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sakura1994

why did prophat Mohammed marry aisha ?

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shouldn't prophat know what gonna happen to this ummah cuz of this marriage to an underage girl , many now marry children and say it's sunnah .. also if prophat mohammed didn't make aisha into um al moamnen / mother of believers then the problem of calapha might have been avoided ... I am not blaming prophat on his decision of course I am use he wanted to unite the tribe of mecca and those were political marragies to unite the arab of arabia , But why didn't he prophecy the problems that gonna erupt from such marriage . 

Edited by sakura1994

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8 minutes ago, sakura1994 said:

But why didn't he prophecy the problems that gonna erupt from such marriage . 

I do not agree with the word 'problems'. And I also believe that there was lot of wisdom in this decision.



 

Edited by Faruk

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The simplest explanation would simply be that he couldn't see into the future. As for the 'underage' thing, that only really became an issue in (in some parts of the world) over 1300 years later. Even if he could have seen into the future, why would he have let 20th century Western attitudes to marriage affect his decision in 7th century Arabia?

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9 minutes ago, Ali al-Abdullah said:

Salam. As far as I know, we shia don't believe the Holy Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him and his Family) married Aisha when she was 9. Rather, we believe that she was 19.

No, this is just something people (both on the Sunni and Shia side) have been advocating recently because they are embarrassed about it. There is nothing in Shi'ism that would point to her being 19.

It's not often that I will post an Ammar Nakshawani video, but since I know he carries a lot of weight with some people:

 

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16 minutes ago, Haydar Husayn said:

No, this is just something people (both on the Sunni and Shia side) have been advocating recently because they are embarrassed about it. There is nothing in Shi'ism that would point to her being 19.

It's not often that I will post an Ammar Nakshawani video, but since I know he carries a lot of weight with some people:

 

Are you sure? I'm not ashamed of that, if the Holy Prophet (pbuh&f) did marry her at 9, then obviously he has a good reason. But I have read somewhere that she was 17 for or 19.

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Just now, Ali al-Abdullah said:

Are you sure? I'm not ashamed of that, if the Holy Prophet (pbuh&f) did marry her at 9, then obviously he has a good reason. But I have read somewhere that she was 17 for or 19.

All the sources point to her being 9 or 10. What people have started doing though is seeking to prove that she must have been older by using indirect arguments based on uncertain dating of other events (like the revelation of certain surahs). Nakshawani goes through some of this stuff in the lecture I posted (and keep in mind that a few years earlier he had been on the opposite side of the fence, and had repeatedly argued that she was 18/19). The motivation for this isn't objective historical research though, but rather a desire to avoid what they consider to be an embarrassing fact.

I think it's possible Aisha was slightly older than 9 (although I have no evidence for this), due to the fact that no birth certificates were kept then, and I don't think there was even a formal calendar. Even today, you will often have people from certain parts of the world who are unsure about their exact date of birth. So it wouldn't surprise me if she was in fact 10 or 11 (and 10 is the age given in some sources). Maybe even 12. But I doubt there is a 10 year discrepancy. 

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2 minutes ago, Haydar Husayn said:

All the sources point to her being 9 or 10. What people have started doing though is seeking to prove that she must have been older by using indirect arguments based on uncertain dating of other events (like the revelation of certain surahs). Nakshawani goes through some of this stuff in the lecture I posted (and keep in mind that a few years earlier he had been on the opposite side of the fence, and had repeatedly argued that she was 18/19). The motivation for this isn't objective historical research though, but rather a desire to avoid what they consider to be an embarrassing fact.

I think it's possible Aisha was slightly older than 9 (although I have no evidence for this), due to the fact that no birth certificates were kept then, and I don't think there was even a formal calendar. Even today, you will often have people from certain parts of the world who are unsure about their exact date of birth. So it wouldn't surprise me if she was in fact 10 or 11 (and 10 is the age given in some sources). Maybe even 12. But I doubt there is a 10 year discrepancy. 

Yeah that's why I remember seeing a Sayyid Ammar lecture where he said she was 19 and thought this was weird.

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Just now, Ali al-Abdullah said:

Yeah that's why I remember seeing a Sayyid Ammar lecture where he said she was 19 and thought this was weird.

Yeah, the lecture you are thinking of was when he was younger, in 2006. He has since changed his mind, but weirdly never feels the need to tell people that in his lectures.

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39 minutes ago, Haydar Husayn said:

The simplest explanation would simply be that he couldn't see into the future. As for the 'underage' thing, that only really became an issue in (in some parts of the world) over 1300 years later. Even if he could have seen into the future, why would he have let 20th century Western attitudes to marriage affect his decision in 7th century Arabia?

Two questions remain:

Wasn't his s.a.w.a.s. way of life a universal model for mankind, then and in times to come?

Is this story really a true story as there are analysts who came to the conclusion that Aisha was much older?

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28 minutes ago, Ali al-Abdullah said:

Are you sure? I'm not ashamed of that, if the Holy Prophet (pbuh&f) did marry her at 9, then obviously he has a good reason. But I have read somewhere that she was 17 for or 19.

