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why Shias are less in number compared to Sunni

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3 hours ago, islam25 said:

But why today Shia do not have effective dawah system and centres to invite non-muslim towards true Islam just like sunnis and particularly wahhabies have.

dawah isnt what converts them... they convert to the popular islam

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Sunnism and christianity have the most offshoot sects than any other religion, therefore this notion of having the majority is somewhat delusional. How can a majority claim to be the correct form of Islam, when they have so many offshoot? This suggest Sunni Islam have not adhered to the correct teachings of Islam, and have created various sects merge from within. 

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Well to be fair, the Safavids did forcibly convert many sunnis in Iran. So I suppose there's that. Otherwise, I think it may just be that historically the only races of people who were shia were Iranian and Desi and a small minority being Arab. In general Desi's and Iranians are very insular. I understand why Shiaism did not take off in India. But the Safavids were quite militarily strong and held off and defeated the Ottomans. Thus I would not say that any Shia genocide occurred in Iran to any real extent since the 1500s. Also it may be that, again, Iranians were quite insular people back then. They were not as concerned with conquest as the Ottoman's and thus mostly kept to themselves strengthening their borders. 

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On 11/7/2017 at 2:29 PM, monad said:

because all the guys are on SC looking for a wife. Someone tell them, they do not exist online, we might then get a population increase. :hahaha:

Maybe someone should tell you that GASP muslim women also constitute 50%  and more of all online muslim matrimonial services... But that can't be right. Monad's paradigm must establish that muslim guys are the only thirsty people out there, and there just CANNOT be muslim women who also do the same thing at the same rate and surprisingly in higher numbers. 

Remember,for every muslim guy out there that is thirsty. There are muslim women that bait him. You solve nothing by only vindicating one gender over the other. I have seen a TON of if not similar in number to muslim men, muslim women scouting the web for that perfect "hubby" as well, of course to no avail. But I suppose that must be a fluke in the system for you, right?

It is very easy to make fun of guys who do a certain behavior, but not so easy when the other gender does the EXACT same thing. 

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On 11/7/2017 at 10:46 PM, Sindbad05 said:

1. Shias did not remain in power to introduce their religion until 16th Century when one of the Persian King took it as objective to propagate the teachings of this religion. So, from 623 till 16th Century most of the area in the Arabian Peninsula and Middle East was governed by the anti-Shia people most of the time.

2. In the beginning of the Caliphate, foreign people thought Abu Bakar to be the real Caliph due to their unawareness regarding civilian instability and all the people in the Arabia regarded Shias as enemy of the Muslims state number one as is now whole of the West considers Islam to be against humanity.

3. Finally, the so called Muslim leaders left no stone unturned in calling Shias to be heretics and Kufar to the extent that they were driven from their areas and many were killed and thus world thought that sitting Caliph is the representative of majority view, therefore, they thought Shias to be a group that has revolted due to political issues but it was not political issue rather religious ones. 

King at that time forcely converted sunnis to shia. Keep in mind that till 16th century zaydi shias were in majority among shias.

In 1501 Isma'il I took the power in Iran and set up the Safavid dynasty. While most of the larger cities of Iran were Sunni, he declared Twelver Shi'ism as the official religion of his empire.

Pre-Safavid Iran

Iran’s population was mostly Sunni of the Shafi`i[3] and Hanafi legal rites until the triumph of the Safavids (who had initially been Shafi`i Sufis themselves).[4] Ironically, this was to the extent that up until the end of the 15th century the Ottoman Empire (the most powerful and prominent Sunni state and future arch-enemy of the Shia Safavids) used to send many of its Ulama (Islamic scholars) to Iran to further their education in Sunni Islam, due to a lack of Madrasahs (Islamic schools) within the Empire itself.[5]The Sunni Iranians had always held the family of Muhammad in high esteem.[6] In contrast, before the Safavid period, a minority of Iranians were Shia and there had been relatively few Shia Ulama in Iran.[7]

Methods of converting Iran

Ismail consolidated his rule over the country and launched a thorough and at times brutal campaign to convert the majority Sunni population to Twelver Shiism and thus transform the religious landscape of Iran.[16] His methods of converting Iran included:

