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Nadia.

Question about sufis

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salam,

I have heard from someone that the sufi sheikhs believe that they are in contact with Allah swt, is this true? And if so, what type of contact? Do they say they talk directly to Allah and he answers or is it something else? Because anyone who prays or makes du'aa is in contact with Allah so I would like to understand this concept a bit better (if such a thing exists in sufism).

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السلام عليكم ورحمة الله

They claim that they see Rasulullah صلى الله عليه وآله in their living state and dream state advising them how to help the Ummah (by starting charity organisations, writing books etc). They say this is through the excessive salawat especially on Friday nights.

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8 hours ago, Ozzy said:

السلام عليكم ورحمة الله

They claim that they see Rasulullah صلى الله عليه وآله in their living state and dream state advising them how to help the Ummah (by starting charity organisations, writing books etc). They say this is through the excessive salawat especially on Friday nights.

جزاك اللهُ خيرًا, thank you I didn't know that

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Salam

.According to Quran (shuara 51) God does not speak to any human except from revelation (in its special ways) and it belongs to the prophets only, not the others.

But if they mean asking god and getting answered it needs no special character. Quran (Esra 20) says: To these and to those—to all We extend the bounty of your Lord, and the bounty of your Lord is not confined. 

Now the question is that what do they seek by telling about these? they invite people to themselves or to the pure religion of the prophets?

 

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13 hours ago, Nadia. said:

salam,

I have heard from someone that the sufi sheikhs believe that they are in contact with Allah swt, is this true? And if so, what type of contact? Do they say they talk directly to Allah and he answers or is it something else? Because anyone who prays or makes du'aa is in contact with Allah so I would like to understand this concept a bit better (if such a thing exists in sufism).

Walaikuam assalaam,

Not necessarily, actually I would say a handful make that claim.

As Ozzy stated, many experience inspirational "dreams" of where they see the Prophet SAW which then influences their actions.  By that contact through the Prophet SAW in dreams, the Prophet SAW is in contact with Allah Swt. 

I believe it is for both Sunni and Shia's that there exists hadith regarding if one see's the Prophet SAW in a dream, that it is for certain that they've seen him for Satan cannot take his shape.  So, it would not be "Direct" contact, no. Even Allah SWT communicated to the prophet's through an Angel such as Jibreel.

But there exists the question if a person is lying about having that dream for some type of personal gain/attention or fame seeking to get their sufi lodges populated. These are the sufi's that claim to see Allah SWT in a living state, and make some outlandish statements.

For the most part from history, these sufis were inviting people to Islam.  One such case is Sheikh Nazim al Haqqani, of the Naqshbandi sufi order.  He was very well known for his exceptional gift of spreading in Da3wah and has converted hundreds if not thousands of Non-Arab/South Asian people.  @zamzam*

However, it's deplorable that such great personalities such as Nazim has that wasilyah/intercession be done through himself (before his passing).

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2 hours ago, wmehar2 said:

Walaikuam assalaam,

Not necessarily, actually I would say a handful make that claim.

As Ozzy stated, many experience inspirational "dreams" of where they see the Prophet SAW which then influences their actions.  By that contact through the Prophet SAW in dreams, the Prophet SAW is in contact with Allah Swt. 

I believe it is for both Sunni and Shia's that there exists hadith regarding if one see's the Prophet SAW in a dream, that it is for certain that they've seen him for Satan cannot take his shape.  So, it would not be "Direct" contact, no. Even Allah SWT communicated to the prophet's through an Angel such as Jibreel.

But there exists the question if a person is lying about having that dream for some type of personal gain/attention or fame seeking to get their sufi lodges populated. These are the sufi's that claim to see Allah SWT in a living state, and make some outlandish statements.

For the most part from history, these sufis were inviting people to Islam.  One such case is Sheikh Nazim al Haqqani, of the Naqshbandi sufi order.  He was very well known for his exceptional gift of spreading in Da3wah and has converted hundreds if not thousands of Non-Arab/South Asian people.  @zamzam*

However, it's deplorable that such great personalities such as Nazim has that wasilyah/intercession be done through himself (before his passing).

