Jump to content
Christianity

Why should I believe in Muhammad over others?

Rate this topic

Recommended Posts

41 minutes ago, just a muslim said:

since the gospels are not infallible, you may be wrong to believe that jesus was resurrected. correct?

Of course, lots of people are certain Jesus died on the cross and remained dead. However today many christians have been convinced that the Gospels are human testimonies, and as such not infallible. They dissgree on some details, but they agree that Jesus was crucified. ( so does all sources from the first century, only the few nonbiblical first century sources do not mention he was resurrected). From a Muslim view it is difficult to understand that Christians can believe a source that is not infallable. Now, Christians capable of detecting errors in the Bible are also capable of detecting errors in the Quran,  have they read it, so for my part, when it comes to first century and earlier history, I do not find the Quran reliable. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, andres said:

Of course, lots of people are certain Jesus died on the cross and remained dead. However today many christians have been convinced that the Gospels are human testimonies, and as such not infallible. They dissgree on some details, but they agree that Jesus was crucified. ( so does all sources from the first century, only the few nonbiblical first century sources do not mention he was resurrected). From a Muslim view it is difficult to understand that Christians can believe a source that is not infallable. Now, Christians capable of detecting errors in the Bible are also capable of detecting errors in the Quran,  have they read it, so for my part, when it comes to first century and earlier history, I do not find the Quran reliable. 

according to you, the matter of jesus' death/resurrection cant be proven or disproven. so it wouldnt be fair to judge the quran on that. besides, there are historical facts in the quran that were not known in the 7th century. facts dating back to 1000BC and before. but lets keep that aside for now.

what do you mean when you say Gospels? 

how about we talk about matters which CAN be proven to be true or false and check those? or about matters which the Gospels themselves disagree on? hopefully you can provide me with some explanation for them

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, just a muslim said:

according to you, the matter of jesus' death/resurrection cant be proven or disproven. so it wouldnt be fair to judge the quran on that. besides, there are historical facts in the quran that were not known in the 7th century. facts dating back to 1000BC and before. but lets keep that aside for now.

what do you mean when you say Gospels? 

how about we talk about matters which CAN be proven to be true or false and check those? or about matters which the Gospels themselves disagree on? hopefully you can provide me with some explanation for them

There are more than 30 known Gospels. Most of them only known from quotations. The 4 Gospels in the Bible are the only ones from the first century. Except for the Gospel of Peter and Thomas who could also be from the first century, but also as late as 150 AD, theories vary.  These are also interesting, but when I speak about Gospels I mean the 4 in the Bible. Mathew, Mark, Luke and John, written in the period 65-100AD.

The most important differences in my opinion is the Gospels different Christology. Was he born divine or did he become divine. There were already different opinions among Christians. There still is Caholic and Orthodox Church differ on how to define trinity. Other Christians never accepted the trinity dogma. More important for you may be historical contradictions. Read and compare the beginnings of Mathew and Luke. You will find they dont agree on much when it comes to the birth story. Only these two Gospels mention the Virgin birth, written about 80 years after it took place. Other Gospels and epistles, some 20 years older, show no knowledge of this. The Virgin birth is an obvious myth.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, andres said:

There are more than 30 known Gospels. Most of them only known from quotations. The 4 Gospels in the Bible are the only ones from the first century. Except for the Gospel of Peter and Thomas who could also be from the first century, but also as late as 150 AD, theories vary.  These are also interesting, but when I speak about Gospels I mean the 4 in the Bible. Mathew, Mark, Luke and John, written in the period 65-100AD.

The most important differences in my opinion is the Gospels different Christology. Was he born divine or did he become divine. There were already different opinions among Christians. There still is Caholic and Orthodox Church differ on how to define trinity. Other Christians never accepted the trinity dogma. More important for you may be historical contradictions. Read and compare the beginnings of Mathew and Luke. You will find they dont agree on much when it comes to the birth story. Only these two Gospels mention the Virgin birth, written about 80 years after it took place. Other Gospels and epistles, some 20 years older, show no knowledge of this. The Virgin birth is an obvious myth.

