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Hadith on black clothes in Muharram

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8 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

Fact is that you have nothing in your books to conclude that black is haram or even markrooh. That's why the Nawasib's used ahadith from our books some of which are mentioned by brother Shuaybi. Otherwise you would have provided me the ahadith from your own books or quoted verses of Quran in support of your claim that wearing black is haram or makrooh.

On the other hand, I have presented before you verses of Quran from chapter 5, a famous hadith "innamal a'amaalo bin-niyaat". You, in no way claim that the mourning for Imam Hussain (a.s) in any manner (weeping as well as wearing black dress) is an act of imitating the Jews or Christians as none of them mourn for Imam Hussain (a.s) & none of them believe on his status as mentioned in the mutawatir & muttafiq alaih ahadith of Prophet Muhammad (peace & blessings of Allah be upon him & his pure progeny).

It were "so called" muslims, who killed the grandson of Prophet & his companions, imprisoned the ahlul bayt (a.s). And we see the same that the objection on mourning for Imam Hussain (a.s) comes from the lovers of same "so called muslims" who love to criticize every style of mourning including shedding tears for Imam-e-Mazloom (a.s).

 

Would you dress like a Jew? Would you dress like a Orthodox Christian or use clothes like the Pope? There's something called Fiqh which is above hadiths. The fact is that it is not permissible to dress like a Jew with their payots, hats and tzi tzi unless you want to be one of them.

Didn't the Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w.s) ordered people to leave the beard and trim the moustache? You know why he did? Because the Zoroastrians used to shave their beards and leave the moustache long.

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8 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

Fact is that you have nothing in your books to conclude that black is haram or even markrooh. That's why the Nawasib's used ahadith from our books some of which are mentioned by brother Shuaybi. Otherwise you would have provided me the ahadith from your own books or quoted verses of Quran in support of your claim that wearing black is haram or makrooh.

On the other hand, I have presented before you verses of Quran from chapter 5, a famous hadith "innamal a'amaalo bin-niyaat". You, in no way claim that the mourning for Imam Hussain (a.s) in any manner (weeping as well as wearing black dress) is an act of imitating the Jews or Christians as none of them mourn for Imam Hussain (a.s) & none of them believe on his status as mentioned in the mutawatir & muttafiq alaih ahadith of Prophet Muhammad (peace & blessings of Allah be upon him & his pure progeny).

It were "so called" muslims, who killed the grandson of Prophet & his companions, imprisoned the ahlul bayt (a.s). And we see the same that the objection on mourning for Imam Hussain (a.s) comes from the lovers of same "so called muslims" who love to criticize every style of mourning including shedding tears for Imam-e-Mazloom (a.s).

 

Would you dress like a Jew? Would you dress like a Orthodox Christian or use clothes like the Pope? There's something called Fiqh which is above hadiths. The fact is that it is not permissible to dress like a Jew with their payots, hats and tzi tzi unless you want to be one of them.

Didn't the Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w.s) ordered people to leave the beard and trim the moustache? You know why he did? Because the Zoroastrians used to shave their beards and leave the moustache long.

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9 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

Fact is that you have nothing in your books to conclude that black is haram or even markrooh. That's why the Nawasib's used ahadith from our books some of which are mentioned by brother Shuaybi. Otherwise you would have provided me the ahadith from your own books or quoted verses of Quran in support of your claim that wearing black is haram or makrooh.

On the other hand, I have presented before you verses of Quran from chapter 5, a famous hadith "innamal a'amaalo bin-niyaat". You, in no way claim that the mourning for Imam Hussain (a.s) in any manner (weeping as well as wearing black dress) is an act of imitating the Jews or Christians as none of them mourn for Imam Hussain (a.s) & none of them believe on his status as mentioned in the mutawatir & muttafiq alaih ahadith of Prophet Muhammad (peace & blessings of Allah be upon him & his pure progeny).

