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Salam 

I've heard that the Bible translated in Arabic is Illah and not Allah so is this true.

and we also have 1 prophet and 12 imams and together it's 13 and in Christianity 13 is a bad number i don't know why but I've heard it's a good day in Islam right?

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Salaam,

Actually we have 14 infallibles: the Prophet, Lady Fatima, and the 12 Imams. We have 124,000 prophets in total. In Islam, we do not have superstitions around 13.

As for the Arabic Bible, they use the word "Allah" for God: http://copticchurch.net/cgibin/bible/index.php?version=SVD&r=Genesis+1

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5 minutes ago, Qa'im said:

Salaam,

Actually we have 14 infallibles: the Prophet, Lady Fatima, and the 12 Imams. We have 124,000 prophets in total. In Islam, we do not have superstitions around 13.

As for the Arabic Bible, they use the word "Allah" for God: http://copticchurch.net/cgibin/bible/index.php?version=SVD&r=Genesis+1

Thanks for the answer 

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On 6/8/2017 at 5:32 PM, Tryingtolearn said:

Salam 

I've heard that the Bible translated in Arabic is Illah and not Allah so is this true.

and we also have 1 prophet and 12 imams and together it's 13 and in Christianity 13 is a bad number i don't know why but I've heard it's a good day in Islam right?

I believe if you check the ancient Hebrew the prefix is "El" is used. I assume the prefixes El, Al, and Il all come from the same root, but were determined by those who chose. Hebrew has no vowels, thus nobody really knows the proper pronunciation. 

Triskaidekaphobes claim Eve betrayed Adam on a Friday, and Judas was the 13th guest at the last supper, ...voila. It is also murmured, (for lack of any evidence whatsoever, therefore cannot be disputed), that Cain killed Abel on a Friday 13th. 

There are significant numbers mentioned in the Bible for various purposes, but 13 isn't one of them. 

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9 hours ago, Son of Placid said:

I believe if you check the ancient Hebrew the prefix is "El" is used. I assume the prefixes El, Al, and Il all come from the same root, but were determined by those who chose. Hebrew has no vowels, thus nobody really knows the proper pronunciation. 

My impression is that the pronounciation of "Jahwe" is uncertain, but that the pronounciation of  "El" is not.

Exodus 6:

"I revealed myself to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob as Ēl Shaddāi, but was not known to them by my name, YHVH."

More info:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_(deity)

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On 6/12/2017 at 3:14 AM, andres said:

My impression is that the pronounciation of "Jahwe" is uncertain, but that the pronounciation of  "El" is not.

Exodus 6:

"I revealed myself to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob as Ēl Shaddāi, but was not known to them by my name, YHVH."

More info:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_(deity)

It still doesn't put vowels in the Hebrew language, so I'm guessing it's *L, and *L, and *L, dependent on who told the story. It's not uncommon for groups to form their own dialect. 

Check Parisian French to Quebecois, then check New Brunswick French, (50% anglaise), but if you actually do check any, you have to check the language spoken in Gaspésie. Part of Quebec, but whoever taught French to the people had a hair lip and taught the entire community to sound like he did. If you've had any experience with people with a hair lip, it's actually quite a distraction. You will find yourself asking for a repeat. It's hilarious but they don't think so.

 

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4 hours ago, Son of Placid said:

It still doesn't put vowels in the Hebrew language, so I'm guessing it's *L, and *L, and *L, dependent on who told the story. It's not uncommon for groups to form their own dialect. 

Check Parisian French to Quebecois, then check New Brunswick French, (50% anglaise), but if you actually do check any, you have to check the language spoken in Gaspésie. Part of Quebec, but whoever taught French to the people had a hair lip and taught the entire community to sound like he did. If you've had any experience with people with a hair lip, it's actually quite a distraction. You will find yourself asking for a repeat. It's hilarious but they don't think so.

 

There are dialects. Naturally "El" was pronounced differently, but no more different than how Americans and Englishmen pronounce "can't". When it comes to JHWE we no longer know if it was Jahve or Jehova, different words. (a witness family  knocked on our door half an hour ago)

 

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On 2017-6-8 at 7:32 PM, Tryingtolearn said:

Salam 

I've heard that the Bible translated in Arabic is Illah and not Allah so is this true.

and we also have 1 prophet and 12 imams and together it's 13 and in Christianity 13 is a bad number i don't know why but I've heard it's a good day in Islam right?

Prophet Muhammad is mentioned many times in the Bible and the Gospel as well the 12 imams. 

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2 hours ago, AfricanShia said:

Prophet Muhammad is mentioned many times in the Bible and the Gospel as well the 12 imams. 

Wrong. Muhammed is not mentioned in the Bible. Nor are the 12 Imams. Muhammed is mentioned in the Quran, but I guess the 12 Imams are not. Or where in the Quran is such text to be found?

Edited by andres

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37 minutes ago, andres said:

Wrong. Muhammed is not mentioned in the Bible. Nor are the 12 Imams. Muhammed is mentioned in the Quran, but I guess the 12 Imams are not. Or where in the Quran is such text to be found?

