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Question: West/East Marriage Culture

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Salaam Alaykum

I have a question in my mind regarding differences between west and east marriage culture. Please don't be over religious or over atheist. Answer THE WAY YOU REALLY ARE.

Why some western women are not like some eastern women in terms of dealing with their husband? In eastern culture, women see their husband as everything. They try to obey him within religion and respond to him. In eastern culture, women enjoy pleasing their husband. In western culture, women are looking for freedom. They work outside like men and have more financial power. Usually they don't want to be house wife.

From women: What are the differences between you and an eastern woman when you are dealing with your husband? What are you looking for exactly? Which culture do you like the most? Why?

From men: Please share your experience with me. Anything that you know may help me. Please share facts and experiences NOT your thoughts.

To all: One of Shia Muslims in mosque got rejected from a girl just because he was not raised in US. What do you think about this?

Appreciation in advance

Edited by Dhulfikar
Added "some", the OP did not meant to generalize on western Muslims.

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Your assumptions are false. 

13 minutes ago, AmirAlmuminin Lover said:

In western culture, women are looking for freedom. If their husband suffers in one of his needs, wife usually doesn't care. They relate it to lack of education etc. They work outside like men and have more financial power. Usually they don't want to be house wife and they consider it as waste of time (although I believe it's an invaluable job). They don't want to have any obstacle in their life even if it's their husband. They are looking for freedom.

If this has been your experience, you've associated with the wrong kind of people. People who want "freedom" have no reason to get married. 

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3 hours ago, AmirAlmuminin Lover said:

Salaam Alaykum

I have a question in my mind regarding differences between west and east marriage culture. Please don't be over religious or over atheist. Answer THE WAY YOU REALLY ARE.

Why western women are not like eastern women in terms of dealing with their husband? In eastern culture, women see their husband as everything. They try to obey him within religion and respond to him. In eastern culture, women enjoy pleasing their husband. In western culture, women are looking for freedom. They work outside like men and have more financial power. Usually they don't want to be house wife and they consider it as waste of time (although I believe it's an invaluable job).

From women: What are the differences between you and an eastern woman when you are dealing with your husband? What are you looking for exactly? Which culture do you like the most? Why? Which one is closer to religion? Why?

From men: Please share your experience with me. Anything that you know may help me. Please share facts and experiences NOT your thoughts.

To all: One of Shia Muslims in mosque got rejected from a girl just because he was not raised in US. What do you think about this?

Appreciation in advance

I know I am not necessarily answering your question. But I feel that an invaluable context is needed for this type of question. So please bare with me. 

Also when I use the word "bureaucratised" I mean it as per the denotation of Max Weber. If you don't know who he is, then google him. 

 

Well actually if you look at the muslim world before the encroachment of western culture (before colonialism) muslims thought of marriage differently than they do now even in the east. Previously, most muslim women had some source of income (doctor, merchant, scholar, etc.) but that these jobs were not bureaucratised and thus did not interfere in a woman's ability to maintain and love her family. These jobs were seen, as well, jobs. And your family and religious duties were seen as exponentially more important. Thus, these muslim women were both obedient to their spouse and their family duties and also extremely religious people but would also earn an income as well since these jobs were not as demanding or if they were were on an informal level (depending on her hirer) were typically made flexible especially if a woman was married. Since at that time it was rare for a man to find a job that could solely provide for the whole family and their growing needs. Again, these jobs were pre-modern and not bureaucratised.

 

However, nowadays jobs have become bureaucratised to such extremes that they surpassed the expectations of even folks like Max Weber. Education is a matter of literally just earning points and little to do with genuine learning (there are people who earn these points but are quite dim in terms of intelligence and problem-solving). And once you do get a job it is incredibly methodical and time-consuming, especially STEM fields. As a result, an informal thing like a marriage and family comes crashing hard against the machine-like socioeconomic demands of education and jobs. And since modern day feminism seems to think a woman's place is in the "machine" as it were, and not amongst her family or spouse a lot of impressionable muslim women become indoctrinated by this ideology and gravitate towards the machine and less towards their family and spouse. Not to say that it is bad to have a job, but that muslim women should be able to hold a job (doctor, engineer, etc.) but know that deep down her family and spouse is way more important than the job that she has. And that she must draw lines whenever she has to.