It were "so called" muslims, who killed the grandson of Prophet & his companions, imprisoned the ahlul bayt (a.s). And we see the same that the objection on mourning for Imam Hussain (a.s) comes from the lovers of same "so called muslims" who love to criticize every style of mourning including shedding tears for Imam-e-Mazloom (a.s).

 

Would you dress like a Jew? Would you dress like a Orthodox Christian or use clothes like the Pope? There's something called Fiqh which is above hadiths. The fact is that it is not permissible to dress like a Jew with their payots, hats and tzi tzi unless you want to be one of them.

Didn't the Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w.s) ordered people to leave the beard and trim the moustache? You know why he did? Because the Zoroastrians used to shave their beards and leave the moustache long.

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34 minutes ago, SunniBrother said:

Would you dress like a Jew? Would you dress like a Orthodox Christian or use clothes like the Pope? There's something called Fiqh which is above hadiths. The fact is that it is not permissible to dress like a Jew with their payots, hats and tzi tzi unless you want to be one of them.

Didn't the Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w.s) ordered people to leave the beard and trim the moustache? You know why he did? Because the Zoroastrians used to shave their beards and leave the moustache long.

Mr . Regarding dress each culture and country have different dress. How do you expect a person living in siberia should have same dress as of Arabs. 

Dress should full fill it's purpose of covering body. 

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5 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

"the khuff, the turban, and the cloak"

How you apply these exceptions in modern society? Or you want to propagate that Islam is the religion limited to Arabs only & limited to 1400 years old society or only scholors can get benefit of these exceptions?

I want to see your response on these questions.

I am not sure how this is related to my original question. I am not proposing we wear the dress of Arabs 1400 years ago. But that does bring up the question of why the Shia scholars wear the turban and cloak in today's modern society? But this is besides the point.

5 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

And thats why our scholars have never declared wearing black dress in the mourning for Imam e mazloom as haram or makrooh but encouraged people to wear black dresses.

Do you follow the "scholars" or ahlul bayt (as)? On what basis have they encouraged people to wear black dress?

6 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

It has value because of the fact that people recognize black color as a sign of mourning from distant past.

We don't follow the traditions of people from distant past. 

5 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

I think every scholor of shia fiqh has been exited out of wilayah of Aimma e Tahireen (a.s) because no scholor prohibits the shia people from wearing black dress.

That is for you and the "scholars" to think about. It is not outside the realm of possibility. 

I have presented you the hadith and you can keep finding defects in them all day long. Wear black if you like and are confident you can defend your action on the day of judgement. As for me, this is a confusing matter. I don't see any merit. I will avoid it. I am confident I can defend myself in this matter. For I am 100% sure ahlul bayt will NOT be displeased with me for NOT wearing black. They never ordered it. Or at least I have yet to see proof of it.

Imam Jafar Sadiq (as) said, ‘In the case of doubt, it is better to refrain from performing an act than to become destroyed by performing it’. [Source: Usool e Kafi Kitab e Aql chapter 22 hadith 10]

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1 hour ago, shuaybi said:

I am not sure how this is related to my original question. I am not proposing we wear the dress of Arabs 1400 years ago. But that does bring up the question of why the Shia scholars wear the turban and cloak in today's modern society? But this is besides the point.

Do you follow the "scholars" or ahlul bayt (as)? On what basis have they encouraged people to wear black dress?

We don't follow the traditions of people from distant past. 

That is for you and the "scholars" to think about. It is not outside the realm of possibility. 

I have presented you the hadith and you can keep finding defects in them all day long. Wear black if you like and are confident you can defend your action on the day of judgement. As for me, this is a confusing matter. I don't see any merit. I will avoid it. I am confident I can defend myself in this matter. For I am 100% sure ahlul bayt will NOT be displeased with me for NOT wearing black. They never ordered it. Or at least I have yet to see proof of it.

Imam Jafar Sadiq (as) said, ‘In the case of doubt, it is better to refrain from performing an act than to become destroyed by performing it’. [Source: Usool e Kafi Kitab e Aql chapter 22 hadith 10]

This article deals with your concerns comprehensively. 

http://www.valiasr-aj.com/english/shownews.php?idnews=251#_ftnref16

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10 hours ago, SunniBrother said:

Would you dress like a Jew? Would you dress like a Orthodox Christian or use clothes like the Pope?

