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alidu78

What do think about demonstrations in Iran

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43 minutes ago, Wahdat said:

Just like an American does not see anything wrong with establishing democracy in a wonderfully functioning Islamic system in Iran. The problem with our times is that everybody wants something regardless of anything else but their desire...i want democracy...i want sharia...i want revolution....i want this or that....

When à country is in majority Muslim sharia law is supposed to be applicated. 

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There have been anti-Khamenei chants such as “Death to the dictator” and slogans opposing Iran’s regional policy, including “Let go of Syria, think about us” and “I give my life for Iran, not Gaza, not Lebanon”.

Many Iranians are sceptical about how the protests have spread so quickly. One prominent senior reformist commentator, Hamidreza Jalaipour, said reformists were opposed to protests instigated by “advocates of regime change”, implying that the new wave of protests was not spontaneous. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/31/protesters-who-spread-fear-and-violence-will-be-confronted-says-iran

 

The protestors' references to Lebanon and Gaza suggest that a foreign power which is most deeply interested in Iran staying out of those two countries may have a hand in this.

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7 hours ago, Haji 2003 said:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/31/protesters-who-spread-fear-and-violence-will-be-confronted-says-iran

 

The protestors' references to Lebanon and Gaza suggest that a foreign power which is most deeply interested in Iran staying out of those two countries may have a hand in this.

Maybe not we can't ignore that there are some Iranians who say that they want more money invested in Iran than in other countries. 

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please read 

http://www.fort-russ.com/2017/12/iran-protest-crisis-everything-you-need.html

 

for non western propaganda view  

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21 hours ago, alidu78 said:

Muslim world is totally in bad way because caliphate had been abolished and Muslims preferred to be like westerners more than Muslims. 

Also could I ask you a question about Muslims in Sweden? I read on a serious demographic website that in 2050 Muslims in Sweden could be 30% of Swedish population. 

Do you think this is true? 

Thank you if you answer me. 

According to Swedish Wikipedia this could be correct. Today 8% of the Swedish population has Muslim background. (of wich 80% are Sunnies.) If immigration is stopped this is estimated to be 11% in 2050, (Muslims have more children than Swedes). With very large immigration, this number could rise to 30% in 2050.

The opinion against immigration is growing, and our 3rd largest party wishes to stop immigration (except for those on the UN quotas) Other parties are also becoming more and more restrictive the more refugees we recieve. But opinion also depend on how successful intergration will be. 50% of immigrants are religious, falling to 15% in the second generation, but this does not necessarily mean 85% of second generation Muslims are well integrated. In 9 months we will have election, and immigration will be one of the most hot issues.

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5 hours ago, Hasani Samnani said:

please read 

http://www.fort-russ.com/2017/12/iran-protest-crisis-everything-you-need.html

 

for non western propaganda view  

Thanks for the view from Belgium.

1] The Noon news today said 12 dead and police stations were attacked by "armed groups".  Note: in 2009 when the police on _____Alley fired on protesters, somewhere on SC is the video of provocateurs throwing firebombs into the police/guard station, police having then 'fire' from the roof.

2] Only someone who actually knows please respond/elaborate on this: ln the article H_S posted it mentioned limited economic activity. l have read that the religious trusts have been active in business and manufacturing and displace and monopolize over their competition. ls this true and to what extent?

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6 hours ago, andres said:

According to Swedish Wikipedia this could be correct. Today 8% of the Swedish population has Muslim background. (of wich 80% are Sunnies.) If immigration is stopped this is estimated to be 11% in 2050, (Muslims have more children than Swedes). With very large immigration, this number could rise to 30% in 2050.

The opinion against immigration is growing, and our 3rd largest party wishes to stop immigration (except for those on the UN quotas) Other parties are also becoming more and more restrictive the more refugees we recieve. But opinion also depend on how successful intergration will be. 50% of immigrants are religious, falling to 15% in the second generation, but this does not necessarily mean 85% of second generation Muslims are well integrated. In 9 months we will have election, and immigration will be one of the most hot issues.

This is what these anti-immigrant people don't realize. A change in percentage of religion or ethnicity does not necessarily mean the country will be a worse place to live after this change. Cultures are always changing just as ethnic and religious compositions of countries are always changing. This is inevitable. Whether or not the country is a worse / better place to live depends on how people deal with this change, not the change itself.  Will they welcome their new neighbors and attempt to work with them on common goals and problems that they both share, or will things devolve into ethnic and religious hatred, mistrust, and animosity. That is up to the people who live in the country, not anyone else. 

 

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13 hours ago, alidu78 said:

Maybe not we can't ignore that there are some Iranians who say that they want more money invested in Iran than in other countries.

One issue which has come up is e.g. the Iranian involvement in Iraq. The situation the world was facing a few months ago was that ISIS was killing hundreds of Shia at a time and the Iraqis on their own were putting up little resistance, even leaving behind equipment for ISIS to pick up as they ran away.

If the situation had carried on there was a chance, in my opinion, that Iran would have had a severe problem on its western borders in terms of both terrorism and refugees.

Now we know from the Afghan experience that the West is quite happy to take military action for colonial reasons, but not so willing to take care of refugees. And in that example Iran has borne the economic, political and human cost of the refugee problem.

In sum, at least as far as Iraq is concerned, the Iranian action was the most economic and most humanitarian one that could have been taken. If any Iranians think they would have been financially better off if Iran had not intervened they are mistaken. IMHO.

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41 minutes ago, shiasoldier786 said:

https://mobile.twitter.com/kamvtv/status/947539441878368256

Widely shared video on twitter of protests in Iran turns out to actually be protests from Bahrain in 2011.

You are right. Red and white flags shows that is a demonstration from Bahrain. 

