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Sumerian

Iraq not part of any axis

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4 minutes ago, Hassan- said:

Not having any relations with the Saudi regime is a good start.

Trust me brother the second the Saudi regime collapses the first people to be happy and celebrate like there is no tomorrow will be us Iraqis and Syrians but that doesn't justify Iran's actions.

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10 minutes ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

No, how would I be aware of that? But doesn't mean that you were right, I may not have studied Iraq as deeply as you have but I do know that Iraq needs to stablise and be independent of Iran or any other foreign power after 45 years of instability.

Brother no offense because you are part of the development team on this site I thought you were a wilayat faqier but you are much more informed than I thought about Iraq thank you for defending us

Salam

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Just now, Forgottenthinker said:

Trust me brother the second the Saudi regime collapses the first people to be happy and celebrate like there is no tomorrow will be us Iraqis and Syrians but that doesn't justify Iran's actions.

If the Saudi regime miraculously collapses before the return of Imam al-Mehdi (af) who do you think will be the one that defeats them? It would be Iran. Then you know what will happen next? Anti-Iran Iraqis will be celebrating for its collapse and STILL blame and curse Iran for everything even when they were the ones that defeated them. The amount of hypocrisy that's in you guys is enormous. I'm starting to believe you are just a troll here with an agenda to start fitnah, I can't take you serious anymore. How about you go back to the first page and answer/refute my questions/points instead of continuing to whine about how "evil" Iran is. 

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11 minutes ago, Intellectual Resistance said:

You had claimed i know nothing about Iraq. This is a judgement which effectively says in less polite words, i know nothing about what i am talking.  There is a difference between 'I disagree with your opinion and you are mistaken in your evaluation' and 'you know nothing about what you are talking.

I see, do you accept my apology? I am kind of tired and gotten you are mixed up with Hassan. I am not really impressed with Ibn Sina and Hassan's answers.

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Just now, Gaius I. Caesar said:

I see, do you accept my apology? I am kind of tired and gotten you are mixed up with Hassan. I am not really impressed with Ibn Sina and Hassan's answers.

My dear brother there is nothing for you to apologise about at all. We are all brothers in Islam, and even closer brothers under the banner of the two weighty things: Quran and the purified progeny Muhammed [saw].  I was just clarifying for general sense.  These debates can get heated as many people stand on quite polar opposites, and so i hope we all generally can continue in these discussions as peacefully as possible (:

Get some rest brother! You know, Ginger - Lemon tea works like a miracle for me when i'm tired.

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10 minutes ago, Forgottenthinker said:

Brother no offense because you are part of the development team on this site I thought you were a wilayat faqier but you are much more informed than I thought about Iraq thank you for defending us

Salam

No problem, I respect Iraq quite a bit personally, the people and the land aren't to be trifled with. I am apathetic or neutral about WF, although I have some misgivings about it.

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Let me just put it out there, the majority of Shia friends i have are Iraqi. I love Iraqis, and i love your dignity, culture, dialect and a lot about what you guys represent as a people.  Let us peacefully, kindly, and respectfully go over what we may disagree on, but not at the cost of disuniting. 

 

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2 minutes ago, Hassan- said:

If the Saudi regime miraculously collapses before the return of Imam al-Mehdi (af) who do you think will be the one that defeats them? It would be Iran. Then you know what will happen next? Anti-Iran Iraqis will be celebrating for its collapse and STILL blame and curse Iran for everything even when they were the ones that defeated them. The amount of hypocrisy that's in you guys is enormous. I'm starting to believe you are just a troll here with an agenda to start fitnah, I can't take you serious anymore. How about you go back to the first page and answer/refute my questions/points instead of continuing to whine about how "evil" Iran is. 

Please Iran cant even take on Israel face to face without killing and sacrificing young Lebanese-Palestinian men hundreds of miles away. When Israel was bombing Gazans Iran didnt do anything. They wont even take on Saudi Arabia in Yemen. We dont HATE Iran we just want them to leave us alone we only hate them if they keep intervening in our affairs. I'm not a troll I have a clear view point and this is coming from the guy that said all Shia that hate Iran aren't Shia. 

Salam

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13 hours ago, Sumerian said:

There are still conspiracies to undermine Iraq but I believe bulk of the work is finished. Iraq came out of the war with ISIS stronger and more stable. I believe if Syria returns to Assad's rule, fully, once again, then Iraq will truly be safe and sound, militarily.

in today's world you are safe only & only if you have the capacity to produce your own weapons tailored to your own needs.