 

if there are contradictions in it, how can you trust such a work? 

and how do you know the gospels were written in 65-100 AD?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, just a muslim said:

if there are contradictions in it, how can you trust such a work? 

and how do you know the gospels were written in 65-100 AD?

Human brain is not perfect. The Gospels are written by humans as are all other existing documents on our planet. Therefore one shall be critical. All first century historical documents say Jesus was crucified. This we can be almost certain about. Only the religious dokuments say he was resurrected. Resurection we cannot be certain about. This is a matter of belief. 

There are many ways to decide when documents are written. For instance, if they mention an episode that we know when happened give the earliest date possible. A specular episode that ought to have been mentioned can also be an argument for latest possible date. The language, expressions and writing style also tell a lot.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, andres said:

There are more than 30 known Gospels. Most of them only known from quotations. The 4 Gospels in the Bible are the only ones from the first century. Except for the Gospel of Peter and Thomas who could also be from the first century, but also as late as 150 AD, theories vary.  These are also interesting, but when I speak about Gospels I mean the 4 in the Bible. Mathew, Mark, Luke and John, written in the period 65-100AD.

The most important differences in my opinion is the Gospels different Christology. Was he born divine or did he become divine. There were already different opinions among Christians. There still is Caholic and Orthodox Church differ on how to define trinity. Other Christians never accepted the trinity dogma. More important for you may be historical contradictions. Read and compare the beginnings of Mathew and Luke. You will find they dont agree on much when it comes to the birth story. Only these two Gospels mention the Virgin birth, written about 80 years after it took place. Other Gospels and epistles, some 20 years older, show no knowledge of this. The Virgin birth is an obvious myth.

 

@andres, Quick question. Why do you call yourself a Christian? You are not espousing biblical views.

  • Luke and Matthew do not disagree, they are simply discussing different aspects of the birth story.
  • Why assert the virgin birth is a myth? We're talking about GOD, he can do whatever he wants to do

Muslim friends, Andres claims to be a Christian, but you need to know that he isn't espousing a biblical view. Sure there are scribal errors here and there in the ancient manuscripts and there are a short passage or two in the New Testament which may have been added later (this is noted in the printed text, by the way, not kept secret). But at its core the Bible is trustworthy.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, thegoodman81 said:

Muslim friends, Andres claims to be a Christian, but you need to know that he isn't espousing a biblical view.

Most of us who have been around for a while are aware that @andres has a fairly liberal interpretation of Christianity. We allow for diversity of opinion here, so long as all are respectful and follow the site rules and guidelines. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/14/2017 at 6:37 AM, just a muslim said:

good question. i will give you two answers.

1. the quran is a book from God. and it testifies that muhammad pbuh is a messenger of God, like in surah 48, verse 29.

2. muhammad pbuh made a lot of prophecies, most of which have come true, and none of which have been proven to be wrong. we have a book which mentions all the prophecies made by him pbuh. i dont know if it has been translated in english, but if you understand arabic or urdu by any chance, i can link you to it.

if you have any issue with my premises, such as quran being from God, i would be more than happy to discuss the miraculous nature of the quran and convince you of it if God wills.

Salam, can I have the link to the Arabic book please? Thanks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, thegoodman81 said:

@andres, Quick question. Why do you call yourself a Christian? You are not espousing biblical views.

  • Luke and Matthew do not disagree, they are simply discussing different aspects of the birth story.
  • Why assert the virgin birth is a myth? We're talking about GOD, he can do whatever he wants to do

Muslim friends, Andres claims to be a Christian, but you need to know that he isn't espousing a biblical view. Sure there are scribal errors here and there in the ancient manuscripts and there are a short passage or two in the New Testament which may have been added later (this is noted in the printed text, by the way, not kept secret). But at its core the Bible is trustworthy.  