I am living in a society where people irrespective of their religions, wear shalwar kameez or pant shirt or kurta pajama etc. 

Only Scholors of any religion wear the dresses made specific for them. So your point is very strange. How many christians wear dress like pope? Any idea of percentage?

Even if I start wearing the dress of pope, it will not make me a christian. It will not make me a mushrik. Do you forgot the verse of Quran which mentions a momin who have concealed his faith? How he dress himself? 

Surah Ghafir, Verse 28:
وَقَالَ رَجُلٌ مُّؤْمِنٌ مِّنْ آلِ فِرْعَوْنَ يَكْتُمُ إِيمَانَهُ أَتَقْتُلُونَ رَجُلًا أَن يَقُولَ رَبِّيَ اللَّهُ وَقَدْ جَاءَكُم بِالْبَيِّنَاتِ مِن رَّبِّكُمْ وَإِن يَكُ كَاذِبًا فَعَلَيْهِ كَذِبُهُ وَإِن يَكُ صَادِقًا يُصِبْكُم بَعْضُ الَّذِي يَعِدُكُمْ إِنَّ اللَّهَ لَا يَهْدِي مَنْ هُوَ مُسْرِفٌ كَذَّابٌ

And a believing man of Firon's people who hid his faith said: What! will you slay a man because he says: My Lord is Allah, and indeed he has brought to you clear arguments from your Lord? And if he be a liar, on him will be his lie, and if he be truthful, there will befall you some of that which he threatens you (with); surely Allah does not guide him who is extravagant, a liar:
(English - Shakir)

10 hours ago, SunniBrother said:

Didn't the Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w.s) ordered people to leave the beard and trim the moustache? You know why he did? Because the Zoroastrians used to shave their beards and leave the moustache long.

If you think this is the "hikmat" behind the command of keeping the beards, then I can only laugh on your mental faculty.

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7 hours ago, shuaybi said:

I am not sure how this is related to my original question. I am not proposing we wear the dress of Arabs 1400 years ago. But that does bring up the question of why the Shia scholars wear the turban and cloak in today's modern society? But this is besides the point.

:) I am not going to explain it. Let your brain work on this question.

It is related to your original question in many ways. You are saying wearing black dress except the three things mentioned in hadith, are either makrooh or haram. And you want & demanding people to quit this practice. For that, you need to answer these sort of many questions.

7 hours ago, shuaybi said:

Do you follow the "scholars" or ahlul bayt (as)? On what basis have they encouraged people to wear black dress?

You think you're following the ahlul bayt (a.s)? Presenting before us the work of Scholars who have collected the ahadith or you have listened these words from the holy mouths of our Imams? Do you know whom Imam was addressing to? Do you know what he means here?

This means you understand yourself free from taqleed. You have spent a great amount of time in understanding the true meanings & mukhatab of these ahadith. 

7 hours ago, shuaybi said:

We don't follow the traditions of people from distant past. 

Surah Al-Fatiha, Verse 7:
صِرَاطَ الَّذِينَ أَنْعَمْتَ عَلَيْهِمْ غَيْرِ الْمَغْضُوبِ عَلَيْهِمْ وَلَا الضَّالِّينَ

The path of those upon whom Thou hast bestowed favors. Not (the path) of those upon whom Thy wrath is brought down, nor of those who go astray.
(English - Shakir)

Is there any limit of time in "sirat allathina an'amta alaihim"? 

7 hours ago, shuaybi said:

That is for you and the "scholars" to think about. It is not outside the realm of possibility. 

I have presented you the hadith and you can keep finding defects in them all day long. Wear black if you like and are confident you can defend your action on the day of judgement.

What I have done in responding you is to expose the DEFECTS in your approach. 

There can be many ways to understand those ahadith which looks contradicting to each other and contradicting with the verses of Quran. 