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13 hours ago, Wahdat said:

Yes thanks to Iran's help Iraq came out of both the storms in one piece....but do you think that those that created ISIS are just going to sit back and suck on their thumb while Iraqis give each other flowers and dance in little circles on the Iraqi streets? Are you familiar with the plot-after-plot-after-plot Iraqi history?

Dunno only Allah knows the future but for now it seems they've all given up for now inshallah

This is off topic but do you actually live in Kabul?

Salam

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58 minutes ago, Hassan- said:

Not having any relations with the Saudi regime is a good start.

Actually, that's not what the ambassador of Iran to Iraq says;

https://www.iraqinews.com/baghdad-politics/irans-ambassador-iraq-neutral-sadrs-uae-saudi-visits/

As you can see Iran says Iraq can do what they like, this is an internal matter.

Second of all even Iran, according to Zarif, is ready to better relations with Saudi Arabia.

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1 hour ago, Sumerian said:

Actually, that's not what the ambassador of Iran to Iraq says;

https://www.iraqinews.com/baghdad-politics/irans-ambassador-iraq-neutral-sadrs-uae-saudi-visits/

As you can see Iran says Iraq can do what they like, this is an internal matter.

Second of all even Iran, according to Zarif, is ready to better relations with Saudi Arabia.

How about the part where you said Iraqis want good relationship with all, does that include Israel?

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45 minutes ago, Hassan- said:

How about the part where you said Iraqis want good relationship with all, does that include Israel?

No, Iraq does not recognise Israel's right to exist and Iraq & Israel are still technically at war, and they have conducted airstrikes on us previously. Also, Israel wants Iraq to be split up, so it backs Kurdish independence.

Iraq recently voted against the US in the UN General Assembly regarding the Jerusalem decision.

And, just so you realise Iraq is not going to demonise and turn on Iran, Iraq also votes against any Saudi bills that attack Iran and Hezbollah, whether it be the UN, the Arab League, the Islamic Cooperation Council and what not. If you remember, only three states voted against declaring Hezbollah a terrorist organisation in the Arab league; Iraq, Lebanon and Algeria. Some states abstained, others voted that Hezbollah are terrorists.

Edited by Sumerian

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Salam  @Sumerian Iran declared during ww2 was not  any part of any axis but if you read history all of allied countries  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allies_of_World_War_II?wprov=sfla1

Invaded it to support Soviet Union &after that they declared end of ww2 in Tehran ,Iran you can't act as Swis unless physically change your country position with them

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4 hours ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

This is the same kind of logic that was used to justify the United States invasion of Iraq...

Only difference is America tried to end the war on terror and bring "democracy" to Iraq, Iran is trying to defeat an already neutralized ISIS and bring "wilayah al faqih"  to Iraq.

It is bound to fail miserably. 

I have honestly no idea what you are talking about, first of all:

Nobody said anything about invasion, there was nothing I said that would hint towards Iran invading Iraq and trust me, if the Iranian government had any intention of pulling a saddam (attacking when your weakened) then Iran would already be occupying whole of Iraq by now.

Second of all:

Iran is not trying to defeat an already neutralized ISIS, you think ISIS got neutralized by themselves? Do you know how much Iranian tax money and solidiers and commanders went to Iraq? Your statements make you seem ignorant about that. Nobody has said that Iran wants to export WF either, but what it wants is for Iraq to have integrity as a shia majority country, which means to stay true to its religious call, which means to not be in bed with wahabis, which means not to allow american military bases in its country, which means to help the shias wherever they may be, not only the ones born in Iraq, which means to stay strong together with their other shia brothers and sisters, not divide and uplift themselves in primitive race ideology.

I wonder how much political news you read and how much politically interested you are in general.

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On 12/28/2017 at 4:33 AM, Forgottenthinker said:

Salam Alykum Sumerian, 

(I can tell your Iraqi) I agree fully with this approach as the people of Iraq just dont want politics to matter anymore to them for they've been at the mercy of war, sanctions, terror, dictators and coups, and violations for 45 years by now!! Yes 45 years of instability. They just want to be left alone but Iran which doesn't have good interests at mind wont unfortunately (they keep thinking Iraqi Shia want a waliyah faqih system which is absolutely untrue they want a secular system). Im very happy Abadi took this approach. Let the Iranians send their own men and children to die in their proxy wars and quest for domination of the middle east. While Iraqis rebuild their own nation wisely while the Saudis and Iranians duke it out. I also advise our Syrian brethren to do the same if they dont want to be a battle ground for these two selfish powers in the future.