Seemingly being a person that does not recognise there are contradictions between the Gospels, I am not surprised you do not regard me as a Christian. Fundamentalist often do. There are very many Christians like me. 

Of course God could have had Jesus born by a Virgin. (but why?) However Mathew and Luke clearly were told two different birth stories. Not anybodys fault, and it has no impact on Jesus message.  For example: did Josef and Mary live in Nasareth before Jesus was born, or did they first settle there later? This is not a copy error.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, thegoodman81 said:

Sure there are scribal errors here and there in the ancient manuscripts and there are a short passage or two in the New Testament which may have been added later (this is noted in the printed text, by the way, not kept secret). But at its core the Bible is trustworthy.  

سبحان الله

“And with those who say, We are Christians, We made a covenant, but they neglected a portion of what they were reminded of, therefore We excited among them enmity and hatred to the day of resurrection; and Allah will inform them of what they did.”

Al-Qur’an Al-Kareem,

Surah al-Ma’ida,

Verse 14

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am a convert to Shiism from Sunnism, but my conversion took place about 9 years ago, and so it is difficult for me to get back into the mindset of what initially brought me over, as I have matured and developed so much throughout the years. In Islam in general, I liked that it was a sophisticated, full-circle, holistic, and comprehensive worldview and way of life. It never leaves one without guidance, on nearly every aspect of one's life, from the mundane to the complex. How to make the best out of life and society is all delineated in a relatively clear and consistent way.  Some may find that constricting, but I think order is the highest function of human life, in that our minds incline towards Order (categorization, systematization, theorization, discipline, cleanliness, organization, language, and logic). These are some of man's highest expressions, and we feel dissatisfied with confusion, disorganization, and laziness. Ethics is but a branch of aesthetics, and in order and symmetry we find beauty and peace. Despite its vast complexity, Islam appealed to every part of the world, and was practiced closely and consistently for many centuries, which suggests that the regimen it brings is constructed to fit human nature and human convention. It is a robust tradition in a world that is constantly changing to the whims of the masses and the market. I can't fathom something like that being fabricated by one man or a group of men, because that would require superhuman foresight and clairvoyance. There is also an insistence on preserving the teachings as they are, so this was not a religion that was founded by accident over a long period of time by many different influences, this was truly (in its essence) the teaching of one man, who saw the completion of his religion in his lifetime, over a 23 year period.

In Shiism I found myself drawn to the men and women who were able to manifest those highest principles of Islam in their wisdom, nobility, chivalry, modesty, eloquence, discipline, mercy, justice, bravery, devotion, self-reflection, and countless other qualities. They truly were the Speaking Quran. But they were not only teachers who talked the talk, but actually walked the walk. They suffered in indescribable ways, by murder, imprisonment, exile, robbery, the loss of friends and relatives; but in the midst of that suffering, they maintained their composure and their humanity, and kept to the virtues that they espoused. Most of us just give up and retire if we are insulted or mildly threatened, but they encountered incredible hardship and remained moving forward until their martyrdoms. Their lives were not recorded by anonymous authors decades or centuries after the fact; they were surrounded by thousands of students that documented their lives and were dazzled by their character. They taught me that love is paired with suffering, that intelligence is paired with humility, that words are paired with beauty (in calligraphy, in eloquence, in poetry, in scripture), that justice is paired with mercy, that hardship is paired with purification, that hope is paired with fear; and you see these tropes consistently throughout all of our books and the lives of the ma`sumeen.