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The following link also has some important information:

http://www.islamquest.net/en/archive/question/fa6393

"Black was a sign of the Abbasids during their reign, the majority of Muslims were forced into wearing identically colored turbans as their rulers. The Imams (as) were in opposition to this and only wore black when forced to as a result of taqiyah(dissimulation/concealing one’s faith). Davood Raqee narrates: “The Shia always questioned Imam Sadiq (as) regarding wearing black clothing. Once, I saw the Imam (as) sitting while clothed in a black jubbah (loose-fitting clothing that is worn over the rest of one’s clothes), a black hat, and a pair of black khaf (leather socks) with black cotton lining. He said: ‘Render your heart white and you may wear whatever you please.’ Saduq, a prominent Shia narrator of hadith explains: ‘The Imam performed this action out of compulsion and taqiyah. He said this as a result of accusations that had been made against him on behalf of the enemy, for the Imam does not consider the wearing of black clothes to be permissible.’” [5]

Ibn Anbah writes that Seyyid Radhiyy was the first Talebiyy that used the color black as a sign. “و هو اول طالبی جعل علیه السواد”.[6] From this passage we understand that before Seyyid Razi, seyyeds did not use the color black as a sign or symbol. Thus, Seyyed Radhiyy was the initiator of using the color black as a symbol.

Only after Seyyed Radhiyy, did using the color black amongst seyyids and those from the tribe of Bani Hashem become customary. Seyyed Radhiyy, was born in the year 359 and died in the year 406 (hijri); meaning that the use of this symbol amongst seyyids became common sometime around the fourth century. Before the time of Seyyed Radhiyy, seyyids did not associate themselves with the color black. As mentioned, one of the reasons for this was their movement against Bani Abbas who had adopted the color black as a sign for themselves. This resulted in narrations regarding the wearing black clothes as being makruh.

Also, it has been narrated that the Prophet (pbuh) wore different colors of turbans. One example is a white colored turban which was generally referred to as Sahab (cloud).[7] In history, we find significant figures who lived at the advent of Islam as wearing white turbans. For example: Ali ibn Husein (as) (Imam Sajjad), Salem bin Abdullah, Saeed bin Jabeer, and Kharjeh bin Zayd all wore white colored turbans.

During the time of Imam Reza (as), green was a symbolic color amongst the Alawiyys (followers of the Imams), and thus wearing a green turban became widespread.[8]

Some deem that kings of the Safavi dynasty in Iran, designated the use of black turbans amongst seyyids as to continually symbolize and mourn oppression that occurred against their ancestor, Imam Hussein (as).[9] The problem with this opinion is that this claim does not correspond with the cultural norms of the Iranian people; for during the time of mourning they wear black clothes, not black turbans."

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2 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

He said: ‘Render your heart white and you may wear whatever you please.’

These are the words of Imam Sadiq (a.s). And sheikh Sudooq (r.a), who was a prominent scholar explained this hadith as:

2 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

Saduq, a prominent Shia narrator of hadith explains: ‘The Imam performed this action out of compulsion and taqiyah. He said this as a result of accusations that had been made against him on behalf of the enemy, for the Imam does not consider the wearing of black clothes to be permissible.’

Whom you follow here @shuaybi? The words of Imam or explanation of Scholar?

Wasa’ilul-Shia, vol. 4, chapter 19, hadith 5469: “کانت الشیعة تسأل اباعبداللَّه(ع) عن لبس السواد قال فوجدناه قاعدا علیه جبة سوداء و قلنسوة سوداء و خف اسود مبطن سبواد... ثم قال: بیض قلبک والبس ما شئت، قال الصدوق: فعل ذلک کله تقیة لانه کان متهما عند الاعداء بانه لا یری لبس السواد...

Edited by Salsabeel

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I understand that brother shuaybi has asked a relatively simple question. 
He is asking if there is a Hadith of Imams asking MEN to wear Black clothes as a sign of mourning. 
And logically in support of his question he is quoting a Hadith which acutally points out that the Prophet said that 
"Black (clothing) is disliked except in three: the sandal/footwear, the turban, and the cloak."