That's the reverse reasoning.

And if the marriage was at 4? Come on bro'. It's not forbidden to use reason.

Edited by Faruk

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26 minutes ago, Faruk said:

Two questions remain:

Wasn't his s.a.w.a.s. way of life a universal model for mankind, then and in times to come?

Is this story really a true story as there are analysts who came to the conclusion that Aisha was much older?

Yes, he is a universal model for mankind. I don't see the contradiction here, unless you think that for some reason 21st century Western values are superior to the values of everyone else in history. Nobody is saying that it's obligatory to marry a 9 year old. It's simply that in the historical context that the Prophet lived in, there was obviously no problem with it. However, most of us now live in a different social context, where such a marriage would not be suitable.

As for the conclusion of these 'analysts', I've already explained what their motivation is. Nobody who isn't already looking to prove that she was much older would come to that conclusion. But of course, as is well known, people will ultimately believe whatever they want to believe. So if someone just can't stomach the idea that the Prophet (s) married a 9 year old, then no amount of evidence of reasoning is going to sway them, and they will continue clutching at straws.

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30 minutes ago, Faruk said:

That's the reverse reasoning.

And if the marriage was at 4? Come on bro'. It's not forbidden to use reason.

The minimal criteria in Islam is that a woman has to attain puberty in order to consummate the marriage. Like it or not, at least there is some objectivity to it. On the other hand, ages like 14, 15, 16, 17, or 18, which are common ages of consent in many Western countries, are just plucked out of thin air. Ultimately, every society can agree on when they think it is appropriate for people to be able to get married (or in the modern context, just to have sexual relations), but they should be honest enough to just admit that it's a subjective convention, and not some objective truth that makes us better than everyone else in the world and throughout history.

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13 minutes ago, Haydar Husayn said:

Yes, he is a universal model for mankind. I don't see the contradiction here, unless you think that for some reason 21st century Western values are superior to the values of everyone else in history. Nobody is saying that it's obligatory to marry a 9 year old. It's simply that in the historical context that the Prophet lived in, there was obviously no problem with it. However, most of us now live in a different social context, where such a marriage would not be suitable.

If the Prophet s.a.w.a.s. married a nine year old than it's sunnah and has nothing to do with historical context.

 

 

16 minutes ago, Haydar Husayn said:

As for the conclusion of these 'analysts', I've already explained what their motivation is. Nobody who isn't already looking to prove that she was much older would come to that conclusion. But of course, as is well known, people will ultimately believe whatever they want to believe. So if someone just can't stomach the idea that the Prophet (s) married a 9 year old, then no amount of evidence of reasoning is going to sway them, and they will continue clutching at straws.

It's clear you did not check the researches done about this subject. What is the reasoning behind marrying a nine year old anyway?

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1 minute ago, Faruk said:

If the Prophet s.a.w.a.s. married a nine year old than it's sunnah and has nothing to do with historical context.

Of course it has to do with historical and cultural context. 9 year olds in that context are not like 9 year olds in a modern city life context. I'm not trying to argue that retrospectively the decision was wrong, but in that context people didn't know that. What I am saying is that in the context the Prophet was in, there was no problem with it, and nor would there be in a similar context today. However, by and large, that context no longer exists.

 

1 minute ago, Faruk said:

It's clear you did not check the researches done about this subject. What is the reasoning behind marrying a nine year old anyway?

Why do you assume that I haven't checked them? I have, and of course, it would be much easier if she really was 18 or 19, because it would provide an easy answer to those who use it to attack Islam. Unfortunately, it just happens that the arguments used to prove that she was much older are very weak, and don't agree with all the direct evidence.

Here is a post I made 6 years ago quoting a scholar refuting many of the common arguments used to prove Aisha was much older: 

 

As for the 'reasoning', I don't see what there needs to be other than the fact that she was considered of marriageable age. This wasn't some 'exception' made by the Prophet (s) to set some kind of example. And to be honest, you now have to deal with the many ahadith and fatawa in Shia literature that make it clear that marriage with a 9 year old is permissible. Also, Shias generally believe that Fatima (a) was around 9 when she married Imam `Ali (a).

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11 minutes ago, Haydar Husayn said:

Of course it has to do with historical and cultural context. 9 year olds in that context are not like 9 year olds in a modern city life context. I'm not trying to argue that retrospectively the decision was wrong, but in that context people didn't know that. What I am saying is that in the context the Prophet was in, there was no problem with it, and nor would there be in a similar context today. However, by and large, that context no longer exists.

 

Why do you assume that I haven't checked them? I have, and of course, it would be much easier if she really was 18 or 19, because it would provide an easy answer to those who use it to attack Islam. Unfortunately, it just happens that the arguments used to prove that she was much older are very weak, and don't agree with all the direct evidence.