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0100EST 02Jan18

Rouhani said these disturbances and vandalism are by a "small and minority group". l do not think these gangs are large enough to be called a "minority".

http://www.presstv.com/Detail/2018/01/01/547511/Intelligence-Ministry-Iran-protests 

Also, "vak' and lRGC have done some "traffic analysis" and determined from where this social media agitation is coming from, US and 'western countries' and KSA. See:

http://www.presstv.com/Detail/2018/01/02/547526/iran-snsc-shamkhani-proxy-war 

Note/Opine: As this act of aggression is very similar to the start of the Syrian lnsurrection, what l am anticipating is another glide bomb from a drone striking a target and then portraying that murder/attempted-murder as part of the 'historical change' in progress. This glide bomb tactic was used outside the Syrian Defense Ministry at the beginning of the "uprising".

Also, with "somebody" moving lS around, it maybe beneficial to extra police/guard in the Khorosan provinces.

@shadow_of_light please note and broadcast,

Edited by hasanhh
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20 hours ago, alidu78 said:

Maybe not we can't ignore that there are some Iranians who say that they want more money invested in Iran than in other countries.

In my last post I referred to Iraq. Let's now look at Iranian involvement in Syria, Lebanon and Palestine.

Whatever Iranian money has gone to Hezbollah has created an effective fighting force that has helped to defeat ISIS. And there was a mutual vested interest in this, because after Syria, it would have been the Christians and Shia of Lebanon who would have been massacred. Indeed more thoughtful people in the west know that Shias have helped Christians more than western governments.

ISIS ideology made co-existence impossible. Iran and the rest of the world simply could not afford to wipe out ISIS in the areas nearest to them and let it survive further away.

Let's not forget that the Khuzestan region of Iran (which lies between that country and Iraq) has an Arab population. And there have been occasions (coincidentally both times Britain was the occupying power in Iraq) when they have called for independence from Iran.

I would not be surprised that the longer term goal would have been for ISIS to resurrect those claims. Again those Iranian nationalists who do not want money spent on others would have been very unwilling for the loss of that land.

Finally Palestine. There is a claim made by some that Shias have something against Sunnis. Iranian support for Palestine shows that that argument does not hold true and that the IRI supports the principle of Muslim unity and fairness. Ordinary Sunnis can see that Iran does more for Sunnis than their own (illegitimate) leaders.

The best example of the long-term pay off for standing by principles is IRI support for the anti-apartheid movement (unlike the Shah who was an apartheid collaborator). Unfortunately for the colonialists, the quotations are out there of Nelson Mandela expressing his support for Iran. He never said the same about Israel and many other western countries, primarily because they supported the aparthied regime.

That sort of support demonstrates wins long-term legitimacy, when finally the rest of the world realises the truth.

 

Edited by Haji 2003

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19 hours ago, alidu78 said:

Maybe not we can't ignore that there are some Iranians who say that they want more money invested in Iran than in other countries.

There is one aspect to this argument that has been completely ignored.

I generally supported Ahmedinejad (the posts are all on Shiachat) and saw Rouhani as someone who'd compromise too much. Unfortunately, as we have seen I and others were right. Rouhani caved in and the UN agrees that Iran has kept its side of the bargain. However, the West has not, which was also predictable.

Sanctions have not been lifted.

The economic gains that should have been made from their lifting have not been made. 

That is not the fault of any Iranian government. Because as I and others have argued all along the issue is not about nuclear capability or Iranian foreign policy or Palestine.

The issue is about having a government in Iran that behaves the same way as the Saudis behave, a government that appoints western consultants to manage the state and one that pays large sums to western arms manufacturers.

If Iranians want a government that the international media describes as being 'moderate', that is what you are looking at.

The ordinary people will still be unemployed but they'd be able to indulge more freely in many more vices.

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Xinhua is reporting slowly. Apparently waiting for confirmations of reports --instead of hyping non-existent events. As of now, Xinhua is reporting 8 dead and a policeman killed.

Tass.com is quoting the lRGC spokensman as saying the police are handling this and no need for lRGC to intervene. http://tass.com/world/983895 

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I have watched some video clips on net in order to understand what is happening because in the area where I live, there is no unrest.

But there are protests elsewhere. To my knowledge, it was primarily for economic problems but now the protests are political too.

And there are rumours about Ayatollah Khamenei (that he is dead)...but I think they are just rumours.

Edited by shadow_of_light

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1 hour ago, hasanhh said:

Xinhua is reporting slowly. Apparently waiting for confirmations of reports --instead of hyping non-existent events. As of now, Xinhua is reporting 8 dead and a policeman killed.

Tass.com is quoting the lRGC spokensman as saying the police are handling this and no need for lRGC to intervene. http://tass.com/world/983895 

Yes, a few people have been killed but it is not clear by who.

 

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2 minutes ago, shadow_of_light said:

Yes, a few people have been killed but it is not clear by who.

 

 From what I understood many death had been committed by protestors and thugs. 

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5 minutes ago, shadow_of_light said:

Yes, a few people have been killed but it is not clear by who.

 

CBS in NYC said moments ago the rioters are mostly young people "and a few poor people". l think those are the exact words. They also said a shopping district in Tehran was attacked and some fire started but other news say Tehran is quiet.

l about never believe Amerikan news anymore than Washington, so it is difficult to get-a-handle-on all this.

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16 minutes ago, shadow_of_light said:

I have watched some video clips on net in order to understand what is happening because in the area where I live, there is no unrest.

But there are protests elsewhere. To my knowledge, it was primarily for economic problems but now the protests are political too.

And there are rumours about Ayatollah Khamenei (that he is dead)...but I think they are just rumours.

Most of the videos l have seen are small groups -like about 20 max that pushed over that white (police?) van; and everyone else, women included, are standing around at a distance watching.

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