Outside of the overstated scientific miracles of the Quran, I found that it was a very precise and mathematical work with incredible depth. Every stroke carries meaning, and the smallest change of vowels or words can ruin the entire structure of the book. Maybe Arabic is not your mother tongue, but if you understand Arabic, I suggest you take a chapter of the Quran, then compare it to a chapter from the Arabic Bible, or an Arabic newspaper article. I have tested this with non-Arabic non-Muslim speakers and even they can distinguish the Quran from these other writings just by listening to them all read plainly. Sunni speakers like Nouman Ali Khan have a lot of interesting videos in English on the Quran's literary structure, but one simple example that I am very impressed by is the chiastic ring-composition of Surat al-Baqara, or the amount of times certain words are used:

 

Beyond that, the Quran's focus on ethical lessons through rhyming stories makes it very memorable, practical, and appealing to our minds (Jungian psychology and Joseph Campbell's monomyth), and this is often more effective than the Bible's structure, which focuses much more on detail, names and places, genealogy, and chronology. The Quran has a timeless element to it.

The prophecy that Muhammad (s) claimed for himself was that he was the fulfillment of Deuteronomy 18:18 - that is to say, he was the Prophet Like Unto Moses - and there were many uncontrollable circumstances in his life that made him similar to Moses. They were both raised in aristocratic homes rather than their parental home, they both attained prophethood at 40, they were both forced to flee from their homeland, they were both law-givers, they both took part in combat against polytheists, they were both were accepted by their respective peoples, they both achieved victory in this world, and they both had an "Aaron" - who was their eloquent, blood-related vizier, and the father of their descendants. There are many other biblical prophecies that came long before the Prophet which seem to indicate the events of his life, Isaiah 42 is a prominent one, which speaks of the coming of a man who will guide Arabia from polytheism.

The Prophet described the signs of the End Times with a spooky level of precision: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8JQqXf-Jv8

Our books were written during the times of the Imams, often under their approval and supervision, and so there are strong historiographical arguments that our sources truly reflect what the Imams espoused. This includes the many miracles attributed to them. This is in contrast to many other religions, where myth develops long after the historical figures have perished.

The qualities of the enemies of the Ahl al-Bayt are often in stark contrast to them. While the Imams walked the walk, they had foes that were, even according to neutral sources, conceited, gluttonous, cunning, selfish, corrupt, degenerate, and scared of everything. A good exercise is to look at the life of Imam Ali, and then look at the lives of those who fought them - look at any sources you'd like on either, and you'll still see what true belief and true hypocrisy does to a person. If Imam Ali was the chief student of Muhammad (s), who was with him from the beginning of the message till the end, then I too want to follow Muhammad (s), because Ali (as) had all of the characteristics that I want in myself, and even his detractors could not find a single aspect of his personality to criticize.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, andres said:

Seemingly being a person that does not recognise there are contradictions between the Gospels, I am not surprised you do not regard me as a Christian. Fundamentalist often do. There are very many Christians like me. 

Of course God could have had Jesus born by a Virgin. (but why?) However Mathew and Luke clearly were told two different birth stories. Not anybodys fault, and it has no impact on Jesus message.  For example: did Josef and Mary live in Nasareth before Jesus was born, or did they first settle there later? This is not a copy error.

It's not a copy error, no, but there also is no contradiction there. Just because Matthew said they moved there without specifying it as a return doesn't mean that they didn't live there before going to Bethlehem and onto Egypt. 

I agree that there are apparent contradictions but virtually all have a reasonable, perspectival explanation. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, thegoodman81 said:

It's not a copy error, no, but there also is no contradiction there. Just because Matthew said they moved there without specifying it as a return doesn't mean that they didn't live there before going to Bethlehem and onto Egypt. 

I agree that there are apparent contradictions but virtually all have a reasonable, perspectival explanation. 

After having been refugees in Egypt, Josef decides to go home. When Josef hears that Archelaus was the new king in Judea, (Judea is home!) he decides to settle in Galilea. In Nazareth.

 

But when Herod died, behold, an angel of the Lord *appeared in a dream to Joseph in Egypt, and said,
20 "Get up, take the Child and His mother, and go into the land of Israel; for those who sought the Child's life are dead."
21 So Joseph got up, took the Child and His mother, and came into the land of Israel.
22 But when he heard that Archelaus was reigning over Judea in place of his father Herod, he was afraid to go there. Then after being warned by God in a dream, he left for the regions of Galilee,
23

and came and lived in a city called Nazareth. This was to fulfill what was spoken through the prophets: "He shall be called a Nazarene."

