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2 hours ago, SunniBrother said:

What Hanafis? Fake Hanifas of mixed Shafi'i and Hanbali opinion or authentic Hanafis?

Authentic Hanafis!

India and Pakistan have only Hanafis.

There are no Shafis, Hambalis or Malikis in those two countries.

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9 hours ago, SunniBrother said:

Yes. Ali is superior to all Sahabas. Imam Shafi'i made poems of praise of him. Early Ahl al Sunnah was very fond of him

So you know Imam Ali will never be wrong. And if you take a same hadith you could say that Bibi Fatima (a.s) will above all sahaba since she belongs to a same family. 

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7 hours ago, baqar said:

Authentic Hanafis!

India and Pakistan have only Hanafis.

There are no Shafis, Hambalis or Malikis in those two countries.

They not really Hanifas in Indo-Pak. They a mix of Shafi'i and Hanbali.

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5 hours ago, SunniBrother said:

They not really Hanifas in Indo-Pak. They a mix of Shafi'i and Hanbali.

You are wrong. I have lived in India all my life.

Indian and Pakistani Sunnis are ALL Hanafis.

And they believe that the spiritual order of the first four caliphs is the same as the chronological order.   

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2 hours ago, baqar said:

You are wrong. I have lived in India all my life.

Indian and Pakistani Sunnis are ALL Hanafis.

And they believe that the spiritual order of the first four caliphs is the same as the chronological order.   

I am not wrong. They think that criticizing blasphemy law earn you death penalty. When this was the position of Abu Hanifa, Maturudi and Tahawi that there is no death for dhimmis. They pick the hardest opinions of the 4 schools and call that Hanifa.

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2 hours ago, baqar said:

And they believe that the spiritual order of the first four caliphs is the same as the chronological order.   

This proves nothing, this is basic Sunni believe and that's basic Sunni believe and there is divergence on the issue, even Salafis and Wahhabis believe this!

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7 hours ago, SunniBrother said:

I am not wrong. 

OK then could you say clearly which of the four groups believes that  spiritually 

  • Imam Ali was the best among Muslims  or
  • he is number four.  

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20 hours ago, baqar said:

You are wrong. I have lived in India all my life.

Indian and Pakistani Sunnis are ALL Hanafis.

And they believe that the spiritual order of the first four caliphs is the same as the chronological order.   

The spiritual order is derived from the chronological order.

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10 hours ago, baqar said:

OK then could you say clearly which of the four groups believes that  spiritually 

  • Imam Ali was the best among Muslims  or
  • he is number four.  

Imam Ali a.s. was number one all the time. Imamate is higher than caliphate.

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1 hour ago, Faruk said:

The spiritual order is derived from the chronological order.

I know but Sunni Brother does not agree. That is why I asked him to say exacty which Sunnnis believe what you are saying and which Sunnis believe that Imam Ali was the best among them.

I hope he will respond. 

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On 9/21/2017 at 8:38 AM, hoskot said:

i found this mind-boggling verse (at least, it is to my mind) - twice believed then twice disbelieved.

[Shakir 4:137] Surely (as for) those who believe then disbelieve, again believe and again disbelieve, then increase in disbelief, Allah will not forgive them nor guide them in the (right) path.

does this verse applicable to companions? if yes, any historical records, who were they?

i was wondering, what great events could have taken place that triggered sahaba to:-

1. disbelieved, the first time.

2. then believed again

3. then disbelieved for the second time

4. then increased in their disbelief

ghadir khum and the demise of the Prophet, are likely candidates, IMHO.

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