  • Imposing Shiism as the state and mandatory religion for the whole nation and much forcible conversions of Iranian Sufi Sunnis to Shiism.[17][18][19]
  • He reintroduced the Sadr (Arabic, leader) – an office that was responsible for supervising religious institutions and endowments. With a view to transforming Iran into a Shiite state, the Sadr was also assigned the task of disseminating Twelver doctrine.[20]
  • He destroyed Sunni mosques. This was even noted by Tomé Pires, the Portuguese ambassador to China who visited Iran in 1511–12, who when referring to Ismail noted: "He (i.e. Ismail) reforms our churches, destroys the houses of all Moors who follow (the Sunnah of) Muhammad…"[21]
  • He enforced the ritual and compulsory cursing of the first three Sunni Caliphs (Abu Bakr, Umar, and Uthman) as usurpers, from all mosques, disbanded Sunni Tariqahs and seized their assets, used state patronage to develop Shia shrines, institutions and religious art and imported Shia scholars to replace Sunni scholars.[22][23][24]
  • He shed Sunni blood and destroyed and desecrated the graves and mosques of Sunnis. This caused the Ottoman Sultan Bayezid II (who initially congratulated Ismail on his victories) to advise and ask the young monarch (in a “fatherly” manner) to stop the anti-Sunni actions. However, Ismail was strongly anti-Sunni, ignored the Sultan's warning, and continued to spread the Shia faith by the sword.[25][26]
  • He persecuted, imprisoned and executed stubbornly resistant Sunnis.[27][28]
  • With the establishment of Safavid rule, there was a very raucous and colourful, almost carnival-like holiday on 26 Dhu al-Hijjah (or alternatively, 9 Rabi' al-awwal) celebrating the murder of Caliph Umar. The highlight of the day was making an effigy of Umar to be cursed, insulted, and finally burned. However, as relations between Iran and Sunni countries improved, the holiday was no longer observed (at least officially).[29]
  • In 1501 Ismail invited all the Shia living outside Iran to come to Iran and be assured of protection from the Sunni majority.[30]

In short this is how Iran became a shia state.

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@Munzir Ahmed 

I doubt because you might have taken it from Wikipedia and Wikipedia does not like Iran due to being anti-US and considers that the embassy personal which were held by post-revolutionary government, were innocent. While before that they admitted that Operation Ajax through which they toppled Mosedaq's government were done by CIA within Iran, so tell me where from CIA would launch such coup to oust Mosedaq's government. So, I do not take Wikipedia to be neutral and find it against those who are anti-US. 

Secondly, if there is truth that Ismail I did such oppression, I oppose it because it is against Islamic teachings. However, his such move might have been influenced by various factors such as: Sunni rulers like Hajaj bin Yosuf's propaganda that dubbed Shia as heretics and oppression of Sunni rulers in the adjoining areas such as in the Sub-continent at that time, Ummayad Islam was so common that people considered Shias to be heretics and you can find such examples in Mughal empire during the time of Sher Shah Suri and before that. So, Ismail's such policies could be the result of hardliner attitude of Ibn Timmyah sect bro who know nothing but to create Takfir and destroy Muslim Ummah.

Finally, it was in the beginning Omar I who invaded Persia and it is very difficult for me to accept that it has huge Sunni population because at the time when Abbasids rose in revolt against Ummayad with the slogans to avenge Imam Hussain a.s blood, the Iranians supported Abbasids because they considered Imam Ali Zainul Abideen to be son of their princess which was taken as prisoner by Omer I. So, do you think that Iranian forget that invasion about Omer I and became Sunnis ?

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If you look at the middle east, the ratio between the Shia and Sunni is roughly 60-40% in favour of the Sunni's, which are actually better odds.

The percentage is skewed because of places like Malaysia, Indonesia, and the far east which hold about 300+ muslims. You can not openly practise your faith, nor proselytise. Even in a region like Saudi-Barbaria, the 20% of Shia living there are under intense persecution and barred from good jobs, meaning many have to perform Taqqiyah.

Historically, the followers of ale Muhammed have been butchered and greatly persecuted.

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I must also add, for the Shia, the majority of us follow the twelve Imams. I had read somewhere this was 85-90%. We are united under one Aqeedah and Fiqh [and there's usually only 1% difference between our Ulema on Ijtihad]. The Sunni's on the other hand have several schools of Fiqh, but what is more is that they even differ on fundamental aspects of Aqeedah [Ashari, Maturidi, Athari] and are bitterly divided. The Salafi, Deobandi, Barelvi, Sufi-cults, Nation of Islam, the Nigeria brand of islam and the likes.

We are blessed to all fall under the banner of Jaffer as Sadiq [alayhisalam], who we follow in Fiqh and Aqeedah.