Edited by Guest Account Ali

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I know some eastern women put up with their husbands, even after being beaten and abused, as they are very dependant on them. I mean, some women go to the extent of obeying their husband soo much and this is just pure injustice!

As for your question about a guy being rejected because he was Eastern - I feel it is a very personal choice as long as she doesn't think Eastern men are inferior to Western men. The choice could be associated with a lot of factors, like personality clash etc

I personally would find it easier to get along with Western Muslim girls, because their way of thinking, interacting etc would be similar to mine. However, I'm okay with marrying an Eastern Muslim girl if I get along with her.

 

 

Edited by ali_fatheroforphans

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1 hour ago, ali_fatheroforphans said:

I know some eastern women put up with their husbands, even after being beaten and abused, as they are very dependant on them. I mean, some women go to the extent of obeying their husband soo much and this is just pure injustice!

As for your question about a guy being rejected because he was Eastern - I feel it is a very personal choice as long as she doesn't think Eastern men are inferior to Western men. The choice could be associated with a lot of factors, like personality clash etc

I personally would find it easier to get along with Western Muslim girls, because their way of thinking, interacting etc would be similar to mine. However, I'm okay with marrying an Eastern Muslim girl if I get along with her.

 

 

Your comment made me sad. I asked for western/eastern marriage culture and the very first thing you mention is obeying even after being beaten and abused. I lived in east. It's NOT what you think. It is against religion, and if you read my post I said obeying WITHIN RELIGION.

As for the second point, yes it's a personal choice, but I think it doesn't make sense to reject without giving opportunity to that person to talk with her and her parents. Their parents rejected him as soon as they realized he is not raised in US. I think this is also pure injustice because prophet said:" If Akhlaq and Iman of a person satisfied you, then do Nekah". Sometimes I think these Hadeeth and other Hadeeth of this sort are considered as very traditional and ignored in these days. It would be better to give this opportunity to them to talk to each other. Maybe that guy changed his mind after talking and seeing differences. It's not like he's %100 OK with marriage.

Edited by AmirAlmuminin Lover

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2 hours ago, AmirAlmuminin Lover said:

asked for western/eastern marriage culture and the very first thing you mention is obeying even after being beaten and abused. I lived in east. It's NOT what you think. It is against religion, and if you read my post I said obeying WITHIN RELIGION.

Sorry, I misinterpreted your question. I don't mean to generalize or anything, it's just that I've encountered those type of people.

2 hours ago, AmirAlmuminin Lover said:

Their parents rejected him as soon as they realized he is not raised in US.

Woah I admit that's a bit extreme. I would at least talk to a girl If I found out she was eastern. Anyways, what right do the parents have to straight up reject someone like that.

 

 

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16 hours ago, AmirAlmuminin Lover said:

Salaam Alaykum

 

From women: What are the differences between you and an eastern woman when you are dealing with your husband? What are you looking for exactly? Which culture do you like the most? Why? Which one is closer to religion? Why?

 

I believe that most women in eastern cultures are abused by their husbands, and most of them don't take it quietly. They abuse their kids, maids, or other women. There are very few women who are at the bottom of the food chain, who take all the abuse and don't take revenge from others.  Men remain sheltered from all this, so they don't realize their actions have consequences. Of course I like the western culture more and I think it's  closer to religion because there's more justice in this culture. I just don't understand what do men want? Women are always told "you are responsible for your own happiness" and you cannot expect someone else to make you happy. Why don't we say the same thing to men? If your wife is raising your kids, that's a lot of work and you should be happy for that. 

You need to realize that there are problems in both cultures. People in east are not all perfect Muslims and all of them are not going to heaven. Also, if men think that eastern women are so perfect, then why don't they get married to eastern women? Why do they have this desire to marry a western woman and tame her into an obedient wife? There are millions of eastern women who are not getting married and they would make perfect wives. Why do men want to be "everything" and center of universe for their wives? Isn't that  egoistical?

When I got married, I liked cooking and I can also clean. But whatever I did, it was never good enough for men and I was always compared with other women who are better at cooking and cleaning. When I go to work, I get money and even appreciation for much less effort. This is why I became interested only in my career and I lost all my interest in housework. I am sure I can be a good mother, but If I have to raise kids, while dealing with an abusive husband and in-laws, I am 100% sure I will end up committing suicide or harming my kids. 

