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Next Level of Evolution (Embarrassing infidels)

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5 minutes ago, Bakir said:

The qualities you refer to were ocassional, not permanent traits according to our narrations.

As for the examples on fragrance, indeed, that is true. A believer, who can be any person in the world, who performs, for instance, salat ul layl, is said that his body will smell good.

My point is that such blessings are just that, blessings. Not another species, because any human being can reach that level. Thus, it is our actions that differentiate us, not the species we belong to. It is the spiritual version of a person who showers and a person who doesn't shower. One will smell bad and the other good. That doesn't mean their biology is different.

Ok, but are you infallible ? With brain like that of Prophet ? Can you decipher the meaning of Quranic words and also know Bible and Torah at the same time ? No you do not know bro but our Prophet PBUHHP did know and also our 12 Imams....So, it makes them different from you and much better. This is not occasional or is it ?

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6 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

Ok, but are you infallible ? With brain like that of Prophet ? Can you decipher the meaning of Quranic words and also know Bible and Torah at the same time ? No you do not know bro but our Prophet PBUHHP did know and also our 12 Imams....So, it makes them different from you and much better. This is not occasional or is it ?

Prophets' brains are no different from any others. It is the same tool for all, we just use it differently. That doesn't make the tool different.

Infallibles are those who won't fall into any mistakes. This characteristic is linked to human will. It is precisely for that reason that it is valuable. Angels are creatures of light that cannot fall into sin, they are infallible, they have no other choice. Humans do have a choice, they can be infallible or not. We believe the Imams and the Prophet to be Infallibles, but not as angels, but as humans, and precisely in there lies the merit. Precisely for that reason they are the Prophet and the Imams.

Edited by Bakir

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1 minute ago, Sindbad05 said:

Also, they did not learnt from people but were born with inherent knowledge. To me everything is miracle even my hands and tongue and you speaking are miracles too but science call them result of process which required billions of years and what about physical attributes of those Prophets and Imams ???? Science is confused there bro, no answer for this. :( 

Except Quranic, hadith sciences and irfan.

Biology, evolution and human sciences are life sciences,the sciences concerned with the study of living organisms, including biology, botany, zoology, microbiology, physiology, biochemistry, and related subjects.

Sigh...You don't get it do you?

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1 minute ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

Except Quranic, hadith sciences and irfan.

Biology, evolution and human sciences are life sciences,the sciences concerned with the study of living organisms, including biology, botany, zoology, microbiology, physiology, biochemistry, and related subjects.

Sigh...You don't get it do you?

No, until you tell me an answer, did Prophet PBUHHP had better brain than yours or not ? Yes or no....

If you twist around then I think we should leave it here....

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2 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

No, until you tell me an answer, did Prophet PBUHHP had better brain than yours or not ? Yes or no....

Before I do, will you look at this?

قُلْ إِنَّمَا أَنَا بَشَرٌ مِّثْلُكُمْ يُوحَىٰ إِلَيَّ أَنَّمَا إِلَٰهُكُمْ إِلَٰهٌ وَاحِدٌ فَاسْتَقِيمُوا إِلَيْهِ وَاسْتَغْفِرُوهُ ۗ وَوَيْلٌ لِّلْمُشْرِكِينَ - 41:6

قُلْ إِنَّمَا أَنَا بَشَرٌ مِّثْلُكُمْ يُوحَىٰ إِلَيَّ أَنَّمَا إِلَٰهُكُمْ إِلَٰهٌ وَاحِدٌ ۖ فَمَن كَانَ يَرْجُو لِقَاءَ رَبِّهِ فَلْيَعْمَلْ عَمَلًا صَالِحًا وَلَا يُشْرِكْ بِعِبَادَةِ رَبِّهِ أَحَدًا - 18:110

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2 hours ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

@Sindbad05 No, how he (saw) used his brain is different from me but anatomically speaking, we are both human. The difference is spiritual.

Every human being is animal but it does not mean that we are like four legged animal. You acceptance that he used his brain differently points out to the fact that he is not a human like you. :) 

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[Shakir 41:6] Say: I am only a mortal like you; it is revealed to me that your Allah is one Allah, therefore follow the right way to Him and ask His forgiveness; and woe to the polytheists;
[Shakir 18:110] Say: I am only a mortal like you; it is revealed to me that your god is one Allah, therefore whoever hopes to meet his Lord, he should do good deeds, and not join any one in the service of his Lord.
 