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On ‎07‎/‎11‎/‎2017 at 2:16 PM, islam25 said:

We know that division amongst Muslims started just after the departure of Prophet saww from this world to Allah. And there wasn't clear cut distinction between Sunnis and shias during the the time of ist four kaliphs. But gradully the distinction widened to the extent of emergence of two major sects. Apparently there should be near equal population in two sects.But why there is gross difference in number between two sects. And why conversation from non muslim to Shia muslim is less than to Sunni Muslims. 

Because Sunnism spread by the sword at the hands of tyrannical Sultans and militant Tabligh and Dawah. No other group hade so many tyrants to spread their misguidance. We see this example today from Salafiyyah which they spread their misguidance through money, coercion and war. Same like Twelver Shiism is only Shia majority today because the Safavid conversion of Sha Ismael I who was a tyrant who also spread his misguidance by killing.

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On 11/7/2017 at 12:50 PM, islam25 said:

You have rightly mentioned the causes. 

But why today Shia do not have effective dawah system and centres to invite non-muslim towards true Islam just like sunnis and particularly wahhabies have.

The main propagation of Wahhabism stems from the Saudis pumping out millions of oil dollars around the world. The Shia just do not have these resources, which means (like our entire history) we are fighting an uphill battle against them.

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3 hours ago, alihaydar said:

The main propagation of Wahhabism stems from the Saudis pumping out millions of oil dollars around the world. The Shia just do not have these resources, which means (like our entire history) we are fighting an uphill battle against them.

Mr.you are giving baseless excuse. To spread Islam you do not need nuclear scientists and infrastructure which cost billions of dollar  

You only need good characterd and educated individuals who may invite non-muslim. 

You mean your Islam weak infront of Saudi Riyals. 

To be frank enough we never done such a challenging job of inviting nonMuslims to Islam. Yes we have used great, energy time and effort in criticising those (wahhabies ) who do it. 

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On 11/7/2017 at 11:16 AM, islam25 said:

We know that division amongst Muslims started just after the departure of Prophet saww from this world to Allah. And there wasn't clear cut distinction between Sunnis and shias during the the time of ist four kaliphs. But gradully the distinction widened to the extent of emergence of two major sects. Apparently there should be near equal population in two sects.But why there is gross difference in number between two sects. And why conversation from non muslim to Shia muslim is less than to Sunni Muslims. 

https://sunnah.com/bukhari/60/123

Narrated Abu Sa`id:
The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "You will follow the wrong ways, of your predecessors so completely and literally that if they should go into the hole of a mastigure (lizard), you too will go there." We said, "O Allah's Messenger (ﷺ)! Do you mean the Jews and the Christians?" He replied, "Whom else?" (Meaning, of course, the Jews and the Christians.) [Sahih al-Bukhari 3456]

Let us see what the Christians and Jews did.

Can ye (o ye men of Faith) entertain the hope that they will believe in you?- Seeing that a party of them heard the Word of Allah, and perverted it knowingly after they understood it… Then woe to those who write the Book with their own hands, and then say:"This is from Allah," to traffic with it for miserable price!- Woe to them for what their hands do write, and for the gain they make thereby. (Quran 2:75,79) 
  
There is among them a section who distort the Book with their tongues: (As they read) you would think it is a part of the Book, but it is no part of the Book; and they say, "That is from Allah," but it is not from Allah: It is they who tell a lie against Allah, and (well) they know it! (Quran 3:78) 
  
But those who wronged among them changed [the words] to a statement other than that which had been said to them. So We sent upon them a punishment from the sky for the wrong that they were doing. [quran 7:162]
  
Among the Jews are those who distort words from their [proper] usages and say, "We hear and disobey" and "Hear but be not heard" and "Ra'ina," twisting their tongues and defaming the religion. And if they had said [instead], "We hear and obey" and "Wait for us [to understand]," it would have been better for them and more suitable. But Allah has cursed them for their disbelief, so they believe not, except for a few.[quran 4:46]
 
And [mention, O Muhammad], when Allah took a covenant from those who were given the Scripture, [saying], "You must make it clear to the people and not conceal it." But they threw it away behind their backs and exchanged it for a small price. And wretched is that which they purchased. [Quran 3:187]
 
O People of the Scripture, there has come to you Our Messenger making clear to you much of what you used to conceal of the Scripture and overlooking much. There has come to you from Allah a light and a clear Book.[Quran 5:15]
 
Indeed, those who conceal what We sent down of clear proofs and guidance after We made it clear for the people in the Scripture - those are cursed by Allah and cursed by those who curse[Quran 2:159]
 
Indeed, they who conceal what Allah has sent down of the Book and exchange it for a small price - those consume not into their bellies except the Fire. And Allah will not speak to them on the Day of Resurrection, nor will He purify them. And they will have a painful punishment.[Quran 2:174]

Why is it a surprise that we are the minority? Historically the truth has been followed by very few. I'd recommend you to watch this video.