Here is a post I made 6 years ago quoting a scholar refuting many of the common arguments used to prove Aisha was much older: 

 

As for the 'reasoning', I don't see what there needs to be other than the fact that she was considered of marriageable age. This wasn't some 'exception' made by the Prophet (s) to set some kind of example. And to be honest, you now have to deal with the many ahadith and fatawa in Shia literature that make it clear that marriage with a 9 year old is permissible. Also, Shias generally believe that Fatima (a) was around 9 when she married Imam `Ali (a).

According to what i understood islam permit to have sexual relation and wedding when people have puberty. Im maybe wrong but im not really shoking to think that girls in 7th century in a arid desert could have puberty earlier than girls who live in good condition of life in 21 th century in europe or america.

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5 minutes ago, alidu78 said:

According to what i understood islam permit to have sexual relation and wedding when people have puberty. Im maybe wrong but im not really shoking to think that girls in 7th century in a arid desert could have puberty earlier than girls who live in good condition of life in 21 th century in europe or america.

The reasons for variations of the age of puberty don't really seem to be well understood. It has been dropping recently in the West, but nobody seems to know why exactly. There have been various guesses, such as diet, TV, chemicals, etc, but no conclusive answer as far as I know. Race also plays a role.

So it's perfectly possible that girls went through puberty earlier in that climate. It's also possible that Aisha went through puberty a little bit earlier than usual, since girls don't all go through puberty at the same age.

Edited by Haydar Husayn

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1 hour ago, Haydar Husayn said:

Of course it has to do with historical and cultural context. 9 year olds in that context are not like 9 year olds in a modern city life context. I'm not trying to argue that retrospectively the decision was wrong, but in that context people didn't know that. What I am saying is that in the context the Prophet was in, there was no problem with it, and nor would there be in a similar context today. However, by and large, that context no longer exists.

Sorry but just no ...

 

1 hour ago, Haydar Husayn said:

As for the 'reasoning', I don't see what there needs to be other than the fact that she was considered of marriageable age. This wasn't some 'exception' made by the Prophet (s) to set some kind of example. And to be honest, you now have to deal with the many ahadith and fatawa in Shia literature that make it clear that marriage with a 9 year old is permissible. Also, Shias generally believe that Fatima (a) was around 9 when she married Imam `Ali (a).

Beside the Qur'an I do not consider any text to be infallible. I read ahaadith but they have to be in line with Qur'an and reason and I check historical sources as well before I make a conclusion.

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3 minutes ago, Faruk said:

Sorry but just no ...

 

Beside the Qur'an I do not consider any text to be infallible. I read ahaadith but they have to be in line with Qur'an and reason and I check historical sources as well before I make a conclusion.

And what in the Qur'an contradicts the idea that Aisha could have been 9? Look, if you want to stick your head in the sand over this, then go ahead, but don't expect anyone to take arguments seriously when they have no basis in history or Islam. The historical sources unanimously say that Aisha was 9 or 10. Shia and Sunni ahadith unanimously say that a woman can enter adulthood at 9. There is absolutely no reason to think Aisha was 18 or 19 other than wishful thinking, based on the fact that in the context of the modern West such as marriage seen as unacceptable.

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It was for political reasons only, and it was an order from God of course. If the prophet scrabble his head it would've been for a reason, he didnt do nothing unless it was for the benefit of the ummah. He cant simply not know what will happen next or in the future. 

Chapter 53, Al-Najm

In the name of God, the Gracious, the Merciful.

1. By the star as it goes down.

2. Your friend has not gone astray, nor has he erred.

3. Nor does he speak out of desire.

4. It is but a revelation revealed.

5. Taught to him by the Extremely Powerful.

6. The one of vigor. He settled.

7. While he was at the highest horizon.

8. Then he came near, and hovered around.

9. He was within two bows’ length, or closer.

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2 hours ago, Haydar Husayn said:

The simplest explanation would simply be that he couldn't see into the future. As for the 'underage' thing, that only really became an issue in (in some parts of the world) over 1300 years later. Even if he could have seen into the future, why would he have let 20th century Western attitudes to marriage affect his decision in 7th century Arabia?

Bro I watched the Sayyid Ammar lecture and I am satisfied with the explanation. However are you saying he (sawa) couldn't see into the future is a dangerous assumption. He (sawa) was not only a Prophet, but the greatest of them all. So to say he couldn't prophesy is kinda dangerous bro. Further there are many prophesies from the Holy Prophet (sawa) which many have come true.

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1 minute ago, Ali al-Abdullah said:

Bro I watched the Sayyid Ammar lecture and I am satisfied with the explanation. However are you saying he (sawa) couldn't see into the future is a dangerous assumption. He (sawa) was not only a Prophet, but the greatest of them all. So to say he couldn't prophesy is kinda dangerous bro. Further there are many prophesies from the Holy Prophet (sawa) which many have come true.

I didn't say he didn't know anything of the future. Clearly Allah told him some of the unseen, and that's generally part of what Prophets do. However, that doesn't mean to say he knows everything of the future.

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Just now, Haydar Husayn said:

I didn't say he didn't know anything of the future. Clearly Allah told him some of the unseen, and that's generally part of what Prophets do. However, that doesn't mean to say he knows everything of the future.

It seems so, and Allah (swt) knows best.

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