Both of the above verses means that eternal is only Allah AWJ and except Allah AWJ everyone is mortal and not God. So, this does not mean that He PBUHHP is like you or me in every way, it is same like I say that Human and animals both belong to animals kingdom. So, this does not make animals like humans are vise versa. 

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15 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

You acceptance that he used his brain differently points out to the fact that he is not a human like you. :) 

Saying that is the equivalent of saying I am not human like you because my brain is different from yours. Plus what you said contradicts the Quran.

By the way, we do in fact belong in the animal kingdom. You would know that if you read a book on biology. We are the ultimate animal.

21 minutes ago, Sindbad05 said:

So, this does not mean that He PBUHHP is like you or me in every way, it is same like I say

But do you know why though? It is from the ismah endowed on Muhammad (saws) and the Ahlulbayt (as), their purity and spirituality is like no other person. Anatomically wise, the Prophet is human, a son of Adam like you and me.

Evolution does not measure spirituality or morality.

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2 hours ago, Gaius I. Caesar said:

Saying that is the equivalent of saying I am not human like you because my brain is different from yours. Plus what you said contradicts the Quran.

By the way, we do in fact belong in the animal kingdom. You would know that if you read a book on biology. We are the ultimate animal.

While we may not be that much different but our Prophet PBUHHP and our Imams really differ a lot. I do not why you cannot differentiate between a mind that does not make mistakes and a mind that makes mistakes such as you and me. 

Although we are ultimate animal but yet we are animals. And, our being ultimate does not end here, as I already told you that the next step should be to attain maximum intellectual capability and even if you connote it to mysticism or spiritualism yet mysticism or spiritualism occurs in brain and so yet again both our brains do not have such power to encompass such spiritual sighting as our Prophet PBUHHP did. So, Prophet PBUHHP is ultimate among Humans and hence we differ according to your definition of ultimate. 

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15 hours ago, Ibn Al-Shahid said:

I don't know why people are so against evolution. It doesn't disprove Allah سبحانه وتعالى

It is problematic with the story of Adam (as).

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The topic you are discussing has nothing to do with evolution of species, but differences between members of the same species. Hitler was as human as, for example, Ayatollah Khomeini.

I wrote a lengthy post, but decided to delete it. You are missing the points. I can only say I am sad that we, muslims, fathers of the scientific method, end up even discussing so poorly.

Let me give you an advice. Obey and respect knowledge, whether it is shaped or presented in a way you dislike or doesn't fit your schemes. Attaining knowledge is a religious duty, not a game.

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31 minutes ago, Bakir said:

The topic you are discussing has nothing to do with evolution of species, but differences between members of the same species. Hitler was as human as, for example, Ayatollah Khomeini.

I wrote a lengthy post, but decided to delete it. You are missing the points. I can only say I am sad that we, muslims, fathers of the scientific method, end up even discussing so poorly.

Let me give you an advice. Obey and respect knowledge, whether it is shaped or presented in a way you dislike or doesn't fit your schemes. Attaining knowledge is a religious duty, not a game.

well if you disagree, I respect your opinion, but in my opinion, I see failure of pro-evolution when they see a thing which is not the result of evolution such as Prophet Jesus a.s who got birth without a father. Secondly, cognitive abilities were counted by the evolution theory as the major development in the process that separates humans from animals and this point I grabbed to tell you that there were human beings who knew past, present and future and were much advanced which is no less telling you that God is not dependent upon evolutionary theory. 

And as for advice, I respect knowledge and that is why I am discussing it here, so your advice is already been honored by me bro. 

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A scientific theory is used to predict results. It is used to explain reality.

A miracle such as that of Jesus is precisely a miracle because it is against the very laws of nature. A man not being burnt when in touch with fire is against natural laws. These are miracles, and they are called miracles for a reason. Science doesn't study nor adapts to miracles. Evolution is a scientific term used in a scientific theory you can't put in doubt through non scientific discourse.

That's the point you are missing, again and again. It is like if I said that prophets and true shias cannot be burnt by fire because there are some traditions in which they defied laws of nature and didn't get burnt. By that narration, I would start a topic in ShiaChat (because you won't find such topics anywhere else in the internet) saying that such men have a special skin that is immune to fire.

Anyway man, I refuse to continue discussing non sense after reasonable explanations were given by several members in a formal way. If we survived the Flat Earth thread, we will survive this one.