And another Hadith from Imam Jafar Sadik, clears up things,who also said, 
"Wearing dark red and black dress is abominable (Makrooh), especially at the time of offering prayers" (Bihar al-Anwar, 15:56).

.. then those who wear black during Muharram, do they change their dress during prayers?

To sum it up,
There are clear Hadith against wearing Black, now i am also not sure if there are any suggesting to wear Black.

Wassalam

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On 9/29/2017 at 0:44 AM, Salsabeel said:

It is related to your original question in many ways. You are saying wearing black dress except the three things mentioned in hadith, are either makrooh or haram. And you want & demanding people to quit this practice. For that, you need to answer these sort of many questions.

I am not demanding that people quit the practice. They can do whatever they like or however their chosen scholars "guide" them. I am asking for a single hadith where the Imams have instructed us to mourn for Imam Hussain (s) wearing black clothes. Such hadith would also need to specify when or the number of days that such dress should be worn. It would also mention the merits/reward. Just like how there are clear hadith on the merits of Ziyarat of Imam Hussain, the days on which it is recommended and its associated merits/rewards.

Without hadith I don't see how an action has any weight/value in front of the ahlul bayt (s) and thus Allah سُبْحَانَهُ وَ تَعَالَى. Please give me an example of a mustahab action that is NOT derived from hadith?

On 9/29/2017 at 0:44 AM, Salsabeel said:

You think you're following the ahlul bayt (a.s)? Presenting before us the work of Scholars who have collected the ahadith or you have listened these words from the holy mouths of our Imams? Do you know whom Imam was addressing to? Do you know what he means here?

I refer to those scholars who guide me to the hadith of ahlul bayt (as). Those who quote the hadith along with the context (if any). That is the only way that I know of to follow the ahlul bayt (as).

On 9/29/2017 at 0:44 AM, Salsabeel said:

This means you understand yourself free from taqleed. You have spent a great amount of time in understanding the true meanings & mukhatab of these ahadith. 

You seem to do "taqleed" of your scholars. In that case, why are you debating with me on this topic with your own research and logic. Why don't you go to your "scholars" and bring from them the detailed reasoning and explanations. Then simply present that to me. 

On 9/29/2017 at 0:44 AM, Salsabeel said:

The path of those upon whom Thou hast bestowed favors. Not (the path) of those upon whom Thy wrath is brought down, nor of those who go astray.
(English - Shakir)

Is there any limit of time in "sirat allathina an'amta alaihim"? 

I have the following hadith on this verse:

Imam Jafar having said regarding the Words of Allah the Mighty and Majestic, in Al-Hamd: 'The path of those You have Bestowed Bounties upon'.  It means, Muhammad (s) and his Progeny (as) [Source: Tafseer Noor Al Saqalayn – CH 1 – H 101]

In any case, black clothes were worn by tyrants of the distant past (Firaun, Bani Abbas). They are in the category of those who incurred the wrath of Allah.

On 9/29/2017 at 0:44 AM, Salsabeel said:

What I have done in responding you is to expose the DEFECTS in your approach. 

My approach is to ask for authentic hadith of Masumeen (as) and submit to it.

Edited by shuaybi

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On 27/09/2017 at 10:50 PM, SunniBrother said:

No such book called bible in the Qur'an, if you're referring to the Injil (Good news) of Isa(a.s) then yes. Yes in the Qur'an I am commanded to believe that previous scriptures where sent to previous nations but that the Qur'an abrogated those scriptures and the previous scriptures are corrupted. Yes I believe in Isa (a.s) and Musa (a.s) because the Prophet (s.a.w.s) and Allah told me so, had they said not to believe in previous prophets I wouldn't.

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Here is article of why they use black - http://newtheologicalmovement.blogspot.com.br/2012/10/why-priests-ought-to-wear-black.html?m=1

_____

Black is the color of Death for them. There's no such thing in Islam. This carries a religious connotation that doesn't belong in Islam. The Prophet (s.a.w.s) used to wear black, was he (s.a.w.s) using black to represent death?