Quran  repeatedly mentions that Muhammad is described in the Torah and in the Gospel and go and read Dueteronomy if you think im wrong. 

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3 hours ago, AfricanShia said:

Quran  repeatedly mentions that Muhammad is described in the Torah and in the Gospel and go and read Dueteronomy if you think im wrong. 

I could not say concerning the Quran, but could you give the reference to one verse where  the Quran say so?

If the Quran really does, the Quran is certainlt wrong. No chanse you have found examples where the Bible speaks about Muhammed and the 12 Imams.

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1 hour ago, andres said:

I could not say concerning the Quran, but could you give the reference to one verse where  the Quran say so?

If the Quran really does, the Quran is certainlt wrong. No chanse you have found examples where the Bible speaks about Muhammed and the 12 Imams.

Yes Brother. It is in Deuteronomy. Please read Deuteronomy and you will see that im truthful. Muhammad is the one whom is identified as unlettered and if you look at the Hebrew version he is called by his name: Muhammadim. Also in Dueteronomy as in Surah 2:124 of the Quran, God mentions of the 12 chieftains (12 imams) after raising Abraham's degree to an Imam and revealing to him the Covenant which is about these 12 chieftains which means 12 leaders and the English definition of Imam is leader or it can be identified as chief as well. :) . Please read Deuteronomy and mark the areas that mentions what im mentioning and you will understand what I mean. Please :)

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5 hours ago, AfricanShia said:

Yes Brother. It is in Deuteronomy. Please read Deuteronomy and you will see that im truthful. Muhammad is the one whom is identified as unlettered and if you look at the Hebrew version he is called by his name: Muhammadim. Also in Dueteronomy as in Surah 2:124 of the Quran, God mentions of the 12 chieftains (12 imams) after raising Abraham's degree to an Imam and revealing to him the Covenant which is about these 12 chieftains which means 12 leaders and the English definition of Imam is leader or it can be identified as chief as well. :) . Please read Deuteronomy and mark the areas that mentions what im mentioning and you will understand what I mean. Please :)

There's like 34 chapters to Deuteronomy, I think he wants you to be a bit more specific. I'm not sure you don't have the Imams mixed up with the 12 tribes of Israel. 

Quote

 

11 And the vision of all is become unto you as the words of a book that is sealed, which men deliver to one that is learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I cannot; for it is sealed:

12 And the book is delivered to him that is not learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I am not learned.

 

I've heard this before, but...

Which men are they that deliver (a) book, and who is the learned man who won't break the seal?

Are these the same men who deliver it to the man that can't read? If you don't know all of them, you don't know any of them. All these "men" are hypothetical, it's the actions around these men that the chapter is explaining.

You have to go back and look at context.

Quote

 

Yet I will distress Ariel, and there shall be heaviness and sorrow: 

And the multitude of all the nations that fight against Ariel, even all that fight against her and her munition, and that distress her, shall be as a dream of a night vision. It shall even be as when an hungry man dreameth, and, behold, he eateth; but he awaketh, and his soul is empty: or as when a thirsty man dreameth, and, behold, he drinketh; but he awaketh, and, behold, he is faint, and his soul hath appetite:

 

You see, the comparison of what the nation of Ariel will face, (as in a vision), is like going to bed hungry and dreaming of eating, only to wake up still hungry. They will want what they cannot have. In the same sense, they will be given a sealed book. The learned man can't read because he can't open a seal, the unlearned man can't read it anyway. They can't learn what they should know. 

The "book" mentioned, transliterated from the Hebrew is "say'-fer" and it describes just about any kind of book, document, scroll, even letter of divorce. "Lo yaw-kole'" from the Hebrew in this case basically means "incapable", (the learned man could not open the seal.) "ash-er'", describing the unlearned man, is translated to English as "him", but in the actual text it means, "whom" in a masculine form. "whom" is not an unlettered prophet, he's just some dude that can't read. 

The nation of Ariel fought against Mount Zion continuously, God confounded them and spread them like dust. 

That's pretty much all the chapter is explaining.

Edited by Son of Placid
fat fingers

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10 hours ago, AfricanShia said:

Yes Brother. It is in Deuteronomy. Please read Deuteronomy and you will see that im truthful. Muhammad is the one whom is identified as unlettered and if you look at the Hebrew version he is called by his name: Muhammadim. Also in Dueteronomy as in Surah 2:124 of the Quran, God mentions of the 12 chieftains (12 imams) after raising Abraham's degree to an Imam and revealing to him the Covenant which is about these 12 chieftains which means 12 leaders and the English definition of Imam is leader or it can be identified as chief as well. :) . Please read Deuteronomy and mark the areas that mentions what im mentioning and you will understand what I mean. Please :)

As SoP pointed out, Deuteronomy is a long book. I suspect you do not really know where to look for these "proofs". Deuteronomy is however a very famous book, so had you been right, this had been an accepted fact. 

There are Muslims that claim that the Earth is flat or that the Earth is not revolving, because the Quran say so. Other Muslim say the Quran say the opposite. The belief that the Bible or the Quran are perfect divine books, with no human influence, thay one must follow as one understands it, even if this means ignoring common sense, has been, and still is, an obstacle to a sound developement of our human society.