Edited by Bakir

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On 11/5/2017 at 12:08 PM, Sindbad05 said:

I see, you mean to say that apes are no longer living right now because we apes transformed into humans to live longer ?

Now science doesn't say that we evolve from apes it says there were apes like people and both human and apes were evolved from them. But again its a science new things come and go. 

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10 hours ago, Bakir said:

A scientific theory is used to predict results. It is used to explain reality.

A miracle such as that of Jesus is precisely a miracle because it is against the very laws of nature. A man not being burnt when in touch with fire is against natural laws. These are miracles, and they are called miracles for a reason. Science doesn't study nor adapts to miracles. Evolution is a scientific term used in a scientific theory you can't put in doubt through non scientific discourse.

That's the point you are missing, again and again. It is like if I said that prophets and true shias cannot be burnt by fire because there are some traditions in which they defied laws of nature and didn't get burnt. By that narration, I would start a topic in ShiaChat (because you won't find such topics anywhere else in the internet) saying that such men have a special skin that is immune to fire.

Anyway man, I refuse to continue discussing non sense after reasonable explanations were given by several members in a formal way. If we survived the Flat Earth thread, we will survive this one.

I see that's non-sense to you, did I invite you to talk here and waste your valuable time since you are prince of your world.  Guess what, that didn't create any impression upon me except that you are too proudy to engage in a debate. SO,  talk to princes like you, and don't waste your time coming here.  Your science deals with the study of physical things but before me it encompasses every aspect whether material or spiritual and it's all encompassing study to learn the manifestation of God's authority. So, if you are feeling that you don't have answers then instead of saying anything nonsense keep calm and move away instead of showing your disappointment that you don't have answer. Thank you.

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10 hours ago, Ron_Burgundy said:

Now science doesn't say that we evolve from apes it says there were apes like people and both human and apes were evolved from them. But again its a science new things come and go. 

I know bro and that's why I am coming with things that science can't explain and show that instead of worshiping a thing that's suspicious, you must take it as a discipline and understand that it's not free from flaws and don't take everything for final.

As for 2 legged ape like animal, they should also have orginated from four legged animal and if you say it's separate creation then I ask why can't you think for Adam a s like that. And if you say they are evolved from four legged then I would say that if Allah wants He could repeal things and produce a higher intellect without letting an evolutionary process such as Jesus a.s talked in cradle and all Jews saw it but an ordinary child don't talk unless he is four.

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1 minute ago, Ibn Al-Shahid said:

Not really. Do we know how Adam (as) descended from heaven onto earth?

There is a debate on whether his Jannah was or wasn't on Earth.

Furthermore, what I meant was it contradicts Adam (as) being the father of all humankind. 

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10 hours ago, Sindbad05 said:

I know bro and that's why I am coming with things that science can't explain and show that instead of worshiping a thing that's suspicious, you must take it as a discipline and understand that it's not free from flaws and don't take everything for final.

As for 2 legged ape like animal, they should also have orginated from four legged animal and if you say it's separate creation then I ask why can't you think for Adam a s like that. And if you say they are evolved from four legged then I would say that if Allah wants He could repeal things and produce a higher intellect without letting an evolutionary process such as Jesus a.s talked in cradle and all Jews saw it but an ordinary child don't talk unless he is four.

Well since can't answer many things. we cannot be certain about anything. 

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1 hour ago, Ron_Burgundy said:

Well since can't answer many things. we cannot be certain about anything. 

Well, I am convinced about religion, however, I doubt science and therefore do not entirely believe whatever is told to me by the scientists.

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On 11/6/2017 at 10:11 PM, E.L King said:

It is problematic with the story of Adam (as).

totally agree with you. with other things, maybe. but not with human beings. From them (Prophet Adam and Hawwa), spread many men and women.

[Shakir 4:1] O people! be careful of (your duty to) your Lord, Who created you from a single being and created its mate of the same (kind) and spread from these two, many men and women; and be careful of (your duty to) Allah, by Whom you demand one of another (your rights), and (to) the ties of relationship; surely Allah ever watches over you.

 

Edited by hoskot

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On 11/6/2017 at 10:11 AM, E.L King said:

It is problematic with the story of Adam (as).

Elaborate. How is it problematic? Do you understand evolution and it's research to this day? Or are you just speaking about tidbits you read here and there? Because some of the posts here arguing against evolution aren't good enough; neither scientifically or philosophically.

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