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From beginning introduction of Shiits not based on doctrine Dawah of sunnis if it was from beginning our Imams tries to do that their method of Dawah is based on good manner &behavior not spending too much money &force they advised us just we show our good manner& behavior our Imams to others and show thier education to others by not using forceful manners if you see Dawah videos on social media the Sunni Dawah Is based on Christian preacher's methods they use everything to increase the quantity not the quality many converts by this method after converting still doesn't have true understanding of basis of Islam we just need that  show them the true manners of our Imams & leave heavy works of mass conversation to sunni bro&sis

Edited by Ashvazdanghe

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47 minutes ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

From beginning introduction of Shiits not based on doctrine Dawah of sunnis if it was from beginning our Imams tries to do that their method of Dawah is based on good manner &behavior not spending too much money &force they advised us just we show our good manner behavior to others and reach thier education to others by not using forceful manners if you see Dawah videos on social media the Sunni Dawah Is based on Christian preacher's methods they use everything to increase the quantity not the quality many converts by this method after converting still oesn't have true understanding of basis of Islam we just need that  show true manners of our Imams to them & leave heavy works of mass conversation to sunni bro&sis

They're very propagandistic, especially the anti Shia ones we all know very well. Often they just lie blatantly.

 

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4 minutes ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

From beginning introduction of Shiits not based on doctrine Dawah of sunnis if it was from beginning our Imams tries to do that their method of Dawah is based on good manner &behavior not spending too much money &force they advised us just we show our good manner behavior to others and reach thier education to others by not using forceful manners if you see Dawah videos on social media the Sunni Dawah Is based on Christian preacher's methods they use everything to increase the quantity not the quality many converts by this method after converting still oesn't have true understanding of basis of Islam we just need that  show true manners of our Imams to them & leave heavy works of mass conversation to sunni bro&sis

Mr.I think you are not correct. Islam from Hazrat Adam as and Till our Prophet saww was completely based on dawah. Invition towards Allah and righteous actions. But unfortunately we failed work on this field. You are right to invite one towards Islam we should have well knowledge and good manners. 

But to be frank enough we failed. What we did is only criticised wahhabies why they spread corrupt Islam. 

Instead of criticising them logic and intellect says we provide non muslim the teachings of true Islam so that they won't go to corrupt form of islam. 

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I personally don't agree with manner of Yaser Al Habib because I don't see any manner of our Imams in his manner he trie to introduce shia islam by insulting Sunnis sacred basis &spread hatred among muslims that none of them is not manner of our Imams they put today minority of shias around the world in danger that will be have more negative infact on shias.

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2 minutes ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

I personally don't agree with manner of Yaser Al Habib because I don't see any manner of our Imams in his manner he trie to introduce shia islam by insulting Sunnis sacred basis &spread hatred among muslims that none of them is not manner of our Imams they put today minority of shias around the world in danger that will be have more negative infact on shias.

Mr.

Yasir Alhabib is not spreading Islam but fitnah and hatred. He is suspect of being Mi6 agent to defame Islam. 

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14 minutes ago, Ashvazdanghe said:

I personally don't agree with manner of Yaser Al Habib because I don't see any manner of our Imams in his manner he trie to introduce shia islam by insulting Sunnis sacred basis &spread hatred among muslims that none of them is not manner of our Imams they put today minority of shias around the world in danger that will be have more negative infact on shias.

 

10 minutes ago, islam25 said:

Mr.

Yasir Alhabib is not spreading Islam but fitnah and hatred. He is suspect of being Mi6 agent to defame Islam. 

Brothers, who is doing more invitation to Islam today then Sheikh Yasser al-Habib? He's written a whole book in Arabic exposing Aisha, which is over 1000 pages long, and so many Sunnis are becoming Shia thanks to him exposing their lies. While others lie around and talk about Shia/Sunni unity, Sheikh Yasser al-Habib is spreading the message of Islam! Did the Imams (as) not curse Yazid and Muawiya? Then why would they not have the same view on their other oppressors, like Abu Bakr and Umar? The Imams (as) also condemned them, and Allah also condemned them in the Quran.

