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Kamaaluddeen al-Ismail

Are Unitarians more closer to Islam?

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2 hours ago, Kamaaluddeen al-Ismail said:

:salam:

Unitarians are those who reject the doctrine of the Trinity (YHWH in three persons), but do they still believe that Jesus is god? What do they believe about the holy spirit? 

I think you have to firstly differentiate between the original Christian Unitarian philosophy associated with Bishop Arian from the 3rd Century and died out about the 7th Century.

This philosophy said that Jesus was a created being and therefore could not be considered to be God, since the created is lesser then the creator. It is said that they still considered Jesus to be the son of God.

Modern day Unitarians seem to be amalgam of various philosophies which agree that say Jesus is the Son of God but reject the trinity.

My criticism of modern day Unitarians is that they try and be inclusive and as such appear to dilute their beliefs   Difficult to find out more without extra study

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Yeah, thought I might be classed as a Unitarian, but can't accept the idea of praying to the dead,  Do Muslims pray to dead people? Not sure if that's closer to Islam, but pretty sure it's not mainstream.

It doesn't seem to matter, shaytan has grounded roots in every belief system.

Sorry, this could be long, I studied this stuff. Doesn't mean I'm right.

 "It is appointed unto man once to die, after this the judgement" Nobody left to pray to except God. What's cool is there is no chain of command. If you pray in the presence of an angel the message remains as pure as your heart. 

Arianism is interesting. Problem is, everything he did was destroyed and the only reports available are those from his enemies trying to explain him. From his perspective the Bible tells a totally different story, well, okay, not totally, actually it accepts the fact that not every reference to supernatural meeting means God Almighty.

He believed the different names used in the OT were for different entities while the council of Nicaea just decided they were all "God", somehow only three active members. The OT mentions many names, not all of which should be considered as Almighty God for their very Hebrew meanings, but are anyway.

There is a good chance Gabriel was also active in the OT and that in some instance his work could have been attributed to be God, not of God. This is the root of the fallacy. So many things in the OT to call God whether they are direct or indirect, knowing that indirect is more direct than humans can fathom, they choose to believe direct through three channels.

Don't hold it against Christians. It is taught to them until they are exhausted and just want to go to bed. Tomorrow they are expected to accept and when we speak of it you will smile and nod. <---- no flags <---sarcasm..

It's a simple concept. You are god. You have option to run around an entire universe, which may be tiny, but time consuming, and do everything little thing yourself or create beings to do everything at your command, always on your watch...somehow, and always according to your will. Delegation becomes a breeze. Everything you create becomes part of the unity of the Will of You. Your choice how the world spins. I would totally mess this up.

Arius believed the entity in Jesus, actually Logos, aka The Word, was of the same essence as God. He did not believe that to be spirit, and probably had no idea thus used the word "essence". "The word" takes on a very active role in Genesis and Exodus, and cannot be translated as words in a book doing something physical... :pushup2:.

John wrote of this before he knew anything else. There is a possibility that He, Lagos, one who dwelt in Jesus, was created at the time God said "Let there be light", Gen 1:3. Remember this light came to earth before the sun was created. End of my knowledge.

To be a son of God is to be a creation of God's doing. This really isn't a Muslim term but let's not go off the deep end. Jesus referred to Almighty God as His father, taught Christians to pray starting, "Our Father" followed EVERY time by, "who is in Heaven"  Why Trinitarians don't see the separation of "essence" in every time Jesus took the time to mention the distance between Himself and God, I don't know, but years of biblical study still show no evidence Jesus is, or will become God. Also nothing says ahadith takes it from here.

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On Wednesday, March 08, 2017 at 9:20 AM, Son of Placid said:

Yeah, thought I might be classed as a Unitarian, but can't accept the idea of praying to the dead,  Do Muslims pray to dead people? Not sure if that's closer to Islam, but pretty sure it's not mainstream.

It doesn't seem to matter, shaytan has grounded roots in every belief system.

Sorry, this could be long, I studied this stuff. Doesn't mean I'm right.

 "It is appointed unto man once to die, after this the judgement" Nobody left to pray to except God. What's cool is there is no chain of command. If you pray in the presence of an angel the message remains as pure as your heart. 

Arianism is interesting. Problem is, everything he did was destroyed and the only reports available are those from his enemies trying to explain him. From his perspective the Bible tells a totally different story, well, okay, not totally, actually it accepts the fact that not every reference to supernatural meeting means God Almighty.

He believed the different names used in the OT were for different entities while the council of Nicaea just decided they were all "God", somehow only three active members. The OT mentions many names, not all of which should be considered as Almighty God for their very Hebrew meanings, but are anyway.

There is a good chance Gabriel was also active in the OT and that in some instance his work could have been attributed to be God, not of God. This is the root of the fallacy. So many things in the OT to call God whether they are direct or indirect, knowing that indirect is more direct than humans can fathom, they choose to believe direct through three channels.

Don't hold it against Christians. It is taught to them until they are exhausted and just want to go to bed. Tomorrow they are expected to accept and when we speak of it you will smile and nod. <---- no flags <---sarcasm..

It's a simple concept. You are god. You have option to run around an entire universe, which may be tiny, but time consuming, and do everything little thing yourself or create beings to do everything at your command, always on your watch...somehow, and always according to your will. Delegation becomes a breeze. Everything you create becomes part of the unity of the Will of You. Your choice how the world spins. I would totally mess this up.

Arius believed the entity in Jesus, actually Logos, aka The Word, was of the same essence as God. He did not believe that to be spirit, and probably had no idea thus used the word "essence". "The word" takes on a very active role in Genesis and Exodus, and cannot be translated as words in a book doing something physical... :pushup2:.

John wrote of this before he knew anything else. There is a possibility that He, Lagos, one who dwelt in Jesus, was created at the time God said "Let there be light", Gen 1:3. Remember this light came to earth before the sun was created. End of my knowledge.

To be a son of God is to be a creation of God's doing. This really isn't a Muslim term but let's not go off the deep end. Jesus referred to Almighty God as His father, taught Christians to pray starting, "Our Father" followed EVERY time by, "who is in Heaven"  Why Trinitarians don't see the separation of "essence" in every time Jesus took the time to mention the distance between Himself and God, I don't know, but years of biblical study still show no evidence Jesus is, or will become God. Also nothing says ahadith takes it from here.

Praying to the dead is not allowed in Islam. 

https://islamqa.info/en/763

But few sects did exist that prayed to the dead, but they were highly criticized by the scholars. 

Edited by Kamaaluddeen al-Ismail

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On 3/15/2017 at 2:59 AM, Kamaaluddeen al-Ismail said:

Praying to the dead is not allowed in Islam. 

https://islamqa.info/en/763

But few sects did exist that prayed to the dead, but they were highly criticized by the scholars. 

In most cases it is believed these people are alive in one form or another and ready to hear your prayers. Fact of the matter is simple, if they were once human they are now dead. 

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