____

Here is a hadith in how we are commanded to oppose them - Ibn Abbas (r.a) narrated, Prophet (s.a.w.s) said;
Fast the Ashura, and oppose Jews by fasting one day before or one day after!
Narrated in Musnad Ahmad

Wait a second. The Jews dont just wear black for their death. They wear black all year round due to the destruction of the Second Temple. The remainders of that temple is the western wall. The same wall our Prophet when he prayed. Will you say that our beloved Prophet imitated the Jews and that was wrong. I don't think so. Anyways the reason why Jews wear black is because they are mourning for their Baitullah which is different to the death. Peace 

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6 hours ago, shuaybi said:

. I am asking for a single hadith where the Imams have instructed us to mourn for Imam Hussain (s) wearing black clothes. Such hadith would also need to specify when or the number of days that such dress should be worn. It would also mention the merits/reward. Just like how there are clear hadith on the merits of Ziyarat of Imam Hussain, the days on which it is recommended and its associated merits/rewards.

 Can you quote me a single hadith of Imams instructing us to wear turban & cloak? Such hadith would also need to specify when or number of days that these two things should be worn. It would also mention the merits/rewards.

6 hours ago, shuaybi said:

You seem to do "taqleed" of your scholars.

Yes, but I am not blind neither my mental faculties are exhausted. The link to detailed answer has been provided. 

6 hours ago, shuaybi said:

have the following hadith on this verse:

Imam Jafar having said regarding the Words of Allah the Mighty and Majestic, in Al-Hamd: 'The path of those You have Bestowed Bounties upon'.  It means, Muhammad (s) and his Progeny (as) [Source: Tafseer Noor Al Saqalayn – CH 1 – H 101]

Yes it means the Holy Prophet & his pure progeny (peace & blessings of Allah be upon them). And the hadith "Awwalo ma khalaq Allaho noori" as well as numerious other ahadith, mention existence of their anwar e muqaddasa from distant past.

6 hours ago, shuaybi said:

My approach is to ask for authentic hadith of Masumeen (as) and submit to it.

You must avoid travelling into planes & trains. Because our Imams have not used these means for travelling neither they mentioned/instruct us to use planes or trains or cars nor they have mentioned the marits/rewards on travelling on these means of transportation & travelling.

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6 hours ago, shuaybi said:

Such hadith would also need to specify when or the number of days that such dress should be worn. It would also mention the merits/reward. Just like how there are clear hadith on the merits of Ziyarat of Imam Hussain, the days on which it is recommended and its associated merits/rewar

There are numerious ahadith which mentions the merits/rewards for mourning on Imam e Mazloom a.s

 

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l did a hadith search. Black and clothes only comes up a few times in Sahih Bukhari and Sahih Muslim together.

l do have a question from this: What is a "Khamisa" ?

Shukran

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22 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

Can you quote me a single hadith of Imams instructing us to wear turban & cloak? Such hadith would also need to specify when or number of days that these two things should be worn. It would also mention the merits/rewards.

No I have not come across any such hadith. That is why I don't consider it necessary to wear that dress. Neither is it forbidden. 

22 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

Yes, but I am not blind neither my mental faculties are exhausted.

Ok but I just don't see the point of you exercising your mental faculty when the scholar under whose taqleed you are under presumably has already done so. Isnt he more knowledgeable, spent more time than you, and examined a wider variety of sources? Are you competing with your own scholar? Or is it that he does not share his research and reasoning with you.

22 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

The link to detailed answer has been provided. 

Which link are you referring to? Is it a link from the scholar whose taqleed you are under?

22 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

You must avoid travelling into planes & trains. Because our Imams have not used these means for travelling neither they mentioned/instruct us to use planes or trains or cars nor they have mentioned the marits/rewards on travelling on these means of transportation & travelling.