Edited by rkazmi33

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I'm American of predominantly European ancestry, and so is my husband. I like a marriage which is a partnership of equals, but where we disagree I tend to go with my husband's choice because hierarchy of authority. I can be independent if I need to be, but marriage shouldn't require that. I'm as educated as my husband, and as smart and competent as he is. Neither of us is superior, neither is inferior.

See what I mean when I say your assumptions are wrong.

As for parents rejecting a suitor for his upbringing, that's their right but they might be ruling out a very good match. 

Edited by notme
Autocorrect incorrect

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How many muslims do you know who earn 6 figures sum within a few years to give them the ability to marry and have a house wife?.

Women prefer financial independence, because that is their plan B. When you earn its your own keep, you decide what to buy and spend it on, not the husband, who may base it on his on whims or financial problems or just control. Earning power is what allows freedom to become a purchasing hamster but also gives choices.

Many women, after 30 and perhaps a kid or two would love to be a house wife or even work part time, if the finances are there.

In the west the youth leave home around university, their parents want it to give them independence and responsibility.

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19 hours ago, AmirAlmuminin Lover said:

To all: One of Shia Muslims in mosque got rejected from a girl just because he was not raised in US. What do you think about this?

I don't think there's anything wrong with that at all.

If she didn't want to marry him for whatever reason then that's her right. Now, if that reason was that he wasn't from the US then so be it.

Her life, her choice. 

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49 minutes ago, Akbar673 said:

I don't think there's anything wrong with that at all.

If she didn't want to marry him for whatever reason then that's her right. Now, if that reason was that he wasn't from the US then so be it.

Her life, her choice. 

Brother, her parents rejected him without telling their daughter anything.  It is not acceptable. Let them talk about marriage. It's not Haram. If she rejected him, I wouldn't have anything to say. It's hard for a guy to be rejected like this. I remember there was a post here in ShiaChat that one girl was complaining about this that her mother rejects guys without telling her anything.

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4 hours ago, rkazmi33 said:

I believe that most women in eastern cultures are abused by their husbands, and most of them don't take it quietly. They abuse their kids, maids, or other women. There are very few women who are at the bottom of the food chain, who take all the abuse and don't take revenge from others.  Men remain sheltered from all this, so they don't realize their actions have consequences. Of course I like the western culture more and I think it's  closer to religion because there's more justice in this culture. I just don't understand what do men want? Women are always told "you are responsible for your own happiness" and you cannot expect someone else to make you happy. Why don't we say the same thing to men? If your wife is raising your kids, that's a lot of work and you should be happy for that. 

You need to realize that there are problems in both cultures. People in east are not all perfect Muslims and all of them are not going to heaven. Also, if men think that eastern women are so perfect, then why don't they get married to eastern women? Why do they have this desire to marry a western woman and tame her into an obedient wife? There are millions of eastern women who are not getting married and they would make perfect wives. Why do men want to be "everything" and center of universe for their wives? Isn't that  egoistical?

When I got married, I liked cooking and I can also clean. But whatever I did, it was never good enough for men and I was always compared with other women who are better at cooking and cleaning. When I go to work, I get money and even appreciation for much less effort. This is why I became interested only in my career and I lost all my interest in housework. I am sure I can be a good mother, but If I have to raise kids, while dealing with an abusive husband and in-laws, I am 100% sure I will end up committing suicide or harming my kids. 

What you wrote about east is not true because I lived in east 23 years.

I don't think everybody is interested to marry a western woman. What shia people usually do is that they are looking for Islamic qualities not nationality.

Inshaallah you'll be a good mother soon.

Edited by AmirAlmuminin Lover

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1 hour ago, AmirAlmuminin Lover said:

Brother, her parents rejected him without telling their daughter anything.  It is not acceptable. Let them talk about marriage. It's not Haram. If she rejected him, I wouldn't have anything to say. It's hard for a guy to be rejected like this. I remember there was a post here in ShiaChat that one girl was complaining about this that her mother rejects guys without telling her anything.

Yeah, I know a set of parents that we’re doing the same thing for their daughter. Kept rejecting guys because they didn’t feel he was up to par. The guys info wouldn’t even make it to get to accept/reject.

Their daughter is now 40 and unmarried. They rejected so many guys that people just stopped approaching her. 