جزاك اللهُ خيرًا

I find sufism really interested and I'm planning on writing a book with a sufi character in it so I didn't want to get anything wrong. Also, about the Sheikh you mentioned, I always wondered why sufism is quite popular in South Asia and now I have a potential answer, thanks :)

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1 hour ago, Nadia. said:

جزاك اللهُ خيرًا

I find sufism really interested and I'm planning on writing a book with a sufi character in it so I didn't want to get anything wrong. Also, about the Sheikh you mentioned, I always wondered why sufism is quite popular in South Asia and now I have a potential answer, thanks :)

Sufism came to South Asia from wandering sufi masters looking to convert and spread islam.  Many of these sufis such as Lal Shabazz Qalandar, and others did more than spread faith, such as bring peace to quarelling parties.  They acted as Mediators and brought two enemies together.

Many of them were Sayyids.

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On ‎10‎/‎15‎/‎2016 at 10:58 AM, wmehar2 said:

Sufism came to South Asia from wandering sufi masters looking to convert and spread islam.  Many of these sufis such as Lal Shabazz Qalandar, and others did more than spread faith, such as bring peace to quarelling parties.  They acted as Mediators and brought two enemies together.

Many of them were Sayyids.

Salaam alaikum,

I remember reading somewhere that some of these Sufi masters were Isma'ili Imams/Da'is incognito.  Have you come across that? I ask because the Isma'ilis seem to me to be more like a tariqah than anything else.

May Allah (swt) always bless and watch over you,

r

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2 hours ago, reisiger said:

Salaam alaikum,

I remember reading somewhere that some of these Sufi masters were Isma'ili Imams/Da'is incognito.  Have you come across that? I ask because the Isma'ilis seem to me to be more like a tariqah than anything else.

May Allah (swt) always bless and watch over you,

r

Wa Alaikum asalaam

To be honest that's the first I've ever heard of that.

The ones I've met and heard of didn't seem to share ismaili characteristics.  

I couldn't tell ya.  I can't undrstand why they would be incognito as sufis, then again technically a sufi isn't necessarily a different sect.

I've heard of few nizari Muslims in south asIA however. Worth looking into.

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2 hours ago, wmehar2 said:

Wa Alaikum asalaam

To be honest that's the first I've ever heard of that.

The ones I've met and heard of didn't seem to share ismaili characteristics.  

I couldn't tell ya.  I can't undrstand why they would be incognito as sufis, then again technically a sufi isn't necessarily a different sect.

I've heard of few nizari Muslims in south asIA however. Worth looking into.

Believe it or not, I found a story on it.  Seems like a post Alamut thing.  Check it out (if you like) :)

http:// https://ismailimail.wordpress.com/2015/12/25/during-the-anjundan-period-nizari-imams-took-on-sufi-names

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Sufi's people in the concept of Bayah (allegiance) to the Shaykh, the initiation requires on to recite the Kalma and pledge allegience to them.  Imam of the time , "Imam Mahdi Al Muntadhir" and to RasulAllah and his AhlulBayt, they all believe that the Shaykh shares a spiritual connection with their mureeds and i know this first hand that alot of them believe in the 12 Imams. 

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1 minute ago, raza82 said:

the concept of Bayah (allegiance) to the Shaykh

Why bay'a to their sheikh if they believe the 12th Imam exists? Is their sheikh in contact with the Imam?

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Well it's connection to one through a chain, you connect to your Shaykh, who connects with his and it leads to Rasul, Noor of our Rasul. we believe he is Hazir and Nazir, and that he is connected to his Ummah. 

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To connect to Rasulullah صلى الله عليه وآله you connect through his representative which is Imam al-Mahdi عجل الله تعالى فرجه الشريف

The Imam is more concerned about his followers and prays for them than any sheikh.

بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم
اللهم صل على محمد و آل محمد
اللهم كن لوليك الحجة إبن الحسن صلواتك عليه و على آبائة في هذه الساعة و في كل ساعة ولياً و حافظاً و قائداً و ناصراً و دليلاً و عيناً حتى تسكنه أرضك طوعا و تمتعه فيها طويلا
و صلى الله على محمد و آله الطاهرين

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Salam

Some sufis have astonishing beliefs for Muslims. They claim:

Imam Ali (as) and the Holy Prophet (saw) were God (God forbid)

Drinking is allowed

No hijab

No daily prayer at masjid 

God, Ali and Muhammad are the same (God forbid) aka Ali-Haqq-Muhammad

Prayer to images of Imams allowed (God forbid. This position is supported by the late Sayyid al-Hakim)

 

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On ‎12‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 11:50 AM, Mansur Bakhtiari said:

Salam

Some sufis have astonishing beliefs for Muslims. They claim:

Imam Ali (as) and the Holy Prophet (saw) were God (God forbid)

Drinking is allowed

No hijab

No daily prayer at masjid 

God, Ali and Muhammad are the same (God forbid) aka Ali-Haqq-Muhammad

Prayer to images of Imams allowed (God forbid. This position is supported by the late Sayyid al-Hakim)

 

Salaam alaikum,

One of my favorite lecturers, and he is a Sufi-  Shaykh Noorudeen Durkee calls the so-called Sufis you are describing the "goofy-Sufis." The path of Tariqah is not (in my unscholarly opinion) is not intended to replace the Sharia; it is intended to enrich it and shed light upon it. Without the esoteric, the exoteric is just an act, but without the exoteric, the esoteric has nothing in which to take root.

 

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7 hours ago, reisiger said:

Salaam alaikum,

One of my favorite lecturers, and he is a Sufi-  Shaykh Noorudeen Durkee calls the so-called Sufis you are describing the "goofy-Sufis." The path of Tariqah is not (in my unscholarly opinion) is not intended to replace the Sharia; it is intended to enrich it and shed light upon it. Without the esoteric, the exoteric is just an act, but without the exoteric, the esoteric has nothing in which to take root.

 

Yes but sects like Bektashi and others are more similar to Christians then Muslims.

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Sufi Alevis/Bektaşî intrepret the Quran as bâtınî and zahir    

 

Quran does not forbid wine Nahl 67 

God Muhammed Ali is not The same 

Outsiders think otherwise but it means Allah the greatest Muhammed the messengar and Ali the imam 

We don't pray to images, we pray towards İnsanî Kâmil being 

The one whom passed 4 doors and 40 levels

 

 

 

 

 

 

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On Sunday, December 11, 2016 at 4:50 PM, Mansur Bakhtiari said:

Salam

Some sufis have astonishing beliefs for Muslims. They claim:

Imam Ali (as) and the Holy Prophet (saw) were God (God forbid)

Drinking is allowed

No hijab

No daily prayer at masjid 

God, Ali and Muhammad are the same (God forbid) aka Ali-Haqq-Muhammad

Prayer to images of Imams allowed (God forbid. This position is supported by the late Sayyid al-Hakim)

 

Sufi Alevis/Bektaşî intrepret the Quran as bâtınî and zahir    

 

Quran does not forbid wine Nahl 67 

God Muhammed Ali is not The same 

Outsiders think otherwise but it means Allah the greatest Muhammed the messengar and Ali the imam 

We don't pray to images, we pray towards İnsanî Kâmil being 

The one whom passed 4 doors and 40 levels

 

 

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, AleviTurkmenKhorasan said:

 

We don't pray to images, we pray towards İnsanî Kâmil being 

The one whom passed 4 doors and 40 levels

 

 

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure it is shirk to pray to anyone but Allah.

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Bro we pray to Allah but we face the "Dede" 

Not kaabe as Kabe was made by man 

We respect kaabe though 

Was it not God whom demanded all creatures to kneel towards Adam? But iblis did not?

We come from prophets bloodline Guruhu Naci and Naciye

 

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When we pray at home to Allah we face any direction however at eam we face the Dede as the Dede teaches Hz Muhammed and Hz Ali 

Dede represents Hz Muhammed and Hz Ali 

 

The images also represents Hz Ali 

 

 

Edited by AleviTurkmenKhorasan

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