It is narrated to me from Muhammad bin Ja'far, from Yahya bin Zakariyya, from Ali bin Hassaan, from Abdulrahman bin Kathir, from Abi Abdillah al-Sadiq (as) on the words of Allah - And he has made loved to them faith, and it adorns their hearts (49:7) - means Amirul Momineen (as) - and has made hateful to you disbelief, defiance and disobedience (49:7) - means Fulan, Fulan and Fulan (Abu Bakr, Umar and Uthman).

[Tafsir al-Qummi, Ali bin Ibrahim al-Qummi, Printed by Mowsassah al-'Ilmi Beirut year 1435, Page 607]

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4 minutes ago, Mansur Bakhtiari said:

Brothers, who is doing more invitation to Islam today then Sheikh Yasser al-Habib? He's written a whole book in Arabic exposing Aisha, which is over 1000 pages long, and so many Sunnis are becoming Shia thanks to him exposing their lies. While others lie around and talk about Shia/Sunni unity, Sheikh Yasser al-Habib is spreading the message of Islam! Did the Imams (as) not curse Yazid and Muawiya? Then why would they not have the same view on their other oppressors, like Abu Bakr and Umar? The Imams (as) also condemned them, and Allah also condemned them in the Quran.

It is narrated to me from Muhammad bin Ja'far, from Yahya bin Zakariyya, from Ali bin Hassaan, from Abdulrahman bin Kathir, from Abi Abdillah al-Sadiq (as) on the words of Allah - And he has made loved to them faith, and it adorns their hearts (49:7) - means Amirul Momineen (as) - and has made hateful to you disbelief, defiance and disobedience (49:7) - means Fulan, Fulan and Fulan (Abu Bakr, Umar and Uthman).

[Tafsir al-Qummi, Ali bin Ibrahim al-Qummi, Printed by Mowsassah al-'Ilmi Beirut year 1435, Page 607]

He is nothing but source of fitnah. We do not need him. In the clothes Shia he is destroying Islam by propagating hate and disrespecting mujtahids. 

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Just now, islam25 said:

He is nothing but source of fitnah. We do not need him. In the clothes Shia he is destroying Islam by propagating hate and disrespecting mujtahids. 

There is a difference between criticism and disrespect. With the scholars he disagrees with, he is criticizing them from an academic viewpoint, while when those who oppose him can muster up nothing but accusations of being an agent or fitnah mongerer.

His teachings are in line with the teachings of Ahlulbayt (as), and you should bring proof if otherwise.

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Firstly the count doesn't makes you the righteous ones.. Christians have more population and countries than Muslims does that make them one on the right path? ... Sunnis are themselves divided  into too many sects so they all should not be counted as one entity as each one of them beliefs other will go to hell..if u see in right through out the history most people didn't accept the prophets and were given painful chastisement by Allah.. In the time of prophet Nuh a.s how many came to boat?  Majority got drowned.. How many in the time prophet moosa a.s changed their religion when he went to mount tur? Majority turned away... So count has got no value. Quran says 

Surah Ash-Shuara, Verse 174:
إِنَّ فِي ذَٰلِكَ لَآيَةً وَمَا كَانَ أَكْثَرُهُم مُّؤْمِنِينَ

Most surely there is a sign in this, but most of them do not believe.

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37 minutes ago, islam25 said:

He is nothing but source of fitnah. We do not need him. In the clothes Shia he is destroying Islam by propagating hate and disrespecting mujtahids. 

We need people like him in our community... Respect of maraaje is must but think anyone comes attacks ur religion and easily goes away.. If we have people like him most of them will think twice before saying a word against us.. I condemn his act of disrespecting maraaje but his stance on enemies of aale Muhammad a.s should be respected 

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18 minutes ago, Mansur Bakhtiari said:

There is a difference between criticism and disrespect. With the scholars he disagrees with, he is criticizing them from an academic viewpoint, while when those who oppose him can muster up nothing but accusations of being an agent or fitnah mongerer.

His teachings are in line with the teachings of Ahlulbayt (as), and you should bring proof if otherwise.

I know what he teachs and what Ahlebayt as taught. He has no ikhlaq and manners. He is not disagreeing but talking bad that too without proof. 

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8 minutes ago, islam25 said:

I know what he teachs and what Ahlebayt as taught. He has no ikhlaq and manners. He is not disagreeing but talking bad that too without proof. 

What does he say that is against Islam. His thoughts on some scholars does not mean he should be excommunicated from the Shia community, he's done some great work for all of Islam. 

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