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5 hours ago, monad said:

How many muslims do you know who earn 6 figures sum within a few years to give them the ability to marry and have a house wife?.

Women prefer financial independence, because that is their plan B. When you earn its your own keep, you decide what to buy and spend it on, not the husband, who may base it on his on whims or financial problems or just control. Earning power is what allows freedom to become a purchasing hamster but also gives choices.

Many women, after 30 and perhaps a kid or two would love to be a house wife or even work part time, if the finances are there.

In the west the youth leave home around university, their parents want it to give them independence and responsibility.

Actually depends on the job. This may surprise you, but a survey done by Dalia Mogahed showed that while muslim women are more "educated" muslim men make more money compared to muslim women on average. The reason is simple. A muslimah may want to become a doctor but that takes time and effort, while a muslim man wants to earn a similar amount of money in less time. So most muslim men opt for business/finance degrees or even nowadays computer engineering.  So while a doctor is more respectable than a person with a finance degree, one makes more money in a lot less time. And muslim women have yet to emerge in high numbers into the finance and business fields. My sister is the only muslim woman I know in my community who is even earning a business degree, the rest of the muslim women I know are all earning STEM degrees.

 

So based on the stats done by Dalia Mogahed, muslim women don't necessarily prefer financial independence more so they want a respectable career and or degree. Lest muslim women would be rushing to get finance or business degrees, which is where the real money is in. But statistically, most muslim women are not emerging into these careers, even in countries wherein the choice and freedom is given for them to pursue these money making degrees.

 

Also there are plenty of muslim women who are doctors, etc. and they still get abused by their in-laws and spouse. Again, what determines whether or not a muslim woman will have financial independence and less susceptibility to abuse is a headstrong personality, not just minting money. There are plenty of aunties who have never went to college but due to being headstrong never got abused or were financially taken advantage of. But I have seen plenty of doctors get financially taken advantage of in my own US muslim community.

 

However, the only possible exception I can think of is when a muslim woman gets married to a guy who turns out to be abusive, etc. and she goes through a nasty divorce. All the while he was financially supporting her. Thus, when she divorces she will have money to rely on when she is single. However, even this is multi-faceted and there are just as many cases where a muslim woman who does not earn money is supported financially by others, even the fiqh demands that she is provided for by other men when she is divorced. Mainly, the fiqh says that her father must provide for her when she gets divorced, and if not father then brother, and so on...

 

One of the biggest myths of modern feminism is your last line in your second paragraph. Studies have shown that income does not contribute to less abuse or being taken advantage of. Not to mention the scarily rising trend of workplace slavery and harassment that occurs in the east and west. So if muslim woman want to get a job, do so because you want to. If you want to become a doctor, become one because you want to heal people, if you want to be filthy rich then go ahead and earn a finance degree and get employed in a fortune 500 company. But don't get a job because you think that by not doing so you will be "taken advantage of" among other things like that. And that the KEY thing to preventing abuse and being taken advantage of is a headstrong but fair personality. 

 

Also you seem to characteristically ignore that there are many muslim women who take advantage of their husbands financially as well. Go to any Arab country and notice that there is a rising phenomenon of SOME muslim women who are "gold-diggers". This gold-digger phenomenon has gotten to such an extent in wealthy arab countries that there are memes and jokes made about these women and how they "suck you dry".

 

Also bruh, trust me I am living on campus right now. And all I can say is that I honestly and sincerely lol at "independence" and "responsibility" for university students, what more buzzwords do you have for me that I can disprove by actually being a millennial and living on campus and seeing through the "American dream" as it were of "independence" and "responsibility"?.

Edited by Guest Account Ali

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6 hours ago, monad said:

How many muslims do you know who earn 6 figures sum within a few years to give them the ability to marry and have a house wife?.

Women prefer financial independence, because that is their plan B. When you earn its your own keep, you decide what to buy and spend it on, not the husband, who may base it on his on whims or financial problems or just control. Earning power is what allows freedom to become a purchasing hamster but also gives choices.

Many women, after 30 and perhaps a kid or two would love to be a house wife or even work part time, if the finances are there.

In the west the youth leave home around university, their parents want it to give them independence and responsibility.