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/14/2017 at 5:50 AM, Christianity said:

Many people have claimed some kind of divine revelation throughout history, so in that respect Muhammad is no unique. I want to know your reasons for choosing Islam over any other religion, and why I should chose it. Why should we believe in Muhammad over Zoroaster, or Buddha, or Mani, or Joseph Smith, or Ellen G. White? How is Muhammad superior to these other "prophets"? How did he prove himself? What makes him unique? 

Why not? 

What do you need to believe in his prophethood, from a unique book to miracles to excellent organization and morals, ask what do you need :) 

Dead sea scrolls:

22627698_1135745876556919_522732951_n.png

Edited by M.IB

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, thegoodman81 said:

I agree that there are apparent contradictions but virtually all have a reasonable, perspectival explanation. 

The historical contradictions between the two Birth narratives cannot be explained away, but Lukes story is by far the most plausible story. Luke reports:

The Roman Emperor had decided a sensus of all people under his rule to be made. Because Josef was a decendant of King David  Mary and Josef had to go to  Bethlehem in Judea to be registered. During this stayJesus was born. Even Luke has problems:

Luke says the sensus tok place when Quirinius was in charge of Roman Syrian and Herod the Great was King of Judea (part of Roman Syria). We know that  Archelaus was fired and Quirinius appointed 6AD. We also know that Herod died 4BC. According to Mathew, Jesus was born when Herod was still alive, which means no later than 4BC.  If Lukes info that the sensus was made under Quirinius rule is correct, Jesus was born after 6AD

Jesus was born in a Barn, because all lodging in small Bethlehem was occupied. David had of course many descendants. Was it really necessary for them at all to go to Bethlehem? We have no indications this was ever so. Instead agents travelled to wherever people lived, making the registration on spot. 

Matthews story, the three astrologers and the Star , the killing of all children in Rama and escape to Egypt, Luke does not mention. Nor does any of the other NT Books. Or contemporary records. Luke and Mathew were 1st century humans. There was no internet to look up when the sensus took place, when Quirinius started his job, or if there was a bright new Star on heaven 80 years before they wrote their Gospels. But does this invalidate both entire Gospels? Of course not. It really does not matter if Jesus was born before or after year zero. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, andres said:

The historical contradictions between the two Birth narratives cannot be explained away (I don't see why not, given how shaky dating is for all events in the ancient world), ......
But does this invalidate both entire Gospels? Of course not. It really does not matter if Jesus was born before or after year zero. 

@andresI'm glad to see you don't write the Gospels off entirely. I'm glad you agree that the minute details such as what year Jesus was born don't affect any doctrine. But why would you go so far as to presume that the miracles reported were mythical? The miracles throughout the Bible do affect the core truth of Christianity. How do you, as a confessing Christian, justify throwing out the miraculous intervention of God throughout human history? 

Please don't read that in an angry tone, I am genuinely perplexed at how or why one would be a Christian without believing the Bible at face value regarding miracles. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Also, @andres, because I don't want you to think I'm ignoring what you said earlier, I agree that at first glance it would seem there is a factual discrepancy between the two accounts.

If you dig just a little deeper, you will see there is a very reasonable potential scenario that explains all of this, without any great acrobatics of the imagination. It is very possible that Quirinius was in charge of Syria at two different times. Scholars don't even know for certain who was governing Syria from approximately 4 - 1 BCE. Quirinius was already active in politics at that time (in fact, serving as a duumviri a "joint legate," apparently stationed in Pisidian Antioch (in modern day Turkey). From this position it is not a stretch to speculate that Quirinius was serving in a provisional gubernatorial role [possibly even a shared role] over Syria while simultaneously leading a lengthy campaign against the Homonadenses as legate of Galatia (also in Turkey). He served in this role from about 5 BC to 3 BC. Keeping in mind that ancient dates are all approximate, this makes it very plausible that he did indeed govern Syria in some capacity while Herod was still alive, even if he did not make it onto history's list of officially appointed Governors.