Did you contact your scholar (whose taqleed you are under) before you boarded for the first time a car, plane, train, etc and ask him for his opinion/verdict? If he allowed you, did he provide proof/evidence from hadith and quran? What about all other modern innovations and conveniences like phone, computer, microwave, tv, etc. For each of them did you first ask permission from your scholar?

The reason I travel in planes & trains is because I have not come across any hadith prohibiting them. I understand that there is no reward/merit for it either. The reason I don't wear black is because of prohibition from hadith. 

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46 minutes ago, shuaybi said:

No I have not come across any such hadith. That is why I don't consider it necessary to wear that dress. Neither is it forbidden. 

How do you know that the Imams would dislike wearing of black dresses in observing the mourning for Imam e Mazloom? And how do you know that the exceptions are limited to those three things tuban, cloak etc? We see a case of exception in the following hadith as well as a clear command:

On 9/29/2017 at 3:58 PM, Salsabeel said:

Wasa’ilul-Shia, vol. 4, chapter 19, hadith 5469: “کانت الشیعة تسأل اباعبداللَّه(ع) عن لبس السواد قال فوجدناه قاعدا علیه جبة سوداء و قلنسوة سوداء و خف اسود مبطن سبواد... ثم قال: بیض قلبک والبس ما شئت، قال الصدوق: فعل ذلک کله تقیة لانه کان متهما عند الاعداء بانه لا یری لبس السواد...

 

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14 hours ago, Salsabeel said:

Wasa’ilul-Shia, vol. 4, chapter 19, hadith 5469: “کانت الشیعة تسأل اباعبداللَّه(ع) عن لبس السواد قال فوجدناه قاعدا علیه جبة سوداء و قلنسوة سوداء و خف اسود مبطن سبواد... ثم قال: بیض قلبک والبس ما شئت، قال الصدوق: فعل ذلک کله تقیة لانه کان متهما عند الاعداء بانه لا یری لبس السواد...

Let me translate the above again:

“کانت الشیعة تسأل اباعبداللَّه(ع) عن لبس السواد قال فوجدناه قاعدا علیه جبة سوداء و قلنسوة سوداء و خف اسود مبطن سبواد... ثم قال: بیض قلبک والبس ما شئت، قال الصدوق: فعل ذلک کله تقیة لانه کان متهما عند الاعداء بانه لا یری لبس السواد...”
The Shias used to ask Abu Abdullah (a.s.) about wearing the black (clothes). He (the narrator) said, ‘So we found him (a.s.) seated, (and) upon him (a.s.) was a black overcoat and a black cap, and black socks padded with black (there is a typo error in the Arabic. Then he (a.s.) said: ‘Whiten your hear and wear whatever you so desire to’. Al Sadouq said, ‘He (a.s.) did all that in Taqiyya (dissimulation), because he (a.s.) was arraigned in the presence of the enemies by that he (a.s.) had not been seen wearing the black (clothes).

This hadith is even more proof that Imam's disliked wearing black.

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7 hours ago, shuaybi said:

This hadith is even more proof that Imam's disliked wearing black.

:) You are free to do whatever you want my dear brother. But dont try to translate the words of Imam wrongly. In this hadith the words of Imam are just:

7 hours ago, shuaybi said:

 بیض قلبک والبس ما شئت،

 

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The hadith is saying is that the Imam wore black and it was done in Taqiyyah. There is no reference to mourning or to Muharram. Surely, this hadith can not be the BASIS on which the Shias started wearing black for mourning Imam Hussain.

So far - not a single hadith with reference to: black + mourning + imam hussain (as)

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5 hours ago, shuaybi said:

The hadith is saying is that the Imam wore black and it was done in Taqiyyah. There is no reference to mourning or to Muharram. Surely, this hadith can not be the BASIS on which the Shias started wearing black for mourning Imam Hussain.

So far - not a single hadith with reference to: black + mourning + imam hussain (as)

Your argument would've carried some weight, if you had categorically showed a narrative form the Imam (as) forbidding wearing black clothes during muharram. So, therefore with absent of a hadith forbidding wearing black clothes during muharram, your debate at this stage is very weak to say the least. 

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