Being house wife was just an example. Plus I don't talk about abusive men(abusive people are ALSO among women). A man spends money on his wife as well. Look at it Islamically. Do you work outside because you don't want to be dependent on your husband? If you trust him and he does his duties towards you, what is the reason?

As I said it's only one example. It's not related to my marriage preferences. I am interested to know western women reasons and ideas. Do you believe if you don't work, you feel empty in terms of personality and social position? Who did put this thought into your mind? 

 

Edited by AmirAlmuminin Lover

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Just now, AmirAlmuminin Lover said:

Being house wife was just an example. Plus I don't talk about abusive men(abusive people are ALSO among women). A man spends money on his wife as well. Look at it Islamically. Do you work outside because you don't want to be dependent on your husband? If you trust him and he does his duties towards you, what is the reason?

As I said it's only one example. It's not related to my preferences. I am interested to know western women reasons. Do you believe if you don't work, you feel empty in terms of personality and social position? Who did put this thought into your mind? 

 

Most of the reasons are that modern feminism has made a boogeyman out of abusive men (yes they exist, but let us be realistic at the same time) and thus it scares women into thinking they need a job because a man could allegedly become an ape and go crazy on her. I am not denying abuse exists, but that a degree and an income prevents NOTHING. A headstrong personality does. You said you are from the east, so you should know what I mean. For example, you probably know of aunties who are just based on personality headstrong and don't have a degree or income. And you must know that these women also manage to prevent abuse done to them and being taken advantage of merely by being headstrong (of course reasonably headstrong and not to the level of being defiant).

And modern day feminism quite literally shames women who are housewives and who do not work. As if they are brainwashed creatures. It honestly sickens me. To heck with any woman who shames a housewife.  

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35 minutes ago, Guest Account Ali said:

Most of the reasons are that modern feminism has made a boogeyman out of abusive men (yes they exist, but let us be realistic at the same time) and thus it scares women into thinking they need a job because a man could allegedly become an ape and go crazy on her. I am not denying abuse exists, but that a degree and an income prevents NOTHING. A headstrong personality does. You said you are from the east, so you should know what I mean. For example, you probably know of aunties who are just based on personality headstrong and don't have a degree or income. And you must know that these women also manage to prevent abuse done to them and being taken advantage of merely by being headstrong (of course reasonably headstrong and not to the level of being defiant).

And modern day feminism quite literally shames women who are housewives and who do not work. As if they are brainwashed creatures. It honestly sickens me. To heck with any woman who shames a housewife.  

I know that there are abusive men, but there are men who are supporting as well. Money don't do anything. When you are broken after divorce, getting a 100k at the end of the year does NOT heal it.

One girl here said:" I liked to marry that man that my mum rejected. EVEN IF MARRIAGE GOES DOWN, I HAVE MONEY TO TAKE CARE OF MYSELF". That is so sad. Even though she likes him, she cannot trust him in support both financially and emotionally. I don't want to think like this on my wife.

People with experience of divorce or experience of having a happy western-eastern marriage can help me a lot to understand more. Please comment.

Edited by AmirAlmuminin Lover

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2 hours ago, AmirAlmuminin Lover said:

I know that there are abusive men, but there are men who are supporting as well. Money don't do anything. When you are broken after divorce, getting a 100k at the end of the year does NOT heal it.

One girl here said:" I liked to marry that man that my mum rejected. EVEN IF MARRIAGE GOES DOWN, I HAVE MONEY TO TAKE CARE OF MYSELF". That is so sad. Even though she likes him, she cannot trust him in support both financially and emotionally. I don't want to think like this on my wife.

People with experience of divorce or experience of having a happy western-eastern marriage can help me a lot to understand more. Please comment.

I Know, and I agree mostly with your sentiments. I also agree that a muslimah should not think like that with regards to a proper husband. Also I am single and not married yet. So I cannot give advice in that department. But I like to think I am fairly observant of social phenomena.

And Also I think that a way that a muslimah can help prevent getting married to a guy like that is by not having shallow standards of a marital partner. I remember in this one podcast a muslim psychologist said that the minimum time a guy and girl should court each other is 6 months. And that during those six months it is important to find out as much as you can about the guy or girl. And to above all else not rush into a marriage. And that part of finding out all details of the potential partner is by asking the right questions. And these questions should be defined by either muslim marital counselors, or by couples who truly have a good relationship.