Peace to you and your Iraqi countrymen inshallah

Salam

I have not read a better propaganda brief in a while.

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5 hours ago, IbnSina said:

Iran is not trying to defeat an already neutralized ISIS, you think ISIS got neutralized by themselves? Do you know how much Iranian tax money and solidiers and commanders went to Iraq?

No, ISIS from what I understand, was neutralized by Russia in Syria and the Iraqi military in Iraq. The Iraqi government doesn't need American or Iranian interference in their affairs. I can guarantee you that it was a waste of tax money and resources for Iran. You seem to think that I am stupid or something.

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10 hours ago, Intellectual Resistance said:

SubhanAllah, unite as brothers in faith. Work together. Be intelligent and know there are intelligence agencies who not only know the difference between the Shia and the Sunni, but the intricate differences between Shias. They have academics advising them on the ins and outs of WF, Marjiyaat, and the rest of it. They have academics who could tell apart Saduq from Mufid and know much more about Shi'sm the the majority of this board, speakers fluent in Arabic, Farsi, and even the dialectical variants. This is all proven. They want to sow the seeds of division among us, and they know that is the best way to get us.

United we stand, divided we fall.

Assalamu alaykum,

The western academic writings on Shi'ism and marjaiyyah are pathetic in quality and academic honesty, bro. Count on my 'in-house' experience. But you are right in the way that they are heavily geared towards their propaganda needs. The last year I was reading a trash-of-a-book by some American nincompoop talking about how Sayyid Sistani  [ha] met a delegation of Iraqi Sunni leaders and told that he 'doesn't believe in Wilayat ul-Faqih', how he boasted to them about his Arab, Prophetic (as he's Sayyid) lineage, and how he was speaking pidgin Arabic (these claims are also repeated a lot in Nasibi circles)to convince them of his pro-Iraqi and anti-Iranian/Persian stance!
As is plain to be seen, even the minimum academic honesty hasn't been maintained - the Sayyid's opinion on Wilayat -ul-Faqih (even though it markedly differs from that of Imam Khumayni [ha]) which is available for all to see on his website, the recent refusal of Iraqi citizenship by the Sayyid who made it plain that he was born an Iranian and die one, and the utter ignorance of Hawza-level academia which would have us believe that someone can become an alim, much less a marja whilst remaining ignorant of Arabic (even though it is true that the Sayyid has a noticeable Farsi accent, but the even the Furati, Hijazi and Yemeni accents differ), were not even given a thought.

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@Gaius I. Caesar currently in Iran many of people are unsatisfied that their taxes & huge amount of resources  is spending in Iraq , Syria & Palestine in a situation we have financial corruption inside Iran the Russia is acting based on its benefits but using Iranian resources for Iraq military & hashd al shab I & Russia causes the neutralizing of ISIS if it just Iraqis were relying on Russia & USA they still suffer from ISIS.

Edited by Ashvazdanghe

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It also has to be recognized that ALL THE PROBLEMS OF TODAY'S IRAQ are not caused by Iraq's alliance with others or lack thereof. Iraq was trampled because it was weak. It will be trampled so long as it stays weak. And my guess is that it will be a weak country without Iran because its strength today comes only from Iran and not Iraq itself.

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On Iraq's neutrality- Its flu season in my area and I have declared neutrality by writing a note saying 'I am neutral' and sticking it to my door...hopefully the flu will pass my house and knocks on my neighbor's door. I do not know why I did not come up with this brilliant idea before :(

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52 minutes ago, Wahdat said:

It also has to be recognized that ALL THE PROBLEMS OF TODAY'S IRAQ are not caused by Iraq's alliance with others or lack thereof. Iraq was trampled because it was weak. It will be trampled so long as it stays weak. And my guess is that it will be a weak country without Iran because its strength today comes only from Iran and not Iraq itself.

You forget Iraq was living for decades even before good relations with Iran... our strength comes from our people and if our people stop fighting each other then we can rise again. At the end of the day even ISIS in Iraq at least, were mostly Iraqi Sunni Arabs. The fact is Iraq has been hijacked by ideologies all over and if the people trust in their Iraqi state, we will do well. So this is an internal issue mostly, outside influence is over exaggerated. People act like the CIA came in and gathered 40,000 men in the Iraqi desert, trained them, gave them weapons, and told them to destroy the country. No. If Iraq can achieve reconcilation between sects and ethnic groups and tribal groups, economic progression, centralisation of state, improvement of security, then this won't happen. 

Remember, we were one of the ME countries to end puppeteering for Britain through revolution, remember that. 

Edited by Sumerian

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