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13 minutes ago, Ron_Burgundy said:

So do sunni people even read quran?

I think you are totally under estimating Sunni scholars they have perfected some sophisticated arguments in the defense of the Sahaba,  I might strongly disagree with them there but it would be foolish to think that they are ignorant or simplistic

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2 minutes ago, Panzerwaffe said:

I think you are totally under estimating Sunni scholars they have perfected some sophisticated arguments in the defense of the Sahaba,  I might strongly disagree with them there but it would be foolish to think that they are ignorant or simplistic

Well i would love to ear their point of view. 

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You will have to do some research on your own brother stay away from people like ibn taymiyyah 

Look into works of ibn athir and ibn hajar... you can look up the biographies of the more controversial companions

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2 minutes ago, Panzerwaffe said:

You will have to do some research on your own brother stay away from people like ibn taymiyyah 

Look into works of ibn athir and ibn hajar... you can look up the biographies of the more controversial companions

I will look into it. 

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21 hours ago, just a muslim said:

how do you define a sahabi?

my definition is same but I don't say that all sahabas are good. I do say some of them were munafiq. Since quran says that so you can't deny it. 

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1 hour ago, Ron_Burgundy said:

my definition is same but I don't say that all sahabas are good. I do say some of them were munafiq. Since quran says that so you can't deny it. 

agreed. 

would you agree that we dont know who the munafiqeen were unless Allah or the prophet pbuh told us? 

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2 hours ago, Panzerwaffe said:

Please elaborate that's interesting 

Ahmad Ibn Hanbal defined the mainstream notion of Sahabas used by Sunnis today, he was friend of Bukhari who took a similar stance on the issue, that a Sahabi is anyone who saw the Prophet (s.a.w.s) even if only for a second and died believing in him. Before that the Sahabas wasn't well defined too Sunnis. It's ironic thou that Ahmad made a comprehensive ranking of sahabas based on the time, merits, virtues, their deeds to help Islam, etc and he regarded Ali (a.s) as the highest ranking Sahabi based on that classifications, the ironic part is that majority of Muslims today dropped this type of analyzes and got brainless putting all sahabas on equal footing. There is several reasons why this happened, is just to long and complex for me to discuss here and I lack the tools to provide all references of why that happened.

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^ I agree with his definition that anyone is a companion who saw the prophet as a Muslim even for a second.It makes sense in the way companions were defined in that day and age

 

What I don't agree with is that companions should always be given the benefit of the doubt when they commit sins they should be evaluated just like any other person

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19 minutes ago, Panzerwaffe said:

What I don't agree with is that companions should always be given the benefit of the doubt when they commit sins they should be evaluated just like any other person

That view is ignoring the Ranks he gave them. The companions are merely to derive Sunnah. So the highest the rank the more reliable is the person. So Ali (a.s) is the most reliable. Early Sunnis where more worried in preserving the Sunna and Theology and developing Islam. Sadly it did not go so smoothly along the line because of the various sectarians war and corrupt caliphates.

Edited by SunniBrother

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i found this mind-boggling verse (at least, it is to my mind) - twice believed then twice disbelieved.

[Shakir 4:137] Surely (as for) those who believe then disbelieve, again believe and again disbelieve, then increase in disbelief, Allah will not forgive them nor guide them in the (right) path.

does this verse applicable to companions? if yes, any historical records, who were they?

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7 hours ago, SunniBrother said:

Ahmad Ibn Hanbal defined the mainstream notion of Sahabas used by Sunnis today, he was friend of Bukhari who took a similar stance on the issue, that a Sahabi is anyone who saw the Prophet (s.a.w.s) even if only for a second and died believing in him. Before that the Sahabas wasn't well defined too Sunnis. It's ironic thou that Ahmad made a comprehensive ranking of sahabas based on the time, merits, virtues, their deeds to help Islam, etc and he regarded Ali (a.s) as the highest ranking Sahabi based on that classifications, the ironic part is that majority of Muslims today dropped this type of analyzes and got brainless putting all sahabas on equal footing. There is several reasons why this happened, is just to long and complex for me to discuss here and I lack the tools to provide all references of why that happened.

can you refer me to where imam ahmad said ali as was the highest ranking companion? and where he made this classification of sahaba?

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1 hour ago, hoskot said:

i found this mind-boggling verse (at least, it is to my mind) - twice believed then twice disbelieved.

[Shakir 4:137] Surely (as for) those who believe then disbelieve, again believe and again disbelieve, then increase in disbelief, Allah will not forgive them nor guide them in the (right) path.

does this verse applicable to companions? if yes, any historical records, who were they?

yes. the hypocritical companions. 

no record of who they were afaik.

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31 minutes ago, just a muslim said:

yes. the hypocritical companions. 

no record of who they were afaik.

salam akhi

indeed, a very unfortunate thing, no record i mean. otherwise could be a lesson for us, the later generation. may Allah guides us all to the true path.

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42 minutes ago, just a muslim said:

can you refer me to where imam ahmad said ali as was the highest ranking companion? and where he made this classification of sahaba?

Abdullah bin Ahmad ibn Hanbal said -

I asked my father what credence he had concerning the preferential merits of the companions? He replied:

In the matter of caliphate, Abu Bakr, ‘Umar and ‘Uthman are superior to all others.

I asked him what about ‘Ali ? He answered:

O my son! ‘Ali bin Abi Talib is from a family concerning whom (whose merits) no one can deliberate

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4 minutes ago, SunniBrother said:

O my son! ‘Ali bin Abi Talib is from a family concerning whom (whose merits) no one can deliberate

In other words, in his belief, he was not prepared to grade Imam Ali along with the rest of the companions.  So in his view, he regarded Imam Ali as possibly superior to all other Sahaba.

Right? 

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12 minutes ago, SunniBrother said:

Abdullah bin Ahmad ibn Hanbal said -

I asked my father what credence he had concerning the preferential merits of the companions? He replied:

In the matter of caliphate, Abu Bakr, ‘Umar and ‘Uthman are superior to all others.

I asked him what about ‘Ali ? He answered:

O my son! ‘Ali bin Abi Talib is from a family concerning whom (whose merits) no one can deliberate

where is this from? which book?

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1 hour ago, baqar said:

In other words, in his belief, he was not prepared to grade Imam Ali along with the rest of the companions.  So in his view, he regarded Imam Ali as possibly superior to all other Sahaba.

Right? 

Yes. Ali is superior to all Sahabas. Imam Shafi'i made poems of praise of him. Early Ahl al Sunnah was very fond of him

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