As a brother in Christ, I urge you not to be so quick to jump to the conclusions that the Bible is in error. It was inspired by the Holy Spirit, after all. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, notme said:

Most of us who have been around for a while are aware that @andres has a fairly liberal interpretation of Christianity. We allow for diversity of opinion here, so long as all are respectful and follow the site rules and guidelines. 

Okay, as long as you are aware! Obviously I'm new here, and I suppose it's obvious now that I have a much more conservative view. In fact, my view is much closer to what the Qur'an espouses in 5:47. Namely, that the Injeel is trustworthy enough that it should be the basis by which Christians make their judgements and decisions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, thegoodman81 said:

As a brother in Christ, I urge you not to be so quick to jump to the conclusions that the Bible is in error. It was inspired by the Holy Spirit, after all. 

سبحان الله

“Certainly they disbelieve who say: Surely Allah is the third (person) of the three; and there is no god but the one Allah, and if they desist not from what they say, a painful chastisement shall befall those among them who disbelieve.”

Al-Qur’an Al-Kareem,

Surah al-Ma’idah,

Verse 73

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, M.IB said:

Why not? 

What do you need to believe in his prophethood, from a unique book to miracles to excellent organization and morals, ask what do you need :) 

Dead sea scrolls:

@M.IB, can you please provide a verse reference for the quotation in the image you put up? I've read the whole Bible several times, haven't seen Ahmad in there yet! So naturally I'm skeptical about that translation. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, thegoodman81 said:

Okay, as long as you are aware! Obviously I'm new here, and I suppose it's obvious now that I have a much more conservative view. In fact, my view is much closer to what the Qur'an espouses in 5:47. Namely, that the Injeel is trustworthy enough that it should be the basis by which Christians make their judgements and decisions.

سبحان الله

Quote

Surah al-Ma’idah, Verse 47

وَلْيَحْكُمْ أَهْلُ الإِنجِيلِ بِمَا أَنزَلَ اللّهُ فِيهِ وَمَن لَّمْ يَحْكُم بِمَا أَنزَلَ اللّهُ فَأُوْلَـئِكَ هُمُ الْفَاسِقُونَ 

47. "So the people of the Evangel should judge by what Allah has sent down in it, and those who do not judge by what Allah has sent down, those are they that are the evil-doers."

Those Who Do not Judge on the Divine Law

After referring to the revelation of Evangel in the former verses, in this verse the Qur'an says:

"So the people of the Evangel should judge by what Allah has sent down in it...."

The objective meaning of this statement is that: after the revelation of Evangel to Jesus (as), Allah ordered the followers of it to act accordingly and judge by what He had sent down in it.

Then, at the end of the verse, it emphasizes again and says:

"... and those who do not judge by what Allah has sent down, those are they that are the evil-doers."

Source: https://www.al-islam.org/enlightening-commentary-light-holy-quran-vol-4/surah-al-maidah-chapter-5-introduction

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kazemi, @Kazemi, what is your point? 

If you read Sura 5, verses 43-47, it is very clear that Muhammad is saying the Jews should judge by their own scripture, and the Christians should judge by their own scripture. It is clear from the orderly flow of ideas. 

I am glad that the Qur'an claims to be a clear revelation. This means we can take it at face value, and should not have to seek explanation. Kazemi my friend, you should read the Bible and seek within it the guidance and light that you have been promised. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Qa'im said:

I am a convert to Shiism from Sunnism, but my conversion took place about 9 years ago, and so it is difficult for me to get back into the mindset of what initially brought me over, as I have matured and developed so much throughout the years. In Islam in general, I liked that it was a sophisticated, full-circle, holistic, and comprehensive worldview and way of life. It never leaves one without guidance, on nearly every aspect of one's life, from the mundane to the complex. How to make the best out of life and society is all delineated in a relatively clear and consistent way.  Some may find that constricting, but I think order is the highest function of human life, in that our minds incline towards Order (categorization, systematization, theorization, discipline, cleanliness, organization, language, and logic). These are some of man's highest expressions, and we feel dissatisfied with confusion, disorganization, and laziness. Ethics is but a branch of aesthetics, and in order and symmetry we find beauty and peace. Despite its vast complexity, Islam appealed to every part of the world, and was practiced closely and consistently for many centuries, which suggests that the regimen it brings is constructed to fit human nature and human convention. It is a robust tradition in a world that is constantly changing to the whims of the masses and the market. I can't fathom something like that being fabricated by one man or a group of men, because that would require superhuman foresight and clairvoyance. There is also an insistence on preserving the teachings as they are, so this was not a religion that was founded by accident over a long period of time by many different influences, this was truly (in its essence) the teaching of one man, who saw the completion of his religion in his lifetime, over a 23 year period.

In Shiism I found myself drawn to the men and women who were able to manifest those highest principles of Islam in their wisdom, nobility, chivalry, modesty, eloquence, discipline, mercy, justice, bravery, devotion, self-reflection, and countless other qualities. They truly were the Speaking Quran. But they were not only teachers who talked the talk, but actually walked the walk. They suffered in indescribable ways, by murder, imprisonment, exile, robbery, the loss of friends and relatives; but in the midst of that suffering, they maintained their composure and their humanity, and kept to the virtues that they espoused. Most of us just give up and retire if we are insulted or mildly threatened, but they encountered incredible hardship and remained moving forward until their martyrdoms. Their lives were not recorded by anonymous authors decades or centuries after the fact; they were surrounded by thousands of students that documented their lives and were dazzled by their character. They taught me that love is paired with suffering, that intelligence is paired with humility, that words are paired with beauty (in calligraphy, in eloquence, in poetry, in scripture), that justice is paired with mercy, that hardship is paired with purification, that hope is paired with fear; and you see these tropes consistently throughout all of our books and the lives of the ma`sumeen.

Outside of the overstated scientific miracles of the Quran, I found that it was a very precise and mathematical work with incredible depth. Every stroke carries meaning, and the smallest change of vowels or words can ruin the entire structure of the book. Maybe Arabic is not your mother tongue, but if you understand Arabic, I suggest you take a chapter of the Quran, then compare it to a chapter from the Arabic Bible, or an Arabic newspaper article. I have tested this with non-Arabic non-Muslim speakers and even they can distinguish the Quran from these other writings just by listening to them all read plainly. Sunni speakers like Nouman Ali Khan have a lot of interesting videos in English on the Quran's literary structure, but one simple example that I am very impressed by is the chiastic ring-composition of Surat al-Baqara, or the amount of times certain words are used:

 

Beyond that, the Quran's focus on ethical lessons through rhyming stories makes it very memorable, practical, and appealing to our minds (Jungian psychology and Joseph Campbell's monomyth), and this is often more effective than the Bible's structure, which focuses much more on detail, names and places, genealogy, and chronology. The Quran has a timeless element to it.

The prophecy that Muhammad (s) claimed for himself was that he was the fulfillment of Deuteronomy 18:18 - that is to say, he was the Prophet Like Unto Moses - and there were many uncontrollable circumstances in his life that made him similar to Moses. They were both raised in aristocratic homes rather than their parental home, they both attained prophethood at 40, they were both forced to flee from their homeland, they were both law-givers, they both took part in combat against polytheists, they were both were accepted by their respective peoples, they both achieved victory in this world, and they both had an "Aaron" - who was their eloquent, blood-related vizier, and the father of their descendants. There are many other biblical prophecies that came long before the Prophet which seem to indicate the events of his life, Isaiah 42 is a prominent one, which speaks of the coming of a man who will guide Arabia from polytheism.