 

And my own input is that if we are going to be honest most of our parents had terrible marital relationships, and thus as our generation grows up we (both genders) develop shallow and unrealistic spousal expectations. And when we carry these into our marriages, the marriage becomes like a bag of popcorn. It is really good for a while to a brief time, but once the "pop" happens is when the marital bubble bursts and now the main issue becomes cohabitation instead of trying to enact some Fabio novella with your spouse. 

 

I think what any muslim woman here can admit is that for every women who had a bad first marital partner there were "signs" of him being not so great even before the marriage. But naivety can sometimes blind muslim women in not being attentive of these things. And even if these signs were not present before the marriage, a thorough vetting process and prolonging courtship can help to sort these things out before the marriage, if even a marriage should occur.

 

Anyone would be surprised that a thorough vetting process and asking the right questions during a prolonged courtship can filter out partners who could potentially do haram things like physical abuse, etc. Since for most men and women, they don't randomly start abusing or that men just go ape on their wives for no reason, but that trained behavioral health specialists or generally mentally acute people can tell of "signs" that certain men and women are more prone to do abuse if given the right situations depending on certain personal factors of an individual. Muslims need to start utilizing these resources better so as to filter out guys and even girls who do these things. 

Edited by Guest Account Ali

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9 hours ago, AmirAlmuminin Lover said:

Do you believe if you don't work, you feel empty in terms of personality and social position? Who did put this thought into your mind? 

What? That's crazy. People who think like that need self esteem, not employment. 

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1 hour ago, notme said:

What? That's crazy. People who think like that need self esteem, not employment. 

As I said I do not believe in this mentality. I said it's an invaluable job. Of course I do support women who participate in society and and work with Hijab. It's self esteem and a good picture of Islam.

Somebody said that men use their money(I don't believe in their money. It's our money) on their own whims. I do not believe this. A good man buys everything that his wife needs within Islamic rules and his budget. Why not doing that really? Of course forcing on something like buying stuff is childish behaviour.

I feel there's a deviation from the main topic. Differences between eastern and western marriage is my point. Working was just an example.

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8 hours ago, rkazmi33 said:

I believe that most women in eastern cultures are abused by their husbands, and most of them don't take it quietly. They abuse their kids, maids, or other women. There are very few women who are at the bottom of the food chain, who take all the abuse and don't take revenge from others.  Men remain sheltered from all this, so they don't realize their actions have consequences. Of course I like the western culture more and I think it's  closer to religion because there's more justice in this culture. I just don't understand what do men want? Women are always told "you are responsible for your own happiness" and you cannot expect someone else to make you happy. Why don't we say the same thing to men? If your wife is raising your kids, that's a lot of work and you should be happy for that. 

You need to realize that there are problems in both cultures. People in east are not all perfect Muslims and all of them are not going to heaven. Also, if men think that eastern women are so perfect, then why don't they get married to eastern women? Why do they have this desire to marry a western woman and tame her into an obedient wife? There are millions of eastern women who are not getting married and they would make perfect wives. Why do men want to be "everything" and center of universe for their wives? Isn't that  egoistical?

When I got married, I liked cooking and I can also clean. But whatever I did, it was never good enough for men and I was always compared with other women who are better at cooking and cleaning. When I go to work, I get money and even appreciation for much less effort. This is why I became interested only in my career and I lost all my interest in housework. I am sure I can be a good mother, but If I have to raise kids, while dealing with an abusive husband and in-laws, I am 100% sure I will end up committing suicide or harming my kids. 

Salaam, 
 

I feel you are projecting your own miseries that occurred in your past. I am not denying abuse occurs, but abuse does occur in the west as well. And a brother here has corrected you on the scale of abuse in the east, so again I feel like you are projecting what you observed in your locality and insist it is emblematic of an entire geographical location. Granted, it takes different forms. While it is true that increasingly in the west women are being abused less and less in the home, they are being abused MORE in the workplace. Since you are a muslim woman, culturally many western men feel hesitant to approach you but non-muslim woman feel the full gauntlet of harassment in the workplace. There are very disturbing stats that illustrate just how rampant rape and harassment has become in the west, especially if you are non-muslim. 