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4 hours ago, andres said:

As SoP pointed out, Deuteronomy is a long book. I suspect you do not really know where to look for these "proofs". Deuteronomy is however a very famous book, so had you been right, this had been an accepted fact. 

There are Muslims that claim that the Earth is flat or that the Earth is not revolving, because the Quran say so. Other Muslim say the Quran say the opposite. The belief that the Bible or the Quran are perfect divine books, with no human influence, thay one must follow as one understands it, even if this means ignoring common sense, has been, and still is, an obstacle to a sound developement of our human society.

I will give you the proofs. 

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Deuteronomy 18:18

I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto you, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.

 

ـ رسولُ اللهِ‏ِ (صَلَّيَ اللهُ عَلَيهِ وَ آلِهِ): أنا أديبُ اللّه‏ِ وعليٌّ أدِيبي . 

The Prophet Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå said, ‘I have been educated by Allah Himself and Ali has been educated by me.’[Makarim al-Akhlaq, v. 1, p. 51, no. 19]

 

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The beauty of the king: "You are the most excellent of men". [Psalm 45:2].

In Hadith, Muhammad (saw) says that Allah made him the most perfect of men and that no one is better than which is true because we believe he is the most beloved of Allah. 

ـ رسولُ اللهِ (صَلَّيَ اللهُ عَلَيهِ وَ آلِهِ): ما خَلَقَ اللّه‏ُ خَلقا أفضَلَ مِنّي، ولا أكرَمَ علَيهِ مِنّي. 

The Prophet Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÂáå said, ‘Allah has not created a creation better than me, nor dearer to Him than me.’[`Uyoun Akhbar al-Ridha (AS), v. 1, p. 262, no. 22]

 

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John 1:20-21 was also cited by Muslims as a proof from the canonical gospels that Deuteronomy 18:18 is not a prophecy of the Christ[27] Dr.Abdullah Jahangir claims that according to John 1:20-21, Jews believed the promised Messiah(Jesus) and the promised prophet(Muhammad) would be two separate persons. And that is why, they asked John who he (John) was.He did not fail to confess, but confessed freely, “I am not the Messiah.”They asked him, “Then who are you? Are you Elijah?” He said, “I am not.”“Are you the Prophet?”He answered, “No.”(John 1:20-21)[28]

We believe that after Muhammad (saw) there are no other messengers and these propheciea are not prophecies of Christ or else you would be contradicting your beliefs. 

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His name is "the highly-praised one": "I will perpetuate your memory through all generations; therefore the nations will praise you for ever and ever." [Psalm 45:17]

As Shia Muslims we praise Muhammad and his family the Ahlul-bayt because they are the most beloved of Allah. 

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Also since Muhammad did seal Islam and brought Salat(prayers) to people then Deuteronomy 9:18 narrates about when Prophet Moses prostrated himself before God, then fasted for 40 days and for 40 nights. We in Islam have the belief of course that all Prophets before Muhammad prayed Salat and im Islam prostration is the most powerful position within our Salat as Muhammad and Ahlul-bayt have expressed that and the Bible narrated with Moses and in verse 25, Moses says that he kept prostrating himself for 40 days and 40 nights. So out of all types of worship that he could have expressed, why did he express in prostration? Because Moses was a Muslim and Allah Subhanu Wa Ta'alaa commanded him to pray Salat as well as his followers as you can see in Jewish prayers and their similarities of our prayers. Also just to add in the above in Christianity the first commandment says observe Sabbath and we observe Sabbath as that is the day for congregational prayers but how should one pray. A Covenant was made with the Children of Israel as they were commanded to prostrate as Moses did but Christians dont even prostrate as Moses did for 40 days and for 40 nights. 

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1 hour ago, AfricanShia said:

Deuteronomy 18:18

I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto you, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.

 

Deuteronomy was written 1.400 years before Muhammed. During all those years and the 1.400 years that have past after Muhammed, there have been many prophets. Had it read: "In Medina a prophet called Muhammed will be born 1.400 years from now", only one prophet could have been meant. 

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1 hour ago, AfricanShia said:

In Hadith, Muhammad (saw) says that Allah made him the most perfect of men and that no one is better than which is true because we believe he is the most beloved of Allah. 

I do not believe Muhammed said this. Hadits are questioned by Muslims, and Muhammed was an humble man.

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1 minute ago, andres said:

I do not believe Muhammed said this. Hadits are questioned by Muslims, and Muhammed was an humble man.

I provided the hadith but you didnt read it. 

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11 minutes ago, andres said:

Deuteronomy was written 1.400 years before Muhammed. During all those years and the 1.400 years that have past after Muhammed, there have been many prophets. Had it read: "In Medina a prophet called Muhammed will be born 1.400 years from now", only one prophet could have been meant. 

Exactly. Its called a prophecy and clearly you are not providing strong answers anymore Brother. Deuteronomy was written 300 years after Isa. Oldest edition of the Bible is the Sinai edition which came after Isa. No recorded history of Prophets in between Isa (as ) and Muhammad (saw). 

Edited by AfricanShia

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