mutah. Even when scholars would act as the middle man for the guy and girl. 

But the internet seems to sift out cultural biases so there is a higher chance of success online than offline with Mutah. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×