 

Also, I am not denying there is more justice implementation in the west. But again that is emblematic of a strong central government and muscular police systems that scare a local population into submission into the law. I believe countries like Iran are a perfect example of how a society can "morally evolve" when muscular police systems are introduced into every rural, suburban, and urban area in the country and scare the population into submission to the law. Thus, in the west the police systems are muscular and take a woman's claim of abuse seriously and do proper investigations. But in many muslim countries, corruption is abound and it is futile to rely on the police to mete out proper justice. Thus men and women will "get away" with abuse despite being illegal in these countries as well. The solution to fix the "east" as it were is to establish strong central governments that have a heavy amount of control and distribute muscular police systems all over the country. And these muscular police systems must be corruption-proof to a reasonable extent. Then magically there will be less "tolerance" of abusive men. 

 

Also again, you are correct on "happiness" that is to be found in your spouse. Unless there are severe deficiencies in iman, muslim men and women are instructed to deal with their spouses shortcomings in a responsible way.

 

And also ironically shaming housewives and not appreciating these women is actually a problem here in the west, and ironically is pervaded largely by third-wave feminism that thinks that housewives are "brain-washed women" and also feminists nowadays pervade the concept that women should be "free" with their sexuality. Thus, men will naturally gravitate towards these free-loving women (which is not a good thing) but then marry another woman to appease familial desires. Essentially, some but not all muslim men will date one kind of woman but then marry another kind. Partly because they feel guilty for being attracted to those types of women and think that by marrying some eastern pious woman he can rectify his mistakes (which is futile and incorrect thinking).

 

Again, what many eastern men will assume is that western women are more freer with their sexuality and thus more sinful (which there is some truth to that statement, but still it is an exaggeration), and in a sort of weird paradoxical moment some but not all eastern men will be naturally more attracted to these "sexually freer" women but then also want to "fix" these women. And why they want to fix these women is because they think it will ease the guilt they have themselves for being attracted to free-loving women in the first place, instead of being attracted to pious women (who some but not all tend to be woefully ignorant of male sexuality). 

 

Again, I think your last paragraph was you going into a personal monologue. When you use the word "men" you most likely have certain men in mind, so kindly don't make blanketed statements and start projecting your experiences onto others who are innocent of such accusations. Also the rest of your statement if emblematic of a typical "culturally muslim" desi household. So again, my suggestion is to distance yourself away from these people who indeed can be toxic and to especially not marry a man who is "culturally muslim" but toxic culturally towards you. I remember a lecture by NAK (yes I know his image is all but ruined now, but for what it is worth he does give out good advice on some things) where he talked about how toxic desi in-laws can be sometimes, not to mention some but not all desi husbands who all believe in some mangled cultural version of Islam and will torture the wife in a toxic manner similar to his parents (wife's in-laws). He ironically said that these toxic desi families belong in a mental hospital, since they are "insane" according to NAK. Which I could not agree with more. 

 

 

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On 19/11/2017 at 10:09 PM, AmirAlmuminin Lover said:

 

Why western women are not like eastern women in terms of dealing with their husband? In eastern culture, women see their husband as everything. They try to obey him within religion and respond to him. In eastern culture, women enjoy pleasing their husband. In western culture, women are looking for freedom. They work outside like men and have more financial power. Usually they don't want to be house ...

To all: One of Shia Muslims in mosque got rejected from a girl just because he was not raised in US. What do you think about this?

Appreciation in advance

Salaam

Stop generalizing eastern and western.  You'e just insulting us. Just because we are born in the west doesn't mean we don't care about our husbands and families. 

As women we are our own people no matter what country we are from.

If western girls don't like you, it's because they know you are not a good match for them. There are personality conflicts. The particular girl just doesn't like you. It's impolite to tell someone you don't like anything about them so we say this. Sometimes we just don't like you. Go for someone else. 

Fix your attitude problem 

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30 minutes ago, AmirAlmuminin Lover said:

Salaam Alaykum

I don't appreciate your tone. It's not about ALL women in west, but I see freedom attitude is something common. I mentioned somebody else, not me.

I think everybody else here can see your tone and my tone and decide which one should change his/her attitude.

I don't appreciate your rude comments in this post or the original. Don't blame girls if they don't like you/ your friend. 

Do you think your original post is not offensive? Why do you get to say whatever you want about us but you have a problem with us explaining the reason we reject who we reject.  Just because someone proposes does not mean we are going to accept 

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