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Razabrah

Was Islam a finished religion at time of Prophet?

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By finished I mean, can anyone(whether it be Imam, Ahlulbayt, sheikh, scholar, mufti, regular person, whatever) after the time of the Prophet add or subtract anything regarding Islamic faith? For example, if someone said that drinking tea is recommended/must in Islam even if there isnt the slightest hint of it in it in the Quran or hadith.

Thanks.

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19 hours ago, Razabrah said:

By finished I mean, can anyone(whether it be Imam, Ahlulbayt, sheikh, scholar, mufti, regular person, whatever) after the time of the Prophet add or subtract anything regarding Islamic faith? For example, if someone said that drinking tea is recommended/must in Islam even if there isnt the slightest hint of it in it in the Quran or hadith.

Thanks.

by finished I think you mean complete?

Don't mean to derail the thread, please continue with the discussion

Edited by starlight
removed joke explaining the difference between complete and finished. Off topic

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19 hours ago, Razabrah said:

By finished I mean, can anyone(whether it be Imam, Ahlulbayt, sheikh, scholar, mufti, regular person, whatever) after the time of the Prophet add or subtract anything regarding Islamic faith? For example, if someone said that drinking tea is recommended/must in Islam even if there isnt the slightest hint of it in it in the Quran or hadith.

Thanks.

Salam Brother

To answer your question, one need to understand the way the divine message is delivered to people though history.

The short answer is NO. But this answer will not suffice this question its right.

Brother, we believe that Islam is the religion since the day of Adam. But since Adam time until or prophet time, there had been many prophets and messengers each with a revelation. Why is that?

Well, one of the explanations provided by scholars is that humanity as collective unit not as indivisuals, needed time to mature and understand the religion. If the Islam was revealed the way it is today to people of Idris, they were not ready for it. 

So revelation was gradual. Each prophet was the next step in bringing humanity to maturation and perfection. Most of the moral and social laws that are accepted world wide are the laws of the religions : No killing, no stealing no promiscuity etc.

Islam is the Quran and the prophet's way of executing the quran laws or his sunnah. Quran was not revealed at once like Moses Torah. It was revealed on occasions over a 23 years period. So peopel can hear and see the circumstances of why , how and what the revelation meant, why it said this not that.

Quran encompasses all laws that we need. Not all problems of ancient Arabia are relevant to us today nor our problems existed back then. So who can tell us what in Quran can solve our problems?

We believe that Imams are the oly one after the prophet who know when each verse was revealed and why. They know its exact meaning and its various applications.

So Imams were there to show people the other application of quran and sunnah that people were not aware of. They did not invent new rules. They just revealed what was not clear and self evident to people.

Quote

And [it is] a Qur'an which We have separated [by intervals] that you might recite it to the people over a prolonged period. And We have sent it down progressively.

Chapter of Israa, verse 106.

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2 hours ago, starlight said:

by finished I think you mean complete?

Don't mean to derail the thread, please continue with the discussion

Yes, that is a much better way to describe it.
 

 

1 hour ago, For The Love of The Emir said:

We believe that Imams are the oly one after the prophet who know when each verse was revealed and why. They know its exact meaning and its various applications.

So Imams were there to show people the other application of quran and sunnah that people were not aware of. They did not invent new rules. They just revealed what was not clear and self evident to people.

Chapter of Israa, verse 106.

So the answer is no then, because according to your answer the Imams based their answer off the Quran and sunnah, they did not invent things or add something out of the blue. Im talking about stuff that has no basis in Quran or sunnah, 

 

2 hours ago, Nmedanum said:

Well it seems the imams sure added a lot of stuff

Can you provide examples for this?

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On ‎19‎-‎5‎-‎2017 at 0:13 AM, Razabrah said:

By finished I mean, can anyone(whether it be Imam, Ahlulbayt, sheikh, scholar, mufti, regular person, whatever) after the time of the Prophet add or subtract anything regarding Islamic faith? For example, if someone said that drinking tea is recommended/must in Islam even if there isnt the slightest hint of it in it in the Quran or hadith.

Thanks.

No

Edited by Faruk

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22 hours ago, For The Love of The Emir said:

So Imams were there to show people the other application of quran and sunnah that people were not aware of. They did not invent new rules. They just revealed what was not clear and self evident to people.

How can we verify that their teachings are as per Quran and Sunnah and are not new rules?

 

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2 hours ago, Ya Allah Madad said:

How can we verify that their teachings are as per Quran and Sunnah and are not new rules?

 

The question is actually what the sunnah is.

Every sect has the same definition yet they disagree about the transmission. Sunnah is not simply ahaadith texts alone. It can even consists of Urf - i.e. living traditions like for example Sadl which is practiced by Maliki's.

The methodolgy to define the Sunnah for Salafi's is merely texts-work yet they claim to do ijtihad while their methodology is actually very dogmatic and unilateral, neglecting s lot of other factors which should be taken in consideration as well.

Edited by Faruk

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8 hours ago, Faruk said:

The question is actually what the sunnah is.

Every sect has the same definition yet they disagree about the transmission. Sunnah is not simply ahaadith texts alone. It can even consists of Urf - i.e. living traditions like for example Sadl which is practiced by Maliki's.

The methodolgy to define the Sunnah for Salafi's is merely texts-work yet they claim to do ijtihad while their methodology is actually very dogmatic and unilateral, neglecting s lot of other factors which should be taken in consideration as well.

Keeping the shia concept of imamate in mind, as per 4:59 we have to follow three i.e Allah, His Rasool and Ulil amr (mansoos minallah Imam for twelvers). To follow Allah means Quran, Rasool means his sunnah via authentic ahadith and to follow ulil amr means their orders. And the same verse say in case of any conflict refer the matter back to Allah (Quran) and His Rasool (sunnah). Meaning they are the ultimate authority to follow. 

In other words, to verify the legitimacy of the orders of Ulil Amr we have to check that with Quran and Sunnah. If they are in accordance and are within the boundaries of the two, then are acceptable. Otherwise we have to refer back to Quran and Sunnah, not ulil amr (Imam in case of twelvers). This is what 4:59 is saying.

For e.g lets consider sunnis. They consider ABu bakr the first ulil amr or Imam or caliph. And to verify his orders they match with Quran and Sunnah. i.e with teachings of Prophet saw not with teachings of another ulil amr or Imam (which also need to be verified in the same way).

So the main question is where is that Sunnah in twelver hadith books? through which we can verify the orders of ulil amr or Imam. If sunnah of prophet and of ulil amr is same thing then how will we act as per 4:59 which says refer to Allah and His Rasool in case of any dispute. 4:59 is separating ulil amr and Rasool when we have conflicts.

I want to hear from twelvers specially. Only short precise answers. No copy pastes of long articles or exegesis.

 

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