The Prophet described the signs of the End Times with a spooky level of precision: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8JQqXf-Jv8

Our books were written during the times of the Imams, often under their approval and supervision, and so there are strong historiographical arguments that our sources truly reflect what the Imams espoused. This includes the many miracles attributed to them. This is in contrast to many other religions, where myth develops long after the historical figures have perished.

The qualities of the enemies of the Ahl al-Bayt are often in stark contrast to them. While the Imams walked the walk, they had foes that were, even according to neutral sources, conceited, gluttonous, cunning, selfish, corrupt, degenerate, and scared of everything. A good exercise is to look at the life of Imam Ali, and then look at the lives of those who fought them - look at any sources you'd like on either, and you'll still see what true belief and true hypocrisy does to a person. If Imam Ali was the chief student of Muhammad (s), who was with him from the beginning of the message till the end, then I too want to follow Muhammad (s), because Ali (as) had all of the characteristics that I want in myself, and even his detractors could not find a single aspect of his personality to criticize.

Salam Alaikum.

What is the significance of the Quran mentioning the word 'day' 365 times? The Hijri calendar only has 360 days, right? So why did the Quran use the Christian calendar?

Thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, thegoodman81 said:

Kazemi, @Kazemi, what is your point? 

If you read Sura 5, verses 43-47, it is very clear that Muhammad is saying the Jews should judge by their own scripture, and the Christians should judge by their own scripture. It is clear from the orderly flow of ideas. 

I am glad that the Qur'an claims to be a clear revelation. This means we can take it at face value, and should not have to seek explanation. Kazemi my friend, you should read the Bible and seek within it the guidance and light that you have been promised. 

سبحان الله

By Allah,

He who created the Qur’an,

Clear and Wise,

The verses are an indication,

An indication of the original Light of the Injeel and Torah,

Before it’s destruction by desire of wealth by people,

An eye for an eye,

Isa held the truth of the Torah,

Before it was altered by desire of wealth by people,

Indeed,

Oh you who believe,

In the crucified theory,

Which by my life and the spheres,

Is false and wrong,

The Holy verses,

By the Messenger to the Prophets,

Jibraeel,

Does not mention the Christians and the Jews,

As judges by their own scriptures,

But indeed,

Allah is the judge for all creations,

For He sent the Holy Books,

As a reminder to the Ummah,

Of Musa and Isa,

And after their mission has passed,

The Prophets and the saints have accepted,

The Holy Books,

By the Merciful Lord,

Every Messenger and Prophet has not been sent,

But as a reminder to their Ummah,

They are in submission to their Lord,

Indeed,

I submit myself to The God,

Allah,

al-Rahman ar-Raheem,

Who has made Makkah,

The Mother of the Cities,

And I shall ask forgiveness to Him,

Until He knows.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Recent Posts on ShiaChat!

    • Salaaam Alaykum,    So I have a SoundCloud for my fav latmiyah for Farsi, Arabic and Urdu. InshaAllah i might even go for a premium account in the future and let me know how they are For Arabic and Farsi -  click below   For Urdu - click below   THANK YOU AND TAKE CARE YA'LL 
    • Salam. Umn al-Baneen AS is well known for her love and loyalty toward the Holy Prophet SA, Fatima Zahra AS, Imam Ali AS, Imam Hassan AS, and Imam Hussein AS. No doubt that Imam Ali AS loved her because she loved Ahlul Bayt AS.  http://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/37432-umm-al-baneen-sa/
    • Members are unaware of many inappropriate posts that banned members made in the past, because Moderators removed those posts from the forums. 
    • Guest Zahra
      Salam! Did Imam Ali (as) love Um al baneen like he loved Fatima al zahra? Or did he marry her just so that she could take care of Imam Hussein and imam Hassan? 
    • Hi Mosa, Thanks for your reply! Sorry to say we have not received your email, might be due to a maintenance that our SMTP server was running. Please Contact me on my temporary email for any urgent issues : techie.world99@gmail.com Thanks
×